Bluemour Melting Pot XXIX

[RPCB]

That came out quite blunt, just imagine a jokingly voice. But I am in the Cerra later Adam camp.

All good mate!

 

[majesticseacapt]

Offering McGovern as trade bait is Ludacris.

In theory, yes it could be beneficial.

But the reality is that he is under contract - and a pretty substantial one at that. This isn't the MLB where you can trade players without their consent. McGovern would have to want to be traded, which usually comes with an extension ala B.Gibbs as incentive. But as McGovern is injury prone and hasn't played the level of football associated with what he would demand financially, then his suitors would be slim to none

 

[Gethelred]

Still think the final games are pretty crucial for all parties involved and interested in Cerra.

Fremantle currently sit in the 8, and have had what many would consider a successful season.

Bit of an aside, but I don't know if any club would call a season a success short of winning a premiership. What you have are degrees of failure; mitigated, qualified, and inexcusable.

Fremantle might have every reason to think positively of their year, but I highly doubt they're thinking of it in terms of success.

Brayshaw is a future elite midfielder, and there's some other handy young players in that squad, eg Serong and Hayden Young. Cerra gets to stay and gauge how the Dockers are tracking over the next couple of years. They can sell him on incremental improvement, and obviously can pay him well too. I'm not as bullish on Freo others, but the optics are pretty decent. Still lacking pieces along the spine. They have what looks like a million capable key defenders, but no quality key forwards. Tabener is a B-grader at best. I'm also not convinced in Longmuir, who outwardly reminds me of Brendan Bolton with a better list. Their next 3 are all winnable, but they could also get knocked over in all of them.

This is a bit of a moot point, seeing as at no point at Carlton did Bolton have a list that was better than bottom four, and at no point has Longmuir been able to assemble a forward line or a back line that is AFL standard.

Coaches paying for the sins of their list managers is something of a recurring theme at Carlton, so it's a bit unfair to judge another young coach in the same circumstances. But then, if we were more understanding of this, perhaps we'd stop firing coaches and instead fire the list managers a little more for underperforming.

Carlton are at the end of an external review, but have more elite young talent (as in AA caliber players) than most teams. Clearly underperformed in season 2021, but despite this still only sits 1 win behind his current team. Go home factor is obvious, and can also match Freo's offer contract wise. Wouldn't be walking in as Carlton's best midfielder, but has the opportunity to become this over time. Next game is a gimme, 2 following will determine a hell of a lot - the club can still play finals and that would be a clear indication the squad is headed in the right direction if the team can jag a couple of wins the last few rounds against quality opposition.

Agreed.

Richmond have shown interest, but recent history is starting to go against them WRT players signing with former powerhouses only for them to meander for a few years and then flatline. I don't think Richmond's squad is as good as Hawthorn 2016 or Geelong from 2012 onward, and they could well be set for a hard rebuild. They've still got some cache, but they've also dropped off a cliff the second half of the year, and lost to some pretty average sides. Think they are done in reality.

I mean, I've said more or less the same thing, but AFL players and their managers have been blinded by Geelong's and Hawthorn's gloss years after 2013/2015. Richmond are just as capable of selling themselves as we are, if not significantly more; they still have a Coleman medalist in a premiership year in Lynch, and they still have Dustin Martin.

A few of us look at them with the eyes of Carlton supporters and thinking why, when Cerra will be looking and thinking why not?

North. I'm probably in the minority, but I'd see them as an attractive place to be if I was Cerra. They are clearly on the up and already have an impressive young midfield, with a number of young stars who Cerra would develop with and around. Thomas, Simpkin, Stephenson and LDU are starting to become serious AFL players and they've got another couple developing in Phillips and Powell. There's also some real future star power up forward with Larkey and Zurhaar and a future star key defender in Ben McKay. They are a year or two behind Freo, but they could be a serious team if it all comes together, and could offer Cerra the most lucrative deal of any Melbourne-based squad.

Thoroughly agree, although they're going to fall off a but when Cunnington and Goldstein retire. Those two are in no small amount a huge reason why they've found a bit of form, and without the Goldstein to Cunnington connection we don't lose to them two weeks ago, regardless of no ruck.

Either way, Cerra is peaking at the right time. Odds on he gets an even bigger deal to stay, he cops a couple of years on a nice contract and re-assesses then.

That's why I don't want him.

I'm not paying 700 thousand for a player who has yet to reach 700 level play. That's just below superstar level; Treloar got 800 thousand when he left GWS, and that contract hung around Collingwood's neck for years afterward.

We already have Martin and Williams on 700 plus a season - with the caveat that some to all of that amount in excess of 600 was paid as part of a signing bonus - and the less said about McGovern the better. We are also just coming out of our 105% of the cap phase; we need to be careful where our money's going over the next few years.

If Cerra comes, I do not want it to be for more than Bolton got, and I definitely do not want to part with this year's first for him. A future first, a second round pick and a player; those are acceptable prices to pay for what he's doing right now. We should not be paying Fremantle for his potential, and we shouldn't be paying him for football he's not yet played. And more than that, we have players of our own who could be doing 85-90% of what he's doing inside six months.

 

[gab213]

Offering McGovern as trade bait is Ludacris.

In theory, yes it could be beneficial.

But the reality is that he is under contract - and a pretty substantial one at that. This isn't the MLB where you can trade players without their consent. McGovern would have to want to be traded, which usually comes with an extension ala B.Gibbs as incentive. But as McGovern is injury prone and hasn't played the level of football associated with what he would demand financially, then his suitors would be slim to none

There is also the possibility that with some luck on the injury front he becomes a valuable contributor to our team.

 

[gab213]

If only they had selection integrity and played the newer posters ...

