Coaching Staff Former Coach Ben "Truck" Rutten - Sacked for real this time - 21/8

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Jordanio said:
All for keeping Rutten till a transparent review ie done on all aspects of the club, including football department, has been completed.
How we commenced the year was diabolical, i include our VFL team also. I don't think we were properly prepared at so many levels. What was the reasons for this? We need stability over the recruiting period and time to perform the review properly otherwise we run the risk of repeating our errors.
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The president has called a board meeting today to decide Rutten's future before the external review has even started. It seems like the biggest moron of all is now running things, and pushing his own agenda.

There is your definition of scapegoat.
 
DonsRule said:
Yep part of my thinking too, how Rutter has handled himself too, can’t fault him on that.

I do think there are question marks on if he is the right man for the got but I think he is far from our biggest problem.
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Let him rebuild the list and bed in the principles, it takes more than a couple of years to do that anyway.

We clearly need to work through that game plan as well, not unlike other clubs that have to reinvent themselves multiple times to get where they need to be. Get the right player development in place, get the right support in place, put a broom through the top third of the organisation, and get on with it.

If we get to the end of next year or the year after and this game plan is bedded in, the list has been fleshed out and the KPPs have matured and we’re treading water mid-table with a stable club/list situation, then that’s where you ask if someone else might get more out of it and you look at the coach.
 
Duckworth said:
The president has called a board meeting today to decide Rutten's future before the external review has even started. It seems like the biggest moron of all is now running things, and pushing his own agenda.

There is your definition of scapegoat.
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And such competition he has too
 

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BrunoV said:
I'm starting to get a sinking feeling that this whole thing has now become about Rutten the man.

Barham was right, we shouldn't forget that. He tried to walk post internal review announcement and was convinced to stay on.

He botched the procedural things in the last week, in exceptional circumstances, mind you, but in the bigger picture none of it is relevant to anything we do going forward.

The weak board at this point in time loses sight of what this really about because its members' empathy has been provoked.
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Barham has completely cooked it from my point of view. Not just with his laughable attempt at getting Clarko or his poor treatment of a decent human. He has given the players an out. Had it started next year the way it finished this year they would've been completely exposed next year as frauds, Truck would've been a no brainer to go (possibly mid year depending on the start) and nobody would've been surprised or thought he'd not been given a fair run at it. The players would have no one to blame but themselves or Truck.

Also his idea of an external review at this stage consists of finding out why Geelong have played in 8 prelims. According to him no positions within the football department will be under review.
 
Jordanio said:
All for keeping Rutten till a transparent review ie done on all aspects of the club, including football department, has been completed.
How we commenced the year was diabolical, i include our VFL team also. I don't think we were properly prepared at so many levels. What was the reasons for this? We need stability over the recruiting period and time to perform the review properly otherwise we run the risk of repeating our errors.
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Agree but if the stability is only temporary until the external review comes in then it’s not really stability with the proverbial anvil about to drop on your head at any moment
 
Fwiw I just rewatched the post-match press conference and the “expecting too much from our players” “really proud of our players” stuff was directly linked with the later comments about “the players are leading the club”, specifically touched on Hurley’s press conference and all he ever wanted was stability, and also tied in with a question about the players’ response to the president when he addressed them on Friday (when they apparently tore shreds off him).

Or in other words, he is proud of Merrett, Hurley, (who have both had media appointments this week) and the players more broadly during the president addressing them on Friday, for “sticking up for what they believe in”, for being honest and showing care commit compete celebrate (4Cs).

His points about “we need more (support and leadership)” seems to be more pointedly that in this entire cluster**** of a week, no one from the club was prepared to face media questions and represent the club, except the players.

We need to be aligned and committed to each other and the club, and knuckle down, head down bum up, that is the recipe, there is no other way.

And that really is an indictment, I think. He tried to say it nicely but 💥
 
Jordanio said:
Disagree, we can match it with most of the top teams. Consistently is the sticking point
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really? Every team we face who has a few quality tall forwards completely own us. We have one of the worst defenses in the league and a pretty average forward line

I found truck's comments that we are expecting too much from the playing group odd last night. We only expect them to be competitive, nothing more
 
Lore said:
Fwiw I just rewatched the post-match press conference and the “expecting too much from our players” “really proud of our players” stuff was directly linked with the later comments about “the players are leading the club”, specifically touched on Hurley’s press conference and all he ever wanted was stability, and also tied in with a question about the players’ response to the president when he addressed them on Friday (when they apparently tore shreds off him).

Or in other words, he is proud of Merrett, Hurley, (who have both had media appointments this week) and the players more broadly during the president addressing them on Friday, for “sticking up for what they believe in”, for being honest and showing care commit compete celebrate (4Cs).

