Current Disappearance of 3yo William Tyrrell * The foster mother has been recommended for charges of pervert the course of justice & interfere with a corpse

[Kurve]

Criminal charges the former foster parents currently face as at 15 April 2022 include:

• Apprehended Violence Orders on both (AVOs)
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster mother *Not Guilty
• Lying to the NSW Crime Commission on former foster father *Not Guilty
• 2 x charges of assault against a child on former foster mother *Guilty
• 1 x charge of assault against a child on former foster father
• Stalking &/or Intimidation on both
• Dummy bidding real estate fraud *Guilty

TIMELINE

Where's William Tyrrell? - The Ch 10 podcast (under Coroner's subpoena)

Operation Arkstone

 

[LRitz]

OK so your theory is that an alibi is created beforehand, but to give it further credibility, it is initially withheld? So, why is the alibi required at all? What did the FM know was about to happen to William? And then, why supply the alibi photographs at all, later? They were not ever required for her to prove anything about her story? Because the police believed initially lost, and then possibly abducted. So why provide a faked alibi when it was never required? They weren't under suspicion.

Exactly. Why set up an alibi for a accident that you do not know is about to occur. But you could set up an alibi if your plan was to make WT disappear.
I bet they were always under suspicion. A male carer of a child who is not related must be on the list. Their conversations were bugged by the police so must of been suspects.

The alibi was for the FF not the FM and now she apparently is under suspicion as her timeline has some gaps. He had proof of being in Lakeshore? or Lakewood ? at a set time at a chemist with his prescription. Pretty good alibi. He had remembered to take his prescription with him the day before but must of had no time to fill it out. What medication is so urgent if you are out by a couple of hours? (Yes, insulin would be one). The FGM sounded like it was urgent for him to get to the pharmacy first thing.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Exactly. Why set up an alibi for a accident that you do not know is about to occur. But you could set up an alibi if your plan was to make WT disappear.
I bet they were always under suspicion. A male carer of a child who is not related must be on the list. Their conversations were bugged by the police so must of been suspects.

The alibi was for the FF not the FM and now she apparently is under suspicion as her timeline has some gaps. He had proof of being in Lakeshore? or Lakewood ? at a set time at a chemist with his prescription. Pretty good alibi. He had remembered to take his prescription with him the day before but must of had no time to fill it out. What medication is so urgent if you are out by a couple of hours? (Yes, insulin would be one). The FGM sounded like it was urgent for him to get to the pharmacy first thing.

There are lots of medications that are critical. BP medicine is one I can think of.

 

[LRitz]

There are lots of medications that are critical. BP medicine is one I can think of.

Yes it is good to have lower blood pressure. But unless BP is totally out of control even missing one dose is not critical. If you have been on medication for some time and medication has a long half-life it would not be critical.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Yes it is good to have lower blood pressure. But unless BP is totally out of control even missing one dose is not critical. If you have been on medication for some time and medication has a long half-life it would not be critical.

In theory yes. But for some missing a single tablet er ah me ...can be catastrophic. You are conditioned into accepting you have to have the scrip filled. So it's not unusual he'd make a separate trip for it at all Imo. Metformin and blood sugar similarity. There are lots of conditions like this..

 

[Angry Red Bull]

From what I can tell the FGM was near to the phone that whole morning and certainly should have heard the missed call from GO. Perhaps she did and even went to check who was calling.....if her answering machine shows number details. So she may have decided not to take the call why? Because perhaps WT had died and been taken away from the home early via National Park eg like 8 as she said.then onto appt and she didn't want to discuss something mundane like a deck repair.

Of course if she was making that choice then it's certainly sensible to ring back that afternoon as she did. What is incriminating is that you would then have a walkthrough a week later and in response to police question say 4 times that there were NO calls that morning. Each time she said No it was with a certain hesitation that usually accompanies a lie seeking agreement with the police officer ( to be sure there was no dissent) and then 4th occasion more confident ....NO. So a lie which was an intentional lie..she could hardly say ......I didn't answer because there had been a major catastrophe and death and didn't want to talk to anyone.

