Black Caviar overrated!

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Surkin said:
Lol at thinking the Melbourne Cup is the best race in the world. Ever heard of the Arc De Triomphe?

Not even the best race in Australia - Cox Plate has that honour.
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Depends on how you determine best s'pose. Attendance, betting turnover, telly ratings, how well known.......... the best.
 
catman 71 said:
I can't find the "Racing" thread, so I will post it here.

I may cop a lot of flak for this, but I believe that Black Caviar is overrated.

Sure it keeps winning races, but who does it beat?

I am not a huge fan of racing, so I was shocked to find that Black Caviar has not been entered in the Caulfield Cup, the Cox Plate or the Melbourne Cup.

My brother, a sports nut, told me that Black Caviar is a sprinter, so it won't do endurance races.

Well, then, I think all the hype is misplaced.

Here I was thinking that everyone talking up Black Caviar as "the next Phar Lap" (and I have heard that comparison), was a champion racehorse, who can match it with the best and beat them. Now I find that it races in the lesser races on the day.

This is why Black Caviar is no champion.

Champions compete in the top "matches" and draws.

Champion AFL teams are the ones who win premierships.
Champion F1 drivers win world championships.
Champion tennis players win the Aust, French, U.S. or Wimbledon (that is why I don't class Caroline Wozniacki as a champion either).
Champion NFL teams win Superbowls
Champion baseball teams win the World Series.

And here is where I get relevant:-
Champion racehorses win the Cox Plate, Caulfield or Melbourne Cup.

Doremus was a champion, Phar Lap was a champion, Mikaybe Diva was a champion, Think Big was a champion.

So, tell me, where does "Black Caviar" rank with the truly great racehorses?

I have never heard so much hype for one horse since people hyped another non-entity, Sunlyne, who was gushed about, despite constantly being beaten by Northerly.

Let's cut the crap. The only reason most commentators gush about Black Caviar is that they are making easy money betting on him all the time.

Once Black Caviar loses, and the shock of that dies down, you will never hear of her again.
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Ok just seen this thread for the 1st time and to be honest I havent laughed this much ever in my life. Black Caviar is a superstar of a horse, the Chris Judd of horse racing.

Black Caviar was bred to be a sprinter and will never run over anything longer than 1400m, get used to it.

Yes, she will most likely go overseas next year to Royal Ascot, She will also travel to Perth before the autumn.

Anyone who thinks Black Caviar is anything less than a champion clearly knows nothing about horse racing. :thumbsu::cool:
 
The_Doctor said:
Melbourne Cup is the most prestigious race in Australia but as for quality it is no where near the Pinnacle.

Makybe Diva is also not even close to our greatest champion ever, she is probably the one who should have a thread like this. A champion no doubt and i loved watching her but she gets overrated especially by people who dont follow racing heavily.

Also Catman 71
Joined: Sep 2011

100% troll - I choose to believe nobody is this ignorant and stupid
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Almost all correc there however, Makybe Diva was a legend whilst racing, especially after her 3rd Melbourne Cup. Overrated ? my arse
 
Jobe3votes said:
Ok just seen this thread for the 1st time and to be honest I havent laughed this much ever in my life. Black Caviar is a superstar of a horse, the Chris Judd of horse racing.

Black Caviar was bred to be a sprinter and will never run over anything longer than 1400m, get used to it.

Yes, she will most likely go overseas next year to Royal Ascot, She will also travel to Perth before the autumn.

Anyone who thinks Black Caviar is anything less than a champion clearly knows nothing about horse racing. :thumbsu::cool:
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There's been talk that Moody is planning to push her up to 1600m eventually, and that she might actually be even stronger at that distance! He reckons if Black Caviar looks good at the distance, he might go straight for it and challenge Frankel at the Queen Anne Stakes next year.

It would be so awesome if that were the case. Two of the highest rated horses ever facing off.
 
