Bluemour Melting Pot XXVI

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As per the Bluemour File OP, this is a thread for discussing Carlton related rumours.
http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bluemour-file.1085141/

Rumour posters should post their rumours in both threads for those that like just to read rumours and for those that like to have get lost in their rumour files.

Remember ... #Bluemour





Continued from here ...

Bluemour Melting Pot XXV

Continued here ... https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bluemour-melting-pot-xxvi.1250444/
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Continued here:

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Bluemour Melting Pot XXVII

As per the Bluemour File OP, this is a thread for discussing Carlton related rumours. http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/bluemour-file.1085141/ Rumour posters should post their rumours in both threads for those that like just to read rumours and for those that like to have get lost in their...
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Broadside said:
is Oliver a good user of the ball or just an extractor, I haven't seem him play much this year --- seems to me we need more outside quality not inside mid but I guess Cripps does need a hand before he is broken.
Click to expand...

His vision and disposal by hand is up there with the best in the comp at present. His kicking is middle of the road for his type - you generally don't want him to be the last in a chain of handballs where he ends up having the final kick inside 50, but if he's in the middle of that chain of handballs he's generally putting someone else in a good position to finish.

His running has improved significantly this season. Similar to the way Cripps went from a fairly static contested mid to one who was prepared to tuck the ball under his arm and dash out the back of a contest.

He can be a bit "gimme gimme" when he feels he's in a good position, and definitely shows some obvious frustration when overlooked by teammates. Reckon that's very much a maturity thing, but also a little bit emblematic of Melbourne in general who aren't a particularly "team-first" team.

Centre stoppages with Oliver, Cripps and any third mid with good acceleration and disposal is going to be a handful for opponents. We'll be able to rotate Williams, Walsh, Martin, Fisher and Cunners through to offer that. Possibly Dow and Philp if they have good enough preseasons to warrant selection.

Then we've got contested mid rotations in Setters and Curnow who provide big bodies when either of Cripps or Oliver are elsewhere. Kennedy, JSOS, Stocker and Kemp the depth/developing options in that space.

Plus the crafty but not overly athletic or physically imposing types like Murphy, SPS and Gibbons who will also offer a point of difference when required.

Despite the fact he's not a classy outside mid, Oliver strengthens an area we are still a little bit lacking in, and his ability to bring teammates into play with quick, precise handballs should allow us to get better value out of some of our damaging but not overly prolific outside types.

We could forego Oliver and chase a Whitfield (as an example of a classy outside mid), but then we're still vulnerable to Cripps being injured/suspended/out of form and being unable to actually bring that outside mid into the game enough.

Got sidetracked and decided to put together a little infographic to show how I see it working:

1603669957762.png
Not all of those names fit in the 22, of course, it's just an indication of the layered view I have of the midfield (ball winners, ball users, outside runners) and which players I identify with which type.

- TDK, Cripps, Oliver and rotations from Curnow/Setterfield are the ball winners. They're looking to clear the ball forward if they have to, but otherwise they should be feeding it out to the next group.
- The next group being Walsh, Williams, SPS, Fisher, Cunners and Martin, who are our better ball users going forward, but are also capable of hunting the loose ball - we don't want them on the bottom of the pack, but if they have to get stuck in they will.
- We've then got the genuine outside running types in Murph, Willo, Newnes and Gibbons who should all be holding position on the wings (not getting sucked into the contest).
- And the forward line looks dangerous on either a quick or a calculated entry, with 4 stay-at-home forwards, plus a few rotating through.
 
Benaly28 said:
Cripps,Oliver,Walsh,Curnow,Harry WILL take us to the promised land.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app
Click to expand...

You probably can’t even start a conversation with Melbourne without including one of the above I suspect as he’s contracted. Any how I have very few ins but one of the ones I do have is heavily linked to Melbourne. Oliver might want to leave but unless we’re willing to pay ridiculous overs, it’s not happening.
 

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What? Saints are targeting Shaun McKernan? 🤣
 
koutaaa said:
Pick 7 and our future first would be pretty good for Oliver. That realistically will be two top 10 picks
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How is future 1st going to be a top 10 pick? 18 isn't top 10...
But seriously, if we get Saad, Williams and Oliver, we shoot straight into top 6 contention. So it would be 7 and a pick in the mid to high teens. I don't think it's enough.
I'd happily throw in Dow. Still has big potential, just hasn't got the opportunities and they are likely to be less with that influx of players. Could be handy for them with more games under his belt.
 
Bfevola said:
The point is, no doubt from the ITK’S that Oliver wants to come, but the power is with Melboure here. If they say no then it’s not happening. Not sure if they are receptive or not. But publicly the noise is No. We need some luck and savvy convincing.
Click to expand...

Oliver just needs to tell Melbourne if it ain’t this year it’s next year so take your pick of compensation...Im done with you campaigners


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Jabba73 said:
Ok, first you need to convince the list of players you have nominated that they are not wanted at the club, and that they want to be at the target club, keeping in mind that if they do not want to go, you will have a very disgruntled and shattered player on your hands until their contract runs out. You also need to convince the other team that the players you don't want at your club are exactly what they need at theirs, good luck with that. If Dees are going to ask for players, they will already be entrenched in our best 22, not the fringe/potential players. Fringe players get chased as value trades to meet needs, not as swaps for elite players.

