Coach Fages and the coaching group

[mpal6]

Its been a recurring theme that we back in the same 22 as much as possible, no matter the break or the conditions. But then struggle as the kids have not been given enough consistent development time. Im pretty sure if we look at the numbers we probably will have attempted to run the same 4 guys in the midfield for exactly the same %ToG and CBA

Looking back with Captain Hindsight would we have been better off resting guys for both games to be as fresh as possible across as many players as possible? Or should we have gone all in on one game (and conceded the other) and then rested a heap of players for the other?

We never look proactive (or fully professional) on this front

Could've gone smaller in the forward line last week. Reville debut etc. Flogging the dead horse anyway.

 

[M Malice]

Great little analysis by Nathan Buckley in the first 5 minutes or so on how the better teams are playing in 2024, it is all about a spare man back, work rate and run from behind... we are just not in good enough physical shape to play the way the game has gone in 2024 sadly. Bucks talks about Chris Fagan around the 10 minute mark.. great measured take on Fagan IMO.

 

[Section 5]

‘Hanging by a thread’: Brisbane in need of ‘facelift’ as loyalty threatens season

‘Hanging by a thread’: Lions in need of ‘facelift’ as loyalty threatens season

www.foxsports.com.au

Nailed it

This selection stuff is so tired. Game style and ball movement are interesting, legitimate possible points of criticism. But the context matters a lot - kiddy being out has taken away our most dynamic player.

We spent all offseason training to do more run and carry, handball receives and got whacked between the eyes in the first game and confidence cratered.

Changing the game style during the season heavily is something I only want to do if we are basically out of contention to make finals. If we are at that point experimenting makes sense.

The game style can be changed slightly to accommodate a good player like Kiddy going down.
Also I think coaches change thing up ever so slightly as the season unfolds.
Agree no major changes but you do have to adjust and I think coaches do.

Going into the season we really did not know how the new player additions would fit in except Doedee.

On exposed AFL form we had Joyce, Fort, Lohmann, Prior, Madden, Sharp, Tunstill, Michael, Ryan.
Our injured players were replaced from this group.
VFL form we had Reville, Lane, Smith, Brain.
New to the Lions were Doedee, Morris, Lloyd, Torrent & ZZ.

I agree early selection pushes from posters to get certain players into a GF team were not really warranted because of a few factors.
The early Start to the AFL season and a later start to the VFL did not help those pushing for a spot.
Hard to get selected from training alone.
We now have 5 games of VFL form to make a better judgement on the fringe guys that are playing well and have those AFL traits to possibly keep a spot in the side.

Sitting 2-5 there will be changes this week. Fagan has no option in my opinion.

We play the Sun's who I think we will thump on Sunday.

I think there will be 2 debutants this week Reville and Morris with Gardiner as the sub.
He can replace Morris if needed or go into defence.
If Big O is not available they may include Smith.

On Lenovo TB-X606F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[western royboy]

The game style can be changed slightly to accommodate a good player like Kiddy going down.
Also I think coaches change thing up ever so slightly as the season unfolds.
Agree no major changes but you do have to adjust and I think coaches do.

Going into the season we really did not know how the new player additions would fit in except Doedee.

On exposed AFL form we had Joyce, Fort, Lohmann, Prior, Madden, Sharp, Tunstill, Michael, Ryan.
Our injured players were replaced from this group.
VFL form we had Reville, Lane, Smith, Brain.
New to the Lions were Doedee, Morris, Lloyd, Torrent & ZZ.

I agree early selection pushes from posters to get certain players into a GF team were not really warranted because of a few factors.
The early Start to the AFL season and a later start to the VFL did not help those pushing for a spot.
Hard to get selected from training alone.
We now have 5 games of VFL form to make a better judgement on the fringe guys that are playing well and have those AFL traits to possibly keep a spot in the side.

Sitting 2-5 there will be changes this week. Fagan has no option in my opinion.

We play the Sun's who I think we will thump on Sunday.

I think there will be 2 debutants this week Reville and Morris with Gardiner as the sub.
He can replace Morris if needed or go into defence.
If Big O is not available they may include Smith.

On Lenovo TB-X606F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Not sure we’re thumping the Suns - hope you’re right but 50/50 at best

 

[McIvor]

Wet weather footy vs Geelong on a saturday night to a thursday turnaround.

There wouldn't be much left in tank after that game.

Yep I thought the same after watching Geelong on the weekend too

 

[Section 5]

Not sure we’re thumping the Suns - hope you’re right but 50/50 at best

Did not mean to include you in the reply western royboy.
I am posting from a Lenovo tablet for the first time.
A learning curve for me.

On Lenovo TB-X606F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[MSB ROYS]

Great little analysis by Nathan Buckley in the first 5 minutes or so on how the better teams are playing in 2024, it is all about a spare man back, work rate and run from behind... we are just not in good enough physical shape to play the way the game has gone in 2024 sadly. Bucks talks about Chris Fagan around the 10 minute mark.. great measured take on Fagan IMO.

M Malice Refreshing to hear some decent analysis. It really will be really interesting to see if our season can get back on track.

