News Gabba Upgrade & Olympics News

[Section 5]

For the least disruption Lions and cricket need a new stadium. Will that happen. Unlikely at present but we can hope.
On the assumption that no new stadium will be built at VP, Albion, Hamilton.

In my opinion the best thing (other than a new stadium) for fans, players and the club over the next 8 years.
Lions just stay at The Gabba, and the Government keep maintenance up to keep the stadium safe.
Sellouts become normal as long as we keep making the 8.
Club see big increases of season memberships and seat prices rise yearly.
Sponsors/Corporates get better value when club is successful and great attendances
Not a terrible scenario.

Athletics goes to Carrara with the stadium fully completed with a proper grandstand and roof finished.
Some disruption to the Suns but they gain a fully completed stadium for their future.
The Gabba host Olympic T20 cricket with games sold out months before the games start.
India and Pakistan supporters alone will make sure that happens.

Yes, it is kicking the can down the road and when someone wakes up, we eventually get a new stadium somewhere close to the CBD

 

[Andyz]

Have the names of or even some names been published re who is going to sit on and/or Chair the 100 day review?

I guess it depends on the answer they want! If they really do understand that Vic park gives us best value for money and the best end result but just worry about how it looks politically they may appoint someone genuine as a 2nd review recommending the same stadium plan would probably be enough to justify a backflip and really put Brisbane on the map for large events showing we deserve the test opener and support the local sporting community. I think most premiers like to leave a mark on their tenure and being the one who finally made a decent stadium happen could be it?

However if they really do not care about AFL / Cricket / Olympics and our sporting future they'll probably appoint Campbell Newman given he came out against Vic park...then surprise surprise he'll recommend a 'spruce up' of the tired old Gabba with a tokenistic increase in capacity to maybe 40,000 by cramming in one taller stand or something on the guise of cost of living pressures. Even though the Gabba would likely remain the worst capital city stadium in the country and offer us nothing for the future...still can't fit an ambulance on the ground....can't accommodate disabled kids....terrible facilities....fail to regain the cricket etc etc....

 

[Section 5]

Have the names of or even some names been published re who is going to sit on and/or Chair the 100 day review?

Unfortunately, Crisafulli has mentioned Mayors of local authorities.
They are not experts and of course they are politicians first.
I expect some reasonably qualified people are also included.
Hopefully Quirk included, as he could stop others requesting information already available under his review.
The more people involved the more split they may become over the best outcome.
At a minimum it will be Schrinner & Tate if they accept. Possibly someone from the Sunshine Coast and Toowoomba.

So, after 3 years we get an authority of mostly politicians recommending something other politicians are not prepared to make.

He may surprise and just appoint a chair and 3 experts

 

[Andyz]

For the least disruption Lions and cricket need a new stadium. Will that happen. Unlikely at present but we can hope.
On the assumption that no new stadium will be built at VP, Albion, Hamilton.

In my opinion the best thing (other than a new stadium) for fans, players and the club over the next 8 years.
Lions just stay at The Gabba, and the Government keep maintenance up to keep the stadium safe.
Sellouts become normal as long as we keep making the 8.
Club see big increases of season memberships and seat prices rise yearly.
Sponsors/Corporates get better value when club is successful and great attendances
Not a terrible scenario.

Athletics goes to Carrara with the stadium fully completed with a proper grandstand and roof finished.
Some disruption to the Suns but they gain a fully completed stadium for their future.
The Gabba host Olympic T20 cricket with games sold out months before the games start.
India and Pakistan supporters alone will make sure that happens.

Yes, it is kicking the can down the road and when someone wakes up, we eventually get a new stadium somewhere close to the CBD

It is a terrible scenario for Lions supporters and cricket fans though?

For most fans they will be priced out and unable to see the Lions play anymore with even more regular sell outs...family days out at the footy become a distant memory & kids follow soccer and other sports more and more.

