Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell Pt 2 * FM guilty of assault & intimidation

[Kurve]

Continued from PART 1

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father *Not Guilty
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both *Guilty
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

 

[LRitz]

The whole "2 cars for 2 children" idea is ridiculous......

It’s so dumb .But it does highlight the bounds of the Foster Mother’s imagination...

I think the FF was thinking someone in the bio family may have tried to take W. Hence the car tracking theory.

at one stage the FF asked the police if there may have been a tracker put on their car before they drove to Kendall

The FF was suggesting the biological family was involved.The FM was suggesting someone had a complex plan to take the children and they were being targeted. The FGM was surrounded by strange people. Lots of alternate suspects. The foster family had their ducks lined up, Which did result in distraction, time and effort for police investigation leading nowhere. (and in the end expensive compensation)
Biological family.
Cars parked across the road.
Car driven with scary driver.
Washing machine repair man
Handy man repairing deck.
Creepy neighbour who comes and goes at odd hours.
FF's car possibility of being tracked.

The FGM mentions both repair men in her "which way would I have gone"- walk through. She also conveniently adds their addresses for the police. After all FGM had organised for both to come to her house. I hear your reply - but the washing machine needed fixing.

 

[Wallace52]

The FF was suggesting the biological family was involved.The FM was suggesting someone had a complex plan to take the children and they were being targeted. The FGM was surrounded by strange people. Lots of alternate suspects. The foster family had their ducks lined up, Which did result in distraction, time and effort for police investigation leading nowhere. (and in the end expensive compensation)
Biological family.
Cars parked across the road.
Car driven with scary driver.
Washing machine repair man
Handy man repairing deck.
Creepy neighbour who comes and goes at odd hours.
FF's car possibility of being tracked.

The FGM mentions both repair men in her "which way would I have gone"- walk through. She also conveniently adds their addresses for the police. After all FGM had organised for both to come to her house. I hear your reply - but the washing machine needed fixing.

According to the media: The FGM and the FM were both POI at the time of the FGM death. Interesting, isn’t it.

 

[js47]

If the police have ruled out everyone but the FF then the FF FM FGM and even the FGF even relatives living in the CH Area could be responsible for William.
Something in their backgrounds is where the answer lay. IMO
William did not go missing in Sydney.
Even if there was an accident WHERE IS WILLIAM?
He went missing where the FF relations had lived for 20+ years.
Maybe the FGM mentioned the visit to the local store owner she probably have stocked up on orange juice toast cereal and eggs. She told the man across the road. Didn’t someone ask the store owner where the street was?
Where is the driver of the car with spider man.
What hobbies did the FGP have FGM was not liked if you believe some accounts of Kendall residents when interviewed by police.
What plays on my mind is the FF said he knew the area well. Did he take his bike with him? Does FM or FGM ride? Why was FGM not dressed ready to go to the cemetery?
My impression was that FF FM FGM all spoke as if they were reading a script like a news paper article.

 

[js47]

If the police have ruled out everyone but the FF then the FF FM FGM and even the FGF even relatives living in the CH Area could be responsible for William.
Something in their backgrounds is where the answer lay. IMO

 

[31550]

If the police have ruled out everyone but the FF then the FF FM FGM and even the FGF even relatives living in the CH Area could be responsible for William.
Something in their backgrounds is where the answer lay. IMO

FGF had been dead for several months. I don't think he could have been involved.
Why would FGM need to be dressed for the cemetery?
Why would FGM be buying orange juice etc on the Thursday? She didn't know they were arriving Thursday night until they rang her around 5pm on the way up. She would have had plenty of time to go shopping on the Friday morning if not for the change of plans. She wasn't expecting them until Friday afternoon originally.
AFAIK FF did not have his bike with him. Someone else may be able to confirm, but it doesn't appear in any of the photos around the time of William's disappearance.

More appropriate questions are:
Why did FGM not collect the newspaper (which came out on Wednesday) while she was in Kendall doing her regular Thursday routine? Why was it necessary for FF to collect her paper on the Friday morning?

