Preview Changes v Freo Round 20

[Tulip]

To be fair, it seems like if they can just up the pressure and intensity the rest may actually begin to fall into place.

Basically, stop being lazy sacks of s**t and start applying pressure you campaigners.

Salem looks half asleep, Oliver and Trac have been awful defensively, and there have been far too many soft tackling attempts.

Yep, the stats clearly show that this isn't a personnel issue - its an attitude issue. The players know they're the best list in it, but they're playing at about a quarter of the intensity of Geelong and it shows. The time to turn it around has come. 3 wins out of 4 is the minimum after blowing leads against other top 8 teams. If we make the finals in the top 4 and with decent momentum then I think the narrative around us changes. Everyone is "the hunted" and "the hunter" in finals.

The fact that BBB is out for another week minimum is both troubling and reassuring at the same time. He's been average this year, but clearly his knee is bothering him and if we can sort that out in the next few weeks then he becomes dangerous again. Also means we're forced to do something in the F50 to become a little more dynamic rather than hoping a clearly injured Brown plays well. My preference is Laurie, I don't really rate KC, but we'll see I guess.

 

[Dancing Potato]

It’s not the forward or defence, it’s the midfield. The bulldogs clearly defeated us through the middle which allowed those entries in the last. We win the middle comprehensively and we are going to win more than not.

Aside from a handful of brilliant individual performances from Viney and Oliver our midfield has been pretty shitful.

Gawn (and sometimes Jackson) have either been hitting it down directly to opposition midfielders or putting it over everyone's heads and into space at the opposition's advantage. There's also been way too many piddly little handballs to stationary players and even a few of our guys getting sucked into the contest too much (that old chestnut again). Haven't seen them helping out back in defence enough either.

Feel like Harmes needs a defined role as well. Either as a mid-foward hybrid in the Petracca mould but also mostly sitting outside the contest to receive, or as a tagger.

 

[Grimesy87]

Forwardline functioned well against the dogs, I get why they wouldn’t send Petty forward.

Recent scores since the bye, against the dogs

100 from 50 inside 50s against dees (w)
56 from 46 against saints (w)
120 from 59 vs Sydney (l)
108 from 50 vs Brisbane (l)
83 from 50 vs Hawthorn (w)
105 from 56 vs gws (w)

Average of 95 against from 52 inside 50s conceded in that time.

I wouldn't read much into how well our forward line worked against them as conceding scores like that appear to be the norm. I'm quite concerned how they're going to score against freo Friday night given they now have the best defensive numbers in the league, averaging 67 points against.

Over the same time, freo have gone
52 from 51 i/50s vs Richmond (d)
82 from 54 vs Sydney (l)
70 from 54 vs St kilda (w)
91 from 51 vs Port (w)
81 from 64 vs Carlton (l)
82 from 61 vs hawks (w)

Even when they're losing, they aren't conceding big scored. I'm concerned we might be in the 50 club on Friday night.

 

[Scythe94]

McDonald still 6-7 weeks away according to injury report. Don't think we'll see him again this year

 

[Scythe94]

Aside from a handful of brilliant individual performances from Viney and Oliver our midfield has been pretty shitful.

Gawn (and sometimes Jackson) have either been hitting it down directly to opposition midfielders or putting it over everyone's heads and into space at the opposition's advantage. There's also been way too many piddly little handballs to stationary players and even a few of our guys getting sucked into the contest too much (that old chestnut again). Haven't seen them helping out back in defence enough either.

Feel like Harmes needs a defined role as well. Either as a mid-foward hybrid in the Petracca mould but also mostly sitting outside the contest to receive, or as a tagger.

Don't have the stats on it obviously, but it feels like we have a pretty good record in games where Harmes tags. His tagging games have also been some of his better individual ones, and he tends to hurt the other player on the scoreboard when he's given that role.

Hopefully goes to Brayshaw this week

 

[SugarHealey]

Yep, the stats clearly show that this isn't a personnel issue - its an attitude issue.

Yep

The players know they're the best list in it, but they're playing at about a quarter of the intensity of Geelong and it shows.

This... is a big part of our problem mindset. a sort of cockiness, has diminished our intensity.

The time to turn it around has come. 3 wins out of 4 is the minimum after blowing leads against other top 8 teams. If we make the finals in the top 4 and with decent momentum then I think the narrative around us changes. Everyone is "the hunted" and "the hunter" in finals.

The time is now for us to bring the intensity, or bugger off.

Aside from a handful of brilliant individual performances from Viney and Oliver our midfield has been pretty shitful.

I agree DP.

There's also been way too many piddly little handballs to stationary players and even a few of our guys getting sucked into the contest too much

Totally.

McDonald still 6-7 weeks away according to injury report. Don't think we'll see him again this year

We can forget him. nearly toasted.