Mmmmmmm. For me the pieces are starting to gel

 

[31550]

Exactly. Why set up an alibi for a accident that you do not know is about to occur. But you could set up an alibi if your plan was to make WT disappear.
I bet they were always under suspicion. A male carer of a child who is not related must be on the list. Their conversations were bugged by the police so must of been suspects.

The alibi was for the FF not the FM and now she apparently is under suspicion as her timeline has some gaps. He had proof of being in Lakeshore? or Lakewood ? at a set time at a chemist with his prescription. Pretty good alibi. He had remembered to take his prescription with him the day before but must of had no time to fill it out. What medication is so urgent if you are out by a couple of hours? (Yes, insulin would be one). The FGM sounded like it was urgent for him to get to the pharmacy first thing.

I believe the prescription he had filled at the Lakewood Pharmacy was for a type of anxiety medication - he mentions this in his police statement. It's possible that he or FM forgot to pack the pills since they left Sydney in somewhat of a rush, which is why he would have needed to go to Lakewood on the Friday morning. It's not clear whether he had a physical prescription with him or not - it may have been a certain medication that the pharmacist was able to supply without a prescription, or perhaps could have made a call to verify the prescription - it appears he needed to wait for a few minutes at the pharmacy to get it filled. Note that he also had to go back to the pharmacy for more medication a few days later (in Wendy Hudson's statement) - possibly for the same medication, possibly for something else. Note also an ambulance was called for FF on the Friday night - possibly he had an anxiety attack? I don't know, it might not be related. I do find it odd that he was seen drinking wine that night. I wouldn't have thought alcohol mixed well with anxiety medication but I'm not a doctor.

He didn't 'need' the pharmacy alibi. He had his GoToMeeting call as a suitable alibi. He decided he would go to Lakewood allegedly because the internet was better, with the bonus that he could visit the pharmacy there.

 

[LRitz]

I believe the prescription he had filled at the Lakewood Pharmacy was for a type of anxiety medication - he mentions this in his police statement. It's possible that he or FM forgot to pack the pills since they left Sydney in somewhat of a rush, which is why he would have needed to go to Lakewood on the Friday morning. It's not clear whether he had a physical prescription with him or not - it may have been a certain medication that the pharmacist was able to supply without a prescription, or perhaps could have made a call to verify the prescription - it appears he needed to wait for a few minutes at the pharmacy to get it filled. Note that he also had to go back to the pharmacy for more medication a few days later (in Wendy Hudson's statement) - possibly for the same medication, possibly for something else. Note also an ambulance was called for FF on the Friday night - possibly he had an anxiety attack? I don't know, it might not be related. I do find it odd that he was seen drinking wine that night. I wouldn't have thought alcohol mixed well with anxiety medication but I'm not a doctor.

He didn't 'need' the pharmacy alibi. He had his GoToMeeting call as a suitable alibi. He decided he would go to Lakewood allegedly because the internet was better, with the bonus that he could visit the pharmacy there.

I am not up to speed on FF time line. if he left the house before 9:00 and was at the chemist at 10:00. Is it 20 minutes to Lakewood? How did he spend that 40 minutes?

 

[31550]

I am not up to speed on FF time line. if he left the house before 9:00 and was at the chemist at 10:00. Is it 20 minutes to Lakewood? How did he spend that 40 minutes?

Captured on CCTV passing the tennis club a little before 9am. Started his online meeting at 9:17 (scheduled commencement time for participants was 9:30). A phone call to his phone went to VoiceMail at 9:45. He returned this call around 10am. He was then allegedly in Lakewood Pharmacy and has a receipt from 10:19 confirming this. Then he messaged 'home in 5' and is reported to have returned to FGM house around 10:30.

 

[LRitz]

Captured on CCTV passing the tennis club a little before 9am. Started his online meeting at 9:17 (scheduled commencement time for participants was 9:30). A phone call to his phone went to VoiceMail at 9:45. He returned this call around 10am. He was then allegedly in Lakewood Pharmacy and has a receipt from 10:19 confirming this. Then he messaged 'home in 5' and is reported to have returned to FGM house around 10:30.

Is there a possible 15 minutes not accounted for? From this the drive from Lakewood could be done in 10 minutes?

