Oppo Camp Essendon V Hawthorn banter thread (Round 18)

[Doss]

I would love to know what the people here blowing smoke up Schoenmakers' arse thought of him after the Geelong and Collingwood finals last year.

I distinctly remember Hawthorn people at work, universally and to a man, wanted him gone. They blamed him for both defeats. Which I actually thought was harsh, it wasn't just his fault.

And now suddenly he's better than any Essendon defender. Cool.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

I suppose you think North has one of the best forwardlines in the comp given their points for column?

Grow up. Your pisspoor backline is being sheltered by a decent midfield and a cushy draw.

North forward line one of the best, no. Effective, yeah. Good team at scoring, obviously.

Grow up??? Where did that come from, someone is a tad touchy. Yep our pisspoor backline has been horrid for years, it was also our achiles heel last year when we, hang on, finished in the top 3 backlines in the comp - that can't be right can it. I saw all the media hype about the short people and Schoey.

Emotions and perception can impede judgement, stats are plain for all to see. People see our short backline and go "pisspoor". They see the errors that Schoey made last year (because they are highlighted to death by the media and were at crucial times) and think "useless". But they think those things without looking at the stats. As far as hiding behind a decent midfield of course a midfield helps out with the defence, but it does with any other team, so we are no different in that regard to anyone else. Beside there are plenty of your mates that don't rate our midfield at all, so you can not have it both ways.

As for the cushy draw, believe whatever you need to to make you feel better. We have one of the tougher draws in the comp this year, we play Collingwood, Geelong, West Coast and Sydney twice and then Port twice. The only difficult double header you have all year is Collingwood and the others are against top 8 hopefulls and Port. I call you to grow up, good sir.

 

[Necromancer Beth]

Who? The mighty Giants, Dogs, Blues, Lions and Power? How impressive. One decent win against a team with half its players missing and half of those left out of form and suddenly you've been crushing the best left right and centre.

You've been gifted a cushy draw, and now things are tightening up you'll be exposed. Maybe not by the injury riddled Pies or Dons, but your time is coming fast. If you scrape into the 4 by virtue of your piss easy draw, I'm predicting straight sets.

We play:

Sydney twice
Collingwood twice
West Coast twice
Geelong twice

That's harder than your draw.

Also played Collingwood, Geelong, Adelaide, West Coast away and Sydney in our first five games. Lol.

 

[brendan84]

He will be back on their shit list after another dismal finals campaign this year.

 

[TELLIMAN1]

this game smells of the geelong one last year.....Depleted bombers/ few losses in a row/ mid season slump/ against a team up n about.....BOMBERS TO WIN!

 

[Necromancer Beth]

He will be back on their shit list after another dismal finals campaign this year.

Who Stanton?

 

[brendan84]

Who Stanton?

Schoenmakers. I figured you would have us missing the 8 completely, glad to see you have us in.

 

[Necromancer Beth]

Schoenmakers. I figured you would have us missing the 8 completely, glad to see you have us in.

You only need to win 2 or 3 more games to secure a spot. Would be hilarious if Essendon missed out after their supporters hopes were raised sky high by the good start to the season

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Who? The mighty Giants, Dogs, Blues, Lions and Power? How impressive. One decent win against a team with half its players missing and half of those left out of form and suddenly you've been crushing the best left right and centre.

You've been gifted a cushy draw, and now things are tightening up you'll be exposed. Maybe not by the injury riddled Pies or Dons, but your time is coming fast. If you scrape into the 4 by virtue of your piss easy draw, I'm predicting straight sets.

You can only beat the teams served up. The thing is, we have done what no one else has and, we have smashed teams on a regular basis. 74 point average winning margin over the past 6 weeks. Where did I say we have been crushing the best left, right and centre?? Please show me so I can retract that statement.

Last week everyone said the same thing, you have beaten nobody, the Pies will show you up. Then when we show them up it is because of injuries? C'mon mate not even the Pies supporters sprouted injuries as to why we beat them. They have been collaring teams with that line up. Including the team that ripped the Bombers a new one last week.

You are letting your hatred cloud your vision a bit now. I will be judging our seasons success at the end of the year but as it stands now I am much happier than I would be if I was a Bombers supporter, and I rate what you guys have done so far with the injuries you have had. But guess what, injuries are part of the game and the good sides still manage ways to win against the better sides, even when they have injuries.

As for the cushy draw, again, your hatred is clouding your judgement. Look at who we face twice this year, I posted it for you in our last exchange.

 

[Jade]

So I think we're all in agreement.

Inanimate carbon rod > Clangermakers

 

[Ben the Gooner]

It's been easy lately on the back of playing...

Collingwood, Geelong, West Coast, Adelaide, Sydney & St Kilda in our first 7-8 weeks. At the end of the years we have played

Pies twice
Geelong twice
Sydney twice
WCE twice
Port twice

Who have the bombers played twice?

