Brownlow Medal: Should the name be changed to Haydn Bunton Medal?

[Benno From Berwick]

That would be to the states that have won the last 5 flags and 7 of the last 9, would it?

While we are at it we will take the money that we paid to prop up a bankrupt VFL? OK?

Good luck, then!

Good tv money when you have lost your number market.

This state vs state crap is great. Shown the complex Western Australian, South Australian, Queenslanders all have when it comes to Victoria.

The reality is the Brownlow has been awarded to the best player in the VFL now AFL for too long to change it. Bunton was a great and will always be regarded as a legend of the game. He has his place in history. Lets not sour that by starting a futile debate!

 

[Benno From Berwick]

Umpires Award - Brownlow Medal
Players Award - Haydon Buton Medal
Coaches Award - Robert Walls Medal

Leigh Matthews award is the AFLPA award.

 

[FIGJAM]

Fig, it's not the VFL anymore it's the AFL. Having a player who played just about everywhere and was an ornament to the game makes sense to me... and we all contribute equally to the league and it's promotion...much to your disgust it appears...anyway, who said anything about Tasmanian?

Well the fact remains, you're trying to change that which does not need changing. You're trying to change the name of a medal which the man you're talking about won three times. I bet HB would be on my side!

And you talk about inclusiveness, well how about the fact that a player from every state has won it within the last four years. Consider yourself included!!

The Tasmanian call was in response to the sleeping with sister recommendation. It was a joke, but me being Tasmanian is not!

 

[bozza1980]

But they changed the name of the whole competition

So you are saying the 14 clubs that competed in the 1990 AFL competition were playing in a different competition to the one that they all competed in 12 months earlier???

Like it or not, the AFL was the VFL, like a pie without sauce you cannot have one without the other.

Just rebadging something doesn't delete it's history.

 

[bozza1980]

But they changed the name of the whole competition

Does that mean winners of the "Pura Cup" don't join the honour roll behind "Sheffield Shield" winners??

Does that mean English Premier League winners don't join the honour roll behind previous Division 1 winners??

You are kidding yourself, the AFL is the continuation of the VFL end of story.

However getting on to the original topic I don't personally agree with taking an honour of somebody deemed worthy (in this proposed case Charles Brownlow) to bestow it on somebody else (Hayden Bunton) no matter how worthy the new individual may or not be.

 

[pazza]

Before there was even the Brownlow, and before there was even the VFL/SANFL/WAFL, there was an award known as the Champion Of The Colony. It's most noted winner was Albert Thurgood. Why not an award named after him (if we are to have another award?)

 

[Magpiespower]

Funny reading this thread with all the Vics diving into their bunkers and adopting a siege mentality.

LMAO.

Why is the league's best player given a medal named after an administrator?

What?

Like the Magarey?

Does that mean English Premier League winners don't join the honour roll behind previous Division 1 winners??

Actually, Premier League records only count for when the breakaway occurred - and only take into account the Premier League (and not the old Div.1).

 

[peejay]

The Bunton medal was awarded to the best player as voted by the experts in the Sporting Globe for years.

If you don't remember the sporting globe do some research.

So what would happen to the previous Bunton medallists?

Stupid idea.

 

[skilts]

given that the award is derived from umpires votes, shouldnt it be named after an umpire?

It may surprise you to know that Bunton also umpired at a very high level. If memory serves me correctly, it was in the SANFL.

I think this is a splendid idea, but as a Fizzroy supporter, you'd expect me to say that. My main reason for supporting it though, is that it is incongruous to have an award for the best player named after an administrator, whose main claim to fame is that he sat on his bum for 25, or however many years it was.

 

[skipper kelly]

It may surprise you to know that Bunton also umpired at a very high level. If memory serves me correctly, it was in the SANFL.

I think this is a splendid idea, but as a Fizzroy supporter, you'd expect me to say that. My main reason for supporting it though, is that it is incongruous to have an award for the best player named after an administrator, whose main claim to fame is that he sat on his bum for 25, or however many years it was.

ah but without administrators we have no administration.

 

[dugrene]

Great idea. No need to get rid of the Brownlow though.
Leave the Brownlow for the Victorian clubs. That should keep the Vics happy.

Then have a national award that recognises our national competition. Bunton snr would be a good choice of name for the award.

 

[xyakks]

Yes, this isn't a pointless debate at all...

 

[go_collingwood]

Before the AFL became the national league for Australian Rules Football each state competition had an annual award for the best and fairest player.

