Fitzroy Vs the Paddle Pop lion court case

[Hollow Knight]

In my view, as a lawyer and CEO Bowers should have understood that, more-so than supporters who by and large are far less interested in that sort of thing. Had Bowers and the Board consulted with the Club's merger partner over changes to "the Fitzroy lion logo", then the whole legal challenge by Fitzroy could have been avoided in the first place.

Agreed 120 percent.

 

[notting18]

I understand all that Roylion.

My point is that some people have a different attachment to the Fitzroy identity. The legal continuity of an ABN (and I am being pointedly facetious here) may hold less of an affinity for some people relative to seeing their club colours represented at the elite level.

There are some Royboys here (I believe Bobby Beecroft is one of them) who identify Fitzroy as the element that is represented as part of the merger, and not the organisation that plays in the VAFA.

I certinaly am not in a position to say they are wrong, and I'd never suggest you are wrong either.

But some people definitely have a less "legal" (pointedly facetious again) assessment of affairs, and perhaps more of a subjective one. A gut feel perhaps.

As an "ex-Fitzroy kid, current Brisbane Lions fan" as much as I am grateful for the FFC taking the risks the enforce the merger agreement, the "legal continuity" of the FFC has little connection/importance to me.

My footy club is the Brisbane Lions wholeheartedly, due to the Fitzroy merger of course, but I am not, currently, a Fitzroy fan who as a result follows the Brisbane Lions in the AFL. Regardless of my deep concerns about how the club is being run.

It should be said though that as a child of 1987, my football experiences are based purely in an national, AFL as opposed to VFL, environment which probably influences my current feelings...

 

[Stocka]

From Tony Kelly's intro to the latest Lions Tale, after detailing the positives from this season:

Thanks for posting that snippet, Bob.

It seems as though Kelly has really been brushing up on his hyperbole lately, doesn't it?

I tend to wonder about his statement about "improving member services" though. When was the last time that members felt that they were receiving better value for money for their membership or were getting more "services" for their membership fee?

I wonder what "member services" Kelly had in mind that would need "improving"?

I know it's a different topic altogether, but I can't help but feel that this sort of pernicious rhetoric is fairly venomous in trying to create angst about the FFC's rightful legal stance, and therefore not a good sign with regards to indicating whether or not the club is prepared to stance about the logo and jumper.

 

[T Rick]

Yawn...
One dollar spent on this "living in the past" claptrap is a dollar too much! Who cares who is to blame; the outcome is the same...money, time and energy being drained away from our Football Department. By "our" I mean the Brisbane Lions, not the Bears or Fitzroy....they are both history as far as 2010 is concerned!
Get a life and move on...

 

[Hollow Knight]

I know it's a different topic altogether, but I can't help but feel that this sort of pernicious rhetoric is fairly venomous in trying to create angst about the FFC's rightful legal stance, and therefore not a good sign with regards to indicating whether or not the club is prepared to stance about the logo and jumper.

Of course it is, the club has been trying to spin it in this direction from the start.

Tony Kelly's speech at the AGM was populist shit.

"We won't let our club be dictated to by an unrepresentative minority! Rar rar rar! We are victims!"

 

[Haggis McHaggis]

Yup. I posted his missive from the 1st LT of the season. Essentially the same shit.

They wanna dig their own graves, let em.

 

[Always a Lion]

Yawn...
One dollar spent on this "living in the past" claptrap is a dollar too much! Who cares who is to blame; the outcome is the same...money, time and energy being drained away from our Football Department. By "our" I mean the Brisbane Lions, not the Bears or Fitzroy....they are both history as far as 2010 is concerned!
Get a life and move on...

Clearly Fairley you don't give a hoot about history. You've been beating your drum about it, and you can keep doing it as far as I'm concerned. I will continue to beat mine. The only thing that should "move on", is the arrogance with which you dismiss the opposing POV. Expressing your POV on forums such as these invites exchange.

As a payed up member of both BLFC and FFC (for the first in years), I am wrapped that one of my clubs is prepared to invest my membership money in the the courts. I am appalled the BLFC is pissing up my money, but glad FFC is using it to good effect. I agree with Kelly, it is an absolute waste of time and money, perhaps he/they can just pull their heads in and comply with the merger agreement, or in future motivate change via an open and consultative process.

What exactly is the club doing to improve members services?