 

[Wallace52]

AFAIK FF did not have his bike with him. Someone else may be able to confirm, but it doesn't appear in any of the photos around the time of William's disappearance.

That’s correct.

 

[js47]

FGM was a very neat lady she would be dressed to go to the cemetery. She had slippers on socks etc. look at her in the walk through and the photo on the deck. She would have gone to the shops the day before Friday and not the day they arrived she appeared to be organised and commented on the beds not made.
I know FGF had died but there was a build up to William vanishing.
There was tension in the house any one can reason that out all these players. Was there any one that could have harboured a grudge.
Yes why didn’t the FGM get the paper? I bet she liked routine. I think the the FM mentioned there were traditions that were followed like drinking tea.
Does any one know if the warranty was disrupted on the camera? Astro photo people dismantle cameras. You can play around with time lapse time settings etc change lens then put them back together and sell them on.

 

[js47]

There is something really off with Williams photo.
The FM loves taking photos makes sure subject is interesting shows care of children etc. But! The photo of William is not posed. William has nothing but a pencil and a bit of paper. Where is the toys from the cupboard LT had her pram FGM has her paper but William had nothing. Also his shoes are at the door but where is other family members’ shoes?
William was very active FGM mentioned this where is his toys? Why are they all sitting out in the cold?

 

[31550]

There is something really off with Williams photo.
The FM loves taking photos makes sure subject is interesting shows care of children etc. But! The photo of William is not posed. William has nothing but a pencil and a bit of paper. Where is the toys from the cupboard LT had her pram FGM has her paper but William had nothing. Also his shoes are at the door but where is other family members’ shoes?
William was very active FGM mentioned this where is his toys? Why are they all sitting out in the cold?

Some folks with digital cameras or smartphones tend to snap a lot of photos and then go through them later and delete the 'bad' or uninteresting ones, keeping only what they want to keep to either print, or put in digital albums.

But it's interesting that there has never been a typical 'happy family' photo published with William and either or both of the fosters (or even with FGM and FGP) - like the ones people send their friends and family at Christmas or special occasions. Even with the fosters blacked out to protect their identity. Not one photo supports the 'happy family' claims.

 

[js47]

EXACTLY 31550.
I do have a smartphone. However! I also try to take an interesting snap.
Then I do not not always understand why the FM does and says some things. If she took the photo.
Where are his toys?

 

[Wallace52]

More appropriate questions are:
Why did FGM not collect the newspaper (which came out on Wednesday) while she was in Kendall doing her regular Thursday routine? Why was it necessary for FF to collect her paper on the Friday morning?

That is a good point.

But it's interesting that there has never been a typical 'happy family' photo published with William and either or both of the fosters (or even with FGM and FGP) - like the ones people send their friends and family at Christmas or special occasions. Even with the fosters blacked out to protect their identity. Not one photo supports the 'happy family' claims.

Hmmmm… they were a “family” but had no family portraits and no snaps of the foster parents with William.

All of his pictures apart from the one where he’s wearing a Santa hat, features William alone.

That’s really weird.

Maybe there were family shots or family portraits taken, but they were not distributed the media or the public…..

 

[LRitz]

EXACTLY 31550.
…Then I do not not always understand why the FM does and says some things. If she took the photo….

We can’t see you took the photo/photos . Could it have been the FF?
Or was FF buying the newspaper.

 

[31550]

We can’t see you took the photo/photos . Could it have been the FF?
Or was FF buying the newspaper.

The photos were examined forensically, and the timestamp was determined by SFR to be 9:37AM. According to phone records this was the same time FF was on his GoToMeeting at Lakewood - this has also been forensically confirmed by SFR.
So, it's not possible that FF took the photos.
Since FGM is in the photos, she didn't take them. This leaves FM as the only person capable of taking the photos.
Nobody else was seen entering or leaving the property, or is alleged by SFR to have done so.
FM testified to taking the photos. Why is this even being discussed?