South Australia has the Magarey Medal awarded annually since 1897 with the exception of 1916 -18 and 1942 - 44.

Western Australia has the Sandover Medal, awarded annually since 1921.

Victoria has the Brownlow Medal, awarded annually since 1924 with the exception of 1942 - 44.

Tasmania had the Lietch Medal from 1930 - 34 and 1945 to 2000.

Now that we have a national competition is it appropriate to celebrate the tradition of only one state competition in the award for the best player in the national league? I would argue no.

It would be great to reflect the traditions of all the state leagues in the name of the best and fairest award for the national league. One possibility would be to include all the names in the title but Magarey Sandover Brownlow Lietch Medal is a mouthful!

South Australian's might want to argue that their medal has the longest tradition. Victorians might want to argue that the AFL is the continuation of the VFL and West Australians might argue that the Sandover Medal has the longest continuous history by virtue of being awarded throughout the WWII years. The problem remains that each award represents a state competition.

I would like to nominate Haydn Bunton (Snr) as the most appropriate footballer to give his name to the award for best player in our national competition.

Many believe that Haydn Bunton is the best player ever of Aussie Rules. He has connections with four states. He was born in New South Wales, was recruited by Fitzroy in 1931 playing 119 games before being recruited by Subiaco in 1938 at the height of his powers and playing 72 games there, then finishing at Port Adelaide in 1945 with 17 games. Bunton won 3 Brownlow Medals and three Sandover medals in an incredible career.

It's time to celebrate the AFL's best footballer with a truly national award - THE HAYDN BUNTON MEDAL.

.........................................................................................................................

Career summary from the AFL website
http://afl.com.au/default.asp?pg=halloffame&spg=legends

Haydn Bunton senior (Fitzroy/Subiaco/Port Adelaide)
5/7/1911-5/9/1955
Inducted: 1996 Elevated to Legend: 1996
Champion rover through the Depression years. A brilliant runner and ball-winner.
Playing career: 1931-1942; 1945 (Fitzroy 1931-1937, 1942, Subiaco 1938-1941, PA 1945)
Games: 208 (Fitz 119, Sub 72, PA 17) Goals: 427 (Fitz 207, Sub 190, PA 30)
Player honors: Brownlow Medal 1931, 1932, 1935, 2nd Brownlow Medal 1934; Sandover Medal 1938, 1939, 1941; Fitz best and fairest 1934, 1935; Fitz leading goalkicker 1936, 1937; Fitz captain 1932, 1936, 1937.
Coaching record: Fitzroy 1936 (18 games, 2 wins, 16 losses)

go suck my ******** u port adealide scum bag. what is the SANFL?

 

[Crow-mosone]

Don't the Sandover and Magerey Medals still exist??

We fell on our sword to get this national competition up and running and we get to keep the Brownlow and our Premiership counts.

Now sod off!!

you fell on your sword to stop your league and clubs going bankrupt.

carry on.

 

[Crow-mosone]

Errr...I realise this. I'm just making the point that ******ed argument by your fellow interstaters stating that it should be named after a great player, is stoopid.

It didn't matter for 80 years, so why's it all of a sudden an issue whether the medal is named after a good player, or after a bootstrap. Fact is it doesn't matter one bit!

And like I said, you've still got your traditions in your poxy bush leagues, so us keeping a couple in the greatest league in the land, which we invited you to join, isn't much to ask.

Now sod off!!

yes, you do appear to be an expert on stoopid (sic).

1. why is equating outstanding playing achievements with an outstanding player stoopid (sic)
2. it didn't matter for the 80 years of the VFL. you might have noticed one or two changes recently
3. the invitation to your league was to rescue your broke sorry asses.
4. if "just because" is your only argument, it's easy to see how you guys got into so much trouble that your league is now dominated on and off field by interstate teams.

 

[Jako]

It is in a way unfortunate that the bronlow is so remembered, everyone remembers the brownlow winners yet no one remembers the MVP award which IMo is much more rewarding. If you go back through History the brownlow medal rarely goes to the best player in that year, yet the MVP almost always goes to the person who probably should have won the brownlow.

Some may argue it is the unpredictibility and tradition of umpires voting that makes it great and to some extent i agree however i do think the MVP award should have more meaning.

Now that doesn't have much to do with that topic but the name brownlow medal is part of the tradition, along with umpires voting. It doesn't make much sense as there are much better ways of doing it but is tradition and we should keep it as it is.

