Freo take heart

[sabre_ac]

Yeah Freo have a great history of drafting dont they???

A quick who am I:
After being picked up in the 1995 Pre-season draft as a "compensatory selection" that was traded away by Fremantle, the Bombers picked up what would be one of their all-time greats for a relative pittance in the draft. He was heralded as a future football star after his AFL debut in 1995, where he scored a goal with his first kick in league football. He has since gone on to be selected in the All Australian Team on five occasions (1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003), has won the Coleman Medal for kicking the most goals in the regular season three times, (2000, 2001 and 2003), and has twice kicked more than 100 goals in a season (109 in 2000 and 105 in 2001). - Who am I?

I'll put my money behind the Eagles thanks!

You can only laugh at the effort this poster went to in an effort to not only be smart but funny as well...Only to fall flat on their face.

Totally and utterly wrong

 

[Selgae]

Either way you could at least tell your players to pretend to look like they're trying.

Yes i would have to agree watching us against Geelong the other night reminded me very much of past Dockers teams... really got me down

 

[sabre_ac]

If I could be bothered during the premireship season a few eagle supporters got a bit excited over the average age of their team and the number of so called "stars" under the age of 25.

Truth is though that the vast majority of those players were not stars and never going to be stars.

After two midfielders left that side, it was exposed as overated team they alway were.

 

[garlic munchers]

I thought eagles fans main argument about palmer not being great was his disposal, ibbo hurts you when he gets the ball, ebert doesn't. kennedy will be a good to great player, I think, this whole thread is all about what people hope or think and yet it started by saying simply "why do the dockers get heaps when they are effectively playing youth and rebuilding and wce don't get the media bashing" strayed a bit havent we?

and as far as the thread goes, it's refreshing people are actually looking at the situation with a bit of reason.

Two years ago in the WAFL, Ibbo's great potential lay with his athletic ability and his disposal wasn't fantastic. He has improved as will Palmers and Ebert's.

Ibbo's stats are not great and I would hazard a guess that Ebert looks a much better prospect. Just as I would admit Palmer looks/is a better prospect than Ebert.

On the rebuilding issue, it is clear that the media's ongoing interest/perception is a result of your first match whereby your selection were based on being in Premiership mode.

Your selection policy has addressed this by accepting you have buckleys (Nathan) chance of winning the flag thus the perception is now unfair.

 

[Kenny_01]

Like i said, on that list i'd take Freos. Palmer, Ibbo and Warnock are better than the rest of em.


With respect, if there was a dutch auction of players, rival clubs would take either of Ebert, Masten, Kennedy or possibly McKinley over Ibbo.

Putting it is perspective:

Ibbos stats are born 15/3/88 averages 10.7 kicks, 7.3 h/balls and .5 goals a game over 10 games this year.

Ebert is two years younger born 02/4/90 and averages 9.77 kicks, 4.4 h/balls and .22 goals over 9 games this year.

Two years further advanced and Ibbo's stats are only marginally better than Ebert's!

Lol, no they wouldn't. Ibbo has shown he as excellent pace, footy skills, acceleration, lateral movement and marking ability. Ibbo would get picked 2nd to Masten from that list.

 

[Selgae]

Lol, no they wouldn't. Ibbo has shown he as excellent pace, footy skills, acceleration, lateral movement and marking ability. Ibbo would get picked 2nd to Masten from that list.

nah after kennedy and masten, toss up between him and ebert... maybe ebert is in front because there may be more perceived upside...

 

[Kenny_01]

The ones in bold are the premiership players. All 6 were important contributors in 2006, and the majority are important contributors now. Waters is injured, and Butler had been injured for 18 months and is just coming back. He's already starting to play good footy. Jones, Selwood and Lynch have been amongst our most consistent players. Only Hansen has been rubbish in '08 and is perennially injured.

Being a premiership player might not mean much to you, but these are some of the guys we brought on over 2003-2006. What exactly do Crowley, Schammer, Peake etc. have to hang their hats on? Of the list of Dockers debutants over the same period I posted, the majority of them struggle to get a regular game. Not a good sign at this stage of their careers.

The premiership players who are copping the most criticism from our fans are Fletcher, Stenglein, Braun, Hansen & Seaby - I don't see most of them in any young gun lists. These guys will be gone in the not too distant future, and the current crop of 21-25 year olds who have been around a few years need to step up, which I'm confident they will.

Talk up Ibbo, Warnock & Palmer all you want, but the cupboard is pretty bare after that. After your core of (ultimately underperformed) recycled players starts to break apart, the next bracket looks decidedly average.

Lol, first you've bolded Hansen as a young gun that played in a premiership, then you say later that he will be gone in the not too distant future?

 

[Kenny_01]

nah after kennedy and masten, toss up between him and ebert... maybe ebert is in front because there may be more perceived upside...

