Player Watch Darcy Fogarty

[NSolis]

Thilthorpe has kicked 18 goals in his last 22 games and Himmelberg 23 goals in his last 22

No need to worry about bringing Thilthorpe back from injury, we've already got a better player right here!

I don't agree we could replace Fogarty with anyone, but there's a difference between a 21 year old and a 24 year old in terms of potential growth. We would prioritise picking Thilthorpe because we think he's going to get better, not based exclusively on his current output.

edit: fixed Fogarty's age

 

[Scorpus]

I don't agree we could replace Fogarty with anyone, but there's a difference between a 21 year old and a 25 year old in terms of potential growth. We would prioritise picking Thilthorpe because we think he's going to get better, not based exclusively on his current output.

That's right, there are more factors to picking a player than their goal output.

Incidentally Thilthorpe has actually kicked fewer goals than Fogarty after the same number of games, and has a similar amount of goals to Himmelberg after the same number of games

But no one would suggest (yet) that Thilthorpe is a fail like Himmelberg

 

[NSolis]

Right but Thilthorpe and Fogarty are not comparable. If Thilthorpe was still producing his current output in 2027 we'd certainly be concerned.

 

[AFC979810]

Thilthorpe has kicked 18 goals in his last 22 games and Himmelberg 23 goals in his last 22

No need to worry about bringing Thilthorpe back from injury, we've already got a better player right here!

Well isn't that just a silly post.

Once more - Himmelberg isnt very good thats why he has only played 22 games over the past 3 and 1/4 seasons. The issue is that FOGs performance has been very similar to Himmelbergs over his past 22 games.

 

[AFC979810]

Right but Thilthorpe and Fogarty are not comparable. If Thilthorpe was still producing his current output in 2027 we'd certainly be concerned.

Spot on. The FOGatics love an excuse. Time is running out.

Yep I’m sure they would have hit up that spot kick

He lowered his eyes inside 50 and spotted up Cook.

14 game Cook did the something very similar earlier in the game.

If one good kick is the pass mark for a member of our leadership group - God help us.

Let’s just give him a few weeks with our new found game plan before we go too early.

This isnt going too early. He has 25 goals in his last 22 games. Half of those goals came in 4 games against bottom four teams WCE/North/Gold Coast.

Remember how Tex has looked.

Tex also missed week 1 with a bad back and still doesn't look 100%.

There can't be any excuses for FOG's performance against Carlton. Was probably our 2nd worst behind McHenry.

 

[Scorpus]

Well isn't that just a silly post.

Once more - Himmelberg isnt very good thats why he has only played 22 games over the past 3 and 1/4 seasons. The issue is that FOGs performance has been very similar to Himmelbergs over his past 22 games.

Again:

Thilthorpe has kicked 18 goals in his last 22 games and Himmelberg 23 goals in his last 22

So why does everyone acknowledge Thilthorpe is a better player than Himmelberg (now and/or on potential)?

There is more to someone's game than raw goal output. That's why Fogarty (and Thilthorpe) are being selected ahead of Himmelberg, because the quality of the player and their output is superior

Of course, goals are important, if you don't kick them as a forward you are toast. Fogarty does pretty much everything better than Himmelberg even over the last 22 games

One area would be score involvements. Fogarty has kicked more goals and had 24% more score involvements. You say Fogarty has had concrete hands lately. 68% more marks inside 50 over that period. About 4x the number of inside 50 tackles. 38% more shots at goal. 67% more goal assists. 15% more effective kicks. He's even managed slightly more inside 50s despite apparently not being able to do anything up the ground.

So no, Fogarty is not performing at the level of Himmelberg even though he's currently below his best

 

[FR0GGY]

Spot on. The FOGatics




He lowered his eyes inside 50 and spotted up Cook.

14 game Cook did the something very similar earlier in the game.

If one good kick is the pass mark for a member of our leadership group - God help us.

I’m all for playing cook and he’s talented but the comparison was Burgess, Gollant, Himmelberg or any average plodder we could pluck from the rookie draft/delisted free agency pool
Apart from Dawson he’s probably our best performer leader

 

[Eagleboy2011]

Spot on. The FOGatics love an excuse. Time is running out.