Jobe3votes said:
Almost all correc there however, Makybe Diva was a legend whilst racing, especially after her 3rd Melbourne Cup. Overrated ? my arse
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What she did was amazing, but she is a tad overrated. IMO she wouldn't even have been the best horse of the last 10 years, she would have never beaten horses such as Northerly, Sunline, Lonhro and So You Think at any distance below 2400.

Back to OP, you're way off. Black Caviar is magical, probably the best horse EVER over distances 1000-1200m. She wins the pinnacle races between those distances, it's just that you aren't a racing fan and have probably never heard of them.
 
She is reminding me so much of Silent Witness, he put more fear into sprinters than any other horse i can remember
 
Cuddly Carlotta said:
Depends on how you determine best s'pose. Attendance, betting turnover, telly ratings, how well known.......... the best.
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Working on that system then the best racing car driver is the one who wins the Indianapolis 500 as the attendence on race-day is the largest of any motor race in the world, the ratings are the largest and it is arguably the most well known.

But simply are they really the best driver world?
 

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I can see where the OP is coming from but when I think about Black Cavier's last win and the easy way she did it then I am inclined to think she would go okay over longer distances.

It really comes back to preparation and if she was given a 12 month period or so to develop her staying then she might be more than a handful come next Spring
 
Bombermania said:
I can see where the OP is coming from but when I think about Black Cavier's last win and the easy way she did it then I am inclined to think she would go okay over longer distances.

It really comes back to preparation and if she was given a 12 month period or so to develop her staying then she might be more than a handful come next Spring
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I don't

Non racing people only believe a race is big/important if they've heard of it and it's raced in a 3 week period in Oct/Nov
 
saint mac said:
I don't

Non racing people only believe a race is big/important if they've heard of it and it's raced in a 3 week period in Oct/Nov
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True to a point, I heard someone on T.V claim that there wasn't daily races, to my amazement the host didn't pull him up instead laughing in agreement

Back to the point - The OP was referring to Black Cavier not winning a major race and most major horse races are over longer distances than what Black Cavier has won at
 
Private Hudson said:
The lack of knowledge of horse racing in this post is laughable ... Black Cavier not a champion because she doesn't run in the major staying races is possibly the most moronic, idiotic, non sensical thing I've ever read in my life , everyone is now dumber for having read it , I award you no points and may god have mercy on your soul !
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This.:D

Horse racing is the most frustrating of all sports when trying to describe the ins and outs to non racing people.
 
Lurkalot said:
OP must be giggling their butt off...surely a complete piss take.

What with the (intentional) misspelling (Mikaybe Diva, Doremus, Sunlyne) I smell an alias of master troll GeelongCrazy26
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It is a parody and a good one. These are the types of things that non racing people say.
 
YOTC said:
Makybe Diva was a champion? LOL

Caviar is nothing compared to Phar Lap until she is weighted like Phar Lap. Same applies to any other faux champion we've had in the past.
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Agree with this sentiment.

The true legends of the turf could do it all in WFA and Handicap races with the top weights.

Brilliant sprinter, but not in the same class as the all time greats.
 
AndSmithMustScore said:
The true legends of the turf could do it all in WFA and Handicap races with the top weights.
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Set weight and WFA racing is the time-honoured way to determine the best. Otherwise the handicapper just keeps piling weight on until champions either meet their match or break down under the strain. It makes little sense to continually put a good horse through that when the prizemoney is so good at WFA. Phar Lap only raced five times in handicaps after his first feature win (and was beaten twice).

Besides, BC gave the males weight and a thrashing in the Newmarket.
 
Ron The Bear said:
Set weight and WFA racing is the time-honoured way to determine the best. Otherwise the handicapper just keeps piling weight on until champions either meet their match or break down under the strain. It makes little sense to continually put a good horse through that when the prizemoney is so good at WFA. Phar Lap only raced five times in handicaps after his first feature win (and was beaten twice).

Besides, BC gave the males weight and a thrashing in the Newmarket.
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Hypothetically if she met a horse like Schillaci race after race carrying 60kgs as often as he had to she'd not have anything like the record she has now imo.

And that was at a time when the depth in sprinting was arguably much stronger and much bigger fields.
 
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