You travel 3 times. Your argument is invalid.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

I would love to know what the people here blowing smoke up Schoenmakers' arse thought of him after the Geelong and Collingwood finals last year.

I distinctly remember Hawthorn people at work, universally and to a man, wanted him gone. They blamed him for both defeats. Which I actually thought was harsh, it wasn't just his fault.

And now suddenly he's better than any Essendon defender. Cool.

Dos23, that part is true, too many blinded by the errors of a 20yo playing on the big stage on the games biggest forwards. I had to put up with people bagging the sh*t out of him, including my old man.
I thought he was a 20 yo with a huge assignment on his hands and he handled it like a 20 yo with a huge assignment on his hands. I honestly don't know what people were thinking he would be able to do.. I was more annoyed that we had not recruited a big seasoned defender to give him time to mature on second talls. Now I am happy, though I still think he has a lot to improve on.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

You travel 3 times. Your argument is invalid.

Yeah but we are on the back of three 6 day breaks right now, so there!! this sh*t could go on forever with you I think.

Edit: When it all comes down to it, you play who you play, you beat as many as you can and you cover injuries as good as you can. Interstate this and 6 day breaks that have fu*k all to do with it if you are good enough. Oh, and you dont put a sh*t load of bulk onto your players and train them into the ground thinking it will have no consequences. that too!!!

 

[Ben the Gooner]

North forward line one of the best, no. Effective, yeah. Good team at scoring, obviously.

Grow up??? Where did that come from, someone is a tad touchy. Yep our pisspoor backline has been horrid for years, it was also our achiles heel last year when we, hang on, finished in the top 3 backlines in the comp - that can't be right can it. I saw all the media hype about the short people and Schoey.

Emotions and perception can impede judgement, stats are plain for all to see. People see our short backline and go "pisspoor". They see the errors that Schoey made last year (because they are highlighted to death by the media and were at crucial times) and think "useless". But they think those things without looking at the stats. As far as hiding behind a decent midfield of course a midfield helps out with the defence, but it does with any other team, so we are no different in that regard to anyone else. Beside there are plenty of your mates that don't rate our midfield at all, so you can not have it both ways.

As for the cushy draw, believe whatever you need to to make you feel better. We have one of the tougher draws in the comp this year, we play Collingwood, Geelong, West Coast and Sydney twice and then Port twice. The only difficult double header you have all year is Collingwood and the others are against top 8 hopefulls and Port. I call you to grow up, good sir.

Grow up because you use stats like a child. Low points against = good backline apparently. But put your backline behind Port's midfield and we'll see how that stat looks.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

Grow up because you use stats like a child. Low points against = good backline apparently. But put your backline behind Port's midfield and we'll see how that stat looks.

Stats like a child good work. I could sit here and list the many reasons I think our backline are better than percieved but I get the feeling I would be wasting my time. Can I ask why you think our backline is pisspoor, genuine non troll question.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

No queries over the attack from the backline, that's pretty obviously good. In a game where your midfield is getting as good as it gives however, I don't think you'll be able to cope with a gorilla forward or a Tippett type tall tall forward when you don't have the time to structure up and you're not able to play with a loose man. In all honesty, Schoey and Stratton are pretty average and are more than capable of being torn apart. Gibson is also a bit suspect when forced to take a genuine tall. I think if you make the 4 you'll meet Adelaide at AAMI and Walker/Tippett/Jenkins/Porplyzia will kick a winning score between them.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

No queries over the attack from the backline, that's pretty obviously good. In a game where your midfield is getting as good as it gives however, I don't think you'll be able to cope with a gorilla forward or a Tippett type tall tall forward when you don't have the time to structure up and you're not able to play with a loose man. In all honesty, Schoey and Stratton are pretty average and are more than capable of being torn apart. Gibson is also a bit suspect when forced to take a genuine tall. I think if you make the 4 you'll meet Adelaide at AAMI and Walker/Tippett/Jenkins/Porplyzia will kick a winning score between them.

Fair observation, we are not a one on one defense, the guys works as a team. The thing is, this has been the case for at least 3 seasons and has not been able to be completely exploited yet. The defence is only getting better too. I think to say Schoey and Stratts are average is unfair, they are not the big bodied defenders in a one on one aspect but overall they are well above average (Schoey this year anyway and Stratts is only getting back to his best now after the knee against the Tiggers last year)

Our midfield usually breaks even, it rarely dominates and the defence holds up. If our midfield gets crunched in a game then we are suspect but so is any team, even at full strength. As for Adelaide, they are a potent forward line but in our last clash the defence structured up well and forced Tippett and Walker wide a lot (With the midfields help) and once the ball hit the ground we ran it out with ease due to their lack of speed. That is the risk of just going with the monster forward line. Plus the Tipster and Walker could not kick straight if their life depended on it. If we end up with Adelaide at AAMi it will be hard but we can get over them at AAMI.

