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Lloyd was drafted as a 16 year old, so he was in the system three years by the time he reached Gumbleton's current age.
Essendons Strengths & Weaknesses
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Lloyd was drafted as a 16 year old, so he was in the system three years by the time he reached Gumbleton's current age.
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Dont give him facts and good reasoning. He'll simply ignore it. I judge that by the ignorance in his whole post.
Lloyd to Gumbleton is not really an apples to apples comparison given Lloyd is an FF and Gumbleton is a CHF. Probably the best comparison would be Travis Cloke as he is also a CHF.
1st seasons:
Gumbleton: 8.2 disposals per game, 5.2 marks per game, 0.6 goals per game.
T Cloke: 9.87 disposals per game, 3.533 marks per game, 0.66 goals per game.
Not a bad start. Admittedly Cloke played many more games but Gumbleton's limited pre-season and mid year hamstring strain would account for that.
I don't think that our future key forward pair will match the pair of Lloyd and Lucas but that is irrelevant because they are not in competition with them. Post Lloyd and Lucas I am confident that we will at least have a forward line that will still be considered as one of the better ones.
1st seasons:
Gumbleton: 8.2 disposals per game, 5.2 marks per game, 0.6 goals per game.
T Cloke: 9.87 disposals per game, 3.533 marks per game, 0.66 goals per game.
Not a bad start. Admittedly Cloke played many more games but Gumbleton's limited pre-season and mid year hamstring strain would account for that.
I don't think that our future key forward pair will match the pair of Lloyd and Lucas but that is irrelevant because they are not in competition with them. Post Lloyd and Lucas I am confident that we will at least have a forward line that will still be considered as one of the better ones.
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Neagle is looking most likely to take over the position of FF from Lloyd. Cant cmpare them yet as they havent had the time to make their mark but in 5-7 years time we should be able to see how Neagle/Gumbleton compare to Lloyd/Lucas. Irrelevant anyway. We have a very promising forward line waiting to take over from the older players. The forward line is one area where I am not overly concerned with, whereas the midfield and to an extent our defence is giving me a bigger headache. Fingers crossed that the likes of Houli, Myers, Hislop, Riemers, Jetta, Dempsey etc come though as we expect. In fact in a few years our midfield could well be our strength. Time will tell.
douggie the don
Team Captain
Essendon are only one class midfielder away from having a list that can compete in finals.
It'll either come from one of the numerous players we've picked up over the last 3 years or someone we get in the next year or two.
If Knights can get our midfield to work as a real group, in a similar fashion to that of collingwood or north, i can't see why we can't challenge.
It'll either come from one of the numerous players we've picked up over the last 3 years or someone we get in the next year or two.
If Knights can get our midfield to work as a real group, in a similar fashion to that of collingwood or north, i can't see why we can't challenge.
DaSawx
Brownlow Medallist
Jason Johnson could be in for a big year
Bit selective there weren't you?
Brown kicked 4, Edwards 2, Jones 2.
There is 10 of your goals from guys who play tall or lead from the goal face.
Our biggest problem in our game against North is that we kicked 2 goals, 9 behinds in the first quarter.
That was a huge problem in a number of games, we failed to put teams away.
The problem isn't that we lack flankers, what we lack is the ability to keep the ball when we have it. You turn the ball over, you put your backline under pressure. We do it, far to often.
And don't forget Brown got a goal before the start of the game as the umpire thought he saw head high contact by McPhee when replays showed there was nothing there.... disgraceful decision.
In reality it was 3 shots at goal to 11 in the first quarter yet we were down at quarter time.
And don't forget Brown got a goal before the start of the game as the umpire thought he saw head high contact by McPhee when replays showed there was nothing there.... disgraceful decision.
In reality it was 3 shots at goal to 11 in the first quarter yet we were down at quarter time.
That might have been the case last year, although I don't think at any point I was that worried, but what about the other 6 years?
I think Tas's point has merit. Nine times out of ten we smash you in the middle, and once that happens, it's just a question of by how much.
I don't know if Knights will be any good or not and I haven't said anything on the subject but I can see why people would have doubts. Even as comparred to Rattan there are 2 main differences.
1 Rattan played finals and premierships whereas Knights came from an unsuccessful club that couldn’t win a chook raffle for virtually his whole career.
2. Carlton wanted Rattan – admittedly after Voss pulled out. Knights was a late choice after other options dried up.
It is true that their AFL senior coaching careers are virtually the same. I recall Richmond supporters had the same attitude as yourself about Frawley after his unsuccessful stint at Collingwood reserves after his long career at an unsuccessful club.
