Rumour GFC 2023 Player Trading, Drafting FA, Rumours and Wish lists Pt1

[cats_09]

As we are now getting into the season and we are starting to get a bit more serious with discussion, seems a suitable time to post the following as it's repeatedly shown itself to be a value reference tool in trade & draft discussion

And as per normal, thanks to Lore for putting this together - always a fantastic reference tool



And yes this post is now stickied - makes it easy to keep track of (can easily reverse this though if needed)

 

[CHAWKTS]

I believe hes coming. Im just not thrilled about it. But im realistic that theres no way hes staying at carlton and we are the logical landing spot for him.

I can understand your concerns…but I reckon in our environment he will blossom and in 2/3 years I can see him and Toby being a great 1-2 punch. With TDK being a forward option as well, he adds great flexibility.

to me it all comes down to whether he is happy to accept $600k to live on the coast vs $800k to go to Sydney.

If he wants to take our money, if we can swap Sav for a pick to use on TDK I reckon great trade

 

[Gee Class Loco]

TK was 5th in the Brownlow that year. Crows probably at the time needed to do it to hit the cap floor and I expect his subsequent contracts the be for less.

Still they paid top dollar... over the odds for me, but you gotta pay when u gotta pay.

 

[Hamingja]

It gets tough to carry multiple uncontested players on the down hill stretch of their career. I've been pro Tuohy when others have written him off for the past year or two just for his ball use. The problem we have now is that Smith and Duncan have both slid into the same territory. I think carrying Duncan for his ball use moving forward next year is enough and the other two finish up.

 

[tielgaz]

Esava update via Jon Ralph on Fox just now - Simon Lloyd confident he’ll stay, club and Sav’s manager in regular discussions, but Port considering offering him as much as $700k which we can’t/won’t match so things could go either way.

Why is Port able to offer 700k, surely they are up to pussies bow on their cap.

 

[Gee Class Loco]

I can understand your concerns…but I reckon in our environment he will blossom and in 2/3 years I can see him and Toby being a great 1-2 punch. With TDK being a forward option as well, he adds great flexibility.

to me it all comes down to whether he is happy to accept $600k to live on the coast vs $800k to go to Sydney.

If he wants to take our money, if we can swap Sav for a pick to use on TDK I reckon great trade

What?? Who's paying a 2nd string ruckman who plays in the magoos that much??
If we are paying him (TDK) $600k per we'll pay Esava $700k per as the latter has shown more this year than TDK has the last couple TBH.

 

[CHAWKTS]

I'm pretty sure no one in this whole world would give up 20% of their pay to employ their sibling especially in a profession that has a 5-7 year profitable span.
I think this is more of hope rather than reality.
If SDK would give up $150k pa or $600k over 4 years he is more a saint than i am lol.
But hey stranger things have happened. Kudos to all involved if that were to happen i say.


I think 2E has plenty of things stewing in the pot for next year, abroad is more likely.

I certainly wouldn’t!! But that reflect me…

The only slight difference here is that I think TDK’s best money will come from Sydney. And the difference in cost between living in sydney and torquey probably closes half of that gap in reality? I do take your point about the accumulation of the gap though - it adds up.

Remember also that it isn’t just Sam that TDK will be joining…he is fairly close to a number of the younger boys (through Sam)… And I also think he will be able to see a great role with the Cats…He and Toby can share the ruck with TDK role in forward line becoming more valuable over time…

I reckon it is going to be very tempting to TDK and will come down to what he values. I am hearing that the club is increasingly confident

 

[Gee Class Loco]

Why is Port able to offer 700k, surely they are up to pussies bow on their cap.

The report came from..?? This is Jon Ralph we are talking about yeah??
Let's just sit back and remember it's Jon Ralph.

 

[CHAWKTS]

What?? Who's paying a 2nd string ruckman who plays in the magoos that much??
If we are paying him (TDK) $600k per we'll pay Esava $700k per as the latter has shown more this year than TDK has the last couple TBH.