You must be smoking something. Start up a thread on the main board who they put pick - Ibbo or Kennedy or Ebert? Ibbo would win easily.

 

[Selgae]

Lol, first you've bolded Hansen as a young gun that played in a premiership, then you say later that he will be gone in the not too distant future?

3 year contract for Big Red not going anywhere

 

[Selgae]

You must be smoking something. Smart up a thread on the main board who they put pick - Ibbo or Kennedy or Ebert? Ibbo would win easily.

You do it...

 

[Kenny_01]

You do it...

Don't need to, I already know the result. One is nominated for a NAB rising star and has been consistantly one of our best players...... the other 3 have been not much chop in a worse side.

 

[Selgae]

Don't need to, I already know the result. One is nominated for a NAB rising star and has been consistantly one of our best players...... the other 3 have been not much chop in a worse side.

Well McKinley has been nominated but I've got him behind Ibbo... I have no doubt Kennedy is better or more valuable as they play different positions...

As for Ebert he is bottom age etc if comparing current form Ibbo is infront..

 

[garlic munchers]

Don't need to, I already know the result. One is nominated for a NAB rising star and has been consistantly one of our best players...... the other 3 have been not much chop in a worse side.

The comparison of Ibbo and Ebert was made in regards to rebuilding.

Ibbo is two years older and I feel fairly confident if you posted Ibbo stats and Eberts stats on the main board and asked posters to make a choice, most would choose Ebert.

If you disagree, please explain why there is so little difference between their statistical output with Ibbo having a greater average game time?

I accept, that Ebert has (just like Palmer) a disturbing turnover count. However, both Palmer and Ebert have two years on their side to improve.

 

[Kenny_01]

The comparison of Ibbo and Ebert was made in regards to rebuilding.

Ibbo is two years older and I feel fairly confident if you posted Ibbo stats and Eberts stats on the main board and asked posters to make a choice, most would choose Ebert.

If you disagree, please explain why there is so little difference between their statistical output with Ibbo having a greater average game time?

I accept, that Ebert has (just like Palmer) a disturbing turnover count. However, both Palmer and Ebert have two years on their side to improve.

It's not about statistics. It's about how much talent they display. Ibbo has pace, evasieness, foot skills, lateral movement, height and excellent marking ability. He would win any debate over Ebert easily.

On your thinking, Carazzo is better than Hodge

 

[garlic munchers]

It's not about statistics. It's about how much talent they display. Ibbo has pace, evasieness, foot skills, lateral movement, height and excellent marking ability. He would win any debate over Ebert easily.

On your thinking, Carazzo is better than Hodge

Or on your thinking, Staker over Sam Mitchell!

 

[garlic munchers]

Kenny, I agree to disagree.

I wouldn't mind Ibbo in our side. Just probably would struggle to fit him in our young talent laden side.

 

[Eagle87]

I know Freo have a few older heads but here's some info from last weekend that I found on another website (ref poster called Pope). Interesting fact re youngsters in the team.

Number of players under 21:
Eagles: 3 (Ebert, Houlihan, Schofield)
Dockers: 3 (Palmer, Ibbo, Mayne)

Number of players over 21, under 24:
Eagles: 5 (Butler, LeCras, McKinley, Priddis, Wilkes)
Dockers: 6 (Dunn, Johnson, Mundy, Murphy, Schammer, Warnock)

Worsefold trots out the 'Rebuilding' line and the media buy it. Freo get pasted all through the media for poor results and they're playing as many young guys. It's all about perspective or the journo's slant really.

This is also a direct copy of a post from the mighty Ripper from earlier this week. In response to this as per Ripp's trolling effort earlier in the week, I would comment as follows;

Since you like stats:

West Coast have 22 players 21 or under, Freo have 12.

West Coast have 5 players 27 or over, Freo have 13.

West Coast had injuries to the following players who would fit in your little lists above:

Kennedy, Masten, Mitch Brown, Waters, Hurn, Spangher, Rosa & Chad Jones.

Fremantles corresponding list consists of Brock O'Brien.

In addition, Ryan Davis was omitted for soreness, rotation reasons (he's 18) and Scott Selwood was concussed the week before. Jamie McNamara was generally considered unlucky to be dropped after about 20 touches v Essendon the week before (these 3 are all 20 or under).

West Coast were deplorable v Geelong. Absolutely abjectly shit.

Fremantle lost one of the worst games ever seen on TV. They were inept.

West Coast have delivered a premiership and given more than half their list is 21 or under can be seen as fully in rebuild mode. Players that through age will be unlikely on the list in 3 years are:
Braun, Fletcher, Stenglein & Wirrapanda
One would imagine that development of our 22 under 21 aged players will cover for their loss.

Fremantle have delivered nothing and only have just over 25% of their list at 21 or under.
They will likely need to replace the following players (through age) over the next 3 years:

Bell, McManus, Farmer, Carr, Johnson, Solomon, Black, Grover, Hayden & Tarrant.


