Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * Coroners Inquiry Current

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

Suppression orders are in force, please use the following to indicate:

FM - Foster Mother
FF - Foster Father
FGM - Foster Grandmother
FD - Foster Daughter
FPs - Foster Parents

Up to you if you wish to refer to them as former fosters but please write it in full, strictly using the above. No deviations.

Other initials posters will use informally but should not are:

BCR - Batar Creek Road
FA - Frank Abbott
MW - Michelle White
SFR - Strike Force Rosann
AMS - Anne Maree Sharpley
CCR - Cobb and Co Road
One even reduced bike riding to - BR

 

[passball]

I disagree, I find alwaysintrigued to be one of the more open minded posters.

Some are very set that FM did it and others just as set that she did not.

Always intrigued very kindly posts their notes from their attendance at the inquest, and I would have thought this group would have been a bit more appreciative, as we are so starved of info on this case.

I don't get that vibe they are open.
I might be more sensitive to it not because I think the FPs are involved but because they are fully protected by their fans.
What we do know is that a little boy in their care who is probably deceased could possibly involve 3 people we will never know.
And 'I don't know' isn't an acceptable out.

 

[Kurve]

Mazda 3’s don’t have GPS.

Two phone calls, one drive.

The FD would have noticed her driving if she went out twice IMO.

The fact that FD didn’t notice FM driving at all is very fortunate for the FM but two drives and she would have been pushing her luck.

Not so sure about that, I used to take my Dad's car out on little jaunts when he was in the house or at the back of the property and I only got caught once.

 

[Tommyz]

What time was that?

Am not sure of the exact time, but as I understand it, it was around 10.15am. It was in the Dan Box's podcast, as well as I read it quite a long time ago. Dan Box spoke to the Crabbe's

 

[Wallace52]

Lol I remember her confusion at inquest. I wondered if she got herself into a muddle because she knew she had turned left at sometime; possibly the trip to Macquarie Airport she had stated to Lia Harris in her interview on 12/9/2013 in which she had stated she picked her sister up 'on the night' and at that time in the interview, they were discussing the 12/9/2014!

I can’t believe she held down a job as long as she did. I think she’s better with written communication, than verbal. I think.

 

[Wallace52]

Not so sure about that, I used to take my Dad's car out on little jaunts when he was in the house or at the back of the property and I only got caught once.

Were you a 4 year old girl? With a brother missing?

4 year old girls hang off their mums, especially if they get the sense that something is up.

Or maybe her and the FM weren’t very close.


IMO

 

[Wallace52]

Could only wish we had one of those so our kids are safe.
Childhood abuse/sexual abuse is something horrific that no one should have to live with for the rest of their lives. Many do unfortunately.

Someone should tell the fosters that, considering they’re convicted of assault and stalking and intimidation of a little girl in their care.

Domestic violence comes in so many forms: Coercive control, physical abuse, verbal abuse, psychological abuse, sexual abuse, intimidation, destruction of property, theft of property, arson, hurting the persons animals/pets. And then there is neglect and withholding things like washing of the person’s clothes and not providing a child with the basic essentials such as underwear.

Obviously the fosters have only been convicted of assault and stalk/intimidate, not the whole list above.

And both of the fosters had Blue Cards.
The system is well and truly broken.

If we are going to have a register for CSA offenders we may as well look at the process for Blue Cards too.

 

[gymjam]

I disagree, I find alwaysintrigued to be one of the more open minded posters.

Some are very set that FM did it and others just as set that she did not.

Always intrigued very kindly posts their notes from their attendance at the inquest, and I would have thought this group would have been a bit more appreciative, as we are so starved of info on this case.

We have to trust that the private notes from tranche attendees are correct or that what is said at the inquest is not misunderstood given that some of the information stated has not been detailed in subsequent media articles and the inquest tranche was packed with attending media reps, as reported by non media representatives on various social sites.

I find peoples opinions are very interesting whatever side they are on. People will perceive facts or published material or evidence differently to others due to their own life experiences. It gets very confusing at times when people say they attended but what is written is not supported by what is reported about the same matter by a multitude of media reps.

 

[Awakening]

I don't get that vibe they are open.
I might be more sensitive to it not because I think the FPs are involved but because they are fully protected by their fans.
What we do know is that a little boy in their care who is probably deceased could possibly involve 3 people we will never know.
And 'I don't know' isn't an acceptable out.

Whether FM is guilty or not, I dont know. But I dont find her at all likeable or trustworthy.

 

[31550]

The fact that FD didn’t notice FM driving at all is very fortunate for the FM but two drives and she would have been pushing her luck.

How do we know whether FD knows anything about the drive? The police might, but the public don't.