Again understand your point…. But I think they see much more upside in TDK and he suits our needs better than Sav. I agree we can’t have both but if Sav wants to leave (and I think he does given he knows his spot is not guaranteed) then swapping him for TDK makes sense.

I do share your concern that “what if TDK doesn’t develop”…if 2023 is what he is then he is not going to be a good trade. But I am hopeful that he is someone with a lot more upside…

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Honestly, I'd rather Tuohy go another year for the same reason - instead of Smith. Some are gonna have to retire, otherwise there'll be no list spots left.

We will have enough list spots cleared.
Ie ceglar is a certain retire, hawkins and a couple of others are possibles.
Sav will go, parfitt will probably go, simpson is every chance to be delisted. Menegola likely leaves FA, Kroeger probably goes (rookie at best) so theres 5 or 6 changes there easily when you consider we have minimal draft picks this year.

Guys like smith and tuohy are fantastic for culture so im fine with them going on so long as it doesnt stop knevitt and clark in particular getting games. So if smith is prepared to play vfl and help kids (like higgins did in his last year) then i have no problems with it. Id say the same about duncan and bews too (they are contracted anyway).

 

[Gee Class Loco]

I certainly wouldn’t!! But that reflect me…

The only slight difference here is that I think TDK’s best money will come from Sydney. And the difference in cost between living in sydney and torquey probably closes half of that gap in reality? I do take your point about the accumulation of the gap though - it adds up.

Remember also that it isn’t just Sam that TDK will be joining…he is fairly close to a number of the younger boys (through Sam)… And I also think he will be able to see a great role with the Cats…He and Toby can share the ruck with TDK role in forward line becoming more valuable over time…

I reckon it is going to be very tempting to TDK and will come down to what he values. I am hearing that the club is increasingly confident

LOL... Me too!!
I sorta see it. But i dont have him TDK very high on any upside from what he's already shown in the past 2-3 years.
I hear the same but at what cost? Picks are one thing $$dollars are another.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

I'm pretty sure no one in this whole world would give up 20% of their pay to employ their sibling especially in a profession that has a 5-7 year profitable span.
I think this is more of hope rather than reality.
If SDK would give up $150k pa or $600k over 4 years he is more a saint than i am lol.
But hey stranger things have happened. Kudos to all involved if that were to happen i say.


I think 2E has plenty of things stewing in the pot for next year, abroad is more likely.

Maybe not that much. But it would reduce the likelihood of asking for a trade which if our on field results take a hot night be an important factor. Regardless, we do need a ruck and it's either him or chase a journeyman.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Still they paid top dollar... over the odds for me, but you gotta pay when u gotta pay.

They had premiership dynasty in their eyes and didn't see the fork in the road

 

[Gee Class Loco]

Why is Port able to offer 700k, surely they are up to pussies bow on their cap.

I think this ai a price produced by Jon Ralph via or/and Sav's management group.

 

[Shadow89]

We will have enough list spots cleared.
Ie ceglar is a certain retire, hawkins and a couple of others are possibles.
Sav will go, parfitt will probably go, simpson is every chance to be delisted. Menegola likely leaves FA, Kroeger probably goes (rookie at best) so theres 5 or 6 changes there easily when you consider we have minimal draft picks this year.

Guys like smith and tuohy are fantastic for culture so im fine with them going on so long as it doesnt stop knevitt and clark in particular getting games. So if smith is prepared to play vfl and help kids (like higgins did in his last year) then i have no problems with it. Id say the same about duncan and bews too (they are contracted anyway).

Mmmm. Let's look at this a different way though, as I thought the same thing earlier on in the year...but not so sure now.

Parf probably goes
They want to retain Sav, and will fight tooth and nail to do so
Ceglar goes
Menegola's knee continues to improves in the back half of the year and he plays some good VFL, so they keep him
Kroeger definitely goes for mine
Hawk has already said he'd likely go around again
Tuohy stays
Smith stays

So at present, for mine, we have 3 close to definite changes, and the rest are murky at best. We have to draft 3, and we're looking to bring in 3. Hawk, Tuohy and Smith are 'part of the transition', Menegola and Sav are 'wanted players', and only Kroeger, Ceglar and Parf are expendable.

