List Mgmt. Hawk's List Management 2023

[Topiary]

By all reports he is an outstanding person, but this is just completely inaccurate. Spang was sounded out by Bevo out of the blue to come on board at the dogs to be to forward line coach, which since that point has been one of worst performing in the league relative to the talent they have.

We should be targeting young coaches coming from winning cultures with fresh ideas about how the game should be played. This feels like going back to the well one too many times.

You can have your opinion, but you were critical of Spang, who in my opinion remains a quality person and potential AFL coach. Your point about him being our new forward assistant has not yet been decided upon I understand.

 

[Colloquy]

Luke hodge pls

Agree has long term benefits also with his kids win win.

Not sure it’s Roughy as he wants to do recruitment doesn’t he unless we plan to boost that department.

 

[SSSSSS]

By all reports he is an outstanding person, but this is just completely inaccurate. Spang was sounded out by Bevo out of the blue to come on board at the dogs to be to forward line coach, which since that point has been one of worst performing in the league relative to the talent they have.

We should be targeting young coaches coming from winning cultures with fresh ideas about how the game should be played. This feels like going back to the well one too many times.

Naughton and JUH have had career best years under Spang.

They aren't scoring significantly less than previous years under his leadership all whilst their midfield ages and loses effectiveness (which most would say is their biggest strength in the last 5-6 years).

Scored 20 points less in 2022 and 60 points less in 2023 compared to 2021.

He's 36 years old. He isn't some jaded coach who's been in the game for decades. He'd be one of the youngest in our coaching set up almost the day he steps in.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

Hard to judge individual coaches from the dogs when their head coach is Bevo

 

[hawkinoz]

Bright & Happy

 

[bigmaxi]

Bright & Happy

Woohoo, I didn’t spot the Axeman……roll the tape again please

 

[HawthornHawk]

You can have your opinion, but you were critical of Spang, who in my opinion remains a quality person and potential AFL coach. Your point about him being our new forward assistant has not yet been decided upon I understand.

I made no mention of him being our forwards coach..

You claimed he has coaching experience at two AFL clubs which is false.

Out of curiosity what is it about Spangher that makes you think he'll be a good assistant for us? Why do you think he'll help drive us to our next flag?

 

[Colloquy]

With Fischer McAsey

3

Fischer Mcasey

Age

23

Ht

196cm

Wt

96kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.8

2star

K

3.3

1star

HB

3.5

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.3

3star

MG

102.3

2star

D

6.8

1star

K

3.3

1star

HB

3.5

2star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.3

2star

MG

102.3

2star

D

7.2

2star

K

3.6

2star

HB

3.6

3star

M

1.8

2star

T

1.6

4star

MG

114.8

2star

from Adelaide retiring at the 22 I wonder if we have a chat with him as DFA.

He is saying the reason was lack of passion and desire to play and perform at the top level is the reason why his retiring but I wonder if this is more to do with living in SA as his from Melbourne then playing the game I wonder if we still at least ask the question.

A Tall defender 197/91 kg defender who was pick 6 in the 2019 draft.

Would he be worth a pickup if he could recapture the love of the game.

Or would that be a big no who has seen him play.

 

[Topiary]

I made no mention of him being our forwards coach..

You claimed he has coaching experience at two AFL clubs which is false.

Out of curiosity what is it about Spangher that makes you think he'll be a good assistant for us? Why do you think he'll help drive us to our next flag?

I thought you did. Let’s not get hung up on this. No question you have an opinion on his coaching ability. You were quite keen that you would be “underwhelmed” on his potential appointment.
The last I heard it had not been even decided what role he would take, other than we were quite keen on him. That is, as an assistant.
With regard to the forwards role, the last I heard it was probable that Hickmott might take a line role. Sam has a very sound relationship with Hickmott. Respects his opinion.

Anyway, I shall back the judgement of our footy dept, which includes the senior coach. Let’s leave it at that.

 

[Brishawk]

With Fischer McAsey from Adelaide retiring at the 22 I wonder if we have a chat with him as DFA.

He is saying the reason was lack of passion and desire to play and perform at the top level is the reason why his retiring but I wonder if this is more to do with living in SA as his from Melbourne then playing the game I wonder if we still at least ask the question.

A Tall defender 197/91 kg defender who was pick 6 in the 2019 draft.

Would he be worth a pickup if he could recapture the love of the game.

Or would that be a big no who has seen him play.

Not athletic enough for afl and not good enough to overcome his lack of athleticism.

 

[MrPremiership]

With Fischer McAsey from Adelaide retiring at the 22 I wonder if we have a chat with him as DFA.

