Domestic Violence Epidemic

[Kurve]

Thread here on COERCIVE CONTROL

 

[BFew]

Front page of the West today

 

[BFew]

It's SHTF time for Police and the WA Government on DV in the West.

Especially after the WA Police Minister (Papalia) yesterday is reported to have told the media

Police inaction over killer’s gun cache rings alarm bells

Police were aware of the cache of guns kept by the Floreat killer and could have confiscated them even without evidence of criminality or a violence restraining order.

thewest.com.au

'Asked when police found out about the historical domestic violence, Mr Papalia said: “Understanding that in talking to Police on March 31 — and bearing in mind, I wasn’t there — his ex-wife would have been explaining why she was requesting police presence the following day to remove belongings from the residence”.

Asked why police did not use the information for further investigation, Mr Papalia said: “They wouldn’t have met the threshold for being an offence or something to charge.”

 

[Pamcake1]

Daughter of Perth killer warned police three times he was an 'imminent threat'

The daughter of Mark James Bombara, who shot and killed Jennifer and Gretl Petelczyc in their Floreat home, says police were warned about her father's disturbing behaviour.

www.abc.net.au

 

[MrsBlueSky]

Agree, more can be done.

How many times do you reckon someone needs to call police to alert them of DV before they do something about it. How about if that man is mentally unstable and has 13 guns.
How about calling cops three times, obviously that is not enough:

Daughter of Perth killer warned police three times he was an 'imminent threat'

The daughter of Mark James Bombara, who shot and killed Jennifer and Gretl Petelczyc in their Floreat home, says police were warned about her father's disturbing behaviour.

www.abc.net.au

 

[Underarrest_]

How many times do you reckon someone needs to call police to alert them of DV before they do something about it. How about if that man is mentally unstable and has 13 guns.
How about calling cops three times, obviously that is not enough:

Daughter of Perth killer warned police three times he was an 'imminent threat'

The daughter of Mark James Bombara, who shot and killed Jennifer and Gretl Petelczyc in their Floreat home, says police were warned about her father's disturbing behaviour.

www.abc.net.au

MrsBlueSkye, This is a tragic story and shouldn’t have happened.
There definitely needs to be improvements and more police training and the way they manage any reports. We often hear about the failures of services such as police but
they do attend many DV incidents and provide services they need to. In my area 65 percent of police call outs are for DV.

 

[MrsBlueSky]

MrsBlueSkye, This is a tragic story and shouldn’t have happened.
There definitely needs to be improvements and more police training and the way they manage any reports. We often hear about the failures of services such as police but
they do attend many DV incidents and provide services they need to. In my area 65 percent of police call outs are for DV.

The WA police commissioner should have kept his Covid mask on today when he was offering excuses for the poor police response to the DV situation that ended last Friday afternoon in Perth because the way you can tell if a policeman is lying in WA is when you see their lips move.

 

[BFew]

18 minutes long: Includes the media Q&A

https://fb.watch/slurSMnP0O/

'9 News Perth was live.​

LIVE: WA Police Commissioner Col Blanch is speaking on the Floreat murders.
Earlier today, the shooter's daughter accused police of ignoring warnings her father was dangerous.'

 

[MrsBlueSky]

From my experience dealing with WA police in recent years, the police force is like a boys club.
It is very unusual for a woman officer to get into the senior ranks, or to even stay in the force for a long time.
One quick start towards ending DV in WA is for a dedicated team of women officers to take the calls from victims.
The second thing to do is to ensure the perpetrator is removed from the house.
Thirdly, have a five-fold increase in the punishment of breaking VRO's.

 

[BFew]

Here's how DV (Family Violence) Restraining Orders (called ADVO's in NSW, FVRO's in WA) work in WA according to p5 of the 'The West Australian' newspaper today.

Which makes it very clear that even if all of the Bombara family went to Police and the Courts repeatedly to plead that they didn't want a DV restraining order of any kind put onto Mark Bombara (or tried to get one about to be issued, or already issued, varied or withdrawn/cancelled/finished early), Police (for temporary FVRO's) and then the Courts (for interim/final FVRO's), have the final say, in order to protect everyone involved and related to the (alleged) victims, and in some cases to protect the wider community.

In WA Even where is not enough evidence to charge someone for a criminal act of any domestic violence, Police can issue a temporary FVRO that takes effect immediately they hand it to the (alleged) perpetrator.

