Did Farmer deserve his game?

[criticize]

the way i look at it both farmer and davey for the bombers are not ideal choices for sub as they do not make immediate impacts and are better suited to playing the full game.
nason/helbig are similiar cases.

the best subs have been players who attract the ball and can make the most of their fresh legs, but both the tigers and essendon have used it to bring players into the team.

tuck has been richmonds best sub imo- came in and made an immediate impact and racked up alot of ball- pace of the game slowing down also worked into his hands, i think webberly could be a good sub, maybe connors if fit.

 

[PHX]

I agree, and I'm all about the horses for courses line of thinking, but I can't help but feel Webbs would be a little disillusioned at the moment. Same as against the Dogs, he should have come in as the replacement for White. I really like Farmer but he didn't deserve a game.


I can't help but feel there's more to it. He literally hasn't had a look in, not one NAB Cup or NAB Challenge game, and he really did look good last year. Coaches never even mention him when talking about our young KPDs.


Disagree, I think a player like Morton would make us a much better team. Him and King/White are polar opposites, clubs would struggle to handle all three.


Agree he hasn't, but it just seems like he's not getting a fair run at it. Every season he starts from a long way further back than other players (or so it seems). Again, I'd be pretty disillusioned if I were Tucky.


I rate Helbig enormously. But he should earn his games. As I said, Webberley should have come in last week.


You're right but I'm not so much talking about disposal efficiency, it's about class. I really do think we could use Morton at the moment. We could really do with a Chapman, Burgoyne classy half forward to cap of the team and get on the end of Cotch and Jacko's hard work. I reckon Morton would be able to do that very well, and is another threat in our midfield as well. Alas, I think he is gonski.

You have demonstrated that all my gripes are explainable and I pretty much agree with your explanations but I do think that these concerns are realistic, it does seem like Dimma and co have their favourites, and yes they are consistent with the gameplan, but can't help but feel we should be rewarding form.

I'm a bit confused by the fact that you say we should be rewarding form and then want Mitch Morton and Daniel Connors in the team who are clearly out of form and not players who would improve the team with what they bring to the table in my opinion.

Webberley I can see your point and too think he should be rewarded soon for his effort.

Tuck is a player who is okay for the now but wont be with us when we aim to be at the top of the ladder. That's not Tucky's fault, but it's also not Dimma's problem.

Finally, comparing Paul Chapman to Mitch Morton is an utter disgrace.

 

[Spluff]

The coaching staff have definitely dropped the ball on Morton. You could see where they're coming from with the other choices but Morton was just exceedingly poorly managed.

 

[Tigermad2011]

No he should not have played

 

[ize_]

I'm a bit confused by the fact that you say we should be rewarding form and then want Mitch Morton and Daniel Connors in the team who are clearly out of form and not players who would improve the team with what they bring to the table in my opinion.

Webberley I can see your point and too think he should be rewarded soon for his effort.

Tuck is a player who is okay for the now but wont be with us when we aim to be at the top of the ladder. That's not Tucky's fault, but it's also not Dimma's problem.

Finally, comparing Paul Chapman to Mitch Morton is an utter disgrace.

I don't think we should have dropped him in the first place, and to be honest I don't think he gets a fair run. Was never going to work playing him deep forward after what he did on the wing last year. Played his best footy second half against Hawthorn when he moved up the field. Was probably out best player in the last half. Morton hasn't pushed via Coburg but I think it's pretty clear he's in our best 22, we should be playing him and I'm not sure why we're not. Same with I'm not sure why we're doing a few of those things I mentioned.

Disgrace is an over the top word, and surely you know I didn't mean that as a direct comparison - I'm talking about a type of player. Morton is a senior body with good skills, good hands, ability to find the footy and a good kick for goal. He could play the role that Chapman plays.

 

[kainokaino]

Hardwick is not going to drop kids after one game, pretty confident Farmer will play a couple more games before being judged, pretty stupid to play someone as a sub and then drop them the next week. Post should stay in the side to, might have to play down back now that Grimes is out. Miller should come straight back in, I know he has a lot of knockers on this site but he has been good so far this year and deserves to come straight back into the side.

 

[Saturday@2]

Morton is a senior body with good skills, good hands, ability to find the footy and a good kick for goal. He could play the role that Chapman plays.

