Preview Changes v Saints Rd 6

[JTCWBFC]

Don't really want to drop anyone but it's so different having so much depth and competition for spots, never would of thought that going into round 1 haha

I can't for the life of me figure out who else you've taken out. Ayce, Jong and?

Edit: Roberts my bad

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[doggies ftw]

Ayce and Jong for Hunter and Minno in my opinion. If Wally gets up he's in too and if anyone is sore Grant gets another run. Don't want to drop anyone though and no VFL this weekend which sucks.

 

[dogsfan]

I'm happy for Cordy to stay in the side while we're playing good footy. Didn't look like Wallis was right so Grant in for Jong and if anyone else is out with soreness etc. then I'd like to see Hunter come in.

 

[Super Hans]

I really want to see Biggs and Hunter both in the team.

Out: Jong, Smith, Cordy
In: Biggs, Hunter, Minson

 

[Super Hans]

Dudes gotta chill a bit re hunter. He was so so young for his draft age.

He's 4 months older than jack billings. He's played more games and has similar stats. He's still a baby. Super talent, and a good human being from all reports. Not everyone's ready to eat up professional football from day 1. He loves the club and has come a long way. I'm well and truly backing him in.

Spot on. We've been spoiled with Macrae and Bont being jets from day one and now we expect everyone to do the same. Hunter/Hrovat are only in their third year.

 

[fronkalicious]

Spot on. We've been spoiled with Macrae and Bont being jets from day one and now we expect everyone to do the same. Hunter/Hrovat are only in their third year.

And hunter will play the whole season as a 20 year old, as is the case with half of the blokes drafted the year after him. He's young young young for his draft year.

 

[lachy]

Ayce and Jong for Hunter and Minno in my opinion. If Wally gets up he's in too and if anyone is sore Grant gets another run. Don't want to drop anyone though and no VFL this weekend which sucks.

I really want to see Biggs and Hunter both in the team.

Out: Jong, Smith, Cordy
In: Biggs, Hunter, Minson

Doggies and Pogba, always enjoy your posts, just interested to know why Minson is an in with a 10 kick at 30% efficiency and no contested marks at VFL level? One of the reasons he is out of the team is his contributions away from hitouts and his VFL form does not indicate in any way he ahs addressed this, therefore why Minno for Cordy?

 

[Super Hans]

Doggies and Pogba, always enjoy your posts, just interested to know why Minson is an in with a 10 kick at 30% efficiency and no contested marks at VFL level? One of the reasons he is out of the team is his contributions away from hitouts and his VFL form does not indicate in any way he ahs addressed this, therefore why Minno for Cordy?

Billy Longer has been one of the best rucks in the comp this year (I'm sure there's stats to back that up). We're hurting our chances big time going in with Cordy against him.

Minson is never going to be a bloke who gets the ball 15+ times and gets 5+ marks, we all know this. But is Cordy? Atleast Minson will put the ball down our midfielders throat. Cordy does neither.

And 'around the ground' stuff also includes tackling and pressure, which I think Minson is just about the best in the league for.

I think Will gets a bad wrap. I'd love a ruckmen in the Dean Cox mould, but they don't grow on trees.

 

[GrahamSmith]

I can't for the life of me figure out who else you've taken out. Ayce, Jong and?

Edit: Roberts my bad

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I think it's hard as well that in the VFL Footscray have a buy this week so boys like redpath, dale and hunter who've carried good form over the past 3 weeks, do you put them in? Or do you hope they can carry there form after the break... Decisions haha

 

[Cori]

I'm feeling the 1%ers are what's keeping Cordy in and Minno out. I'd love to see a comparison on that statistic because it's the pressure acts and perceived pressure that the whole team needs to bring at all times that Bev rates.

I think it was in an interview with Bont that he said the two things that Beverage looks for are pressure and effort. Everything else is secondary.

 

[Super Hans]

I think Minson's big strength as a ruckmen is pressure.. that and the ability to shove the ball down a players throat.