 

[demondavey]

Also did a really quick check on goal scoring when we win. It’s evident that the midfield is not getting amongst the scoring enough; Petracca, Jordan, Harmes etc. I really feel we have one avenue to goal and that’s through Fritsch and Pickett. Not particularly reassuring when you look at, say, Geelong with Hawkins and Cameron. Carlton have McKay and Curnow. If our midfielders don’t contribute, who does? The two forwards I mentioned.

Spargo and ANB are virtually not existent this year, why? Are key forwards not bringing the ball to ground? Yes. Are we lacking pressure inside 50? Yes. It seems as though we are hoping Fritsch or Pickett kicks a bag, with the occasional cameo from Petracca. It’s also really hard for our forwards to get involved when the midfield is getting hosed. Which we are. Which brings criticism to the defence.

Are our defenders under siege? Yes. Defenders these days don’t really play man on man, they zone off etc, so when repeat entries occur they’re going to get exposed more frequently due to opposition hitting targets through higher chance.

I am absolutely convinced there are a few players that need to start getting busy;
Gawn
Jackson
Oliver
Petracca
ANB
Spargo
Pickett
ONE KF

If we can begin winning the middle then that allows good entry to a KF, it brings in the smalls (who need to fight like hell) to keep it in there, and we need offensive midfielders to get in and look to score as well.

The heat comes off May, Lever, Petty etc if those listed find another gear. People will say ‘well Petracca can’t do more etc etc’ well he can. We are talking about the most explosive bloke in it. He is in his prime right now. I’d like to see Gawn get back to showing us just how good he is, because right now I see a guy like Rhys Stanley

1

Rhys Stanley

Age

34

Ht

200cm

Wt

102kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

13.6

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

6.4

4star

CL

3.4

5star

HO

27.6

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

7.5

3star

HB

4.5

3star

CL

5.0

5star

HO

21.5

5star

D

11.8

3star

K

5.4

2star

HB

6.4

4star

CL

3.0

5star

HO

33.0

5star

playing better than him.

We don’t need to change our system, you don’t fatten a pig on market day. It’s round 20, we aren’t changing the cones on the training track, this is all mental now. This is effort and just lifting by plenty. If we lift by 20-30% across the board, nobody gets near us, because the confidence from wins will be addictive. We have the cattle to play finals, these guys are pigs for finals.

Effort and desire. B2B.

 

[demondavey]

Yep. That's why it feels like a win this week is pretty meaningless if they just come out and flop against the Pies the following week. If we need external heat to get motivated 4 weeks before a finals series, then we're in trouble.

A loss this week, however, would be a bit of a disaster.

If we can pack two wins together, that’s huge. Collingwood is a bogy team and they’ll probably get smoked by Sydney this week given they are running out of lives. Brisbane I am less concerned about than Collingwood or Carlton, to be honest. Beating a bogy side would be seriously uplifting.

 

[demondavey]

Aside from a handful of brilliant individual performances from Viney and Oliver our midfield has been pretty shitful.

Gawn (and sometimes Jackson) have either been hitting it down directly to opposition midfielders or putting it over everyone's heads and into space at the opposition's advantage. There's also been way too many piddly little handballs to stationary players and even a few of our guys getting sucked into the contest too much (that old chestnut again). Haven't seen them helping out back in defence enough either.

Feel like Harmes needs a defined role as well. Either as a mid-foward hybrid in the Petracca mould but also mostly sitting outside the contest to receive, or as a tagger.

I’d definitely play him as a tagger. He is very dangerous up forward and if he shuts a gun mid out it’s a huge plus.

 

[jakefooty23]

Sorry to barge in like this fellas, very keen for this weekends game but at the same time I have a bad feeling we will be the team to put you back into form. I think this will be the week Langdon, Spargo and Petracca will all have really good games and damage us alot. We were lucky in our first matchup and don't think you will lose to us twice in one year.

 

[Topkent]

Sorry to barge in like this fellas, very keen for this weekends game but at the same time I have a bad feeling we will be the team to put you back into form. I think this will be the week Langdon, Spargo and Petracca will all have really good games and damage us alot. We were lucky in our first matchup and don't think you will lose to us twice in one year.

Apart from us losing May I don't think I'd call you lucky. You smashed us in the middle and turned the game in your favour. That's not luck

 

[Proper Gander]

Sorry to barge in like this fellas, very keen for this weekends game but at the same time I have a bad feeling we will be the team to put you back into form. I think this will be the week Langdon, Spargo and Petracca will all have really good games and damage us alot. We were lucky in our first matchup and don't think you will lose to us twice in one year.

I smell a reverse jinx

 

[schmuttt]

Part of me thinks we are stuffed and part of me thinks we turn it around this week. At least we won’t have any false hope going into finals, we either lift and are in good form or we fall out of the 4 completely.

 

[Headless]

At least we won’t have any false hope going into finals

We'll find a way.

 

[stEdy]

Part of me thinks we are stuffed and part of me thinks we turn it around this week. At least we won’t have any false hope going into finals, we either lift and are in good form or we fall out of the 4 completely.

This is what i'm looking forward to.