He lowered his eyes inside 50 and spotted up Cook.

14 game Cook did the something very similar earlier in the game.

If one good kick is the pass mark for a member of our leadership group - God help us.



This isnt going too early. He has 25 goals in his last 22 games. Half of those goals came in 4 games against bottom four teams WCE/North/Gold Coast.





Tex also missed week 1 with a bad back and still doesn't look 100%.

There can't be any excuses for FOG's performance against Carlton. Was probably our 2nd worst behind McHenry.

Is his role as a decoy for Tex. He hung back a fair way at times. Too deep. Some of his on-ball stuff was good when there. That pass to Cook was a gem late in the match.

 

[George Kramer]

I reckon this thread needs more DMack and defending experienced players

 

[AFC979810]

I’m all for playing cook and he’s talented but the comparison was Burgess, Gollant, Himmelberg or any average plodder we could pluck from the rookie draft/delisted free agency pool

Look it was a great play by FOG. Kept his head under pressure, but lets not act like it was some amazing piece of magic.

Two Carlton players collide - FOG gathers the loose ball and under pressure kicks a 25 meter drop punt to an open Cook.

Apart from Dawson he’s probably our best performer leader

Which isnt that bad I guess considering there are 37 of em.

 

[weekend at bernies]

all the fog bashing is hilarious. 2 of Rankines goals came directly from Fog imposing himself.

 

[AFC979810]

I reckon this thread needs more DMack and defending experienced players

Isn't that what FOG is now?

88 Games of AFL footy, 7 preseasons, and in the leadership group.

You are more than willing to stick the boot into poor old leadership Murphy, but rather quite when old golden man child puts in an absolute stinker.

 

[cmndstab]

He's still our second best key forward option (see Gollant yesterday?) If you really wanted to strain for the positives in this game, his possessions are at least impactful, and he didn't completely drop his head out of the game- he was a significant part of what led to two of the three goals in our come back. Hopefully he can take some confidence out of that.

This is where I'm at, too. It would be one thing if we had a dominant key forward killing it at SANFL level, but we don't. Or even just an untried high draft pick young forward. The notion that we could replace him with Gollant or Himmelberg seem fanciful to me - those guys can't perform at his level even when he's there taking a stronger defender. And Fogarty has the benefit that when he does get the ball in his hands, he usually does something good with it. Great skills all around the ground.

It doesn't seem like he's ever going to be a dominant player off his own back in the way that Walker has been lately, so it's up to us to find a way to get the ball in his hands. Whether that's by using him in a different role, or creating a different forward-line structure, or even just by improving our I50 entries.

 

[Scorpus]

I don't think a comparison between an out of form Fogarty and the ever consistent Lachie Murphy would be very flattering to Murphy at all

 

[FR0GGY]

He’s not keeping anyone worth it out of the side, so keep playing talent.
Form is temporary, class is permanent.
If there was a young bloke in the wings by all means give him a spell.

 

[AFC979810]

This is where I'm at, too. It would be one thing if we had a dominant key forward killing it at SANFL level, but we don't. The notion that we could replace him with Gollant or Himmelberg seem fanciful to me - those guys can't perform at his level even when he's there taking a stronger defender. And Fogarty has the benefit that when he does get the ball in his hands, he usually does something good with it. Great skills all around the ground.

This is completely fair.

However I didnt see anyone suggesting we drop him for Gollant or Himmelberg, just that his recent output hasn't been better than what those guys produced.

It doesn't seem like he's ever going to be a dominant player off his own back in the way that Walker has been lately, so it's up to us to find a way to get the ball in his hands. Whether that's by using him in a different role, or creating a different forward-line structure, or even just by improving our I50 entries.

I disagree. I really think he can and he showed it early in 2023.

 

[AFC979810]

Yep I’m sure they would have hit up that spot kick

And circling back - I am sure all of those players wouldn't have missed the wide open shot from the goalsquare which he missed and likely cost us the game against Geelong.

 

[Coopers]

all the fog bashing is hilarious. 2 of Rankines goals came directly from Fog imposing himself.

That's why he's not a total write-off, cos he's still contributing during a poor game.

However, we want him to be better. He needs to dominate contests more often. He's a big lad, he should be.