 

[doggies ftw]

Doggies and Pogba, always enjoy your posts, just interested to know why Minson is an in with a 10 kick at 30% efficiency and no contested marks at VFL level? One of the reasons he is out of the team is his contributions away from hitouts and his VFL form does not indicate in any way he ahs addressed this, therefore why Minno for Cordy?

Yeah those are disappointing stats. I just feel this week we can afford to cover Minson in the zone which is his biggest weakness in our set up. If you can cover his weaknesses then his positives far outweigh Cordy, I reckon we should control this game for the most part and that starts with midfield dominance. Don't even let them get a sniff by winning the clearances and getting things on their terms. If Minson costs us a few goals by letting them get through the zone so be it, shouldn't matter too much. Also let's Rough stay back for more of the game and considering how well Bruce is going, that could be important.

Maybe when we get Libba, Wally and Jong back and Clay finds form, with those guys we could lose every single hit out and still win the clearances but our inside stocks are copping a battering and it hasn't hurt us yet but if we keep getting smashed in the ruck one of these days it's going to be costly.

I like Cordy and a few times a game he does something like pick a ground ball up cleanly and fire off a handball and it just makes you think geez he could be a good player who suits our style perfectly. But personally I don't believe you can get a touch up like that in the ruck consistently, Bev might not care though and if so I'll back him in.

If Cordy plays he just needs to show something! Anything! In the ruck contest. He can really jump sometimes so it's surprising he's so uncompetitive in there, just don't think he's judging it well but who knows he might come good in that regard and Id be bloody rapt

 

[lachy]

Yeah those are disappointing stats. I just feel this week we can afford to cover Minson in the zone which is his biggest weakness in our set up. If you can cover his weaknesses then his positives far outweigh Cordy, I reckon we should control this game for the most part and that starts with midfield dominance. Don't even let them get a sniff by winning the clearances and getting things on their terms. If Minson costs us a few goals by letting them get through the zone so be it, shouldn't matter too much. Also let's Rough stay back for more of the game and considering how well Bruce is going, that could be important.

Maybe when we get Libba, Wally and Jong back and Clay finds form, with those guys we could lose every single hit out and still win the clearances but our inside stocks are copping a battering and it hasn't hurt us yet but if we keep getting smashed in the ruck one of these days it's going to be costly.

I like Cordy and a few times a game he does something like pick a ground ball up cleanly and fire off a handball and it just makes you think geez he could be a good player who suits our style perfectly. But personally I don't believe you can get a touch up like that in the ruck consistently, Bev might not care though and if so I'll back him in.

If Cordy plays he just needs to show something! Anything! In the ruck contest. He can really jump sometimes so it's surprising he's so uncompetitive in there, just don't think he's judging it well but who knows he might come good in that regard and Id be bloody rapt

Fair enough comment. However, in developing a zone it only takes one player to not work and the entire zone collapses. There are no games now where I believe you can risk covering a player who even when he was in there in the first 3 rounds did not provide any midfield dominance whatsoever.

I also do not think Cordy is the answer, but if Minson is we are asking the same wrong questions we have in the past and not been successful

 

[lachy]

I think Minson's big strength as a ruckmen is pressure.. that and the ability to shove the ball down a players throat.

This appears to be an impression, but do the numbers over the first 3 weeks for example show a domination in clearances?

Wil plays his heart out, just not sure he fits into a system that requires multi faceted skills and cannot afford to cover players who do not work well in the system and the numbers appear to support this which is why Bev has him in the VFL

 

[SWest75]

I'm feeling the 1%ers are what's keeping Cordy in and Minno out. I'd love to see a comparison on that statistic because it's the pressure acts and perceived pressure that the whole team needs to bring at all times that Bev rates.

I think it was in an interview with Bont that he said the two things that Beverage looks for are pressure and effort. Everything else is secondary.

Yeah I heard Bev in an interview say something about Minson working on his defensive side. Never too old to learn was something he said.

 

[Reptilia]

How much worse could it get then last week against Sydney ? Leave Cordy in.