His points about “we need more (support and leadership)” seems to be more pointedly that in this entire cluster* of a week, no one from the club was prepared to face media questions and represent the club, except the players.

We need to be aligned and committed to each other and the club, and knuckle down, head down bum up, that is the recipe, there is no other way.

And that really is an indictment, I think. He tried to say it nicely but 💥
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Thats what i took out of it. He gave the club a whack for their incompetence at the top, which you cant argue with.
 
Lore said:
Fwiw I just rewatched the post-match press conference and the “expecting too much from our players” “really proud of our players” stuff was directly linked with the later comments about “the players are leading the club”, specifically touched on Hurley’s press conference and all he ever wanted was stability, and also tied in with a question about the players’ response to the president when he addressed them on Friday (when they apparently tore shreds off him).

Or in other words, he is proud of Merrett, Hurley, (who have both had media appointments this week) and the players more broadly during the president addressing them on Friday, for “sticking up for what they believe in”, for being honest and showing care commit compete celebrate (4Cs).

His points about “we need more (support and leadership)” seems to be more pointedly that in this entire cluster* of a week, no one from the club was prepared to face media questions and represent the club, except the players.

We need to be aligned and committed to each other and the club, and knuckle down, head down bum up, that is the recipe, there is no other way.

And that really is an indictment, I think. He tried to say it nicely but 💥
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Head down bum up and take whatever comes your way. The brace position? I'd at least like something to bite down on.
 

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I'm not saying I'm 100% certain that Truck is the right man for the job however, making that move now is just unnecessary. Let's stop expecting success every year and focus on a proper rebuild.

First, do the proper review. It should be multifaceted.
  1. A CEO type to look at how our board, business side, culture and influence of things like coteries all affect the club.
  2. A leading sports scientist and doctor to investigate the health and fitness and all aspects of managing players' physical and mental health.
  3. A football department manager to look at the connection between players, coaching staff, list management, fitness staff and the board.
  4. A recently retired player (Hodge or Riewoldt for example) to look at leadership in the playing group.
Bring it all together.

Don't sack anyone till after the draft.
Start with the recruiting, boss of footy, boss of the business, fitness staff type people. Tell coterie types to back off if necessary. Current fitness staff can sent players off with instructions on fitness for their eight-week break. However, if we make changes the new list manager can start in November and new fitness staff can start when preseason starts.

If there are demonstrable issues with Truck's coaching tell him that and set a few KPIs for him to meet at regular intervals. I'd suggest at the start of xmas break and then round 1 to judge his performance in the off-season. Then round 6, the first game after the byes are finished, and after our final game to judge him in season. If he fails to meet certain KPIs at any of those stages he'll be sacked then and there. If he exceeds them all we'll start negotiating a new contract along the way to be signed between the bye and the end of the season.

If we need to bolster the coaching panel then do that before the preseason starts. Someone to oversee the coach and comment on his connection with players would be good. Is he too close to pull them up? Is he too distant or harsh to garner a response from them, etc?

Spend money on a proper research project.
Spend a year trying to implement it.
Re assess at the end of next year.

The demographics of our list say that next year should be a continuation of the rebuild. So get everything right at the club. Two more off-seasons of list changes and players like Reid and Cox hitting the gym. Our aim should be sustained success from 2024.
 
Lore said:
Let him rebuild the list and bed in the principles, it takes more than a couple of years to do that anyway.

We clearly need to work through that game plan as well, not unlike other clubs that have to reinvent themselves multiple times to get where they need to be. Get the right player development in place, get the right support in place, put a broom through the top third of the organisation, and get on with it.

If we get to the end of next year or the year after and this game plan is bedded in, the list has been fleshed out and the KPPs have matured and we’re treading water mid-table with a stable club/list situation, then that’s where you ask if someone else might get more out of it and you look at the coach.
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As well as the whole Essendon coteries/factions we are also in a hard position because of the whole we’ve been shit so long the Pies etc as well as they’ve done never had to put up with our mentality rebuild plenty of other teams had some form of recent success we well keep expecting things to change because Essendon
 
fishardansin said:
I'm not saying I'm 100% certain that Truck is the right man for the job however, making that move now is just unnecessary. Let's stop expecting success every year and focus on a proper rebuild.

First, do the proper review. It should be multifaceted.
  1. A CEO type to look at how our board, business side, culture and influence of things like coteries all affect the club.
  2. A leading sports scientist and doctor to investigate the health and fitness and all aspects of managing players' physical and mental health.
  3. A football department manager to look at the connection between players, coaching staff, list management, fitness staff and the board.
  4. A recently retired player (Hodge or Riewoldt for example) to look at leadership in the playing group.
Bring it all together.