 

[Angry Red Bull]

I am not up to speed on FF time line. if he left the house before 9:00 and was at the chemist at 10:00. Is it 20 minutes to Lakewood? How did he spend that 40 minutes?

There is nothing contentious or anomalous for FF movements between 8.40 CCTV and 10.30 return. The pharmacy opened at 9am. It takes 10 min and is 7 km away. The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone before 8.00am. Even accounting for the fact she got up a little later than normal.becuase she had a cold....her normal being 7.30 there is a massive segment of time unexplained for FF.

Virtually the whole walk through she was trying to explain he has a legitimate reason not to be there being the online meeting and the chemist but both of those occurred after 9am. Where was he between 7.45am and 8.40am.?

The following things happened

• Breakfast with scrambled eggs toast and juice
• WT and FD riding bikes on driveway FM watching
• WT playing Mummy monsters with FM in yard then joined by FD
• FM unsuccessfully encouraging WT to climb tree
• WT, FD, FM and FGM all in back verandah drawing, playing dice. We are told this part took 1 hr.

Given the number of activities and how variable they may be it's virtually impossible to prove it disprove either timeline.

 

[31550]

Is there a possible 15 minutes not accounted for? From this the drive from Lakewood could be done in 10 minutes?

Yes there is no definite accounting for his movements after passing the tennis club and before starting the meeting at 9:17. It's a 10 minute drive from Kendall to Lakewood. His car is reported only passing the CCTV once though. Not sure what you are suggesting he may have done on these minutes. According to his statement he parked the car and set up his phone, headset and computer for the meeting. It seems he would have had a few minutes spare, but not long enough to return to FGM house.

 

[31550]

There is nothing contentious or anomalous for FF movements between 8.40 CCTV and 10.30 return. The pharmacy opened at 9am. It takes 10 min and is 7 km away. The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone before 8.00am. Even accounting for the fact she got up a little later than normal.becuase she had a cold....her normal being 7.30 there is a massive segment of time unexplained for FF.

Virtually the whole walk through she was trying to explain he has a legitimate reason not to be there being the online meeting and the chemist but both of those occurred after 9am. Where was he between 7.45am and 8.40am.?

The following things happened

• Breakfast with scrambled eggs toast and juice
• WT and FD riding bikes on driveway FM watching
• WT playing Mummy monsters with FM in yard then joined by FD
• FM unsuccessfully encouraging WT to climb tree
• WT, FD, FM and FGM all in back verandah drawing, playing dice. We are told this part took 1 hr.

Given the number of activities and how variable they may be it's virtually impossible to prove it disprove either timeline.

FGM says she slept late but heard FF making coffee in the morning. She does not report actually interfacing with FF in the morning. She thinks she got up 'around 8' but she was not questioned how she knew what time it was. I reckon it's possible she got up closer to 9am, which would then fit with the remainder of her walkthrough. Breakfast, then straight to the verandah. FGM not present for bike riding if it took place - if it happened it probably happened just before or immediately after FF left. FF doesn't mention bike riding in his 2014 statement.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

So she says 8, probably had a watch on to check, definately had a clock on the wall to check but you believe she really meant 9 because she is so obviously in cognitive decline she couldn't tell the difference.

Out of interest, what do you think the most common step is when you first to wake up? Sight unseen I'm probably saying check the time. Because it sets your bearings for the day ahead.

The FF obviously thought she was cognitively ok because in the police walk through she says he asked her what time the chemist was open......then mumbled failing to add more.

 

[LRitz]

There is nothing contentious or anomalous for FF movements between 8.40 CCTV and 10.30 return. The pharmacy opened at 9am. It takes 10 min and is 7 km away. The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone before 8.00am. Even accounting for the fact she got up a little later than normal.becuase she had a cold....her normal being 7.30 there is a massive segment of time unexplained for FF.

Virtually the whole walk through she was trying to explain he has a legitimate reason not to be there being the online meeting and the chemist but both of those occurred after 9am. Where was he between 7.45am and 8.40am.?

The following things happened

• Breakfast with scrambled eggs toast and juice
• WT and FD riding bikes on driveway FM watching
• WT playing Mummy monsters with FM in yard then joined by FD
• FM unsuccessfully encouraging WT to climb tree
• WT, FD, FM and FGM all in back verandah drawing, playing dice. We are told this part took 1 hr.

