Ahmed Saad's ban for energy drink on match day

[SaintsSeptember]

ASADA would have reviewed the text of interview and case files and made a judgement as to whether to appeal, or not, based on that.

There is no doubt that Saad was naive in doing what he did and the vast majority of football supporters would agree that he has broken the laws governing this, but the 18 month punishment is not proportionate to the crime. Calling for four years, even in flippantly is callous and unnecessary.[/quote]

Its pretty stupid, but the penalty for repeatedly taking a banned stimulant probably isn't worse than taking it once.
Then its probably the same penalty if he had taken a banned steroid.

Imagine driving on the wrong side of the road pissed had the same penalty as driving 55 in the 50 zone.
Or if answering the phone when your wife rings had the same penalty as driving at 130 in the 100 zone .... oops it does.

Stupid bloody world .... all you dickhead lawmakers can get stuffed.

 

[aussierulesrules]

I agree with Brian that Saad has been ridiculously stupid for continually taking something that wasn't cleared by the club AND then going on radio before the appeal window closed.

Farcical.

I wonder if the club knew he was going on SEN?

Yep, bloody stupid, IMO. If he'd kept quiet ASADA may have let him get away with the 18 months, but coming out inside the window where they could appeal and admitting on radio that he'd done it several times would likely have been like a red rag to a bull and given ASADA little doubt that they had to make more of an example of him and go for the full 2 years.

Sometimes it's just better to keep your mouth shut and not temp fate. They may have already made their minds up about appealing, but surely it wasn't worth risking it if they hadn't? Bloody hell.

 

[Q TRAIN]

Im obviously not talking for everybody on here, but i think its fair to say most of us arent all that upset Saad got rubbed out. We know he did a stupid thing.
We are all more upset that he got rubbed out while the Essendope players all got off

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Im obviously not talking for everybody on here, but i think its fair to say most of us arent all that upset Saad got rubbed out. We know he did a stupid thing.
We are all more upset that he got rubbed out while the Essendope players all got off

Personally I find it unfair that dickheads like Justin Beiber can do dumb things every day and get away with it, while Saad looks like losing his chance at being an AFL footballer.

 

[Confuscius]

Im obviously not talking for everybody on here, but i think its fair to say most of us arent all that upset Saad got rubbed out. We know he did a stupid thing.
We are all more upset that he got rubbed out while the Essendope players all got off

They haven't got off anything yet. I honestly believe that it's taking so long because they want to ensure they get everyone involved, and to do so requires an incredibly thorough process.

If anything, Saady saying that he took something from someone he trusted like a coach and thus didn't check off the ingredients sounds quite similar to what happened to the Bomber's players.

Except, y'know, they actually were their coaches.

Edit: you're right though, if they get off I will be disgustingly angry

 

[SaintLex]

Im obviously not talking for everybody on here, but i think its fair to say most of us arent all that upset Saad got rubbed out. We know he did a stupid thing.
We are all more upset that he got rubbed out while the Essendope players all got off

The Essendon players haven't gotten away with anything yet. Don't speak too soon.

 

[Q TRAIN]

The Essendon players haven't gotten away with anything yet. Don't speak too soon.

I was actually starting to believe that they will get off with a soft slap with a wet lettuce leaf. But after making Andy D look like a fool again, maybe that stubborn arrogant prick might go after them again and give Asada a bit more infomation

 

[aussierulesrules]

Personally I find it unfair that dickheads like Justin Beiber can do dumb things every day and get away with it, while Saad looks like losing his chance at being an AFL footballer.

The thing is though, Saad and everyone else on an AFL list get it hammered into them by their clubs and probably someone also comes out from the AFL or ASADA, to tell them how careful they need to be and to not take any risks when it comes to what they put into their bodies (especially if what they are taking is designed for an energy boost, or anything like that) and what the extremely serious consequences can be if they take something that is on the banned list, so if they make a mistake like Saad did they really don't have anyone to blame but themselves.

Yes it is harsh, but they know the risks and if they choose to take those risks this is the almost certain outcome if they don't pay off.

As for Bieber, the karma-bus will stop at his door like it will everyone else, you don't need to worry about that.

 

[VDS66]

Saad deserves four years for getting on the radio and telling the world he had taken it several times before a game, how stupid can one be? For that reason alone ASADA should appeal, it sends the wrong message that you can continually cheat and only miss one full season of footy.