Don't sack anyone till after the draft.
Start with the recruiting, boss of footy, boss of the business, fitness staff type people. Tell coterie types to back off if necessary. Current fitness staff can sent players off with instructions on fitness for their eight-week break. However, if we make changes the new list manager can start in November and new fitness staff can start when preseason starts.

If there are demonstrable issues with Truck's coaching tell him that and set a few KPIs for him to meet at regular intervals. I'd suggest at the start of xmas break and then round 1 to judge his performance in the off-season. Then round 6, the first game after the byes are finished, and after our final game to judge him in season. If he fails to meet certain KPIs at any of those stages he'll be sacked then and there. If he exceeds them all we'll start negotiating a new contract along the way to be signed between the bye and the end of the season.

If we need to bolster the coaching panel then do that before the preseason starts. Someone to oversee the coach and comment on his connection with players would be good. Is he too close to pull them up? Is he too distant or harsh to garner a response from them, etc?

Spend money on a proper research project.
Spend a year trying to implement it.
Re assess at the end of next year.

The demographics of our list say that next year should be a continuation of the rebuild. So get everything right at the club. Two more off-seasons of list changes and players like Reid and Cox hitting the gym. Our aim should be sustained success from 2024.
Click to expand...
Bang on. fishardansin is my vote to take Brasher's place on the board.
 
fishardansin said:
I'm not saying I'm 100% certain that Truck is the right man for the job however, making that move now is just unnecessary. Let's stop expecting success every year and focus on a proper rebuild.

First, do the proper review. It should be multifaceted.
  1. A CEO type to look at how our board, business side, culture and influence of things like coteries all affect the club.
  2. A leading sports scientist and doctor to investigate the health and fitness and all aspects of managing players' physical and mental health.
  3. A football department manager to look at the connection between players, coaching staff, list management, fitness staff and the board.
  4. A recently retired player (Hodge or Riewoldt for example) to look at leadership in the playing group.
Bring it all together.

Don't sack anyone till after the draft.
Start with the recruiting, boss of footy, boss of the business, fitness staff type people. Tell coterie types to back off if necessary. Current fitness staff can sent players off with instructions on fitness for their eight-week break. However, if we make changes the new list manager can start in November and new fitness staff can start when preseason starts.

If there are demonstrable issues with Truck's coaching tell him that and set a few KPIs for him to meet at regular intervals. I'd suggest at the start of xmas break and then round 1 to judge his performance in the off-season. Then round 6, the first game after the byes are finished, and after our final game to judge him in season. If he fails to meet certain KPIs at any of those stages he'll be sacked then and there. If he exceeds them all we'll start negotiating a new contract along the way to be signed between the bye and the end of the season.

If we need to bolster the coaching panel then do that before the preseason starts. Someone to oversee the coach and comment on his connection with players would be good. Is he too close to pull them up? Is he too distant or harsh to garner a response from them, etc?

Spend money on a proper research project.
Spend a year trying to implement it.
Re assess at the end of next year.

The demographics of our list say that next year should be a continuation of the rebuild. So get everything right at the club. Two more off-seasons of list changes and players like Reid and Cox hitting the gym. Our aim should be sustained success from 2024.
Click to expand...
Great post.

Sacking a rookie coach 2 years into the role without previously providing strategically identified constructive feedback is ridiculous. When gaps are identified and support structures are put in place to address, if he still doesn't hit these KPIs then there's a valid reason to get rid of him and get someone else to do the job right.

What's seems to be happening is we haven't identified what the issues are, but we want to get rid of the guy running the show without knowing if he can fix them, while bringing in someone new without knowing what skillsets they need to have
 
Old man fletch said:
Great post.

Sacking a rookie coach 2 years into the role without previously providing strategically identified constructive feedback is ridiculous. When gaps are identified and support structures are put in place to address, if he still doesn't hit these KPIs then there's a valid reason to get rid of him and get someone else to do the job right.

What's seems to be happening is we haven't identified what the issues are, but we want to get rid of the guy running the show without knowing if he can fix them, while bringing in someone new without knowing what skillsets they need to have
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There's currently only 1 coach in the game who has been in their spot longer than 3 years and who hasn't won a final. 2 of the coaches who've lasted more than 5 don't have a premiership, and their sides have recently been top 4. That is the nature of the industry.
 
At least they're not dragging it out. It's just sad there's no trust in the process that should follow
 

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Coaching Staff Former Coach Ben "Truck" Rutten - Sacked for real this time - 21/8

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