 

[Awakening]

We have to trust that the private notes from tranche attendees are correct or that what is said at the inquest is not misunderstood given that some of the information stated has not been detailed in subsequent media articles and the inquest tranche was packed with attending media reps, as reported by non media representatives on various social sites.

I find peoples opinions are very interesting whatever side they are on. People will perceive facts or published material or evidence differently to others due to their own life experiences. It gets very confusing at times when people say they attended but what is written is not supported by what is reported about the same matter by a multitude of media reps.

I certainly take that into consideration. We all interpret things differently.

As evidenced regularly in this thread.

 

[Wallace52]

How do we know whether FD knows anything about the drive? The police might, but the public don't.

She doesn’t know. She didn’t know.

 

[gymjam]

Where you a 4 year old girl? With a brother missing?

4 year old girls hang off their mums, especially if they get the sense that something is up.

Or maybe her and the FM weren’t very close.


IMO

It sounds to me from statements made publicly by FM and what she detailed in sworn statements about her relationship with both childen could only be described as being polar opposite statements. One negated the other.

 

[31550]

We have to trust that the private notes from tranche attendees are correct or that what is said at the inquest is not misunderstood

Absolutely. And people can (sometimes innocently) misquote or misinterpret things. It also seems some people can't tell the difference between what is presented as evidence, and what the deputy coroner actually accepts as fact.
We are still hearing most things second or third hand, and not direct from the source.
And all the reporting is selective. If something doesn't get reported for any reason, we will never know about it. Full transcripts are not generally available.

 

[Kurve]

Where you a 4 year old girl? With a brother missing?

4 year old girls hang off their mums, especially if they get the sense that something is up.

Or maybe her and the FM weren’t very close.


IMO

I have no idea exactly when it was the FD was made aware that William was missing and it was serious? Whether it was before or after this drive.

I've also seen no mention of the FD being with the FM or both the FM and the FGM while they were out looking and talking to the neighbours.

What was she doing at that time? Probably oblivious.

 

[gymjam]

Whether FM is guilty or not, I dont know. But I dont find her at all likeable or trustworthy.

Is thete anything in particular that that caused you to react to her in that way?

 

[Awakening]

You can give off a bad vibe and still not be guilty.

Guilt is not how you feel about someone, it’s based on evidence and a lack of reasonable doubt.

What I’m saying is even if she’s found to be innocent, I don’t like her.

I think she’s guilty of neglect and is more interested in covering her own backside then finding William.

I’m undecided if she’s involved in his disappearance or not. An opportunistic abduction, whilst unlikely, is still possible.

 

[passball]

We have to trust that the private notes from tranche attendees are correct or that what is said at the inquest is not misunderstood given that some of the information stated has not been detailed in subsequent media articles and the inquest tranche was packed with attending media reps, as reported by non media representatives on various social sites.

I find peoples opinions are very interesting whatever side they are on. People will perceive facts or published material or evidence differently to others due to their own life experiences. It gets very confusing at times when people say they attended but what is written is not supported by what is reported about the same matter by a multitude of media reps.

I understand that.
That is why having access to the walkthroughs are so important, it's coming straight from the horses mouth and shows their demeanour, slip ups if there's any.
I would be very interested if we could see the FMs one but someone has done a good job of finding it.

 

[Awakening]

Is thete anything in particular that that caused you to react to her in that way?

Not any one thing, but an overall observation from the things she says and does.

 

[Wallace52]

I understand that.
That is why having access to the walkthroughs are so important, it's coming straight from the horses mouth and shows their demeanour, slip ups if there's any.
I would be very interested if we could see the FMs one but someone has done a good job of finding it.

There is a select group of people who have it and they won’t part with it for love or money.

 

[Underarrest_]

Someone should tell the fosters that considering they’re convicted of assault and stalking and intimidation of a little girl in their care.

Domestic violence comes in so many forms: Coercive control, physical abuse, verbal abuse, psychological abuse, sexual abuse, intimidation, destruction of property, theft of property, arson, hurting the persons animals/pets. And then there is neglect and withholding things like washing clothes and not providing a child with the basic essentials such as underwear.

Obviously the fosters have only been convicted of assault and stalk/intimidate, not the whole list above.

And both of the fosters had Blue Cards.
The system is well and truly broken.

If we are going to have a register for CSA offenders we may as well look at the process for Blue Cards too.

Yes unfortunately blue cards are only for those who haven’t been caught.
Many people think that if someone has a blue card they can be trusted, whether it be foster carers, day care workers, and any other work place.
Some can of course.
Go the Morcombs for spending their lives focusing on child protective behaviours because it’s the best way to keep our children safe!!

 

[Wallace52]

What I’m saying is even if she’s found to be innocent, I don’t like her.

