Coronavirus 2020 / Worldwide (Stats live update in OP) Part 5

[Chief]

Continued in Part 6:

Health - Coronavirus 2020 / Worldwide (Stats live update in OP) Part 6

Part 6 Part 1 is here - https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/coronavirus-2020-worldwide-stats-live-update-in-op.1234843/ Part 2 is here - https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/coronavirus-2020-worldwide-stats-live-update-in-op-part-2.1238584/ Part 3 is here -...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Brad Goodman]

Not sure why Eriksen is being mentioned seeing as he hasn't been vaccinated.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Which science did you trust; given it's changed dozens of times over the last 18 months?

How good is virtue signalling?



There has also never been a vaccine rushed to market as quickly as this one - you cannot compress time, no matter how many resources you've thrown at it.

There has also never been an mRNA vaccine used.

Both of those are facts, not opinions.

More young adults than expected have reported heart inflammation following Covid-19 vaccination

The condition, called myocarditis, is usually mild, but a handful of patients remain hospitalized.

www.nbcnews.com

It's also a fact that the COVID vaccines are causing disproportionately high heart problems in (primarily) healthy young men.

Is that evidence that Eriksen's heart attack on the field was caused by the COVID vaccine?

No.

Is it a sufficient possibility that it warrants consideration?

Yes.

Hardly virtue signalling. I was replying to a query as to what I had done. How would you like me to answer?

As to Eriksen, exploring the cause of his heart attack is one thing. Jumping onto social media and blatantly stating that the vaccine caused the event, as many have done is outrightly disgraceful. There hasn't even been a medical report released.

But there is this:

No, Christian Eriksen’s sudden collapse was not from the COVID vaccine

Eriksen is in stable condition at a hospital in Copenhagen. He released a statement Monday in which he said he felt better.

indianexpress.com

Yet, those of us who are pro-vaccine are the fear-mongers? Ironic.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Not sure why Eriksen is being mentioned seeing as he hasn't been vaccinated.

Thus proving my point mate.

These whackjobs and crazies didn't even look into it. They just used it to push their anti-vaccine propaganda.

 

[Over The Post]

More on the Sydney case:

Second Sydney COVID case confirmed after household contact tests positive

The household contact of a new locally acquired case of COVID-19 also tests positive in Sydney. The man lives with a 60-year-old driver who transported an international flight crew.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Brasher]

This whole vaccine versus anti-vaccine debate is a product of a Covid plan for Australia that relied on Zero Covid until vaccination. There has never been a Plan B or any attempt to manage a Covid presence at an acceptable level in the community.

Unfortunately the government didn't count on a vaccination that people simply are not rushing to take or have available to them....and there are many reasons, some more valid than others.

So here we are, a year on from our first lockdown and with no more assuredness that we aren't one escaped HQR from the next one.

The worrying part is I can't see any serious attempts to reinforce or adjust the plan.

 

[King Elvis]

Maybe, maybe not but how many people should be allowed to die whilst we wait to find out? But until I see a list of the guy's medical/epidemiological qualifications you'll forgive me for not giving whatever he is peddling a passing thought.

We currently have 3.8 million dead in the space of a little over 12 months (the flu kills @ 300-500k annually) and no real sign of it slowing down in areas that are un-vaccinated. How many should would it need to kill before getting as many vaccinated as quickly as possible is not an overreaction?

Once again, Ivermectin and HCQ are proven medicines that are effective against COVID - the vaccine isn't necessary.

Treat the high risk with it as a preventative measure, use it for those who catch COVID badly, and move on.

Also, you can't quote the 3.8 million dead figure in isolation - given the way COVID 'deaths' were track, the only relevant statistic is excess mortality.

 

[King Elvis]

Isn't the point of good science that, unlike religion, it changes as new information comes to light?

Yes, and opinions should change with it, should they not?

Scientific theories are also meant to be tested, peer reviewed, and proven; not thrown out as thought bubbles and then changed a month later, as we've experienced here.

 

[King Elvis]

Thus proving my point mate.

These whackjobs and crazies didn't even look into it. They just used it to push their anti-vaccine propaganda.

Initial reports were he was vaccinated, now that he wasn't - will be interesting to see which is true.

Regardless, this is still factual;

More young adults than expected have reported heart inflammation following Covid-19 vaccination

The condition, called myocarditis, is usually mild, but a handful of patients remain hospitalized.

www.nbcnews.com

Any comment there?