Perhaps our Brisbane brethren can see those exiting new services Kelly refers to. Down here in Melbourne we are getting shafted, we see nothing but erosion. Call me blind but in our last two Melbourne games I lapped Etihad Stadium with my nephew hoping to collect our membership caps (normally at a Membership caravan), but could find no BLFC presence whatsoever. Very disappointing - explain that to your 10 year old nephew.

It's all about the Brisbane market now, I'm convinced of it. Loyalty doesn't register in market trend charts and KPIs. Next year I'll be a member of just one club, it'll be my local one. I know a few who also think like me. I wonder whether that trend will show in their KPI charts.

Is that what you mean by "move on" Fairley?

If by minor chance it's not what you mean... it is what the BLFC board and it's administration mean... 'move on, we have'.

 

[Kickit2brown]

It's a very sad day when Melbourne based Lions supporters don't feel like the club is supporting them, respect is something that has to go both ways for it to work. The melbourne based Lions supporters have turned up rain hail or shine to watch us get pumped every game this year, yet the club has paid us back with a big pile of shit. The poor win/loss ratio in Melbourne is something we deal with, move on with and understand. The pathetic management by the club when it comes to melbourne is another thing all together. I have never felt this distant from the club since i started supporting them over 25 years ago. That includes the time when my club moved from Melbourne to Brisbane. Bowers needs to go, he has no idea about the club and what it represents.

 

[Football Pope]

What exactly is the club doing to improve members services?

Perhaps our Brisbane brethren can see those exiting new services Kelly refers to. Down here in Melbourne we are getting shafted, we see nothing but erosion. Call me blind but in our last two Melbourne games I lapped Etihad Stadium with my nephew hoping to collect our membership caps (normally at a Membership caravan), but could find no BLFC presence whatsoever. Very disappointing - explain that to your 10 year old nephew. .

The "Merchandise/Membership Tent" was on the Bourke St walkover/bridge...back towards Southern Cross Station..

Worse to come I'm afraid...With the sale of the Manningham..In the next month Victorian members can expect the Victorian Office to be relocated to Docklands...Hidden away somewhere within the bowels..heard of but never seen.....

Our Administration has taken frugal living to Victorian Members...offering less for their hard earned ready's...The little gem of a cost saver.......Lion merchandise will not be sold at the office...available only on line...

 

[MICKYCONLAN]

I still don't understand how discarding members in Melbourne will create new members in Brisbane. Wouldn't it have been better to have both?

 

[whatboutbob]

I still don't understand how discarding members in Melbourne will create new members in Brisbane. Wouldn't it have been better to have both?

There's a theory that Melbourne members actually cost the club money, due to the high cost of tickets, lower number of members and distinct administration costs. Not saying I agree with it, but the club's recent approach seems to indicate that this may be the case.

 

[fitzroy_lions123]

Is our apparel sponsor gona change for next season?
If it is, does that mean the jumper design will change again or even a logo change?

 

[Hollow Knight]

Is our apparel sponsor gona change for next season?
If it is, does that mean the jumper design will change again or even a logo change?

Our deal with Puma is up at the end of the year and they are pulling out of footy.

My mail is that the club is talking to Koo Ga.

It would be a good opportunity to change jumper design, but I doubt Bowers will give an inch on that.

 

[fitzroy_lions123]

Our deal with Puma is up at the end of the year and they are pulling out of footy.

My mail is that the club is talking to Koo Ga.

It would be a good opportunity to change jumper design, but I doubt Bowers will give an inch on that.

WOW!
Thats a really bad choice. What are they thinking?
Isnt it a Rugby League brand?

 

[Hollow Knight]

WOW!
Thats a really bad choice. What are they thinking?
Isnt it a Rugby League brand?

 

[T Rick]

Clearly Fairley you don't give a hoot about history.

Next year I'll be a member of just one club, it'll be my local one. I know a few who also think like me.

Is that what you mean by "move on" Fairley?