Given the number of activities and how variable they may be it's virtually impossible to prove it disprove either timeline.

So many things going on and alleged activities and no proof of these narratives. Scrambled eggs climbing trees, kookaburras out the window, mystery cars, riding bikes. How did they fit it all in? The kids must have been starving by the time they had breakfast. Just saying all these narratives can be distracting from what is alleged and what can be proved.
First light on this date is around 5:30. FF had lots of time to be out and about early and then back at the house at 8:30.
" The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone before 8.00am" ... Do we believe anything the FGM says?

 

[Angry Red Bull]

So many things going on and alleged activities and no proof of these narratives. Scrambled eggs climbing trees, kookaburras out the window, mystery cars, riding bikes. How did they fit it all in? The kids must have been starving by the time they had breakfast. Just saying all these narratives can be distracting from what is alleged and what can be proved.
First light on this date is around 5:30. FF had lots of time to be out and about early and then back at the house at 8:30.
" The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone before 8.00am" ... Do we believe anything the FGM says?

I was open to believe the 9.37 timeline IF there was proof of life other than the photo. When I looked into PS witness statements I find that in the inquest he retracted on what he originally said. He no longer heard any kids playing.

There is no independent proof of life. For me that means all those red flags I saw as incriminating relating to 7.39 points to what I believe happened.

Even the time FGM says she awoke I believe was also a lie. She was woken up by the kids. They went in and woke her up. Per Lia Harris podcast. An elderly lady with visitors (even family) wouldn't get up after the visitors. ill mannered to that age group. I think they were all up early..

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Why does someone volunteer and say without being asked that "everyone was happy" sitting at breakfast. Because there was a need to tell a story. A deception.

"This is where it all happened" pointing to the verandah. What exactly is "it*?

I don't believe you'd phrase it like that. What you'd say is....."this is the last place we were before he went missing" it's incriminating and indicative there was an "it"

Oh IDK perhaps the "it" relates to "bouncing out of his skull"

I watch a lot of witness statement analysts.they always tell you ....listen to what they say.. if they say "it",happened out here and WT was "bouncing out of his skull" then literally that may be what actually happened

 

[Lady O]

Why does someone volunteer and say without being asked that "everyone was happy" sitting at breakfast. Because there was a need to tell a story. A deception.

"This is where it all happened" pointing to the verandah. What exactly is "it*?

I don't believe you'd phrase it like that. What you'd say is....."this is the last place we were before he went missing" it's incriminating and indicative there was an "it"

Oh IDK perhaps the "it" relates to "bouncing out of his skull"

I watch a lot of witness statement analysts.they always tell you ....listen to what they say.. if they say "it",happened out here and WT was "bouncing out of his skull" then literally that may be what actually happened

Yep, FGM's saying "this is where it all happened" is the single most revealing statement anyone connected with this case has said. According to FM, nothing happened. WT just "disappeared". "Five minutes" and he was gone, never to be seen again.

 

[LRitz]

FGM says she slept late but heard FF making coffee in the morning. She does not report actually interfacing with FF in the morning. She thinks she got up 'around 8' but she was not questioned how she knew what time it was. I reckon it's possible she got up closer to 9am, which would then fit with the remainder of her walkthrough. Breakfast, then straight to the verandah. FGM not present for bike riding if it took place - if it happened it probably happened just before or immediately after FF left. FF doesn't mention bike riding in his 2014 statement.

"She slept late" (no proof) ... "making coffee "(no proof).. FF awake at ??? a.m. (no proof) Climbing tree (no proof), suspicious cars in street (no proof), time of eating breakfast (no proof).
Photo of WT, sister, and FGM (reading last weeks paper). But there is a possible question of what time it was taken.

"The FGM says to police that when she got up FF wasn't there and that he was gone.." Why listen to anything that the foster family says. It may not be true.

 

[31550]

So she says 8, probably had a watch on to check, definately had a clock on the wall to check but you believe she really meant 9 because she is so obviously in cognitive decline she couldn't tell the difference.