WA Police have power to issue 72-hour restraining orders

Police have the power to issue a 72-hour temporary restraining order against a domestic violence perpetrator even if there is not enough evidence to arrest and charge that person with family violence offences.

thewest.com.au

 

[MrsBlueSky]

In the Floreat murders, police will investigate the police actions in the lead up.
What an f***ing waste of time that will be.
I can see Col Blanch standing up defending what actions police took every time the family rang to say a murder was about to happen - following rules as they were trained .... b*lls**t
Courts can take firearms off a person who is issued with a restraining order and that's what this family should have been trying for instead of getting WA police (the worst in Australia IMO) to do something

 

[jason_recliner]

Here's how DV (Family Violence) Restraining Orders (called ADVO's in NSW, FVRO's in WA) work in WA according to p5 of the 'The West Australian' newspaper today.

Which makes it very clear that even if all of the Bombara family went to Police and the Courts repeatedly to plead that they didn't want a DV restraining order of any kind put onto Mark Bombara (or tried to get one about to be issued, or already issued, varied or withdrawn/cancelled/finished early), Police (for temporary FVRO's) and then the Courts (for interim/final FVRO's), have the final say, in order to protect everyone involved and related to the (alleged) victims, and in some cases to protect the wider community.

In WA Even where is not enough evidence to charge someone for a criminal act of any domestic violence, Police can issue a temporary FVRO that takes effect immediately they hand it to the (alleged) perpetrator.

WA Police have power to issue 72-hour restraining orders

Police have the power to issue a 72-hour temporary restraining order against a domestic violence perpetrator even if there is not enough evidence to arrest and charge that person with family violence offences.

thewest.com.au

View attachment 2003706

Having been the respondent of a (malicious) 72 hour VRO I can assure you they are very rapidly implemented! It's an unusual instrument specific to WA. I was told it was introduced in response to an horrific DV murder.

 

[MrsBlueSky]

Having been the respondent of a (malicious) 72 hour VRO I can assure you they are very rapidly implemented! It's an unusual instrument specific to WA. I was told it was introduced in response to an horrific DV murder.

Are you saying someone got a 72 hour VRO when it wasn't needed but the in the Floreat case they couldn't get one when it was?

 

[jason_recliner]

Are you saying someone got a 72 hour VRO when it wasn't needed but the in the Floreat case they couldn't get one when it was?

I don't know if anybody asked for one in the Floreat case. They are - or were, this was a long time ago - pretty much no questions asked. If one was requested, I can't imagine why it was denied.

 

[Underarrest_]

Here's how DV (Family Violence) Restraining Orders (called ADVO's in NSW, FVRO's in WA) work in WA according to p5 of the 'The West Australian' newspaper today.

Which makes it very clear that even if all of the Bombara family went to Police and the Courts repeatedly to plead that they didn't want a DV restraining order of any kind put onto Mark Bombara (or tried to get one about to be issued, or already issued, varied or withdrawn/cancelled/finished early), Police (for temporary FVRO's) and then the Courts (for interim/final FVRO's), have the final say, in order to protect everyone involved and related to the (alleged) victims, and in some cases to protect the wider community.

In WA Even where is not enough evidence to charge someone for a criminal act of any domestic violence, Police can issue a temporary FVRO that takes effect immediately they hand it to the (alleged) perpetrator.

WA Police have power to issue 72-hour restraining orders

Police have the power to issue a 72-hour temporary restraining order against a domestic violence perpetrator even if there is not enough evidence to arrest and charge that person with family violence offences.

thewest.com.au

View attachment 2003706

The police had the capacity to act and should have acted to protect both families. 13 guns? Why? and why weren’t they taken away?
I do agree with the perpetrator’s daughter though, her Father, without the guns, could have found another means. (Hannah Clark and her children come to mind.)
Nevertheless the police didn’t listen to the victim when asked for support to remove belongings due to fear (DV,) told that he had 13 guns and asked for an emergency order.
I hope the internal investigation find answers and actions to prevent this from happening again.

 

[faible]

I don't know if anybody asked for one in the Floreat case. They are - or were, this was a long time ago - pretty much no questions asked. If one was requested, I can't imagine why it was denied.

According to the daughters statement they requested one and were told no, which seems silly given they'd gone to the police multiple times already.

 

[jason_recliner]

According to the daughters statement they requested one and were told no, which seems silly given they'd gone to the police multiple times already.

Can only assume there was some kind of legal intervention - the guy sounds very wealthy and no doubt had excellent lawyers. I had just bought a house at the time of my conflict and was flat broke (my ex let me stay in my house as I had nowhere else to go) so there was no question of resisting/defending it in any way. I didn't even know if that's an option.