The Fitzroy connection is important to me but I am far more concerned with the present and the future of the Brisbane Lions. I never supported Fitzroy, I simply inherited their history by a quirk of the AFL and the fact that the FFC went "belly up". Sorry to be so blunt but that is the reality of most supporters in Queensland.
I understand that your passion runs deep... but I am not remotely interested in Vossy's Lions being compromised by court cases about problematic logos. To me that is pedantic history that has absolutely no relevance to the BLFC I support and the team I barrack for. I am also a member of the BLFC, as is my father who "inducted" me into the sport and imbued me with his passion for the Bears and then subsequently the Lions.
I suspect we are from very different eras and I trust the Brisbane Lions have given you some joy (2001-2003 in particular), perhaps much greater than anything you had previously and that you will find happiness in supporting a local team in Melbourne next year.
Sadly for you, the Brisbane Lions are not the FFC or the Brisbane Bears. They are a new entity and as for merger agreements, unfortunately only the lawyers and courts can resolve that issue. If the FFC is "right" they will have achieved little other than to financially hurt the Brisbane Lions. From my perspective this is a win:lose scenario that is just plain stupid.
I respect your views and emotions but I am not interested in anything that compromises the BLFC from going forward.
On another separate matter, I do empathise with your angst as a Melbourne based BLFC supporter and would support anything you do to get a better deal from the Club...we need a strong Melbourne base of Brisbane Lions supporters. To me this is not about logos and court cases this is about the Club and its membership department maximising its market and looking after its members.

 

[fitzroy_lions123]

yeh TBD....its only one AFL club tho.
Its mostly for rugby. KooGa's website is full of rugby stuff.
The club should be able to do better than KooGa.

 

[Hollow Knight]

yeh TBD....its only one AFL club tho.
Its mostly for rugby. KooGa's website is full of rugby stuff.
The club should be able to do better than KooGa.

At the risk of sounding dismissive... who gives a shit?

A very trite thing to criticise the club over, especially as KooGa are actually considered to be one of the more innovative sporting apparel companies out there.

It's not like Reebok, Nike or Puma are known primarily as AFL companies either.

 

[fitzroy_lions123]

At the risk of sounding dismissive... who gives a shit?

A very trite thing to criticise the club over, especially as KooGa are actually considered to be one of the more innovative sporting apparel companies out there.

It's not like Reebok, Nike or Puma are known primarily as AFL companies either.

You know, your right!
But i just think something like a Nike or Adidas would be better.

Who gives a shit tho

 

[Mobbs]

I actually feel for Fairley, obviously the situation is a pain in the butt for anyone following the Brisbane Lions, whether they are from Fitzroy, Brisbane or Brisbane Lions stock.

This is exactly why it must frustrate most folk to see the mess created by the likes of Bowers, in breaching agreement without consultation. There was an agreement, a merger agreement, that was agreed to, that has now been breached, without any consultation with the other merger parties.

To me it seems that a step back towards ethical business - or if failing that then the removal of the miscreants, replaced with new people who would approach from an ethical business perspective - would be beneficial to the Brisbane Lions, to the FFC, and to all fans of all walks of Lions/Roys/Bears life.

Otherwise you just have people in charge of your club who are committing crimes against football. On the field, you're supposed to defeat all around you. Off the field, you're at least not supposed to attempt injury upon your partners!

PS: grrrrrrrrr (just cant keep my keystrokes light on this, sorry, maybe a little hyperbole there)

 

[Football Pope]

Our deal with Puma is up at the end of the year and they are pulling out of footy.

My mail is that the club is talking to Koo Ga.

It would be a good opportunity to change jumper design, but I doubt Bowers will give an inch on that.

A positive to that...is ....Last time Puma pulled out of sponsoring us...we won 3 premierships in a row wearing Russell Athletics gear...

 

[Warwick]

Off topic: KooGa is a great brand and the guernseys they make (usually training gear for rugby teams) is first class.

On topic: Agree with the angst in here. Kelly bemoaning the fact valuable cash is trickling down the gurgler makes me see red. How about either listening to the majority of members or consulting a greater group of them plus Fitzroy before making such a stupid decision. You made your bed...

 

[Hollow Knight]

David Devine needs to challenge for a board position.

He is no Bowers fan and has the profile to make a successful tilt. This year is the year to do it.

 

[doddgey]

Settlement has been reached.

We keep both Lions ?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/afl/paddle-pop-lion-stays/story-e6frf9jf-1225892329436

 

[viclion17]

http://www.lions.com.au/news/newsarticle/tabid/5085/newsid/98274/default.aspx

Tbh I think all of these conditions are pointless if the official club logo hasn't been changed. But in the end the terrible jumper will stay and I highly doubt that it will change if the current management team is in charge.

What would it take to get Bowers sacked?