 

[Nothing]

Once again, Ivermectin and HCQ are proven medicines that are effective against COVID - the vaccine isn't necessary.

Treat the high risk with it as a preventative measure, use it for those who catch COVID badly, and move on.

Also, you can't quote the 3.8 million dead figure in isolation - given the way COVID 'deaths' were track, the only relevant statistic is excess mortality.

Are you ignoring the serious side effects and adverse reactions to ivermectin? If you acknowledge these risks, how do they compare to the risks of the vaccine (or indeed COVID itself)?
What about HCQ?

The serious side effects of the drugs (that are very well known) need to be weighed up against any possible benefit. Certainly in the case of HCQ those risks significantly outstrip any benefit. Further evidence is needed for ivermectin.

 

[faible]

Yes, and opinions should change with it, should they not?

Scientific theories are also meant to be tested, peer reviewed, and proven; not thrown out as thought bubbles and then changed a month later, as we've experienced here.

You've described both sides in a nutshell. Politicians and Science don't play well together. This 'variant' stuff would play out every flu season behind the scenes without nearly as much drama for example.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Initial reports were he was vaccinated, now that he wasn't - will be interesting to see which is true.

Regardless, this is still factual;

More young adults than expected have reported heart inflammation following Covid-19 vaccination

The condition, called myocarditis, is usually mild, but a handful of patients remain hospitalized.

www.nbcnews.com

Any comment there?

226 out of how many vaccines administered? I couldn't find that data in the article. 80% have recovered without any further treatment. Most cases of myocarditis go away on their own without leaving any lasting damage.

You may have let a headline cloud the body of the article.

 

[King Elvis]

Are you ignoring the serious side effects and adverse reactions to ivermectin? If you acknowledge these risks, how do they compare to the risks of the vaccine (or indeed COVID itself)?
What about HCQ?

The serious side effects of the drugs (that are very well known) need to be weighed up against any possible benefit. Certainly in the case of HCQ those risks significantly outstrip any benefit. Further evidence is needed for ivermectin.

Based upon what?

It's been widely used for years, what further evidence is required?

You realize it’s the primary reason India is getting things back under control?

 

[Over The Post]

Are you ignoring the serious side effects and adverse reactions to ivermectin?

Links? Certainly it is toxic if overdosed, no doubt about that, but you can say that about most medicines.

What about HCQ? The serious side effects of the drugs (that are very well known) need to be weighed up against any possible benefit. Certainly in the case of HCQ those risks significantly outstrip any benefit.

I'd rather inject myself with bleach, or drink cow urine.

 

[The Cryptkeeper]

Once again, Ivermectin and HCQ are proven medicines that are effective against COVID - the vaccine isn't necessary.

Treat the high risk with it as a preventative measure, use it for those who catch COVID badly, and move on.

Also, you can't quote the 3.8 million dead figure in isolation - given the way COVID 'deaths' were track, the only relevant statistic is excess mortality.

The WHO estimates that number to be in excess of 3 million.

The true death toll of COVID-19 estimating global excess mortality

Estimates suggest the total number of global deaths attributable to the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020 is at least 3 million, representing 1.2 million more deaths than officially reported.

www.who.int

So I will ask you again using the terminology that you prefer. How many excess deaths would have to occur before widespread vaccination should be taken seriously?

 

[faible]

Based upon what?

It's been widely used for years, what further evidence is required?

You realize it’s the primary reason India is getting things back under control?

You know the majority of States in India are under varying degrees of restrictions and lockdowns, right?

 

[Over The Post]

You know the majority of States in India are under varying degrees of restrictions and lockdowns, right?

They also have 56 times the population of Australia in 42% of the land mass, right? Going to take a lot of vaxes and it's hard to enforce social distancing and hygiene and the medical facilities for those who do get sick are very much substandard outside the major cities.

 

[Brad Goodman]

They also have 56 times the population of Australia in 42% of the land mass, right? Going to take a lot of vaxes and it's hard to enforce social distancing and hygiene and the medical facilities for those who do get sick are very much substandard outside the major cities.

Yes but they're sprinkling liberal quantities of Ivermectin into the Ganges so it kinda balances out.

At the end of the day if you're not a paid professional in the field being discussed your opinion is irrelevant so we're really all wasting our time here.