They should send him off to Indonesia.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

The thing is though, Saad and everyone else on an AFL list get it hammered into them by their clubs and probably someone also comes out from the AFL or ASADA, to tell them how careful they need to be and to not take any risks when it comes to what they put into their bodies (especially if what they are taking is designed for an energy boost, or anything like that) and what the extremely serious consequences can be if they take something that is on the banned list, so if they make a mistake like Saad did they really don't have anyone to blame but themselves.

Yes it is harsh, but they know the risks and if they choose to take those risks this is the almost certain outcome if they don't pay off.

As for Bieber, the karma-bus will stop at his door like it will everyone else, you don't need to worry about that.

If only that were true.

 

[aussierulesrules]

It is. Everyone gets theirs, one way or another.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

Yes condemn Saad for telling the truth. This is a new low in condemning him for that. Surely you don't think Saad wouldn't have also told the complete truth when giving evidence?

ASADA would have reviewed the text of interview and case files and made a judgement as to whether to appeal, or not, based on that.

There is no doubt that Saad was naive in doing what he did and the vast majority of football supporters would agree that he has broken the laws governing this, but the 18 month punishment is not proportionate to the crime. Calling for four years, even in flippantly is callous and unnecessary.

A new low in condemning someone who is a serial drug cheat? I don't believe so, and my comments about him getting four years were not flippant.

In regards to whether the Saints knew he was going on radio, he's no longer employed by the club so it had nothing to do with us. For the rest of my response, see ARR's post.

 

[BrianSpeaking]

I was actually starting to believe that they will get off with a soft slap with a wet lettuce leaf. But after making Andy D look like a fool again, maybe that stubborn arrogant prick might go after them again and give Asada a bit more infomation

A little birdie told me that ASADA is poised to issue infraction notices and the club has been made aware of this, all we need to do is put two and two together. Where do we think these so called 'secret documents' have come from? Gonzo? No. ASADA? No. Hird and Essendon? Yes.

 

[Sunshine Saint]

A new low in condemning someone who is a serial drug cheat? I don't believe so, and my comments about him getting four years were not flippant.

In regards to whether the Saints knew he was going on radio, he's no longer employed by the club so it had nothing to do with us. For the rest of my response, see ARR's post.

Your condemning of Saad wasn't because he was a serial drug cheat, it was because he publicly told the truth.

Saad deserves four years for getting on the radio and telling the world he had taken it several times before a game, how stupid can one be? For that reason alone ASADA should appeal, it sends the wrong message that you can continually cheat and only miss one full season of footy.

The interesting thing about Saad telling the truth about this, is that it is consistent with the fact that he was unaware he was in fact doing anything unto wards, let alone illegal. If his taking of the shake and its status as illegal, on match day, he logically would have said that this was the only time, he had taken it. By his admission, that he had taken it throughout the year and simply not been tested, clearly shows that he had no idea that he was doing the wrong thing. Otherwise why admit to multiple instances of taking this throughout the year.

Naive, ill informed, yes. But a serial drug chat, no. Was your objection simply that Saad has a different moral compass than you, in telling the truth, or is there more at play in your demonising him calling for a four year ban, which as we all know, would be a life time ban from every playing AFL again? All for taking a product that is legal 6 days a week, but not on the 7th.

I wonder if you would be calling for the same penalties, if the player in question was BJ?

 

[ike2112]

It is but I fully support the rules that WADA have in place.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WADA acknowledge that genuine misunderstandings etc may require more lenient punishment, and allow for less than 2yr in their rules.
They (wada) only appeal or get involved in individual cases (normally by appeal to CAS) where they believe an association has been too lenient.
They've allowed people who did exactly the same as Saad to be handed bans of 18, 14, and even as little as 5 month bans.
ASADA are it seems pretty much the strictest association out there. Yet are hypocritical in when they use that sledgehammer of theirs.

 

[Squizz]

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2013-12-05/aflpa-unhappy-with-saad-appeal

AFLPA boss Matt Finnis said (the) appeal showed a lack of respect to the expertise and the standing of the AFL tribunal that handed down the penalty.

He expressed surprise and disappointment ... saying that an 18-month sanction was substantial as it represented a significant chunk of an average AFL player's career.

"For any anti-doping regime to be credible and engender confidence among those it seeks to bind, it must be fair and recognise proportionality of penalties imposed," Finnis said. "This inevitably involves recognition of the specific context and impact of the penalty – something which the AFL Tribunal clearly did, but which is threatened by ASADA's decision to appeal."