That hurts the club long term too because kids are the ones who want all the merchandise - I used to get dragged into the Lion Shop every match after facepainting....but last year only got to one game with my older daughter because it was one of the few games that didn't sell out and ticket prices remained relatively reasonable (v Adelaide).

I think it would be a terrible scenario if we end up stuck with the current Gabba and no plan for anything else....especially as the population grows and grows and we end up missing out on more and more things.

 

[Section 5]

It is a terrible scenario for Lions supporters and cricket fans though?

For most fans they will be priced out and unable to see the Lions play anymore with even more regular sell outs...family days out at the footy become a distant memory & kids follow soccer and other sports more and more.

That hurts the club long term too because kids are the ones who want all the merchandise - I used to get dragged into the Lion Shop every match after facepainting....but last year only got to one game with my older daughter because it was one of the few games that didn't sell out and ticket prices remained relatively reasonable (v Adelaide).

I think it would be a terrible scenario if we end up stuck with the current Gabba and no plan for anything else....especially as the population grows and grows and we end up missing out on more and more things.

Agree it will be terrible if we can't get a ground for a new stadium other than The Gabba

No home ground for 5 years. So, what's available if The Gabba goes ahead. Nothing that will please anyone really

Prices will go up even more if we can't stay at The Gabba (36k) so as you say less families etc. attending.
Either squeeze 65k membership into Carrara capacity 23k for 5 years. At least it is an AFL standard ground.
Or squeeze 65k membership into RNA arena with plans for a capacity increase to 20k at a cost of $137 million.
What would that do to the supply and demand price situation.
Only one answer to that is they go up, unless the AFL comes in and subsidies the Lions for the loss of revenue.
The RNA oval to be a shorter, skinner ground, and not really suitable to play modern AFL games on anyhow.
Also, the RNA since that plan was announced had a big problem with one grandstand.
It has to be taken down brick by brick to restore it back to original condition.
So less than 20k if that can't be completed in time.

 

[mighty_lions]

Agree it will be terrible if we can't get a ground for a new stadium other than The Gabba

No home ground for 5 years. So, what's available if The Gabba goes ahead. Nothing that will please anyone really

Prices will go up even more if we can't stay at The Gabba (36k) so as you say less families etc. attending.
Either squeeze 65k membership into Carrara capacity 23k for 5 years. At least it is an AFL standard ground.
Or squeeze 65k membership into RNA arena with plans for a capacity increase to 20k at a cost of $137 million.
What would that do to the supply and demand price situation.
Only one answer to that is they go up, unless the AFL comes in and subsidies the Lions for the loss of revenue.
The RNA oval to be a shorter, skinner ground, and not really suitable to play modern AFL games on anyhow.
Also, the RNA since that plan was announced had a big problem with one grandstand.
It has to be taken down brick by brick to restore it back to original condition.
So less than 20k if that can't be completed in time.

I have no inside knowledge but surely RNA is off the table, this was meant to be our last year at the Gabba for a rebuild so there's no chance of having RNA developed in time which just leaves Carrara

Danny daly sounded rather hopeful/optimistic of Victoria park on sportsday

 

[Andyz]

Agree it will be terrible if we can't get a ground for a new stadium other than The Gabba

No home ground for 5 years. So, what's available if The Gabba goes ahead. Nothing that will please anyone really

Prices will go up even more if we can't stay at The Gabba (36k) so as you say less families etc. attending.
Either squeeze 65k membership into Carrara capacity 23k for 5 years. At least it is an AFL standard ground.
Or squeeze 65k membership into RNA arena with plans for a capacity increase to 20k at a cost of $137 million.
What would that do to the supply and demand price situation.
Only one answer to that is they go up, unless the AFL comes in and subsidies the Lions for the loss of revenue.
The RNA oval to be a shorter, skinner ground, and not really suitable to play modern AFL games on anyhow.
Also, the RNA since that plan was announced had a big problem with one grandstand.
It has to be taken down brick by brick to restore it back to original condition.
So less than 20k if that can't be completed in time.