 

[M Malice]

M Malice Refreshing to hear some decent analysis. It really will be really interesting to see if our season can get back on track.

I'm not expecting many changes for the Suns game(Big O & ? for Fort/Ah Chee might be about it) but if we put in another shocker I'd be expecting 3-4 omissions for the following weeks game against the Crows in Adelaide.

 

[davemc_lions]

Be interesting how we go Sunday. How Fagan goes to fix problems problems.
If it just ends up Oscar for Fort and Lyons for AhChee.
Or he tries someone like Reville or Brain or Morris.

I do think Kiddy gone been the problem all year.. We had no one to break the lines.
Zorko a great kick although you not getting 40m kicks out of him.
With Berry playing defensive wing we sort of lost Kiddy and replaced him with Berry and Zorko.
So down a player.

Hardwick is a good tactical coach he would have seen how we beaten easily by run.
Be interesting how Fagan regroups.. if we loose to suns which is highly probably what he does next.
Suns have a lot of fast running mids which always undoes us. add a tall forward that Harris cannot outstretch and Miller will keep Neale to low disposals.

 

[mpal6]

Be interesting how we go Sunday. How Fagan goes to fix problems problems.
If it just ends up Oscar for Fort and Lyons for AhChee.
Or he tries someone like Reville or Brain or Morris.

I do think Kiddy gone been the problem all year.. We had no one to break the lines.
Zorko a great kick although you not getting 40m kicks out of him.
With Berry playing defensive wing we sort of lost Kiddy and replaced him with Berry and Zorko.
So down a player.

Hardwick is a good tactical coach he would have seen how we beaten easily by run.
Be interesting how Fagan regroups.. if we loose to suns which is highly probably what he does next.
Suns have a lot of fast running mids which always undoes us. add a tall forward that Harris cannot outstretch and Miller will keep Neale to low disposals.

Hardwick will look to run us off our feet. Take the ball from defense and feed every player who is running past. Lions will be gassed out by Q2/Q3.

 

[Nathan Barley]

Be interesting how we go Sunday. How Fagan goes to fix problems problems.
If it just ends up Oscar for Fort and Lyons for AhChee.
Or he tries someone like Reville or Brain or Morris.

I do think Kiddy gone been the problem all year.. We had no one to break the lines.
Zorko a great kick although you not getting 40m kicks out of him.
With Berry playing defensive wing we sort of lost Kiddy and replaced him with Berry and Zorko.
So down a player.

Hardwick is a good tactical coach he would have seen how we beaten easily by run.
Be interesting how Fagan regroups.. if we loose to suns which is highly probably what he does next.
Suns have a lot of fast running mids which always undoes us. add a tall forward that Harris cannot outstretch and Miller will keep Neale to low disposals.

Hardwick will look to run us off our feet. Take the ball from defense and feed every player who is running past. Lions will be gassed out by Q2/Q3.

Not sure the suns are that quick

I’m more concerned about contested footy

 

[M Malice]

Be interesting how we go Sunday. How Fagan goes to fix problems problems.
If it just ends up Oscar for Fort and Lyons for AhChee.
Or he tries someone like Reville or Brain or Morris.

I do think Kiddy gone been the problem all year.. We had no one to break the lines.
Zorko a great kick although you not getting 40m kicks out of him.
With Berry playing defensive wing we sort of lost Kiddy and replaced him with Berry and Zorko.
So down a player.

Hardwick is a good tactical coach he would have seen how we beaten easily by run.
Be interesting how Fagan regroups.. if we loose to suns which is highly probably what he does next.
Suns have a lot of fast running mids which always undoes us. add a tall forward that Harris cannot outstretch and Miller will keep Neale to low disposals.

If Jarryd Lyons comes in to the starting 22 >

 

[martinson]

I'm not overly worried by the Suns at all if we bring effort and intensity across 4 quarters.

They can run as fast as they like but if we can get our energy back and make them earn every possession around the ball they won't run fast enough to beat us.

The mental/energy dropoffs are a real concern and no doubt that will be the focus this week.

 

[SizeMatters]

Great little analysis by Nathan Buckley in the first 5 minutes or so on how the better teams are playing in 2024, it is all about a spare man back, work rate and run from behind... we are just not in good enough physical shape to play the way the game has gone in 2024 sadly. Bucks talks about Chris Fagan around the 10 minute mark.. great measured take on Fagan IMO.

We are arguably still playing 2022 footy. And some may say we are still playing 2019 footy. Game changed a lot over the off season. We haven’t changed much… though tbf we have been on the back foot pretty much every game so haven’t had a chance to show what we have tweaked over the offseason. Midfield getting smashed…

 

[Lionheart182]

Yep I thought the same after watching Geelong on the weekend too

Ignoring the '5 day break' part of that post?

 

[McIvor]

Ignoring the '5 day break' part of that post?

Fair

 

[davemc_lions]

I'm not overly worried by the Suns at all if we bring effort and intensity across 4 quarters.

They can run as fast as they like but if we can get our energy back and make them earn every possession around the ball they won't run fast enough to beat us.

The mental/energy dropoffs are a real concern and no doubt that will be the focus this week.