Out of interest, what do you think the most common step is when you first to wake up? Sight unseen I'm probably saying check the time. Because it sets your bearings for the day ahead.

The FF obviously thought she was cognitively ok because in the police walk through she says he asked her what time the chemist was open......then mumbled failing to add more.

No the point I am emphasising is that she wasn't ASKED how she knew it was 8am and not later. Basic detective work 101. "You woke at 8am? How do you know it was 8am?" Because detective asks what happened next (breakfast) and then asks what happened next (dishes), and then (on the verandah with drawing and dice), and asks how long they were out there (one hour). So putting that all together only accounts for about 90 minutes until 9:30, but we need to know what happened until FF returned at 10:30. There's a whole hour missing. But detective doesn't ask if they did anything else during this period. We know they made tea around 10am. How do you get from 8am to 10am in only one hour? Doesn't add up. So why not clarify this on the spot just in case FGM forgot something, like the bike riding or tree climbing? But FGM insists "This is where we STAYED", indicating no other activities took place.

If detective bothered to ask the simple question, "What makes you say 8am?" then FGM might have said she looked at a clock, or she heard the radio or TV, or she noticed something else, or she might have said, "Oh, I thought it was 8, but maybe it was later...". We don't know. Maybe she did wake at 8am when the kids woke her up but she didnt go out of her room to breakfast until 9am?

Giving her the benefit of doubt, and putting aside conspiracy theories, we KNOW FF passed the tennis club around 8:50am. It appears FGM did not interface with FF in the morning, only heard him, so my logical inference is that she didn't leave her bedroom until around 9am. It fits the facts and her narrative. May explain why she didn't hear the phone - (in the shower?).

FF asking about what time the chemist opened was the night before, I believe.

 

[31550]

Why does someone volunteer and say without being asked that "everyone was happy" sitting at breakfast. Because there was a need to tell a story. A deception.

"This is where it all happened" pointing to the verandah. What exactly is "it*?

I don't believe you'd phrase it like that. What you'd say is....."this is the last place we were before he went missing" it's incriminating and indicative there was an "it"

Oh IDK perhaps the "it" relates to "bouncing out of his skull"

I watch a lot of witness statement analysts.they always tell you ....listen to what they say.. if they say "it",happened out here and WT was "bouncing out of his skull" then literally that may be what actually happened

Agree with this entirely. Offering information which was not requested raises suspicion. "Everyone was happy" sounds like a rehearsed line, as does the inventory of breakfast items ... "see, I can remember all the exact details about what we had for breakfast, THEREFORE everything I am telling you is a FACT".
I think entirely possible everyone was NOT happy. FF was stressed about his meeting and no internet. FF did not have his anxiety meds. FF keen to leave the house as early as he could (didn't even stay for breakfast). For some reason they had unusual sleeping arrangements (marital issues?). They 'sprung' the visit on FGM - perhaps she was not ready to accommodate 4 guests at short notice. Then William had a wet nappy. Kids woke up early and fought over a toy. William wouldn't climb the tree. William crashed his bike into the garden. William wouldn't roll the dice properly. William was taking over everything and being boisterous. William got fed up with drawing and wanted to roar like a tiger. FM had a strained relationship with FGM. Hadn't visited for 6 months since her father died. Disagreements over property? FGM about to sell house? These are all stressful things - why were they so happy?
I think more likely there was a lot of tension in the household. Even in the photos we can see FGM reading the newspaper rather than engaging directly with her beloved daughter and foster grandchildren whom she hadn't seen for some time.

 

[LRitz]

Agree with this entirely. Offering information which was not requested raises suspicion. "Everyone was happy" sounds like a rehearsed line, as does the inventory of breakfast items ... "see, I can remember all the exact details about what we had for breakfast, THEREFORE everything I am telling you is a FACT".
I think entirely possible everyone was NOT happy. FF was stressed about his meeting and no internet. FF did not have his anxiety meds. FF keen to leave the house as early as he could (didn't even stay for breakfast). For some reason they had unusual sleeping arrangements (marital issues?). They 'sprung' the visit on FGM - perhaps she was not ready to accommodate 4 guests at short notice. Then William had a wet nappy. Kids woke up early and fought over a toy. William wouldn't climb the tree. William crashed his bike into the garden. William wouldn't roll the dice properly. William was taking over everything and being boisterous. William got fed up with drawing and wanted to roar like a tiger. FM had a strained relationship with FGM. Hadn't visited for 6 months since her father died. Disagreements over property? FGM about to sell house? These are all stressful things - why were they so happy?
I think more likely there was a lot of tension in the household. Even in the photos we can see FGM reading the newspaper rather than engaging directly with her beloved daughter and foster grandchildren whom she hadn't seen for some time.