Nothing is conclusive yet of course but it is all about credentials. Sight unseen Mathews on day 1 had great credentials. Then again Tony Shaw had good credentials and even Mathews believed that.
Yeah pretty much spot on.
The lack of fight and discipline in the middle over the last few years has been a major downfall.
You guys have been tougher, harder at it and generally have more numbers around the contest and it's been reflective of our past few games.
We started to get a good running game early last year and we troubled a few teams as some of the kids started to come in in Winderlich, Stanton, etc.
We expect more improvement next year as Knights has instilled a lot more discipline in midfield defense, one percenters, shepharding, etc, etc.
We were a better side and a vastly different side in 2007 than what we were in 2006.
Winning the ball out of the middle hasn't been an issue, even in 2006 we were in the top four in clearances and first possessions.
It's turning it over that kills us and that's not something that North have exclusive rights over us in.
You've beaten us since 2002 because for the most part, you've been a better side than us. Not because we are weak across the flanks.
Once you turn the ball over, you are automatically out of position.
Your best and fairest results in 2007 confirm that indeed you were the SAME side in 2007 than you were in 2006. It was the same-old-same-old-very-old names who carried you last year.
You just had a little more luck, or a little less bad luck, than you did in 2006.
Tas
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TheBrownDog
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Yeah, I think in recent years Sheedy probably hasn't been as innovative on-field as he was through the vast majority of his career. I have no doubt there will be some significant differences between Sheedy and Knights, he might bring some new plays, strategies, etc which helps to counter previous weaknesses.
Time changes things, under Pagan Port Adelaide were our bunnies only beating us once or twice even during their premiership era, when Pagan left and Laidley came our victories against them since have been scarce. I am sure Knights' style will make it easier to beat some teams you have struggled against but may also see you more vulnerable to teams you have normally beaten consistently in the past.
I think a good thing for Essendon supporters is with a clean slate you can go into the 2008 optimistic about any real clash because the trends of the past are largely irrelevant.
I agree with pretty much all of that, and I would need to rack my brains to debate the flanks issue. Except to say the stats put forward by Tas do suggest you've had issues winning the midfield battle against North. I also think some of our midfielders seem to enjoy playing Essendon for whatever reason. I remember the huge come back game in 2001 that Daniel Harris as a kid played a good game that day and he/Rawlings/Harvey always seem to be amongst it against Essendon.
But it's funny how tides can often turn. We used to blow the shit out of West Coast/Collingwood under most circumstances and yet struggle against Geelong. Then we started to dominate Geelong and struggle against West Coast/Collingwood. Essendon always seem to rise the occasion against West Coast and Collingwood and yet struggle against us.
I think what I'm trying to say is some teams simply do better and/or worse against others.
Keep dreaming mate Try about 4 class midfielders before you can consider finals.You dont have any midfielders at present with any class so what are you going on about
Does this mean that collingwood had a little more luck as well?
Our best and fairest results show that it was our youngsters who led the way in 2007.
So if our best and fairest results are the same, surely then it wasn't our best players the led us to improvement, because they were already playing well.
It was our next tier that stepped up to help us win an extra 7 games.
Where did Davey, Jetta, Winderlich finish in the 2006 B&F?
Your best player in the pf was Clement.
He is now gone.
You got a free win in the first game against North because the umpire couldn't work at the difference between 35m and 50m.
You had a very soft draw. Your last 5 games were against teams that basically packed it in. A normal draw and you would have had 11 wins.
You couldn't get any luckier with your final win in Perth as the WCE could barely field a side!
Not sure you can sustain that luck in 2008.
Dont know what game you were watching - his clangers during the finals series were very uncharacteristic.
Clement was sh1te in the finals series.....was ridiculously out of touch, turned the ball over repeatedly.
Best players in the PF were T.Cloke, Swan and M.Clarke
Players of the finals series were our young guns, T.Cloke won the award for best finals player.
rnd 21 v Sydney - fighting for a spot in the finals
rnd 22 v Adelaide - simple solution for Adelaide, win and play finals, lose and miss out
but yeah they had packed it in
How many teams have beaten West Coast in Perth in a final in history??
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Edited for accuracy.
Strengths = Kevin Sheedy
Oh wait hes gone.
Weaknesses = Kevin Sheedy left.
Oh wait hes gone.
Weaknesses = Kevin Sheedy left.
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