 

[Crow-mosone]

There were some clubs struggling, mine included I dare say, but the league was far from broke and the expansion was a practical business move. And I doubt it was cheap!

most impressive, not many 11 year old were very good at assessing the financial fortunes of major clubs, and their growth/survival options for the future.

If Aylett and Schwab were aware of such a prodigy, maybe they'd have beat down the door of your primary school and asked you whether they issue a license to indian pacific? How different it might have been.

 

[Crow-mosone]

Arguments from both sides have made valid points. Name changes to traditional trophies happen. How many times have you heard "Sheffield Shield" used in the media in recent years?

Personally, I don't favour a name change. My point in case (it's a fairly loose one at that) is what happened in wrestling (yes, the fake sport).

NWA changed it's name to WCW. It was a gradual progression, but there came a time when the NWA World Heavyweight Championship was renamed as the WCW World Heavyweight Championship. A new championship belt was made to recognise this. This seemed fine at the time, as past NWA champions are still recognised in this linkage.

Several years later, the NWA World Heavyweight championship belt was resurrected as a separate title. Now the confusion begins, as the WCW Championship was linked to PAST NWA champions, while the new NWA title was a new entity.

I think there was a unification down the line, and the WCW title now had two separate championship histories.

Fast forward to the WWF/WWE takeover of the WCW. The WCW World Title has been resurrected again but in the form of the old NWA Championship belt. However it is not called the WCW title or the NWA title, but the World Heavyweight Title (and is linked to the RAW television program), while the regular WWF/E title is linked to the Smackdown! program.

So what history does this "World" title have?

Add to that, a separate organisation, TNA, adopt an even OLDER NWA title as its championship. Confusing huh?

I know this isn't really a direct comparison to what would happen if the Brownlow changed names. If it is just a simple name change, then the history linkage is quite clear. But do we call past Brownlow medallists "former Hayden Bunton medallists"?

And if the VFL (which is already confusing enough to history because it has a different history to the current AFL, which used to be VFL) adopts the Brownlow as its award, then what linkage does it have?

Or maybe it all makes sense. I dunno.

Maybe wait till we're all dead and then they can change it.

Besides, maybe in future will be called the "Coca-Cola Brownlow Medal" and then trimmed down to the "Coca-Cola Medal", and then another sponsor comes along and calls it the "Coles Medal" or the "Toys R Us Medal"....

WTF????

there is no history in 2 privately run entertainment companies.

 

[Crow-mosone]

How about you accept with good grace that somethings will stay around for ever.

what, like your social and economic standing?

 

[ExTasDeeMan]

For the record - Tasmanian's medal is the William Leitch medal (although thanks to AFL and TFL administrators the state is split footballwise).

Fat chance of an rock solid institution as its so buried in Football Folklore - i can only compare it to renaming the MCG to a sponsored stadium name.

 

[tigerdan]

If you go back through History the brownlow medal rarely goes to the best player in that year, yet the MVP almost always goes to the person who probably should have won the brownlow.

You do know that the Brownlow is for the best AND fairest, right?

Many have said that Williams 'lost' the 93 (?) brownlow in his famous 44 posession game (0 votes) because he was mouthing off to the umpires all day.

 

[Embers]

They should stop the wait and just rename it the Chris Judd Medal...

 

[The Opposition]

So the coleman medal should be the Lockett medal because he is the greatest goalkicker of all time? By your logic, yes.
Should the Norm Smith Medal be named after someone who dominated all grand finals he played in? By your logic, yes.
Stupid idea! Just leave it alone. All you interstaters should just be grateful that it is a national competition and forget all this "us against victoria" crap... it is a national competition, victoria are happy about it so why boast about winning the last however many premierships, its good for the game...

 

[Truetiger]

Should leave it how it is

 

[Toots Hibbert]

So the coleman medal should be the Lockett medal because he is the greatest goalkicker of all time? By your logic, yes.
Should the Norm Smith Medal be named after someone who dominated all grand finals he played in? By your logic, yes.Stupid idea! Just leave it alone. All you interstaters should just be grateful that it is a national competition and forget all this "us against victoria" crap... it is a national competition, victoria are happy about it so why boast about winning the last however many premierships, its good for the game...

No the thread is about having the Best and Fairest medal named after a famous player from the history of the game who has connections with five states rather than an obscure Victorian football administrator. It's a national competition lets respect the traditions of all the states.