 

[Wallace52]

The photos were examined forensically, and the timestamp was determined by SFR to be 9:37AM. According to phone records this was the same time FF was on his GoToMeeting at Lakewood - this has also been forensically confirmed by SFR.
So, it's not possible that FF took the photos.
Since FGM is in the photos, she didn't take them. This leaves FM as the only person capable of taking the photos.
Nobody else was seen entering or leaving the property, or is alleged by SFR to have done so.
FM testified to taking the photos. Why is this even being discussed?

People like to go around and around in circles. It’s such a frustrating case.

 

[js47]

William’s case will go round and round till it is solved unfortunately.
No you can set a camera up on a timer and take multiple photos. You can stack them. The only thing that was tested was the time. You can set a camera over a time frame. In that time you could say make a cup of tea.
Sorry I know you can all jump on me.
No wonder William was bored.

 

[31550]

William’s case will go round and round till it is solved unfortunately.
No you can set a camera up on a timer and take multiple photos. You can stack them. The only thing that was tested was the time. You can set a camera over a time frame. In that time you could say make a cup of tea.
Sorry I know you can all jump on me.
No wonder William was bored.

The photos were all taken from different angles and heights. The camera was clearly held by someone, not unattended on a stand or tripod.

 

[Wallace52]

The photos were all taken from different angles and heights. The camera was clearly held by someone, not unattended on a stand or tripod.

The camera was held by someone who (imho) is really an amateur photographer. I think those last photos were taken by the FM.

 

[LRitz]

The camera was held by someone who (imho) is really an amateur photographer. I think those last photos were taken by the FM.

Maybe a reason for the photo quality and subjects is that the photos were taken in a hurry.

The photos, those that have been released, were taken over about 3 minutes, not very long. And it seems that the last photo was the one of William roaring at 9:37, then no more photos. There could have been other photos from that morning or earlier that we do not know about (assume nothing). Or photos taken in-between that were deleted from the memory stick. Was there a seperate photo of William's sister? She seems to be overlooked. As commented by others, there does not appear to be a group photo. The FGM said they were playing on the patio for an hour so lots of time to take photos. What about a photo of the children showing their drawings? The sister is busy with her drawings, but even so wouldn't you think you would ask her to look up and smile for the camera. The first four photos show William, but he is not looking at the camera. The last photo, although it is a better photo of his face, he is also not looking at the camera and he is not smiling. Then no more photos. Was the camera put away?

 

[31550]

Maybe a reason for the photo quality and subjects is that the photos were taken in a hurry.

The photos, those that have been released, were taken over about 3 minutes, not very long. And it seems that the last photo was the one of William roaring at 9:37, then no more photos. There could have been other photos from that morning or earlier that we do not know about (assume nothing). Or photos taken in-between that were deleted from the memory stick. Was there a seperate photo of William's sister? She seems to be overlooked. As commented by others, there does not appear to be a group photo. The FGM said they were playing on the patio for an hour so lots of time to take photos. What about a photo of the children showing their drawings? The sister is busy with her drawings, but even so wouldn't you think you would ask her to look up and smile for the camera. The first four photos show William, but he is not looking at the camera. The last photo, although it is a better photo of his face, he is also not looking at the camera and he is not smiling. Then no more photos. Was the camera put away?

There was definitely one other photo taken at the time but not released. (Going by the sequential photo numbers assigned by the digital camera). Perhaps this photo was a 'dud', or perhaps it was not of William or had nothing to do with William? E.g. any photos taken of William's sister on her own, or not with William would not be expected to be publicly released. Nor any photos of FGM or FF or FM without William as their identities are all protected. Photos without any people in them would not be expected to be released.
3YOs are difficult to photograph, especially if they are not in the mood for it. If William was not co-operating, perhaps FM just put the camera away while she made tea to wait for a better opportunity to present itself later?