Ahhhh its just a bloody mess now isn't it!!

Can't believe both Governments have stuffed up something so simple...wasted 3 years and still no plan at all and the longer this drags on there becomes an even greater risk of more disruption, more cost blowouts & probably a rushed half ar#%%$ed job.

I think I'd have been happy with Anastasia's plan if they just stuck to their guns and proceeded with it....at least they'd have wheels turning and while Vic park is indisputably better from every angle (and likely cheaper too) we'd have the process underway rather than 2 years later and no one knows what on earth is going on with an increasing likelyhood of Olympic failure.

If Crisafully can't muster up the courage to make a Vic park decision then you'd think the only options left are:
- Move the Lions to Carrara for 5 or so years & go all in on the Gabba
- Throw more money down the toilet trying to "spruce" up the Gabba with minimal interruption.

The first option is going to be quite disruptive to the Lions, members and supporters and would hit the club financially as attendances will suffer - the M1 is just shocking these days so unless they somehow can build a spur line / light rail off the Gold coast train line to the stadium (which honestly they should have done anyway by now) then I can't see people regularly attending. And while we at least receive a decent stadium at the Gabba it won't be tier 1 like you would expect for a $3 billion spend which begs the question is spending $3 billion on a non-expandable 55k stadium good use of taxpayer funds?

The 2nd option is we receive no rebuild per se and just a spruce up or maybe 1 stand replaced with a slighly higher stand to increase capacity by a token amount. Minimal disruption to Lions / supporters etc but its a real blow to Brisbane's sporting future with no decent oval stadium, Lions future remains in limbo & we still have no Olympic venue...and continue to miss large events & fail to regain the test opener. Gabba reportedly needs a entire new roof structure according to Quirk so there's another $1 bill odd to spend on top of whatever else they decide to do to it....ends up costing a similar amount to a new stadium anyway but still a small, undersized stadium and has a remaining lifespan of only 8 years. So when the Olympics arrives the Gabba is falling down at the end of its life so must be demolished anyway & our city looks like an utter failure. Both local Governments start fighting over who's fault it is that we have no oval stadium left & wasted billions on a pile of rubble, Olympics is a global embarrasment, Lions move permanently back to Victoria - or maybe Carrara if Tom does a good job at sourcing federal funding to expand the train line to the ground & build 2 new stands so it holds 50-60k. Brissie doesn't host sport anymore unless it can be played on a square surface.....

 

[Grasshopper17]

is spending $3 billion on a non-expandable 55k stadium good use of taxpayer funds?

No. It's an absolute waste of time and money and I've been saying this for a while.

The quoted 55k will end up just like the quoted 42k capacity of the Gabba. We never get 42k to the Gabba. Heck, we're lucky to get 32k most of the time when it's a "sell out". It will get eroded considerably by things like the Verandah and other activations around the ground, not to mention sightscreens when used for cricket.

So 55k will ACTUALLY end up being only 45k. For $3.4b, why bother?

Build it properly the first time, make it 70k, which will still be 60k once you've taken into account all the above malarkey, and THAT makes it worth doing. Sure, maybe we go a decade or two without selling it out regularly. But not selling out the Gabba regularly didn't stop its capacity being upgraded in the late 90s did it. Brisbane's population is growing rapidly and now is the time to account for that, not in 20 years when we look at our puny little 55,000 seat stadium, which as it turns out only seats 45,000, wherever it is, and wish we'd done it properly when we had the chance.

Let's not be afraid of how a 80% full stadium looks on TV or whatever. Or even 60%. The MCG rarely sells out when you look at all the events held there, and it's still magnificent.

In the meantime, you can also hold all your big concerts at this 70k stadium and allow people out onto the stadium surface, increasing the capacity at those events to 75k or even 80k.