Are you angling for early retirement with a pay out?

 

[forever blue 1]

If only they had selection integrity and played the newer posters ...

I sleep at

Are you angling for early retirement with a pay out?

Its a chook lotto!

 

[forever blue 1]

I sleep at

Its a chook lotto!

So we can’t have a little fun Gab in general conversation? I was expecting nothing but a laugh face

 

[Gethelred]

Offering McGovern as trade bait is Ludacris.

In theory, yes it could be beneficial.

But the reality is that he is under contract - and a pretty substantial one at that. This isn't the MLB where you can trade players without their consent. McGovern would have to want to be traded, which usually comes with an extension ala B.Gibbs as incentive. But as McGovern is injury prone and hasn't played the level of football associated with what he would demand financially, then his suitors would be slim to none

Gov is, despite all suppositions, still worth something to a club that has need in his position, that being a medium forward who plays tall. Fremantle could desperately use a player of his type, and he's from Perth. Fremantle have a genuine inability to find players to play in their front half, and supposing that Gov's injuries are starting to come good, as a potential bonus added to a first round pick he could very easily be considered a both a free hit and of potential value.

If we offered to pay him 350 a year, that's half his contract off our books. You've in essence given yourself 350 to spend elsewhere. And I think the notion that you cannot trade a player unless they want to go is archaic; Treloar loved Collingwood, and he for all intents and purposes did not want to leave. It happened anyway.

Gov is not nearly as attached to Carlton as Treloar was to Collingwood, and he has every reason (if informed he is not in our future plans) to explore a career elsewhere. Under my proposal, he's still getting paid the same amount. Not every exit need be as acrimonious as Treloars was.

 

[gab213]

So we can’t have a little fun Gab in general conversation? I was expecting nothing but a laugh face

I was having fun, the chook looked scary.

 

[forever blue 1]

I was having fun, the chook looked scary.

Yea it’s funny, my chook picture on my phone had the chook the side view
But bf integrates it to chook mug shot mode

 

[Gethelred]

There is also the possibility that with some luck on the injury front he becomes a valuable contributor to our team.

I can't see it.

He's only played more than 13 games a season twice in his entire career; his first year (2016, and 23 games) and his first year with us (2019, and 16 games). Injured is what he is, nearly always.

At Brisbane or one of the obnoxious clubs that somehow seems to be able to keep their players on the park the entire ****ing time, maybe, but not at Carlton. If it was going to happen, it'd have happened with the change of scenery.

 

[Just Kreuzing]

it would be good to offload Ferris' salary but there's no way he would agree to the trade, nothing funny about North

being at Carlton is a "target rich environment" for his skills

Not sure North would want Ferris, maybe just keep him and walk Snake Baker through the PSD.....

 

[Just Kreuzing]

If only they had selection integrity and played the newer posters ...

Infraction integrity....

 

[Arr0w]

That's a good way to end up like Collingwood.

Don't think we have cap issues and would still have decent coin to attract a quality player

 

[azlou]

Don't think we have cap issues and would still have decent coin to attract a quality player

What’s you’re opinion on Cerra I’m still on the get him for $650
But some have put up strong arguments to contrary ide be interested in you’re take

 

[Beyond Blue]

Offering McGovern as trade bait is Ludacris.

In theory, yes it could be beneficial.

But the reality is that he is under contract - and a pretty substantial one at that. This isn't the MLB where you can trade players without their consent. McGovern would have to want to be traded, which usually comes with an extension ala B.Gibbs as incentive. But as McGovern is injury prone and hasn't played the level of football associated with what he would demand financially, then his suitors would be slim to none

Agreed, we'd probably end up having to pay part of his salary to get a reasonable deal done or take under on any deal that reflects his current market value, so we might as well see the contract out and hope he turns it around in 2022 and 2023.

 

[mjonc43]

Trading McGovern would be the best bit of business we’ve ever done.



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[AceAndy]

Trading McGovern would be the best bit of business we’ve ever done.



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Who would take him ?

 

[Blue and Blue]

If McGovern kicks 6 in a GF for us and we win then yeah real good business..... that we traded him in......
Kind of player that would too.

 

[Arr0w]

What’s you’re opinion on Cerra I’m still on the get him for $650
But some have put up strong arguments to contrary ide be interested in you’re take

Always liked him, just think the trade cost would now be too high

 

[Broadside]

If McGovern kicks 6 in a GF for us and we win then yeah real good business..... that we traded him in......
Kind of player that would too.

I have run the numbers. The chances of us making the Grand final AND McGovern being fit and available…..

Well it’s a small number.

I needed a magnifying glass for the Venn diagram.

 

[DangerousD]

Don't trade him because you think he's not up to it or not going to make it or he's lazy or he's not very good or he picks and chooses when to go. Trade him when, and only when, you're going to get decent value in return.

I am so so so confused by this, leaving the names out of it, why would you need to trade a player in the first place, if they were playing well enough to get a good return?

The only reason we raise players in hypothetical trade scenarios, is because they havent displayed the qualities required to progress the team and we want to get some value back, before there is zero value.

If a players has shown they aren’t up to it, don’t trade, but trade if they have, it seems totally backwards.

 

[DangerousD]

Always liked him, just think the trade cost would now be too high

What’s the cost/comparable trade?

 

[Arr0w]

What’s the cost/comparable trade?

A mid to low 1st + a late 2nd

 

[The Blue Weirdo]

Trading McGovern would be the best bit of business we’ve ever done.



Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

There is a certain aura about Gov. He's going to be another Paddy Dow next year, and make a lot of bigfooty posters eat their words. He also resembles Dow in the way he doesn't need a shitload of possessions to be awesome, always looking to bring others into the game.