Bit unsure how this is gonna play out to be honest.

 

[Gee Class Loco]

So at present, for mine, we have 3 close to definite changes, and the rest are murky at best. We have to draft 3, and we're looking to bring in 3. Hawk, Tuohy and Smith are 'part of the transition', Menegola and Sav are 'wanted players', and only Kroeger, Ceglar and Parf are expendable.

Bit unsure how this is gonna play out to be honest.

Who has to be upgraded at years end from the rookie list?? Anyone?

 

[Turbocat]

Conways not ready to play afl straight off the bat next year and we need someone who is because stanley and ceglar are just about done. Tdk is a ruck placeholder for a year or two until conway is ready then he can move into the r2/fwd role (hawkins and rohan will be gone by then).

I know some have issues on ...its a bit too in house focused but we attract in system players for several reasons .. and if a player of an list geelong player fits our list needs can be added then im fine with it. I really do not see the problem with it as its not much different to drafting Zac Guth ..and several other examples. A look at our talls that can play ruck shows a deficiency in that 23-28 range... Stanley , Ceglar are basically done. Blitz is not far away either especially of he is expected to ruck. As it stands our future all rests on the back of Conway and Neale . Potential high but both have produced 2 afl games so far. We obviously need to add to our talls ... so Tdek is a type we need and yes or no is purely a cost choice.

Perhaps we could/should target Flynn as a FA. He at his age would be ideal. Although its probably more of a possible clash with Conway. I doubt both of them play in the same side but we have show before we want a FA for 2 years ... the back end of the contract is less important if he is pushed out by better younger etc. Its a bit of a worry that Briggs has pushed him out. Now he would be a handy add.

Do we look for a bargain in lower levels. A Fort type again? I feel the club likes players who have at least shown something at the level to judge them on.

At the start of year when the click bait trade articles thought was TDEK might elevate ... multiple r1 picks etc is different to possibly a fr2. at that price ...its a pick in the Stanley range at worst.. more likely a bit later. In fact ...I feel thats lightish. It would not surprise if we have to add to that somehow. Carlton will need future picks.

We might add him and he remains an oddity that can not find a way to fit in ... IF Neale and Conway both develop and play every game next year then he might even seem superfluous but I think there few perfect solutions.

WE just keep adding player that are close to their draft age than their retirement age , and we will evolve the side.. so that by 2025/2026 we will have a "new" group without doing a full wrecking ball to our competivness. Im not fussed if a few fall short as planty fall short when drafted too.

 

[CatsDoItBetter]

How the deal gets done while lacking picks and still looking at Tdek will be very interesting.

If this is true... it confirms our trade target profile has changed a bit since Stev Hocking came here. We are looking at much younger players who cost early picks.

It’s a bit of a change in direction but onto slightly. I think it’s as much about the fact the old boys are or have moved on. Selwood gone and Hawkins close to the end with all the other from that era gone, the strategy was based a lot on maximising the chances around those guys.
We’ve got a new group similar in Danger, Stewart and Cameron. But they’ve already won one and we have a good group of younger players coming through so it makes sense to try and boost that 20s demographic on the list.

 

[PzBlinky]

Mmmm. Let's look at this a different way though, as I thought the same thing earlier on in the year...but not so sure now.

Parf probably goes
They want to retain Sav, and will fight tooth and nail to do so
Ceglar goes
Menegola's knee continues to improves in the back half of the year and he plays some good VFL, so they keep him
Kroeger definitely goes for mine
Hawk has already said he'd likely go around again
Tuohy stays
Smith stays

So at present, for mine, we have 3 close to definite changes, and the rest are murky at best. We have to draft 3, and we're looking to bring in 3. Hawk, Tuohy and Smith are 'part of the transition', Menegola and Sav are 'wanted players', and only Kroeger, Ceglar and Parf are expendable.