And that is how you get your Taylor Swifts and Coldplay to come to Brisbane.

Build it and they will come. But build it PROPERLY, the FIRST time.

 

[SizeMatters]

The club, the AFL, supporters, cricket and even tourism side of things should start pumping publicly support for VP with all the positive reasoning for doing so.

Makes the lost economic sense. There is no reason not to follow this path outside losing a few trees. It’s close to all existing public transport options and with a bit of work would be able to fill and disperse extremely well. The Gabba is a joke as it is now and just doubling down on this space will come at a huge cost. It struggles to drain 30k people now can’t imagine what it will be like with 45k or whatever it is.

 

[Elixuh]

The club, the AFL, supporters, cricket and even tourism side of things should start pumping publicly support for VP with all the positive reasoning for doing so.

Makes the lost economic sense. There is no reason not to follow this path outside losing a few trees. It’s close to all existing public transport options and with a bit of work would be able to fill and disperse extremely well. The Gabba is a joke as it is now and just doubling down on this space will come at a huge cost. It struggles to drain 30k people now can’t imagine what it will be like with 45k or whatever it is.

The issue is that coming up with a simple narrative to explain this to the average voter is too difficult. All they will see is 'perfectly good stadium' in the Gabba gone. New stadium build up. ~$4b spent. And that type of spend isn't a vote getter, certainly not in this economic climate.

 

[McIvor]

The issue is that coming up with a simple narrative to explain this to the average voter is too difficult. All they will see is 'perfectly good stadium' in the Gabba gone. New stadium build up. ~$4b spent. And that type of spend isn't a vote getter, certainly not in this economic climate.

Yet the average voter in WA had no issue abandoning Subi Oval for Optus and it didn’t even have any notable event at all on the horizon; just did it for the good of the state.

The less said about the average Queensland voter the better.

 

[Elixuh]

Yet the average voter in WA had no issue abandoning Subi Oval for Optus and it didn’t even have any notable event at all on the horizon; just did it for the good of the state.

The less said about the average Queensland voter the better.

The lead in and narrative build for that new stadium began in 2003. The stadium opened in 2018. It was pitched at a cost of $700m to build.

Entirely different circumstances to what we are facing.

 

[Section 5]

The issue is that coming up with a simple narrative to explain this to the average voter is too difficult. All they will see is 'perfectly good stadium' in the Gabba gone. New stadium build up. ~$4b spent. And that type of spend isn't a vote getter, certainly not in this economic climate.

True if they can't come up with a three-to-six-word slogan they struggle big time.

Crisafulli was so intent on just winning the unlosable election he did not keep to his first narrative on the Olympics
For some time, he stuck to "let's wait for the 100-day review recommendations".
If only he did not vary, but inexperience and getting bombarded with questions, he caved and matched Miles.
No new stadiums, 50 cent public transport, matched Labors satellite hospital plan and no reduction in the public service.
Probably other stuff that i can't recall.
He was not going to lose votes due to a budget problem

 

[Pride of lions]

Yet the average voter in WA had no issue abandoning Subi Oval for Optus and it didn’t even have any notable event at all on the horizon; just did it for the good of the state.

The less said about the average Queensland voter the better.

Great point! If the Queensland government can’t put forward a good argument for a new 21st century stadium for the Olympics there will never be a better opportunity to do so. And Brisbane will just become a sporting and entertainment backwater. If they are so concerned about a voter backlash then they shouldn’t even be hosting the Olympics. The whole thing has become a fiasco. Melbourne had a similar carry on when people griped about the government building a new sporting precinct in unused parkland near the city. And that precinct which includes the tennis centre etc is now hugely popular and a massive attraction for tourists and locals. Governments are supposed to look at the long term benefits for a city and forget about their short term electoral prospects. And by the time the Olympics start I’m sure the public would be happy with the outcome instead of the pathetic small minded proposal that the previous government came up with. We can only hope anyway.