Sink or swim time fellas. Having won the flag last year, this year feels like something approaching a free-hit (I probably won't feel this way as much if/when we lose a final)

 

[Jamurp]

This is what i'm looking forward to.

Sink or swim time fellas. Having won the flag last year, this year feels like something approaching a free-hit (I probably won't feel this way as much if/when we lose a final)

Yeah I’m so glad we broke the drought last year, would make this season all the more frustrating, not the end of the world if we struggle this year, we’ll be bigger and better next season I have no doubt.

 

[pjfairbairn]

Part of me thinks we are stuffed and part of me thinks we turn it around this week. At least we won’t have any false hope going into finals, we either lift and are in good form or we fall out of the 4 completely.

But will we make the 8?

 

[A11dAtP0w3R]

I smell a reverse jinx

very astute observation community leader.

To cancel this out, I say we are going to get flogged by 75 points and there is a punch up between teammates on the flight back home forcing the pilot to land in Adelaide so police can arrest 8 of our players.

 

[Topkent]

Yeah I’m so glad we broke the drought last year, would make this season all the more frustrating, not the end of the world if we struggle this year, we’ll be bigger and better next season I have no doubt.

Not saying we can't, but Brown, Hibberd, Gawn and May are all in the zone where they could decline anytime. That's your FF, Ruck and FB and best mid sized defender.
Plus we lose our mobile ruck who is instrumental to how we play at our best


I bet the Bulldogs were guaranteed to have a long era after 2016, you take your chance while it's available you don't just bank on oh well there's always next year.

 

[schmuttt]

Not saying we can't, but Brown, Hibberd, Gawn and May are all in the zone where they could decline anytime. That's your FF, Ruck and FB and best mid sized defender.
Plus we lose our mobile ruck who is instrumental to how we play at our best


I bet the Bulldogs were guaranteed to have a long era after 2016, you take your chance while it's available you don't just bank on oh well there's always next year.

Yeah agree which is why if we don’t win the flag this year I’ll be disappointed, but I’m glad I’ll know before finals at least if we are any chance.

Loser this Friday night doesn’t make the top 4, we all know how difficult our run home is but Freo also have the dogs next week at marvel and if they lost that too they might not even get a home final.

 

[stEdy]

Would be awesome if we came 4th and played first final against the Cats at the G anyway

 

[Grimesy87]

Yeah agree which is why if we don’t win the flag this year I’ll be disappointed, but I’m glad I’ll know before finals at least if we are any chance.

Loser this Friday night doesn’t make the top 4, we all know how difficult our run home is but Freo also have the dogs next week at marvel and if they lost that too they might not even get a home final.

There's still a very solid core in Oliver, trac, lever, pickett, fritsch, Salem, viney, harmes, langdon, petty, gus etx, and you'd be hoping rivers, spargo, Jordan, sparrow, bowey etc continue improving.

Then got some really promising players like Howes, Laurie, JVR.

I think the dogs issues really increased when they kept dunkley and bought in treloar, they really could have turned that into a big win

History will repeat for us if we don't find some genuine ruck/kpf strength off the back of Jackson leaving. This is even more key with McDonald and brown edging 30 and both under heavy injury concerns. I suspect this will hurt us again this Friday night too.

 

[Grimesy87]

Would be awesome if we came 4th and played first final against the Cats at the G anyway

**** yeah now you're singing my song

 

[Topkent]

There's still a very solid core in Oliver, trac, lever, pickett, fritsch, Salem, viney, harmes, langdon, petty, gus etx, and you'd be hoping rivers, spargo, Jordan, sparrow, bowey etc continue improving.

Then got some really promising players like Howes, Laurie, JVR.

You could literally name the top 10 blokes at about 12 clubs and it would sound as good, 3AAs in that list. That's not premiership guaranteed at all there. That's the same core that was a middle of the road side in 2020.

Including Howes Laurie and JVR lol, that's peak 2009 Melbourne shit. Promising youngesters that have never played a game.

 

[Grimesy87]

You could literally name the top 10 blokes at about 12 clubs and it would sound as good, 3AAs in that list. That's not premiership guaranteed at all there. That's the same core that was a middle of the road side in 2020.

Including Howes Laurie and JVR lol, that's peak 2009 Melbourne s**t. Promising youngesters that have never played a game.

Yeah that's exactly why I wrote "really promising players" at the end, as that's all they are at this stage. Guys that have been on the list 12-18 months and have shown good promise.

I'm not sure what you're arguing, I just named the blokes aged 25/26 for 2023 (viney would be 28) after the players you'd initially named being towards the end of their careers. Also the ones aged 22 or under in another group. There's still plenty of good players there. 3 have been AA and another 3 have been named in AA squad, off the top of my head under 26 at other clubs, only dogs and carlton are close to that profile.

I also said quote "History will repeat for us if we don't find some genuine ruck/kpf strength off the back of Jackson leaving" meaning we will be a middle of the road side like the dogs have been since 2017 if we don't address the players who are leaving/closer to the end asap.