I think she’s guilty of neglect and is more interested in covering her own backside then finding William.

I’m undecided if she’s involved in his disappearance or not. An opportunistic abduction, whilst unlikely, is still possible.

There could be some ass-covering happening.

If the FM really wanted to bring about change in the world she should be campaigning for balcony safety and building approvals laws regarding high balconies and the safety features needed on them to protect children from death and injury: Instead of this Where’s William stuff which is just getting very sad and very old, and is not really helping anyone very much.

IMO

She could have still been the hero. She has a great passion for advocacy and raising awareness: I can see that.

Pics: Circa 2022

 

[Underarrest_]

There could be some ass-covering happening.

If the FM really wanted to bring about change in the world she would be campaigning for balcony safety and building approvals laws regarding high balconies and the safety features needed on them to protect children from death and injury: Instead of this Where’s William stuff which is just getting very sad and very old, and is not really helping anyone very much.

IMO

When was this?

There could be some ass-covering happening.

If the FM really wanted to bring about change in the world she would be campaigning for balcony safety and building approvals laws regarding high balconies and the safety features needed on them to protect children from death and injury: Instead of this Where’s William stuff which is just getting very sad and very old, and is not really helping anyone very much.

IMO

She could have still been the hero. She has a great passion for advocacy and raising awareness: I can see that.

What do parents with young children do when they go on holidays and stay in 1,5,10,20 or more storey hotels?
I’d think ask for a bottom floor or
keep them off the balcony.
Not just the height, what if the railings fell.
The children should have been kept off this balcony. I can’t believe they were allowed anywhere near it.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

That 9 time is incorrect. I think people are getting confused with the time FF stated Khodary Pharmacy opened - its in his 14/9/2014 statement and he had pre-checked the opening time on the net - it was 9; and also his vehicle was captured on Kendall tennis club cctv heading in Lakewood direction at 8:40! In this statement he doesn't actually state what time he left Benaroon Drive, he bumbled on about 8am but its hard to make out whether he meant he departed Benaroon at 8am or whether he had intended to get to Lakewood by 8am, and spend a bit of time setting up his video system to hook up with the woman in Queensland. Note: he was still at 48 Benaroon around 7:50.

He said he used to test his video systems to make sure the hookup could occur without issues and it was dependent upon the system his contact was using at their end to get the hookup flowing ok. He initially stated on 14th that his video call commenced at 9.15, then changed the time to 9.30, but later during the 14th interview, checked his phone and a note he had made and showed this evidence to both interviewing detectives that he actually commenced the video call at 9.17.

Therefore, we know his presence in Lakewood was verified by police by an independent cctv system in Lakewood. He parked in the Woolworths carpark and also had a view of Khodary Pharmacy adjacent to Woolworths. So he didn't need to drive off somewhere else before he made his way to Khodary after his video call was completed at 9.56. He obtained a receipt from Khodary at 10:19 recording his payment for his script - the detectives interviewing him on 14th did not ask him what his movements were between 9:56 and 10:19.

During the video meeting he had a missed call from a woman he referred to as a 'recruiter' with initials BR (I have chosen not to use her full name as recorded in his statement), and he returned that call whilst he was at Khodary and he said he told her he was at the chemist waiting for a script, and told her he needed to finish the call because he need to get back home.

He commenced his travel back to Kendall and was stopped by roadworks in Kew. During this time he made a call at 10.23.

edit: spelling - the auto correct function is driving me crazy lately!

Wait what? He mumbled on over 8 am? That is the same crap the FGM went on about. Do you have the detail?

 

[gymjam]

Yes unfortunately blue cards are only for those who haven’t been caught.
Many people think that if someone has a blue card they can be trusted, whether it be foster carers, day care workers, and any other work place.
Some can of course.
Go the Morcombs for spending their lives focusing on child protective behaviours because it’s the best way to keep our children safe!!

Blue cards are only based on recorded convictions arent they? So if someone hasnt been caught and successfully prosecuted for certain crimes ....... wella congrats here is your blue card.

 

[gymjam]

There could be some ass-covering happening.

If the FM really wanted to bring about change in the world she would be campaigning for balcony safety and building approvals laws regarding high balconies and the safety features needed on them to protect children from death and injury: Instead of this Where’s William stuff which is just getting very sad and very old, and is not really helping anyone very much.

IMO

She could have still been the hero. She has a great passion for advocacy and raising awareness: I can see that.

Did I read somewhere , it could have been a side note on one the the house plans attached to her 2015 statement that her father when the house was built in the 80s, took responsibility for verandahs and railings? I wonder what the Australian building code was in the 80s and what the code was when DOCS and or Young Hope inspected the property prior to granting approval for 48 Benaroon to be listed as satisfactory to visit?