It was a surprise visit to FGM. Do we know that for certain. Do we believe any of their narratives? Just saying, she had a lot of things for breakfast for her visitors. FF did not have to bring back extra milk or groceries for the kids. I don't recall any mention of bringing groceries with them to FGM house the night before, but maybe they did.
Was there something about her telling repair man she needed washing machine fixed because she was expecting the family to visit. is this correct?
Dice game. What is this game anyway. It does not sound like a game for 3 year olds, tossing the dice and counting the numbers was probably beyond WT's concentration or skills. FGM said they played this game for 20 Minutes! Really!

Back to the photo (sorry). Some posts a while back had comments that the photo looked like it was taken earlier. First light this year was 5:28, and sunrise 5:52. I think it would have been pretty bright by 8:00. At 8:00 people are off to school and work and they are not leaving in the dark. Though we are all a bit in the dark at the moment.

 

[31550]

It was a surprise visit to FGM. Do we know that for certain. Do we believe any of their narratives? Just saying, she had a lot of things for breakfast for her visitors. FF did not have to bring back extra milk or groceries for the kids. I don't recall any mention of bringing groceries with them to FGM house the night before, but maybe they did.
Was there something about her telling repair man she needed washing machine fixed because she was expecting the family to visit. is this correct?
Dice game. What is this game anyway. It does not sound like a game for 3 year olds, tossing the dice and counting the numbers was probably beyond WT's concentration or skills. FGM said they played this game for 20 Minutes! Really!

Back to the photo (sorry). Some posts a while back had comments that the photo looked like it was taken earlier. First light this year was 5:28, and sunrise 5:52. I think it would have been pretty bright by 8:00. At 8:00 people are off to school and work and they are not leaving in the dark. Though we are all a bit in the dark at the moment.

We don't know anything for certain, but the claim is that the visit was pre-arranged for the Friday and a late decision was made to leave early on the Thursday afternoon. This is supported (not necessarily proven beyond doubt) by cat boarding arrangements, phone calls, and childcare records. FF diary records probably also had details of his meeting which was supposedly cancelled on the Thursday afternoon. However, one thing I find strange is that he also had the GoToMeeting scheduled for 9:30am Friday and knew the internet was crap at FGMs house. So what was his original plan? To have the meeting in the car on the way up from Sydney while FM drove? With 2 kids in the back? Doesn't make sense. Or wait till the meeting was finished and drive up around lunchtime on the Friday?

According to FGM and Spedding the washing machine had been broken for a few days, Spedding had already inspected it and ordered the necessary parts and was going to come and fix it when the parts arrived. On the Friday morning Spedding maintains he had only received one of the two parts required. FM claims she left a voice message asking Spedding to call back. This coincides with the outgoing call from FGM phone made around 9am. FGM had allegedly told FM she was waiting for Spedding to come back and FM took it on herself to chase him up - presumably she wanted to wash something - maybe this was another thing 'everybody was happy' about???
Yes, it's a bit unusual that there was available breakfast for 4 people but FGM says she went into town on the Thursday, and if she was expecting visitors on the Friday she would likely have done shopping on this visit. But then this raises another question - why she didn't pick up the newspaper which comes out on Wednesdays? She is seen reading the previous week's paper in photos and FF picked up the papers for her on his outing on Friday (supposedly).