 

[King Elvis]

You know the majority of States in India are under varying degrees of restrictions and lockdowns, right?

Yes - you know a number of provinces have been using ivermectin which has resulted in huge decreases in daily cases?

 

[faible]

Yes - you know a number of provinces have been using ivermectin which has resulted in huge decreases in daily cases?

You mean the same provinces under lockdowns and restrictions?

Any evidence to support ivermectin being the cause of the decrease and not the lockdowns and restrictions that we know causes decreased case numbers?

 

[King Elvis]

RETRACTED ARTICLE: The mechanisms of action of Ivermectin against SARS-CoV-2: An evidence-based clinical review article - The Journal of Antibiotics

www.nature.com

 

[faible]

RETRACTED ARTICLE: The mechanisms of action of Ivermectin against SARS-CoV-2: An evidence-based clinical review article - The Journal of Antibiotics

www.nature.com

I'll have to have a read tomorrow, but their Conclusion isn't exactly filling me with confidence.

 

[King Elvis]

Odd conclusion for you to draw, given they're effectively saying it should be used.

" Real-time data is also available with a meta-analysis of 55 studies to date. As per data available on 16 May 2021, 100% of 36 early treatment and prophylaxis studies report positive effects (96% of all 55 studies). Of these, 26 studies show statistically significant improvements in isolation. Random effects meta-analysis with pooled effects using the most serious outcome reported 79% and 85% improvement for early treatment and prophylaxis respectively (RR 0.21 [0.11–0.37] and 0.15 [0.09–0.25]). The results were similar after exclusion based sensitivity analysis: 81% and 87% (RR 0.19 [0.14–0.26] and 0.13 [0.07–0.25]), and after restriction to 29 peer-reviewed studies: 82% and 88% (RR 0.18 [0.11–0.31] and 0.12 [0.05–0.30]). Statistically significant improvements were seen for mortality, ventilation, hospitalization, cases, and viral clearance. 100% of the 17 Randomized Controlled Trials (RCTs) for early treatment and prophylaxis report positive effects, with an estimated improvement of 73% and 83% respectively (RR 0.27 [0.18–0.41] and 0.17 [0.05–0.61]), and 93% of all 28 RCTs. "

 

[King Elvis]

There have been lockdowns and restrictions throughout most of the Western world for the last 12 months.

Watch this and then give me your thoughts - if you're being genuine.

You mean the same provinces under lockdowns and restrictions?

Any evidence to support ivermectin being the cause of the decrease and not the lockdowns and restrictions that we know causes decreased case numbers?

Those Indian states that adopted more aggressive Ivermectin policies saw their cases fall far more than 80%, states like Uttar Pradesh - down 98% [37,944 to 596], like Uttarakhand - down 97% [9642 to 287] and Goa - down 90% [4195 to 423]. Delhi saw a 99% drop [28,395 to 238].


Tamil Nadu, which publicly banned Ivermectin, saw their cases rise to the highest in India, and they continued setting state records until May 21, 2021, when they peaked at 36,184.

Meanwhile, deaths have also dropped markedly in Delhi, among the first areas to adopt Ivermectin. Their deaths have plummeted from 448 on May 3 to 36 on June 9, a drop of 92%.

By contrast, Tamil Nadu's deaths rose ten-fold from April 20 to May 27. On June 9, Tamil Nadu's COVID-19 deaths remained the second highest in India at 405, while the states that chose Ivermectin were all dramatically better.

On June 9, Tamil Nadu, with a population less than 4.9% of India's, accounted for almost 20% of all of India's 2,177 June 9 death toll. By contrast, Uttar Pradesh which is on Ivermectin, with 204 million people, three times that of Tamil Nadu, saw a mere 91 deaths, less than 1/4 of Tamil Nadu.

 

[William Wonka]

We cant ban Aussies wanting to come home.

But Aussies should remain here after coming home (no pissing off to India for a ******* wedding or other bullshit)

But we need dedicated facilities ASAP, but Scotty has had his jab so he does not care about us.

I agree.
They can return home by boat.

 

[PP34]

Millions don't bother with the flu shot each year, I'm sure you've never worried.

Brainwashed beyond help. Turn off the TV, you're going to harm yourself

Spare me the "It isn't the flu". We know, it's a BEAST!!

Millions don’t have to bother with the flu because of all the people who get vaccinated and because the flu has been around for years.