However as he is unable to train with a club until the final month of the ban ... any increase in the penalty would make it very difficult for him to work his way back into the system.

Finnis said that component of the ban made Saad's 18-month penalty even more onerous than if it were awarded to an individual athlete.

"In the case of an individual athlete, in which the opportunity to still train during suspension would be possible, the same can't be said for Ahmed (who) ... is impacted by the AFL's particular listing times."

 

[Baldur]

Saad deserves four years for getting on the radio and telling the world he had taken it several times before a game, how stupid can one be? For that reason alone ASADA should appeal, it sends the wrong message that you can continually cheat and only miss one full season of footy.

I was already aware this was the case, as was everybody who read the original stories as to what happened and considered the implications. From the beginning the story was that Saad had followed his normal match day proceedure. No doubt ASADA was well aware of this.

ASADA was sent a message. The message is "Half way cheating does not work. Go the whole way. Steriods, masking agents, etc etc. You end up with a great career and if caught get no more then some idiot who does not read the label on a drink bottle"

Cheating to my mind requires intent or at least willful blindness. Saad I think comes close to willful blindness, but quite close enough. Unlike the Essendon players, 50+ injections is willful blindness.

 

[ike2112]

If you seriously think that the information-gathering phase leading to, and within the tribunal, didn't include the question "is this the first time you have used that particular beverege on a match day?", then I would love to read what questions you think they would have spent the time asking him.

The radio interview was not new news to Saad's file.

Now, whether his being so open and honest gave ASADA a worry around perception, is another thing. But the fact that he had used the drink on other matchdays was not new information. He strongly implied it numerous times, just never outright explicitly stated it. But he has many times said he followed his usual pre-game routine, and that included this drink, and when he told the Saints Dr this, the doc knew that was the source.

 

[stkildathunda]

How do we know he is telling the truth and didn't know he wasn't allowed take it? I mean look at everyone ever done, they are say they are innocent and all were "good honest people".

He admitted to taking it on regular basis and trusted an outside source. Look at the product in question and look at what benefits it gives you, there's only one reason why you'd be taking that on Gameday IMO.

 

[Baldur]

How do we know he is telling the truth and didn't know he wasn't allowed take it? I mean look at everyone ever done, they are say they are innocent and all were "good honest people".

He admitted to taking it on regular basis and trusted an outside source. Look at the product in question and look at what benefits it gives you, there's only one reason why you'd be taking that on Gameday IMO.

We do not, everybody who is done for breaking rules has a sob story. Judges decide if they believe the story based on the evidance before them. Make your mind up one way or another. But which way you come down will say more about you than Saad.

 

[St_Laz]

He MAY have been able to play AFL again if he got an 18 month ban. But a 2 year ban is career over. WADS would know this. Why are they being so callous?
He could've been shooting up steroids and actively avoiding detection and got the same ban?! What's the point in having an investigation or trial then?

 

[Defacto]

We do not, everybody who is done for breaking rules has a sob story. Judges decide if they believe the story based on the evidance before them. Make your mind up one way or another. But which way you come down will say more about you than Saad.

i agree

the 18 month ban to saad is already pretty severe. 24 months is over the top.

people comparing matty clarke to saad need a reality check. one will lose over 200k a year, thats much more severe than someone competing in an amateur sport, that isnt his main source of income

saad co-operated with asada

matty clarke gave them the finger

big differences between the two, hell look at matty clarkes interview, shows exactly the type of bloke he is

 

[Persevering Saint]

The latest on Saad, which is...

... nothing's happening.

http://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/fo...limbo-with-asada/story-fndv8ufg-1226855190767

AHMED Saad is stuck in limbo, still waiting for an appeal date to find out if ASADA will successfully lift his doping sentence to two years.
As Essendon players continue to await potential infraction notices, the former Saint still has no idea if his football career is alive or on life support.

Former ASADA boss Richard Ings said he believed ASADA should have been happy with an 18-month ban rather than appealing it.

Saad has been told that ASADA will definitely appeal his 18-month sentence but has no date to appear again before the AFL’s three-member anti-doping tribunal.

 

[L_W_P]

Finnis should be right onto this to be honest. He would have most of the relevant information from his time at the AFLPA.

 

[Percel]

Big day tomoz for the little fella