As I said, both sides are shit and I guess we can only look to our futures....

 

[Bestbird]

Players born between 1986 and 1990 that have debuted makes an interesting comparison

West Coast

86 - Lecras, Waters, Rosa, Butler, Wilkes
87 - Kennedy, Hurn, Spangher,Mckinley
88 - McNamara, M Brown, Mackenzie
89 - Masten,Houlihan,Schofield, Davis
90 - Ebert, Selwood

18 players

Freo

86 -
87 - Drum, Warnock
88 - O'brien, Mayne, Ibbotson
89 - Palmer, Hinkley

7 Players

 

[Ripper]

Players born between 1986 and 1990 that have debuted makes an interesting comparison

West Coast

86 - Lecras, Waters, Rosa, Butler, Wilkes
87 - Kennedy, Hurn, Spangher,Mckinley
88 - McNamara, M Brown, Mackenzie
89 - Masten,Houlihan,Schofield, Davis
90 - Ebert, Selwood

18 players

Freo

86 -
87 - Drum, Warnock
88 - O'brien, Mayne, Ibbotson
89 - Palmer, Hinkley

7 Players

Spin spin spin. Add in the 85 list.


Quality over quantity
Pnly the bolded ones have shown much do far.

 

[Jafa]

Spin spin spin. Add in the 85 list.


Quality over quantity
Pnly the bolded ones have shown much do far.

Well - Warnock`s gone at years end.


Funny thread. It`s almost like two guys with 2 inch pricks comparing in a room where the rest are John Holmes like in stature. It matters not. Potential and Success are wildly divergent when it come to Fremantle. Why anyone thinks that the next stanza will be any different from the previous is beyond me.

 

[Quinz]

Spin spin spin. Add in the 85 list.


Quality over quantity
Pnly the bolded ones have shown much do far.

Hinkley has played two matches.

Every single one of our players bar Selwood has done more than him.

Hurn, Butler, Waters have done more than any of the Freo listed players.

 

[jom09]

Spin spin spin. Add in the 85 list.


Quality over quantity
Pnly the bolded ones have shown much do far.

Wow, your an idiot

 

[WestCat]

I'd put both teams in the same boat in that they both need a fairly quick rebuild to take advantage of what they currently have (unless they want to trade away good players for picks and do a full rebuild). West Coast have guys like Kerr, Cox, Embley, Hunter and Glass in addition to some good solid players like Jones, Stenglein and Hansen who are all 25 or over, while Freo have Pavlich, Sandilands, Hasleby, Hayden, McPharlin and Grover who are in the same boat. These groups of players could form a good core with a solid backup crew, but both teams need to be back on deck within probably 2 years to take full advantage of them.

Both teams have got some good young runners (Masten, Ebert and Selwood for the Eagles and Palmer, Ibbotson and Mayne for the Dockers), but need to get them to the next step quickly if they want to challenge for the flag. If both teams can't do this quickly then they're destined to be in limbo for a while and neither will win a flag for probably the next 10-12 years with the new teams coming in with priority draft picks and most likely a token flag or two (clubs tend to win flags approx 6-8 years after joining the comp, the amount of time it takes to get players into their prime).

So it should be midfielders, midfielders and more midfielders for both teams in this year's draft. Though Natanui, being a top aged pick, would probably be worth going for if available because he may be ready to go.

 

[Scotland]

Quality over quantity

Only the bolded ones have shown much do far.

86 - LeCras, Waters, Rosa, Butler, Wilkes
87 - Kennedy, Hurn, Spangher,Mckinley
88 - McNamara, M Brown, Mackenzie
89 - Masten,Houlihan,Schofield, Davis
90 - Ebert, Selwood

18 players

Freo

86 -
87 - Drum, Warnock
88 - O'brien, Mayne, Ibbotson
89 - Palmer, Hinkley

LOL. Good to see those chilly desert mornings haven't affected your sense of humour.

Not a fan of Waters, Butler & Hurn I take it.

Remind me again what Clayton Hinkley has shown that Will Schofield and Brad Ebert haven't.

 

[VoR]

The freo ******s on this thread remind me of the two Freo scum I had the misfortune to sit next near by on Friday night.

All thru the game it was constant asbuse of umpires/opposition players/weather/grounds/city...never once was a positive word be be heard.

Then when Freo actually lost, these ________s spent a good 10 minutes hanging over railing, screaming abuse at the bemused Saint supporters below. Of course they didn't remonostrate with any of the Saint supporters on the same level as them, oh no...big mouths and no guts.

Perhaps the most disgraceful display of poor sportsmanship I've seen in 15+ years of going to the footy.

Was interesting to compare that to the Dons v Blues game I went to on Sunday...3 times the crowd, yet all I heard was good humour.