Melbourne are going to want a kings ransom, even if the rumoured rift is true, you don't let one of your better players go without a fight. They will rightly play hard ball to start with, only Oliver and his management will have any say over how long that will continue and that depends on how serious he is about getting out. Is it just a childish tantrum to gain some love and attention or is it the end of the road at the club and it is untenable for him to stay? Depending where he is on the scale determines if he can get here or not.

Saad will get done for a second with maybe a later pick swap factored in if we get Oliver. Cannot see us holding onto pick 7 in this scenario and it will need all of that and then probably our first next year as well to get Oliver. The best * can hope for is we swap both our firsts for Oliver and the Dees pick 23, which we then give to * for Saad.

We have used about 25 first round picks in the last 5 years, should be able to convince Gill to let us go without for a year or two if needed. Otherwise the blow up will be epic given some teams haven't used any since Walsh was born.
Click to expand...

Can’t disagree with any of this. Im struggling to see Melb willing to let go at a price that makes sense to us.

Hope I’m wrong!
 
Blue_Fusion said:
You reckon with Saad, Williams and Oliver, plus the return of Charlie Curnow will still see us net a top 10 pick next year?
Click to expand...
We'd have to play quite a few posters in our team to go that badly.
 

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TGR said:
You probably can’t even start a conversation with Melbourne without including one of the above I suspect as he’s contracted. Any how I have very few ins but one of the ones I do have is heavily linked to Melbourne. Oliver might want to leave but unless we’re willing to pay ridiculous overs, it’s not happening.
Click to expand...
we need a scandal - oliver's laptop being seized eg
 
TGR said:
You probably can’t even start a conversation with Melbourne without including one of the above I suspect as he’s contracted. Any how I have very few ins but one of the ones I do have is heavily linked to Melbourne. Oliver might want to leave but unless we’re willing to pay ridiculous overs, it’s not happening.
Click to expand...

Melbourne will no doubt ask for those names to be involved.

But they'll also be professional about it and look into what options there are at other clubs.

Melbourne's first pick this year is 23. That's probably going on Ben Brown, who addresses a major need of theirs.

They're also looking a decent chance of landing Isaac Smith as a free agent, who also addresses a major need of theirs.

So if they turn whatever they get for Oliver into Wines and an early second, then the net result is OUT: Oliver, IN: Wines, Smith, Brown, and they've still got an early second to take to the draft. However you look at it, that's improvement - no change in the number of quality inside mids, gain a mature winger and a bona fide key forward target.

I'm tipping the reason this is being kept relatively hush hush while both parties negotiate is because Melbourne are hunting around to see what they could land with the picks we're offering for Oliver.
 
Blue__Balls said:
Melbourne will no doubt ask for those names to be involved.

But they'll also be professional about it and look into what options there are at other clubs.

Melbourne's first pick this year is 23. That's probably going on Ben Brown, who addresses a major need of theirs.

They're also looking a decent chance of landing Isaac Smith as a free agent, who also addresses a major need of theirs.

So if they turn whatever they get for Oliver into Wines and an early second, then the net result is OUT: Oliver, IN: Wines, Smith, Brown, and they've still got an early second to take to the draft. However you look at it, that's improvement - no change in the number of quality inside mids, gain a mature winger and a bona fide key forward target.

I'm tipping the reason this is being kept relatively hush hush while both parties negotiate is because Melbourne are hunting around to see what they could land with the picks we're offering for Oliver.
Click to expand...
Even without Wines Melbourne has plnety of inside ball winners, losing Oliver isn't going to hurt that much when they have Petracca, Viney & Brayshaw. Not saying they will agree to a trade but they would be mad not to explore the opportunity to use a surplus to address a deficit.
 
Blue__Balls said:
Melbourne will no doubt ask for those names to be involved.

But they'll also be professional about it and look into what options there are at other clubs.

Melbourne's first pick this year is 23. That's probably going on Ben Brown, who addresses a major need of theirs.

They're also looking a decent chance of landing Isaac Smith as a free agent, who also addresses a major need of theirs.

So if they turn whatever they get for Oliver into Wines and an early second, then the net result is OUT: Oliver, IN: Wines, Smith, Brown, and they've still got an early second to take to the draft. However you look at it, that's improvement - no change in the number of quality inside mids, gain a mature winger and a bona fide key forward target.

I'm tipping the reason this is being kept relatively hush hush while both parties negotiate is because Melbourne are hunting around to see what they could land with the picks we're offering for Oliver.
Click to expand...

More likely that Melbourne have no interest in moving him from what I’m told. There’s been issues but they believe that it can be worked out. It’s going to take something not worth our while to make it happen.
 
The Greek Freak said:
Well considering I've seen Charlie up here most of the season and seen the way he's getting around I'd say I know it's BS..... 🙄
Click to expand...

There were very strong rumours that his initial operation and recovery didn’t go as perfect as planned. It does match the timeline.

Having over 12 months off will do him really well. He’ll be as good as new next year and in hindsight not having him this year wasn’t a huge issue. Write off year.
 
skadoosh said:
Cripps vs Oliver over their respective careers. Pretty amazing stuff from a 23yo, given the high stead we place on Cripps.
View attachment 995366
Click to expand...

Yep, Oliver is a People trying time downplay him here do not understand football.

Will be like having 2 Cripps, one a very good mark and one with a bit of leg speed...both with an insatiable desire for the footy


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
 
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