Geelong - Too old, too slow?

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Spook said:
I honestly think it is more about leadership. Selwood is a selfish player who prefers to get a free kick and therefore a stop play and then a slow play. If he lifted his arms, took the take, got off a quick handball it would be an attacking fast play. Diverfiled spent son much time off his feet last night that he was out of the next contest. Picked up most of his possession across the middle of the ground, none in the back 50 pushing hard back to help the defense and only one in the forward 50 tucked up in the pocket. Oliver had 6 in the back 50, Petracca 5.
Selwood was abusing umpires while melbourne leadership were telling players to shut up and push back when they occasionally spoke back to the ump.
Selwood is probably the least respected, by the fans, great player in my lifetime.
Free kicks don't win finals.
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Great post. 100% spot on.
 
Red Bull said:
Melbourne obviously went all in and on last nights evidence will be mighty hard to beat in the GF with a nice window still in front of them …
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Yep that is true. But they really weren't trying to be down the bottom, what they did was realise they were already there and made sure they got good picks out of it. And it has been many years of wasted high draft picks before they got it right, plus there is a significant component of older players they have traded in.
 

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Kangaroos4eva said:
They had a good crack at trying to win a premiership with an older list over the past few years, despite not completing the final hurdle. No shame in that, but now is the time to bite the proverbial bullet and commit to a rebuild.
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Guess we will see what the plan is when we announce our departures from the list this year.
 
They probably don’t have much choice but to run back the older group next year but they can’t be a superannuation site for players looking for a surf coast see change.
 
Messenger said:
They probably don’t have much choice but to run back the older group next year but they can’t be a superannuation site for players looking for a surf coast see change.
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I think it is still a valid option and a comparative advantage for us that we should use. However if you say that we have done it too much I don't think many Cats fans would disagree. And the cumulative amount of spaces in the team that is taken up by those players is too high IMO.

Harry Taylor retires, Jack Henry gets a chance and does well.
Gary Ablett retires, Close gets a chance and does well.
 
michaelk said:
Great post. 100% spot on.
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They get so talked up by the Geelong media - Hutchy's advertising station SEN, Whately, Dwayno, Huddo, etc. It feeds this perception that they are a great team, full of exceptional players, all superstars, all elite. Its rubbish and continues to be fed by the media. They continue to perpetuate this myth.

The Scott brothers are great coaches. Another myth. They are good coaches. Better than some, slightly above average - not even close to great. But gee, can they spin the BS 'intellectual' answers at a press conference or interview. All lapped up by the Geelong media.
Dangerfield clangerking for years. The ducker Selwood. Shocking leaders.
May they continuing topping up for years to come.
 
The 747 said:
Guess we will see what the plan is when we announce our departures from the list this year.
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Absolute minimum Jenkins, Rohan, dahlhaus, Higgins and Henderson should go.

Selwood should go but will probably stay. I'm not sure what the point of blicavs is. If you can get anything for him trade but he's also the wrong side of 30.

Isaac smith looks good enough to go around again but the cliff is looming. Hawkins still going good but he's not far away becoming immobile.

Dangerfield is just crap. I think he got the most possessions last night but kicked it straight to Melbourne almost every time he got it. Turnover merchant.
 
Gee whiz 12 players 30+ …… quarter of its list! With the draft, equalisation rules etc it’s impossible for the Cats to quickly bring in quality to replace this big chunk of it’s list. Cats will struggle to make the 8 next year and will be bottom 4 in two years. Hey that’s what the AFL wants.
 
sobrave said:
Absolute minimum Jenkins, Rohan, dahlhaus, Higgins and Henderson should go.

Selwood should go but will probably stay. I'm not sure what the point of blicavs is. If you can get anything for him trade but he's also the wrong side of 30.

Isaac smith looks good enough to go around again but the cliff is looming. Hawkins still going good but he's not far away becoming immobile.

Dangerfield is just crap. I think he got the most possessions last night but kicked it straight to Melbourne almost every time he got it. Turnover merchant.
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No argument from me, but I suspect Rohan will stay. Blicavs is a very important part of the team although you need to be pretty familiar with how we play to see it, and understand most fans of other clubs are not that interested lol.
 
Gresh_Magic said:
Look. I’d rather bottom out & actually win it then make top 4 & be no where near it. Just me 🤷‍♂️

Chip chip chip will never win in finals but what do I know lol
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Second part I hope is now beyond dispute.

The first part is easy in hindsight. The problem with that is - who has the bottom out model categorically worked for? I guess you'd have to look at recent premiership teams and players they've drafted with first round 'lottery' picks (i.e. when they missed the finals). Still not too many #1 picks can say they won a flag with the club that drafted them.