 

[Wallace52]

Agree Wallace52. Why not use the reliable land line and phone him. FF may have driven past the person who snatched William. And yes, look out for William as you approach the house. If starting the abduction narrative, wouldn't this be the time to alert the FF?
Perhaps they did not want to be seen to be communicating with each other while FF was away.

I hope the Council Assisting the Coroner asks SD that very question at the upcoming Coronial Inquest.

 

[Wallace52]

You also have the impact on the relationship that would occur on alleged unilateral decisions to hide a death of your foster child.

We can draw some similarities too with Lindy Chamberlain. She was accused, charged and convicted and her personal journey though innocent drove a wedge that ended the relationship. It would have been nighe impossible if one partner was actually responsible in the sense of hiding a body as has been alleged in unilateral way. Major betrayal of trust. Yet they remain united which to me shows unity on the whole sordid drama with WT missing that wouldn't be possible if one acted alone.

AFAIK, Lindy Chamberlain didn’t kick and intimidate her other child(ren).

There could be a variety of reasons why SD and JS have maintained a unified front.

Maybe it’s because they’re innocent and have banded together, like Daniel M’s parents.

I’ve been following the inquest of the Weiambilla siege, and it’s fascinating to me how 3 people developed a shared psychosis.

Just saying. It’s something to think about.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

AFAIK, Lindy Chamberlain didn’t kick and intimidate her other child(ren).

There could be a variety of reasons why SD and JS have maintained a unified front.

Maybe it’s because they’re innocent and have banded together, like Daniel M’s parents.

I’ve been following the inquest of the Weiambilla siege, and it’s fascinating to me how 3 people developed a shared psychosis.

Just saying. It’s something to think about.

Yes unity does derive from common purpose as would exist if they were both innocent. It may also arise IF the common purpose is that they both participated in equal measure in some way. That is what I construe from this process that it is very unlikely to be a unilateral decision from behavioural viewpoint. If that is true and I think it is then it has implications to what happened and when.

 

[31550]

Yes unity does derive from common purpose as would exist if they were both innocent. It may also arise IF the common purpose is that they both participated in equal measure in some way. That is what I construe from this process that it is very unlikely to be a unilateral decision from behavioural viewpoint. If that is true and I think it is then it has implications to what happened and when.

It could also be a case of 'blind faith', or 'unquestioning loyalty', where FF has chosen to unequivocally accept FM narrative as truth. This is not unusual in relationships where one person holds power through perceived competence, or is unusually charismatic, or where one party is able to generate fear in another in order to control them. It can extend beyond relationships to entire communities or societies: Jonestown, Nazi Germany.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

It could also be a case of 'blind faith', or 'unquestioning loyalty', where FF has chosen to unequivocally accept FM narrative as truth. This is not unusual in relationships where one person holds power through perceived competence, or is unusually charismatic, or where one party is able to generate fear in another in order to control them. It can extend beyond relationships to entire communities or societies: Jonestown, Nazi Germany.

There is imo no co dependency type relationship here where one enables the other. Impossible to conclude from afar but based on what is exposed.... no. Both have narcissistic traits (especially FM) that fall short of diagnostic thresholds.....once again from afar. I therefore feel the relationship is unlikely to be deflected in that way where one would blindly follow the other. Opinion. And this is my problem.....that I've formed that opinion it then feeds the unlikelihood they would stay united on the back of unilateral choices of such significance. But they have.

From behavioural viewpoint it is clear that both have parental dysfunction incompatible to the situation of children from such a background. It fuelled the problem.

We are led to believe that FM allegedly hid a dead child and that FF did nothing in response and stayed supportive. It doesn't gel

 

[LRitz]

GJ .................As for speaking at the Inquest, as he was no longer a serving member of NSWPOL, and not an active witness or participant in the case, there is no more reason to call him than there is to call you or me.

I hope the Council Assisting the Coroner asks SD that very question at the upcoming Coronial Inquest.

31550 as an interested and interesting party maybe there is a spot for you at the inquest. I am sure that the forum would be helpful in supplying you with a list of questions.