Morton may have some (or maybe even all) of the attributes you claim, but the one attribute he is missing is a willingness to apply pressure to the opposition. Without that being addressed, he's highly unlikely to play football for Richmond in the near future.

 

[AstuteTiger]

I like farmer "when fit" but he shouldn't have come in way underdone and was stuck in 1st gear and he's form in the 2's didnt warrant promotion albeit coming off injuries but thats more reason to let him ride it out on the 2's until match fitness comes his way....how he got the nod ahead of webborley still mystifies me, what happened to rewarding good form in the 2's...

Many including myself thought he'd come in for white and play his role well that didnt come to fruition, so he came in as the sub and looked so underdone just wasnt a good selection from the coaching panel to have him selected based on his non match fitness, webbs should've come in as another runner off half back or wing....

 

[El Tigre]

I reckon barring injury, the plan was to sub Helbig out of the game, and replace with Farmer. Farmer is being trained in the forward line, and would be the ideal swap for Helbig.
i said before the game, that i reckon Tuck was being brought in to assist Browne, because he was going to need help. But Browne actually performed better than expected, and then Tuck less than expected, so therefore, the decision was made to sub Tuck.

Anyway, the answer to original question is probably no, but what he offered filled what was required to the plan. You can't just go sticking players in to any team, because they have earnt it. There is a thing called team structure. Webberley will get his chance, and when its your turn to go, its your turn to go.

 

[PHX]

I don't think we should have dropped him in the first place, and to be honest I don't think he gets a fair run. Was never going to work playing him deep forward after what he did on the wing last year. Played his best footy second half against Hawthorn when he moved up the field. Was probably out best player in the last half. Morton hasn't pushed via Coburg but I think it's pretty clear he's in our best 22, we should be playing him and I'm not sure why we're not. Same with I'm not sure why we're doing a few of those things I mentioned.

Then we're watching different footy games.

If you cant see the results of dropping these players and replacing them with kids who have barely played a game, Batch, Helbig, Conca etc you're on the wrong planet. The culture at our club is changing for a reason, because if you dont play to team rules you dont play and Connors and Morton have shown time and time again they cant do that.

Disgrace is an over the top word, and surely you know I didn't mean that as a direct comparison - I'm talking about a type of player. Morton is a senior body with good skills, good hands, ability to find the footy and a good kick for goal. He could play the role that Chapman plays.

I dont think it is at all. Morton could never play the role that Chapman does. Morton is not that rare combination of grunt and outside skills that Chapman is. Morton also needs most often to snap to kick goals while Chapman can kick them on a set shot or on the run anywhere from 55 metres and under. Chapman also plays defense while Morton is a liability. And Chapman has a senior body, Morton has a just football body that struggles to hold tackles.

They are not the same type of player.

 

[ize_]

Then we're watching different footy games.

If you cant see the results of dropping these players and replacing them with kids who have barely played a game, Batch, Helbig, Conca etc you're on the wrong planet. The culture at our club is changing for a reason, because if you dont play to team rules you dont play and Connors and Morton have shown time and time again they cant do that.
I dont think it is at all. Morton could never play the role that Chapman does. Morton is not that rare combination of grunt and outside skills that Chapman is. Morton also needs most often to snap to kick goals while Chapman can kick them on a set shot or on the run anywhere from 55 metres and under. Chapman also plays defense while Morton is a liability. And Chapman has a senior body, Morton has a just football body that struggles to hold tackles.

They are not the same type of player.

I guess the fact that your first response was to leap to the defense of the coaching staff can only be a good thing. In years gone by my comments would probably be met with agreement, no matter how accurate/inaccurate they were. Don't get me wrong, I think Hardwick is the best thing to happen to the club since I've been alive. But this is just my first gripe and I think it's valid, but not complaining too hard the way we are playing at the moment. Just don't think you can focus too much on one or two features of the game, and ignore players who don't display these features. Need a mix.

 

[PHX]

Fair enough.

By the way, Ize, you do realise we are discussing the merits of Morton and Connors getting a game while both are in fact injured anyway?

 

[ize_]

I knew it about Connors which is why I didn't focus on him too much but I didn't know it about Morton. What's up with him?

 

[PHX]

I have no idea. One of those mysteries that dont get on the injury list but I'm pretty sure he didnt play last week.