 

[FR0GGY]

And circling back - I am sure all of those players wouldn't have missed the wide open shot from the goalsquare which he missed and likely cost us the game against Geelong.

See my post above.

 

[Coopers]

And circling back - I am sure all of those players wouldn't have missed the wide open shot from the goalsquare which he missed and likely cost us the game against Geelong.

We had to drop Burgess for doing it two games in a row before it was Fog's turn to pay the price for that though

 

[George Kramer]

Isn't that what FOG is now?

88 Games of AFL footy, 7 preseasons, and in the leadership group.

You are more than willing to stick the boot into poor old leadership Murphy, but rather quite when old golden man child puts in an absolute stinker.

Fog should be doing better but he has played better footy than Murphy ever will and plays in a lot harder position than what Murphy.

He also was crucial in setting up that Cook goal, which would we know Murphy would have sprayed.

I’m also more tolerant of players that I see have the ability to be critical to our teams success going forward.

I find it weird you’re devoting so much energy into bagging him the last 12 months and yet you defend average mediocre players in Mackay, it’s a rather odd sense of priorities.

 

[Golumless]

Spot on. The FOGatics love an excuse. Time is running out.



He lowered his eyes inside 50 and spotted up Cook.

14 game Cook did the something very similar earlier in the game.

If one good kick is the pass mark for a member of our leadership group - God help us.



This isnt going too early. He has 25 goals in his last 22 games. Half of those goals came in 4 games against bottom four teams WCE/North/Gold Coast.





Tex also missed week 1 with a bad back and still doesn't look 100%.

There can't be any excuses for FOG's performance against Carlton. Was probably our 2nd worst behind McHenry.

For what, exactly?

Fog has been a 1.5+ goal per game key forward for the past two years. This is a bit of an inconsistent/rough stretch, but Fog has at least 3 months to sort it out, and he inevitably will. You can almost take it to the bank Fog is going to get 200 games as a 2nd KPF here if he stays healthy.

It's not going too early. It's a misread of our list to think there is any pressure on Fog.

 

[AFC979810]

For what, exactly?

His poor performances.

Fog has been a 1.5+ goal per game key forward for the past two years. This is a bit of an inconsistent/rough stretch, but Fog has at least 3 months to sort it out, and he inevitably will. You can almost take it to the bank Fog is going to get 200 games as a 2nd KPF here if he stays healthy.

He has plenty of time to sort it out.

He isnt out of contract until the end of 2025 and our cupboard is empty with regards to replacing him. Obviously the club rates him highly - making him one of our esteemed 23 leaders in the leadership group.

It's not going too early. It's a misread of our list to think there is any pressure on Fog.

I haven't said there is pressure on him. I have just said that his form over his past 22 games has been pretty piss poor. He is a board favorite and IMO escapes a lot of the criticism that our other players get.

 

[Pugsley]

Well thats dramatic.

In no way am I advocating dropping FOG for Himmelberg, but I don't think we would lose too much based on FOG's form over the past 22 games.

For the record Himmelberg played 22 games between 2021 and 2023 and kicked 22 goals with zero continuity. Fog has kicked 25 goals in the last 22 games he has played.

Himmelberg is gone end of this year. We won't be getting much so let him play in the Snaffle.

 

[Golumless]

His poor performances.



He has plenty of time to sort it out.

He isnt out of contract until the end of 2025 and our cupboard is empty with regards to replacing him. Obviously the club rates him highly - making him one of our esteemed 23 leaders in the leadership group.



I haven't said there is pressure on him. I have just said that his form over his past 22 games has been pretty piss poor. He is a board favorite and IMO escapes a lot of the criticism that our other players get.

If you say 'times ticking', that implies there is pressure on him. There is precisely 0 pressure on Fog's spot or performances at this point.

Whilst I do agree a tad that he's escape some criticism that others - i.e. Murphy - have received over the preseason, really every best 22 member in our forward line in 2023 should have been seen as above criticism when dissecting last year. I still think Fog is not at the point where much, if any, criticism is genuinely warranted, though in part that's due to the credits in the bank from 2023. In the end of the day, he had a good year last and really the job of a second key forward is pop up with a goal or two a game and contribute a bit around the ground. Fog did that. Especially when your partner is white hot.