I always worry when we play a team of young kids with some run.
We always had problems against teams like the dogs because of it
Suns beat us last year..
I do think we too slow in the middle of the ground. Have been so for a few years
Just skill and a better connected forward line helped us. We still getting it in forward 50 although once Joe or Hippy or Charlie drop the mark it comes straight back out.
I can understand the Dizzy experiment although not worked.

 

[mpal6]

If Jarryd Lyons comes in to the starting 22 >

Be ready for it !!!!!!!!!!!

 

[McIvor]

And yet many on here don’t think there aren’t major issues. If people don’t believe the experts (who supposedly aren’t experts) then perhaps those stats or even our diabolical second half scores hopefully are realising that there are issues.

Hell even Fages PC he admitted he has no ideas and please, the expression on his face clearly showed that to be the case and that was no act.

Also pretty damning and he’s not the first one to say it but Dal Santo just said on AFL Tinight that this group is pretty much done and that we should now look to change.

 

[Nathan Barley]

And yet many on here don’t think there aren’t major issues. If people don’t believe the experts (who supposedly aren’t experts) then perhaps those stats or even our diabolical second half scores hopefully are realising that there are issues.

Hell even Fages PC he admitted he has no ideas and please, the expression on his face clearly showed that to be the case and that was no act.

Also pretty damning and he’s not the first one to say it but Dal Santo just said on AFL Tinight that this group is pretty much done and that we should now look to change.

This nonsense is starting to get pretty old now McIvor

 

[davemc_lions]

If Jarryd Lyons comes in to the starting 22 >

He does give 100% for the whole game, unlike some others who play 5-10 mins every 2-3 games.
Then he gets dropped where some others are undroppable.
You cannot knock his endeavour.
Just we have Neale, Clugga and Dunkley who all just as slow in the mid but better quality output.

Seeing this is a coach thread as we knew we short on someone with pace or burst and Ashcroft was out to mid season.
You wonder why did not try get someone with a difference into the team
Did we just think Bailey and Rayner get their s**t together and play full games?
Why we did not go for some young kid with some pace.
I still find it interesting seeing we kept all 3 VFL ruck/Forwards, that we then drafted in 2 mid sized forwards and traded for one Key forward. Then we play a defender in the forward 50 in the seniors. Then now pushed Lloyd into defence in the VFL.

 

[martinson]

We are arguably still playing 2022 footy. And some may say we are still playing 2019 footy. Game changed a lot over the off season. We haven’t changed much… though tbf we have been on the back foot pretty much every game so haven’t had a chance to show what we have tweaked over the offseason. Midfield getting smashed…

Understandably seeing we made the GF last year we figured more of the same with a few tweaks would see us back there.

Kiddy going down threw us into a bit of disarray so we reverted even harder into what had always worked for us.

Now we're caught between a rock and a hard place because what's ensued didn't work ,our energy has dropped off and sapped our confidence .

I think it's too late now to make any dramatic changes to the gameplan , we need to try a couple of new players and the rest have to dig deep. As Lethal used to say ad infinitum it's not rocket science.

 

[martinson]

He does give 100% for the whole game, unlike some others who play 5-10 mins every 2-3 games.
Then he gets dropped where some others are undroppable.
You cannot knock his endeavour.
Just we have Neale, Clugga and Dunkley who all just as slow in the mid but better quality output.

Seeing this is a coach thread as we knew we short on someone with pace or burst and Ashcroft was out to mid season.
You wonder why did not try get someone with a difference into the team
Did we just think Bailey and Rayner get their s**t together and play full games?
Why we did not go for some young kid with some pace.
I still find it interesting seeing we kept all 3 VFL ruck/Forwards, that we then drafted in 2 mid sized forwards and traded for one Key forward. Then we play a defender in the forward 50 in the seniors. Then now pushed Lloyd into defence in the VFL.

Seeing you put it that way that makes a lot of sense.

Sometimes things unfold the opposite way you expect and it's hard now to undo whatever our plan was.

So the players are good enough to be a lot better than they have been and it starts this week.

 

[lionshine]

I wouldn’t be surprised if every few weeks we bob up with a big performance similar to the Demons win. We should see a few like that on talent alone but I don’t think we will have the consistency this year in effort or application due to a few reasons. It wouldn’t surprise me if we turned things around this weekend after a 9 day break and a bit of a bashing in the media only to lose to the Crows the week after.

I’d like to see Reville, Sharp and Brain filtered in over the next few weeks to add more run and skill(Sharp won’t help much in the skill department but the other two will).

I’m also all for promoting Henry Smith or Logan Morris in place of Gardiner.

 

[Tom14]

And yet many on here don’t think there aren’t major issues. If people don’t believe the experts (who supposedly aren’t experts) then perhaps those stats or even our diabolical second half scores hopefully are realising that there are issues.

Hell even Fages PC he admitted he has no ideas and please, the expression on his face clearly showed that to be the case and that was no act.

Also pretty damning and he’s not the first one to say it but Dal Santo just said on AFL Tinight that this group is pretty much done and that we should now look to change.

Please leave this sort of posting to the coaching group thread or the post-game thread.

Let's not pollute this beautiful stats thread with our ongoing board warzzz.