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That is still youngish in aircraft terms.Fleet age averages 9 yrs.
Qantas’ 737’s are 12 years old and their A330’s are nearing 14 years old.
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That is still youngish in aircraft terms.Fleet age averages 9 yrs.
All those are happy to walk away and will be wiped outThats why its the shareholders that need to take the haircut.
- Etihad Airways (20.94%)
- Singapore Airlines (20.09%)
- Nanshan Group (19.98%)
- HNA Group (19.82%)
- Virgin Group (10.42%)
All those are happy to walk away and will be wiped out
The bond holders will be the ones that stand to lose the most.
I think 4 of the 5 parties care about the business and would like Government money but probably realise that without major changes things weren’t going to improve. HNA is as good as dead so they probably couldn’t care less what happens to their share. I don’t know the legality of who is responsible for the leases as it’s not an area I have great knowledge in. The A330’s being leased are fantastic aircraft but it was a very poor lease arrangement and the administrators will find a way to either cut them completely or re-negotiate them. I would try to keep them as they offer a great product for Transcon service but with the amount of aircraft sitting idle I’m sure the lessors will take whatever they get for themOr were the current shareholders expecting Govt money. Are they party to the leases?
I think 4 of the 5 parties care about the business
And they probably won’t IMONot enough to stump up as yet.
Someone like TPG will probably buy it, sell off all the landing slots to airlines with no licence to operate in Australia yet, asset strip, and then do a slick PR campaign selling it off for heaps while being worth less than zero. Just as they did with Myer. And three months after the refloat, we'll have a monopoly airline again for 2-3 years while someone else gets licences sorted and operates main routes only.why don’t u put together a few business associates PR and buy it?
I personally don’t think that will be the case but who knows. It all depends with who buys them but I think Virgin will still continue but not sure what it will look like.Someone like TPG will probably buy it, sell off all the landing slots to airlines with no licence to operate in Australia yet, asset strip, and then do a slick PR campaign selling it off for heaps while being worth less than zero. Just as they did with Myer. And three months after the refloat, we'll have a monopoly airline again for 2-3 years while someone else gets licences sorted and operates main routes only.
Except they are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them, which at the moment is scrap valueThat is still youngish in aircraft terms.
Qantas’ 737’s are 12 years old and their A330’s are nearing 14 years old.
I personally don’t think that will be the case but who knows. It all depends with who buys them but I think Virgin will still continue but not sure what it will look like.
Yeah I wasn’t having a go at you just hearing plenty of commentary from people saying VA have an ageing fleet when in fact it is still a pretty good darn fleet.Except they are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them, which at the moment is scrap value
$2.3 B Secured $2 B Bonds $1.9 B Aircraft Leases $0.5 B Employees 0.25 B Trade and Leases. 6.9 Billion in total the creditors are getting a buzz cut shortly
This is going to get ugly
Pert Airport is privately owned (Hedge fund from memory). They are applying lien, which means they can hold assets in their control until their debts are settled.Not sure who owns Perth airport or who provides legal advice to them but as I understand it there are laws which determine the order in which creditors are looked after in the case of a company going bust. Creditors can't just go in free for all and start stealing assets to recover their debts.
Imagine you paid for a tradie to do some work on your house and they went bust before the work was finished. No worries I'll just pop round to the guys house and drive off with his truck.
If any airport was going to do it then Perth would be it.Not sure who owns Perth airport or who provides legal advice to them but as I understand it there are laws which determine the order in which creditors are looked after in the case of a company going bust. Creditors can't just go in free for all and start stealing assets to recover their debts.
Imagine you paid for a tradie to do some work on your house and they went bust before the work was finished. No worries I'll just pop round to the guys house and drive off with his truck.
Pert Airport is privately owned (Hedge fund from memory). They are applying lien, which means they can hold assets in their control until their debts are settled.
In your situation, if the tradie left tools at your house, and you were owed money, you could apply lien similarly over those tools. You couldn't go to his house and steal his truck/tools.
Within reason everyone could try and do it. I believe you can only lien assets to the value of what you are owed. If Virgin move out of administration then Perth Airport, as a creditor, will be satisfied. It's not my area of expertise though.Thanks for the clarification, do they at least need some sort of court order? What protects Virgin if the claim is contestable? Also especially if they need those assets to generate revenue (I know in this case the planes aren't doing anything so that's a moot point).
Assuming there's multiple creditors (other airports) it seems a bit of a free for all, especially if they try to trade out of their troubles when travel bans are relaxed. If Virgin owes more to Sydney airport than Perth but there's no planes on the ground, why does Perth get priority?
Seems like the wild west.
Within reason everyone could try and do it. I believe you can only lien assets to the value of what you are owed. If Virgin move out of administration then Perth Airport, as a creditor, will be satisfied. It's not my area of expertise though.
Any chance they could be rentals?Cars, excavator used to impound Virgin planes at Perth Airport amid stand-off over 'significant' debt
Perth Airport is using heavy machinery and company vehicles to block a number of Virgin Australia aircraft from taking off over what it says are $16 million in unpaid debts.www.abc.net.au
"Perth Airport says the debt-laden airline owes it $16 million in outstanding invoices for airfield and terminal use charges."
Must be pretty ordinary planes to be worth less than $16 mil in total. What are they, crop dusters?
It'll be like Ansett when it crashed it will float/glide a while during administration but with no bailout unless sold its crashing.Was listening to Hutchy and Barrett's podcast today, they both reckoned that going into administration would be a clause of a goverment bailout package. I don't know much about this sort of stuff but they seemed to think there's no doubt Virgin would be continuing.
The trade creditors and rent probably wont get paid , so I suppose it's worth a try, although it shouldnt work. Secured creditors and employees would be paid out I would think, I can't see anyone stumping more than 3 billion but who knows it may not even be that.Thanks for the clarification, do they at least need some sort of court order? What protects Virgin if the claim is contestable? Also especially if they need those assets to generate revenue (I know in this case the planes aren't doing anything so that's a moot point).
Assuming there's multiple creditors (other airports) it seems a bit of a free for all, especially if they try to trade out of their troubles when travel bans are relaxed. If Virgin owes more to Sydney airport than Perth but there's no planes on the ground, why does Perth get priority?
Seems like the wild west.
Not sure who owns Perth airport or who provides legal advice to them but as I understand it there are laws which determine the order in which creditors are looked after in the case of a company going bust. Creditors can't just go in free for all and start stealing assets to recover their debts.
Imagine you paid for a tradie to do some work on your house and they went bust before the work was finished. No worries I'll just pop round to the guys house and drive off with his truck.