 

[Angry Red Bull]

No the point I am emphasising is that she wasn't ASKED how she knew it was 8am and not later. Basic detective work 101. "You woke at 8am? How do you know it was 8am?" Because detective asks what happened next (breakfast) and then asks what happened next (dishes), and then (on the verandah with drawing and dice), and asks how long they were out there (one hour). So putting that all together only accounts for about 90 minutes until 9:30, but we need to know what happened until FF returned at 10:30. There's a whole hour missing. But detective doesn't ask if they did anything else during this period. We know they made tea around 10am. How do you get from 8am to 10am in only one hour? Doesn't add up. So why not clarify this on the spot just in case FGM forgot something, like the bike riding or tree climbing? But FGM insists "This is where we STAYED", indicating no other activities took place.

If detective bothered to ask the simple question, "What makes you say 8am?" then FGM might have said she looked at a clock, or she heard the radio or TV, or she noticed something else, or she might have said, "Oh, I thought it was 8, but maybe it was later...". We don't know. Maybe she did wake at 8am when the kids woke her up but she didnt go out of her room to breakfast until 9am?

Giving her the benefit of doubt, and putting aside conspiracy theories, we KNOW FF passed the tennis club around 8:50am. It appears FGM did not interface with FF in the morning, only heard him, so my logical inference is that she didn't leave her bedroom until around 9am. It fits the facts and her narrative. May explain why she didn't hear the phone - (in the shower?).

FF asking about what time the chemist opened was the night before, I believe.

She makes a comment that her usual waking time was 7.30. With visitors you'd expect with manners you'd at least wake the same time as them..Was she late because she had the cold? But then again the kids went into TO wake her. We will never know. The only things we do know is she said FF wasn't there at 8 and there is a whole bunch on incriminating red flags to multiple comments she made. To me they all seem to centre around the fact she was a very poor liar.

Yes I noticed too the breakfast list. That IS a technique used to both distract and convey you are a person of detail and therefore truth to which I respond.......why would conveying that be necessary at all if you are being truthful in all you say? Red flag again.

I still don't understand how Bigfooty came in possession of the entire police walk through not the edited version..was it intentionally leak by them because it was incriminating? I suspect so.

As regards the 8 v 9 discrepancy I say this. Her cognitive capacity was sufficient the night before for the FF to ask then rely on her answer about what the opening time was for the chemist...we know is 9. Yet a mere week later you consider she was so muddled that she couldn't tell the difference between 8 and 9. I can't accept that. I believe that she knew it was 9 and she knew she was up before 8 and she wanted to hide where he was and help the alibi and rather than say they were up later her solution was to lie and say he had to go to chemist early before 8 yet knowing it wasn't open until 9 hoping the police wouldn't check. It was imo an intentional lie in am amateurish way to hide whatever happened between 7.39 and 8.40. But the lie was exposed as a lie by her own conduct

 

[Angry Red Bull]

If something happened early that morning, the Fosters wouldn't want to involve the FGM. The surest way to do that would be to argue that she was up late and saw nothing. What's more she didn't even see the FF. So she had no involvement in anything directly or indirectly as an accessory..That was what was sought to be achieved by the lies. But instead what shows up are multiple red flags and a clear troubled timeline where over 1 hour is mysteriously unaccounted for. This on the morning WT went missing is conspicuous as to something happening in this time.

 

[31550]

If something happened early that morning, the Fosters wouldn't want to involve the FGM. The surest way to do that would be to argue that she was up late and saw nothing. What's more she didn't even see the FF. So she had no involvement in anything directly or indirectly as an accessory..That was what was sought to be achieved by the lies. But instead what shows up are multiple red flags and a clear troubled timeline where over 1 hour is mysteriously unaccounted for. This on the morning WT went missing is conspicuous as to something happening in this time.

The issues with that theory are:

• FF car was seen on CCTV only once at ~8:50 passing the tennis club
• no neighbours saw any cars coming and going from the FGM house, but a few people were in the street getting kids to school, going to work etc.
• FGM and LT alibis needed to be created and they needed to be coached before talking to police. A big risk for an elderly woman and very young child. What if they didn't go along with the concocted story?
• Savage heard children (plural) playing - not proof but casts reasonable doubt
• and of course the photos. No mean feat to expertly create those

I think more likely FGM is covering up for other events which occurred - a family fight? , an accident ? for which she was either embarrassed or took some personal responsibility. What if FM asked FGM to mind the kids for a few minutes and something happened to William? What if someone else was at the house they don't want anyone to know about?