Richmond and Hawthorn deserve a lot of credit for cashing in on their windows much better than we did over the past decade, but it's not like it's been all home grown players.

There's no magic formula and without the past 10 years of disappointment, I actually would have thought that getting 3-6 finals games into your core players in seasons where you've ultimately come up short would be the best model to help prepare for the pressure of September, but fat lot of good it's done for us.

As I've said, I dearly hope that Scott's cryptic comments mean a return to the 'no player appears in every H&A game' policy and that 4-5 of the players in their early 20s (along with any of this year's draftees) become fixtures in the side for better or worse. No more of the young player out/young player in revolving door at the selection table. It's time for over 30 players to be left out of the side if they're in our bottom eight.
 

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sobrave said:
Absolute minimum Jenkins, Rohan, dahlhaus, Higgins and Henderson should go.

Selwood should go but will probably stay. I'm not sure what the point of blicavs is. If you can get anything for him trade but he's also the wrong side of 30.

Isaac smith looks good enough to go around again but the cliff is looming. Hawkins still going good but he's not far away becoming immobile.

Dangerfield is just crap. I think he got the most possessions last night but kicked it straight to Melbourne almost every time he got it. Turnover merchant.
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IMO, the best thing about this is the longer they hold onto their geriatric tortoises who continue to under-perform in finals, the less they will get for them in a trade.

Saying that, I still expect an idiotic club like Freo may give them too much for Menegola and Clarke (another wasted 1st round pick irrespective of whether you believe - as some misguided Geelong fans do - that he's being played in the wrong position or not), but even accounting for more Freo or Gold Coastb trade pick stupidity (reckon they will hand over a low 1st rounder for Esava not much of a player), the longer Kolo.... , Atkins, Duncan, Guthrie (is it really 4 more years oh my), Rohan, Parfitt, Blicavs play like drop kicks in finals, the less value they have.

And with some luck, the list managers out there have finally woken up to the fact that there's no hidden gems in Geelong's list - I hope they have studied long and hard that none of Cockatoo (geez, was he overrated), Motlop, Darcy Lang, Vardy, even Lincoln McCarthy are that much chop. To the List Managers: Constable, Clarke, Holmes, et al are nothing special. Stay strong, only idiots like SOS think he can get gold from Geelong's kids.
 
Gresh_Magic said:
Look. I’d rather bottom out & actually win it then make top 4 & be no where near it. Just me

Chip chip chip will never win in finals but what do I know lol
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I don’t think it’s a one or the other choice.

Easier to win a flag when you are making top 4 than bottom 4.

Also no guarantee you rise instantly after being at the bottom, 3 years of bottom 4 finishes can just lead to another 3 years of bottom 4 finishes.
 
doppleganger said:
What absolute crap.
C.Scott arrived at the tail end of a successful era 07-11, when the Cats went 3 flags from 4 GFs..

Lions were up from 99-04, then rubbish for a decade and Geelong still outperforming them recently too, when the Lions finally moved out of the cellar.
Hawks were up from 11-16, kept punching for a bit but now out of contention and no guarantee of getting back any time soon.

It is where the Tigers are right now.

Cats have spent the next decade 12-21 still playing in PFs, sure they came up short to some Dusty brilliance on more than one occasion, but that is what happens only one team can be premiers.

Even the Pies are a good case, after 2009-12, we moved on plenty of premiership stars and hit the draft hard in 2012, 13 and 14 - taking 4 top10 picks and 3 in top 20 - from those 3 drafts. We spent 4-5 years being mediocre, and then rose for a few but still fell short and were actually trounced by the Cats in a SF, and now look shitful again.

What path do you want the Tigers to take in the next decade post their successful period - Lions, Hawks, Pies or Cats - none have won anything so by your definition all have failed, but their is being bottom 4 for a decade (Lions), being mediocre (Pies/Hawks) or playing in 6 PFs (Cats), where if get a bit of luck you could grab a flag.
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It's a interesting predicament and as we know everyone is correct in hindsight. It's like asking the question would you take a flag and 20 years of mediocrity or would you rather 20 years of thereabouts but always coming up short. I'm of the view there is more to football than just winning the flag. But as we know fans of teams who continually fall short can start to get just as agitated with failure to those of teams who never get close to winning anything.
 
Lach72 said:
19 players above 28….that ain’t good
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I just read elsewhere that only 1 of Geelongs top 10 players last night was younger than ANY of Melbourne’s top 16 players. Yikes.
 
doppleganger said:
Cats have given their fans almost 20 years of success, back to the 04 PF all based on smart drafting and trading. They never "hit the draft" and from memory I think pick 7 is the earliest pick they ever used.
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they may have only had a few early picks in that time, but they had a group of fairly impressive father-son picks that no other team had access to.
 

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Geelong - Too old, too slow?

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