 

[Vtorians]

And yet your club would jump at the trade offer of Hurley & Gumbleton for the games best player

No thanks, just like Cyril he's already shit stained.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

Fair observation, we are not a one on one defense, the guys works as a team. The thing is, this has been the case for at least 3 seasons and has not been able to be completely exploited yet. The defence is only getting better too. I think to say Schoey and Stratts are average is unfair, they are not the big bodied defenders in a one on one aspect but overall they are well above average (Schoey this year anyway and Stratts is only getting back to his best now after the knee against the Tiggers last year)

Our midfield usually breaks even, it rarely dominates and the defence holds up. If our midfield gets crunched in a game then we are suspect but so is any team, even at full strength. As for Adelaide, they are a potent forward line but in our last clash the defence structured up well and forced Tippett and Walker wide a lot (With the midfields help) and once the ball hit the ground we ran it out with ease due to their lack of speed. That is the risk of just going with the monster forward line. Plus the Tipster and Walker could not kick straight if their life depended on it. If we end up with Adelaide at AAMi it will be hard but we can get over them at AAMI.

I don't say average as a massive insult, although obviously I am saying that they're worse than you think. They're not terrible, but they're certainly not at the other end of the spectrum either.

The reason you're performing well though is that it takes a perfect storm to expose your weakness down there. You're really strong through the midfield so that makes it difficult for an opposition team to deliver enough quality ball inside 50 to let the forwards kick a winning score. On top of that, you pretty much always have a man loose which allows Gibson to chop out the other talls down there. To expose Hawthorn's defence, you need to beat their midfield, or at least make it a free flowing midfield battle. Then you need enough talls to force Gibson and possibly Birchall/Murphy to take a tall (and the other one to take a dangerous small), and a leading pattern to isolate those one on one contests. I think fully fit we have the quality of talls to exploit you, and the quality of defenders to deal with an open Hawthorn forwardline in exchange for going man on man in our forwardline. Not fully fit, let's see how Friday pans out.

The team which I do think can and will exploit you though is, as I said, Adelaide. They are one of the fastest clearance teams with dynamic players like Dangerfield and Sloane. Their tall forwardline is unsurpassed by any other you actually have to play against (I'd give them the edge over you on the strength of Porplyzia as the fourth tall, but it's a lineball call) and 3 of their 4 talls (apart from Jenkins the resting ruckman) are capable of kicking big bags of 6+ on a semi-regular basis.

I can't wait to see another Hawthorn-Adelaide game because it'll be a great tactical struggle in your back half.

 

[Ben the Gooner]

And in order to not derail the thread lol hodge is fat and buddy is injunction

 

[essendon2008]

this game smells of the geelong one last year.....Depleted bombers/ few losses in a row/ mid season slump/ against a team up n about.....BOMBERS TO WIN!

I think the Geelong win last year can be put down to 70% tactics and 30% determination.

We don't seem to have any inside knowledge on the hawks, are highly injury affected and at the moment are playing without a lot a determination.

I like the enthusiasm by some posters but I really can't see a win this week.

 

[MrFujiMoto]

And in order to not derail the thread lol hodge is fat and buddy is injunction

Cmon, don't go down the fat, law breaking path. not with Burley.. I mean Hurley in your squad

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

I would love to know what the people here blowing smoke up Schoenmakers' arse thought of him after the Geelong and Collingwood finals last year.

I distinctly remember Hawthorn people at work, universally and to a man, wanted him gone. They blamed him for both defeats. Which I actually thought was harsh, it wasn't just his fault.

And now suddenly he's better than any Essendon defender. Cool.

Mate he is 21 and just starting to mature physically this year.

Many Hawks were jumping on him laat year but not all. Personally I was disappointed but cited Hawkins as a good reason why we should be patient.

Anyone with a skerrick of football knowledge knows not to rate a 21yo KPD on performances from the previous season.

He'll be giving Hurley nightmares for the rest of their careers..

 

[Doss]

Mate he is 21 and just starting to mature physically this year.

Many Hawks were jumping on him laat year but not all. Personally I was disappointed but cited Hawkins as a good reason why we should be patient.

Anyone with a skerrick of football knowledge knows not to rate a 21yo KPD on performances from the previous season.

He'll be giving Hurley nightmares for the rest of their careers..

I think you might be missing my point, mate.

I'm not rating him just on last season- anyone who has been following should be able to acknowledge he has improved since 2011.

I just think it's pretty fickle to go from criticising a player as much as many Hawthorn supporters did with him last year, to one year later pumping up his tyres as much as some now are. He has improved- but not that much.

In comparison to our talls, he is not a better defender than Fletcher, Carlisle or Hooker yet. I'll give you Pears based on this year (and because of injury, whether Pears ever gets back to his 2009 form remains to be seen), but that's about it.

 

[Fatessendonman]

i hope someone smashes that campaigner isac smith, ****n overrated lanky awkward kent **** u