 

[Dalions]

I don’t really think we should be bagging the Government too much just yet until the review is set and terms of Reference are finalised.
Then we can go to town.
Especially if “No new Stadium” and NO to VIC Park is still part of the TOR.

 

[Andyz]

True if they can't come up with a three-to-six-word slogan they struggle big time.

Crisafulli was so intent on just winning the unlosable election he did not keep to his first narrative on the Olympics
For some time, he stuck to "let's wait for the 100-day review recommendations".
If only he did not vary, but inexperience and getting bombarded with questions, he caved and matched Miles.
No new stadiums, 50 cent public transport, matched Labors satellite hospital plan and no reduction in the public service.
Probably other stuff that i can't recall.
He was not going to lose votes due to a budget problem

Yes it's really unfortunate he caved....wasn't any need to state 'no new stadiums' given the election was already good as won. These days it seems like loud minorities really do win out....Miles' flip from Anastasia's plan really was an overreaction imo.

Whilst there are some that don't see the need to improve upon the Gabba, I think that opinion is relatively rare given our city has 2.5 odd million people & we can all see we're losing events & can not see our team play often anymore due to sell outs & such overpriced tickets.

There is no doubt cost of living is on everyone's minds though but that really is a separate issue driven primarily by such massive & rapid population growth of the country....which is the federal Govt's responsibility & should not mean we have to forego a good stadium that allows us to keep watching sport & attract local events / jobs.

If the price we have to pay for such massive ongoing population growth is that we lose our stadiums & other public infrastructure because we can't afford to replace dilapidated and antiquated facilities anymore, then it is a very sad day for our country & its future.....Obtaining the 2032 Olympics was such a fantastic & exciting time for us but gees it's turned around quickly now that we're discovering we'll basically receive nothing at all out of hosting them & won't be able to see anything with such old antiquated & low capacity venues.

At this rate there will be no one who even wants the games anymore & that is such a shame.

 

[SizeMatters]

The issue is that coming up with a simple narrative to explain this to the average voter is too difficult. All they will see is 'perfectly good stadium' in the Gabba gone. New stadium build up. ~$4b spent. And that type of spend isn't a vote getter, certainly not in this economic climate.

Now’s the time to strike with Olympic funding available. 4bn?

 

[Grasshopper17]

I don’t really think we should be bagging the Government too much just yet until the review is set and terms of Reference are finalised.
Then we can go to town.
Especially if “No new Stadium” and NO to VIC Park is still part of the TOR.

They said 100 days. Well it's already been 20 days since the election and this so-called 100 day period hasn't even started.

This government is absolutely fair game.

 

[Elixuh]

Now’s the time to strike with Olympic funding available. 4bn?

Which makes me wonder why Labor didn't run with that narrative - maybe too difficult to get across coming up to an election.

Vic Park was pitched at 3-3.4, you'd assume it + other stadium related spend would easily get up to ~$4b. If they do the Gabba then I reckon it'll easily be $4b given the major infrastructure that'll have to go in around it to accommodate a 55k build.

 

[Section 5]

What i would like to see happen is for three sports possibly four to get together pushing their wishes.
Fund a short campaign before the terms of reference are made and again after the New Year.
I know they have done their own thing separately. It's time for a joint effort but unlikely to happen

AFL with the Brisbane Lions, Queensland cricket, Swimming Australia and possibly Athletics Australia.
The first three are obvious.
Swimming Australia did their own short advertising thing against Brisbane Arena. They want a new permanent venue.
They would still have that add. They could just add to it with the other sports.
Athletics Australia are not going to get a QSAC legacy with Crisafulli now.
Maybe they will now want a decent venue during the Olympics.

There are enough high-profile people in those sports to each call repeat press conferences to get the message across.
Press conferences are free and if three or four sports could alternate the message that also helps.
For the adds Swimming Australia were able to get high profile people. Just add some well-known Qld AFL, cricket people.