 

[Doggies_13]

I would say Minson was sent back to the vfl to work on his defensive side and work off the ball as in getting in position in the zone etc. I'm guessing round one bevo thought sole rucking he was too tired to do it then round 2-3 realised it was laziness or bad habit this dropping him. maybe some who watch the vfl could let us know how he is going in these areas.
I doubt his possessions have much to do with it what so ever if it was about stats he would have never been dropped ahead of cordy in the first place.
For me hunter to be rewarded for form, I would go with Campbell or Minson this week not concerned which as longer has been excellent with hitouts to advantage which is the only hitout stat that counts just look at scores from stoppages to see that. I also think a Biggs or a dale get a crack but probably as sub.
In: Campbell/Minson hunter dale
Out: cordy Jong smith

B: Roberts Roughead wood
Hb: murphy talia Boyd
C: macrae Bont Stevens
Hf: hrovat Crameri hunter
F: stringer Boyd Dickson
Foll: Minson/Campbell Dahl Picken
Int: Webb jj honey sub: dale

 

[Dogsman16]

Do we just swap the Roughead and Cordy roles. Roughead plays majority of the game as a ruck (60 - 70%) and Cordy plays the majority as a 3rd defender (manning the resting ruck) and then plays 25 - 30% of the game in the ruck. Might limit the damage of getting slaughtered in the middle.
Although if saints drop hickey we might as well drop Cordy and play Roughead as the sole ruck v Longer. Roberts/Boyd can cover the 2nd ruck role against bruce.

The saints should make this a whole lot easier and just play the one ruck. I would like to see how the Roughead ruck experiment goes.

 

[Super Hans]

This appears to be an impression, but do the numbers over the first 3 weeks for example show a domination in clearances?

Wil plays his heart out, just not sure he fits into a system that requires multi faceted skills and cannot afford to cover players who do not work well in the system and the numbers appear to support this which is why Bev has him in the VFL

I'm not trying to say Minson is perfect, but he's still a shitload better than Cordy.

I look at Cordy and see a bloke who doesn't win hit outs, doesn't kick, doesn't mark, doesn't tackle, doesn't make a physical presence. Will atleast does two of those things. I don't want to sound like I'm just belting into Cordy, but I just don't see what he offers the team at all.

Is he a Stefan Martin, who might not win the taps but will get 25 touches? No.
Is he a Sam Jacobs who shoves the pill down the midfielders throat? No.

I'm sure he's a good guy, but Minson offers a lot more than him.

 

[Super Hans]

How much worse could it get then last week against Sydney ? Leave Cordy in.

Longer is a much better ruckmen than Pyke. If we let him have 50 odd hit outs he'll kill us.

 

[DexterTan]

I'm not trying to say Minson is perfect, but he's still a shitload better than Cordy.

I look at Cordy and see a bloke who doesn't win hit outs, doesn't kick, doesn't mark, doesn't tackle, doesn't make a physical presence. Will atleast does two of those things. I don't want to sound like I'm just belting into Cordy, but I just don't see what he offers the team at all.

Is he a Stefan Martin, who might not win the taps but will get 25 touches? No.
Is he a Sam Jacobs who shoves the pill down the midfielders throat? No.

I'm sure he's a good guy, but Minson offers a lot more than him.

Minson is 30. Time to get used to playing without him.

 

[Super Hans]

Minson is 30. Time to get used to playing without him.

Might aswell stop playing Boyd and Moz then. I doubt age is the reason he isn't playing.

 

[GreatSouthWest]

Can Ayce play Jong's role?

 

[Zgope1]

Can Ayce play Jong's role?

such a pity:

If Ayce could win hit outs and run like jong he'd be special.

meanwhile if Jong could handball and kick like Ayce he'd be elite

 

[threenewpadlocks]

And hunter will play the whole season as a 20 year old, as is the case with half of the blokes drafted the year after him. He's young young young for his draft year.

Not just young, young, young, he was the youngest player from his draft year - he was the youngest listed player in the entire AFL in 2013. He's closer, on average, in age to the blokes drafted the next year not to his year.
Same with Bontempelli. December and November birthdays are the best.