Bit unsure how this is gonna play out to be honest.

Even more interesting is that none of those potential changes affects our current 22 - except to preserve the status quo.

And with Cuthrie to come back, the squeeze for starting spots is looking very tight next year.

I'd understand why Knevitt and Dempsey would feel hard done by if they couldn't each get at least a dozen games next year, so hopefully "Managed" becomes a regular theme in the 2024 season.

On top of that, I'd expect Mullin, Neale, Clark, and even Whyte to be getting more senior exposure - so there's 6-7 changes there BEFORE we bring in TDK or Ash.

Right there with you Shadow89 - no idea how this off-season is going to go, but I'm fascinated by how the club is going to handle this transition period.

 

[Nest of Cats]

For mine, Thouy, Smith, Ceglar all retire at seasons end.
Menegola will probably go as FA (if he can get a suitor). Sav might ask for trade - worth R2.

I'd keep all of Parfitt, Kroeger and Simpson.

So, at least 4 out, maybe 5.
Besides TDK, who else comes in? Anyone? Parish would be great. Doedee was mooted earlier in the season, but reckon he stays at Crows now.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

You what I'd like to see? Us having a crack at landing Choco as a development coach. Would be exactly what the younger group needs.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Mmmm. Let's look at this a different way though, as I thought the same thing earlier on in the year...but not so sure now.

Parf probably goes
They want to retain Sav, and will fight tooth and nail to do so
Ceglar goes
Menegola's knee continues to improves in the back half of the year and he plays some good VFL, so they keep him
Kroeger definitely goes for mine
Hawk has already said he'd likely go around again
Tuohy stays
Smith stays

So at present, for mine, we have 3 close to definite changes, and the rest are murky at best. We have to draft 3, and we're looking to bring in 3. Hawk, Tuohy and Smith are 'part of the transition', Menegola and Sav are 'wanted players', and only Kroeger, Ceglar and Parf are expendable.

Bit unsure how this is gonna play out to be honest.

I think before anyone puts a line through Parfitt we need to consider which clubs would have him.

He's contracted so I expect no one would bother trading for him

 

[Kobe Gryant]

Even more interesting is that none of those potential changes affects our current 22 - except to preserve the status quo.

And with Cuthrie to come back, the squeeze for starting spots is looking very tight next year.

I'd understand why Knevitt and Dempsey would feel hard done by if they couldn't each get at least a dozen games next year, so hopefully "Managed" becomes a regular theme in the 2024 season.

On top of that, I'd expect Mullin, Neale, Clark, and even Whyte to be getting more senior exposure - so there's 6-7 changes there BEFORE we bring in TDK or Ash.

Right there with you Shadow89 - no idea how this off-season is going to go, but I'm fascinated by how the club is going to handle this transition period.

I wouldn't go too quickly on that.

We all thought we'd have extraordinary depth this year (and we do) but we've rarely seen them all on the park this year.

You can never have enough good players. Injuries will strike, players will be down on form etc...they'll all get their shot.

 

[Gee Class Loco]

You what I'd like to see? Us having a crack at landing Choco as a development coach. Would be exactly what the younger group needs.

Mmmm not sure...
A bit of a polarising individual from what i've heard. Some may say divisive.
Maybe the reason he hasn't stuck anywhere for too long.
Not sure he is what Scott/Hock would need... or indeed want to bring into the club. ??

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Mmmm not sure...
A bit of a polarising individual from what i've heard. Some may say divisive.
Maybe the reason he hasn't stuck anywhere for too long.
Not sure he is what Scott/Hock would need... or indeed want to bring into the club. ??

I think we do need an older mentor for the kids though. Hinkley as a development coach for a year while he hunts around for another senior gig would be good also, but you'd want to make sure you're setting the right expectations RE the senior coach position

 

[Johanpetro]

I think before anyone puts a line through Parfitt we need to consider which clubs would have him.

He's contracted so I expect no one would bother trading for him

TBH I think Geelong ask where he wants to go and trade him in good faith for a 3rd or 4th rounder