He is saying the reason was lack of passion and desire to play and perform at the top level is the reason why his retiring but I wonder if this is more to do with living in SA as his from Melbourne then playing the game I wonder if we still at least ask the question.

A Tall defender 197/91 kg defender who was pick 6 in the 2019 draft.

Would he be worth a pickup if he could recapture the love of the game.

Or would that be a big no who has seen him play.

No thanks.

 

[Colloquy]

Not athletic enough for afl and not good enough to overcome his lack of athleticism.

Thanks Brishawk

Just thought being young a tall high draft pick defender that would come for free May help our rebuild seeing we wouldn’t be using any picks on him fair enough thanks for the feedback on him.

As I said I’ve never seen him play.

 

[FB19]

Thanks Brishawk

Just thought being young a tall high draft pick defender that would come for free May help our rebuild seeing we wouldn’t be using any picks on him fair enough thanks for the feedback on him.

As I said I’ve never seen him play.

Don’t worry you are not the only one.

 

[eldorado]

With Fischer McAsey from Adelaide retiring at the 22 I wonder if we have a chat with him as DFA.

He is saying the reason was lack of passion and desire to play and perform at the top level is the reason why his retiring but I wonder if this is more to do with living in SA as his from Melbourne then playing the game I wonder if we still at least ask the question.

A Tall defender 197/91 kg defender who was pick 6 in the 2019 draft.

Would he be worth a pickup if he could recapture the love of the game.

Or would that be a big no who has seen him play.

I think he goes the same way as Jackson Callow

 

[Colloquy]

I think he goes the same way as Jackson Callow

Callow wasn’t pick 6, but I do get your point same kind of skills but as a backmen.

 

[KermitJagger]

I think he goes the same way as Jackson Callow

Amazingly, Callow was actually quicker than McAsey.

 

[KermitJagger]

Callow wasn’t pick 6, but I do get your point same kind of skills but as a backmen.

Something it seems you've struggled to grasp about draft picks is that at some point after being drafted, in plenty of cases almost immediately, their draft position becomes irrelevant.

 

[FB19]

Something it seems you've struggled to grasp about draft picks is that at some point after being drafted, in plenty of cases almost immediately, their draft position becomes irrelevant.

Sure but the first draft pick of the poor side is the one thing that differentiates them from the good sides. After that their draft hand is essentially the same. Getting that top end pick wrong can be why rebuilds from the bottom up largely don’t work and /or take forever. Look at the 2019 draft top 15 Mcasey the only bust although Dylan stephens might be too. How good would crows look with Caleb Serong Sam Flanders or dare I say it Will Day in their midfield?

 

[HedgeFund]

No thanks.

BuT hE BaRrAcKs 4 HaWtHoRn!

 

[Colloquy]

Something it seems you've struggled to grasp about draft picks is that at some point after being drafted, in plenty of cases almost immediately, their draft position becomes irrelevant.

I agree with you in some cases it doesn’t matter but alot of the time it does you will have your Thorp’s, Dowler’s etc but in most cases it as they say cream rises to the top.

Why do you think we traded up to get Weddle and not just taken a kid around the same pick range we had because we classed him as a first round pick even though once he was drafted he was no different to the other picks we got as they all start at ground zero as they say.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

I agree with you in some cases it doesn’t matter but alot of the time it does you will have your Thorp’s, Dowler’s etc but in most cases it as they say cream rises to the top.

Why do you think we traded up to get Weddle and not just taken a kid around the same pick range we had because we classed him as a first round pick even though once he was drafted he was no different to the other picks we got as they all start at ground zero as they say.

he means once they've become established in an AFL system. it doesn't matter if you're pick 1 or pick 100 because your performance is no longer dictated by potential.

 

[FuzwaldQO]

If Dear doesn't get picked in National Draft, would he need to be picked as Rookie with one of our rookie picks or is he automatically Rookie given the FS nomination. Don't think there is a points match in RD if another club tries to pick him before us.

I didn't see anyone answer this, so I'll jump in. Now he has been nominated by us, if no one bids for him in the National draft he will be automatically added to our senior list. To get to our Rookie list, he would have to have been rookie nominated. Which would have meant that he would automatically be added to our Rookie list. And would have been the preferable option seeing as he will be a while before playing I would think. But if anyone bid on him in the National draft, we would not have the ability to match. Seeing as it's likely that someone might bid on him, we had to nominate him in the National draft to ensure we got him.

What happens to the Gold Coasts picks as they seem to have more picks than list spots but did not trade them by the deadline. Has the AFL given them yet another gift?

While they do have more picks that spots available, not sure it's worth ranting about.