 

[MrsBlueSky]

I don't know if anybody asked for one in the Floreat case. They are - or were, this was a long time ago - pretty much no questions asked. If one was requested, I can't imagine why it was denied.

I can imagine why it was denied - because the whole process is stuffed.
I had someone try and take an MRO against me last year and it resulted in me having 5 court appearances and it was dismissed after a half day trial.
I had no case to answer so represented myself and the other party used two lawyers.
Magistrates can usually work it out quickly if a restraining order is warranted but getting common sense from WA police on the other hand is another matter and I've also had a very big amount of dealings with police in recent years.
And I do have a firearms licence.

 

[jason_recliner]

I can imagine why it was denied - because the whole process is stuffed.
I had someone try and take an MRO against me last year and it resulted in me having 5 court appearances and it was dismissed after a half day trial.
I had no case to answer so represented myself and the other party used two lawyers.
Magistrates can usually work it out quickly if a restraining order is warranted but getting common sense from WA police on the other hand is another matter and I've also had a very big amount of dealings with police in recent years.
And I do have a firearms licence.

You don't go to court if a 72-hr VRO is issued against you. You just wait for 72 hours and it goes away.

Working in the field of policing and justice is very difficult and demanding. You're dealing with the worst PoS trash all the time, and occasionally good people at their worst. What makes you so much smarter and more capable than the police? What do you do???

 

[MrsBlueSky]

You don't go to court if a 72-hr VRO is issued against you. You just wait for 72 hours and it goes away.

So the police can issue a 72 VRO, correct?
The process is stuffed if they didn't issue one against Bombara when repeatedly asked for help from the family

 

[BFew]

Having been the respondent of a (malicious) 72 hour VRO I can assure you they are very rapidly implemented! It's an unusual instrument specific to WA. I was told it was introduced in response to an horrific DV murder.

In NSW we have what's called a Provisional ADVO which is very similar to WA's temporary (72 hour) FVRO.
The below applies to both DV ADVO's and non-DV AVO's.
There is no 72 hour limit on NSW Provisional ADVO/AVOs, so it looks like NSW has for many years had stronger than WA temporary DV and non-DV violence orders that Police can take out on the spot, without going before any court.

Types of AVOs

Information about the different types of Apprehended Violence Orders (AVOs) that a court can make, and the conditions a court can include in an AVO, to protect a person from harm.

www.legalaid.nsw.gov.au

'A Provisional AVO is an order applied for by a police officer and granted by a court or senior police officer.

The police must apply for a Provisional AVO when they believe that someone needs immediate protection to:

• ensure their safety, or
• prevent substantial damage to their property.

These orders are sometimes referred to as 'Telephone Interim Orders' (TIOs) as they can be made by phone, fax or online.

A Provisional AVO will contain mandatory orders and may also have additional orders, which tell the defendant what they can and can't do.

A Provisional AVO lasts until:

• it is revoked
• the Court makes an Interim or Final AVO
• the defendant is served with the Interim or Final AVO - if they didn't go to court
• the AVO application is withdrawn or dismissed.

Where a Provisional AVO has been made, it will automatically become an Interim AVO at the first mention unless:

• the AVO is revoked
• the matter is withdrawn or dismissed
• the Court makes an Interim or Final AVO.

When a Provisional AVO is automatically converted to an Interim AVO, the Interim AVO will contain the same orders as the Provisional AVO.'

 

[BFew]

You don't go to court if a 72-hr VRO is issued against you. You just wait for 72 hours and it goes away.

This needs urgently changing to strengthen it and align it more with other States. (the 72 hour BS part).

I expect that the WA Government won't wait until the Coroners report to get moving on this, as part of it's recommendations to the Government arising from this horrific case.

 

[jason_recliner]

This needs urgently changing to strengthen it and align it more with other States. (the 72 hour BS part).

I expect that the WA Government won't wait until the Coroners report to get moving on this, as part of it's recommendations to the Government arising from this horrific case.

I wouldn't say the 72-hr element is BS. It serves a purpose (gives one or both parties time to cool down, provides immediate protection to the applicant). It sounds like NSW at least has caught up to WA and gone further and I agree WA should adopt the NSW system. Maybe implement 72hr or PADVOs, depending on the case (probably easier to get a 72hr order and less admin/court resources as it goes away of its own volition).

 

[Underarrest_]

This needs urgently changing to strengthen it and align it more with other States. (the 72 hour BS part).

I expect that the WA Government won't wait until the Coroners report to get moving on this, as part of it's recommendations to the Government arising from this horrific case.

Especially when the highest time of risk to a victim is when they leave.

 

[BFew]

I wouldn't say the 72-hr element is BS. It serves a purpose (gives one or both parties time to cool down, provides immediate protection to the applicant). It sounds like NSW at least has caught up to WA and gone further and I agree WA should adopt the NSW system. Maybe implement 72hr or PADVOs, depending on the case (probably easier to get a 72hr order and less admin/court resources as it goes away of its own volition).

I agree, that they need to look at a range of options and not just blindly implement what another jurisdiction has done many years ago.

NSW appears to have introduced Provisional ADVO's in 2014 (10 years ago).

When did the temporary (72 hour) FVRO's get introduced in WA?

Further changes to NSW ADVO's laws included in 2016 (at least)

NSW Apprehended Domestic Violence Orders given major overhaul

"Victims can be reluctant to tell police they're afraid of their partner," says Attorney-General.

www.smh.com.au

The Crimes (Domestic and Personal Violence) Amendment Act 2013 (NSW)

The Crimes (Domestic and Personal Violence) Amendment Act 2013 (NSW) was assented to on 11 November 2013 and will commence on a date to be fixed by proclamation.

rlc.org.au

The Crimes (Domestic and Personal Violence) Amendment Act 2013 (NSW)​

Date published 17 December 2013
...
The Act will amend the Crimes (Domestic and Personal Violence) Act 2007 to:

• Allow senior police officers at or above the rank of sergeant to issue provisional Apprehended Domestic Violence Orders;
• Expand police powers to direct a person to go to or remain at a particular place or to detain a person to serve a Domestic Violence Order
• Include protections in relation to the issue of provisional Apprehended Domestic Violence Orders and the power of detention
• Introduce an offence to make a false or misleading statement in an application for an Apprehended Personal Violence order
• Strengthen a registrar’s discretion to refuse an application for filing a Personal Violence Order; and
• Provide a presumption in favour of mediation in applications for Personal Violence Orders and a non-exhaustive list of considerations when making a referral to mediation.

.....
NSW Police have advised they expect to commence the implementation of police issued provisional Apprehended Domestic Violence orders by approximately April 2014, by which time senior officers at or above the rank of sergeant will have completed appropriate training.
...'

 

[BFew]

WA Police were just following current policy says WA Police Commissioner Blanch.

Live Moment: WA police commissioner says it's 'wrong' to say nothing was done prior to Floreat murders

Authorities in WA have leapt to defend the way police responded to concerns raised by the wife and daughter of Floreat double murderer Mark Bombara prior to the shootings. Follow live.

www.abc.net.au

'WA Police response to Mark Bombara's wife and daughter in weeks before Floreat murders inadequate, minister says​

By Courtney Withers and Nicolas Perpitch
Posted 1h ago1 hours ago, updated 2m ago
...
WA's police commissioner has defended the way police responded to concerns raised by the wife and daughter of Floreat double murderer Mark Bombara prior to the shootings, saying they "did exactly what their policy says they should do".
...
Commissioner Blanch defended the way officers handled the situation, saying correct policy was followed.

"When the first report was made police took a family violence information report, an incident report, as per our policy," he says.

"That immediately triggers … a risk assessment based on what was known at the time, it sends information to the family and domestic violence response team so they can triage that information.

"That was done. there was a triage meeting. It was referred to a third party through the Department of Communities for action. All of those things did happen."

He stressed that in his view, all three times the Bombara family raised concerns "police did exactly what their policy says they should do".

Police response 'seems inadequate': Federal Minister​

Federal Social Services Minister Amanda Rishworth and WA Liberal Leader Libby Mettam were among those calling for police to do better.

Ms Rishworth said WA Police's response seemed inadequate, while Ms Mettam called for an independent inquiry to be launched in addition to the police internal review announced yesterday.

Ms Rishworth is part of an urgent review into the prevention of domestic violence and said the family of the gunman were let down by the response of police.

"It certainly seems that she did not get the response that she needed from police," she told ABC News Breakfast this morning.

"And so, it's right that the West Australian government looks into this and it's right that the Police Commissioner looks at what could have been done to prevent this tragedy."

Ms Rishworth noted the bravery of Ms Bombara for speaking out and said her call for action was "incredibly powerful".

"I think it [speaking] requires an enormous bravery, particularly at a time where she would be grieving to speak up and make these comments," she said.

"Her urge for action is very powerful."
...'