Picks: 24, 26, 27, 32, 36, 38, 66, 71, 74, 84 = 10
Players that have left their list - 9:
Jed Anderson (del)
Connor Blakely (ret)
Chris Burgess (trd)
Mabior Chol (trd)
Charlie Constable (ret)
Elijah Hollands (trd)
Brodie McLaughlin (del)
Jeremy Sharp (del)
Jake Stein (del)

Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't believe that they traded anyone in. So while they have 10 picks, only 8 are worth points. Nine once they start matching bids as 74 will start coming in. Not sure they will be that worried about losing 84, which they will.

I wonder what the report from the Collingwoo medical said

Probably said. Damn, dude. Looks like you had surgery on your Achilles. Nice tatts btw.

I'd like to see Dew back, but not sure he's "favourite son" territory

Dew was certainly my favourite son in the 3rd qtr of the 2008 GF.

 

[hawkinoz]

I didn't see anyone answer this, so I'll jump in. Now he has been nominated by us, if no one bids for him in the National draft he will be automatically added to our senior list. To get to our Rookie list, he would have to have been rookie nominated. Which would have meant that he would automatically be added to our Rookie list. And would have been the preferable option seeing as he will be a while before playing I would think. But if anyone bid on him in the National draft, we would not have the ability to match. Seeing as it's likely that someone might bid on him, we had to nominate him in the National draft to ensure we got him.

While they do have more picks that spots available, not sure it's worth ranting about.

Picks: 24, 26, 27, 32, 36, 38, 66, 71, 74, 84 = 10
Players that have left their list - 9:
Jed Anderson (del)
Connor Blakely (ret)
Chris Burgess (trd)
Mabior Chol (trd)
Charlie Constable (ret)
Elijah Hollands (trd)
Brodie McLaughlin (del)
Jeremy Sharp (del)
Jake Stein (del)

Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't believe that they traded anyone in. So while they have 10 picks, only 8 are worth points. Nine once they start matching bids as 74 will start coming in. Not sure they will be that worried about losing 84, which they will.

Probably said. Damn, dude. Looks like you had surgery on your Achilles. Nice tatts btw.

Dew was certainly my favourite son in the 3rd qtr of the 2008 GF.

I think Suns have only 6 senior list spots open. Some of the guys who left are rookie listed.

So taking only 24, 26, 27, 32, 36, 38 to draft.

I did some calculations and assuming they match 3 bids based on Cal Twomey's draft rankings, 2,9,13 they will be in deficit by around 500pts by pick 13. That would mean their F1 next yr is likely to downgraded by 4-5 picks.

Would be even worse if Will Graham gets a R1 bid, add another 700 pts deficit pushing deficit to 1200+. if their top pick is Pick 5, it will become pick 29. Luckily they have 2 F1's.

Most times clubs don't get big deficit for R1 picks and so the rules never get clarified. Last yr, Lions had a deficit of some 20pts by my calculations for their 1st pick(pick 30) this yr stayed as is.

I remember reading that deficit is calculated from same round and same pick spot. So in above scenario if their deficit is taken from picks after pick 13 in 2024, then they may get lucky..

On same note, I believe if Dear is bid on after R3, then any deficit we incur will be for F3 or later picks we hold. I can see few HFC fans assume the deficit will affect our f1 next yr which I don't think is the case. I have been looking for the news article that talked about this last year but no cookie till now.

PS : mods, if this is deemed off topic, pls move it to the draft/trade thread

 

[FuzwaldQO]

I think Suns have only 6 senior list spots open. Some of the guys who left are rookie listed.

So taking only 24, 26, 27, 32, 36, 38 to draft.

I did some calculations and assuming they match 3 bids based on Cal Twomey's draft rankings, 2,9,13 they will be in deficit by around 500pts by pick 13. That would mean their F1 next yr is likely to downgraded by 4-5 picks.

Would be even worse if Will Graham gets a R1 bid, add another 700 pts deficit pushing deficit to 1200+. if their top pick is Pick 5, it will become pick 29. Luckily they have 2 F1's.

Most times clubs don't get big deficit for R1 picks and so the rules never get clarified. Last yr, Lions had a deficit of some 20pts by my calculations for their 1st pick(pick 30) this yr stayed as is.

I remember reading that deficit is calculated from same round and same pick spot. So in above scenario if their deficit is taken from picks after pick 13 in 2024, then they may get lucky..

On same note, I believe if Dear is bid on after R3, then any deficit we incur will be for F3 or later picks we hold. I can see few HFC fans assume the deficit will affect our f1 next yr which I don't think is the case. I have been looking for the news article that talked about this last year but no cookie till now.

PS : mods, if this is deemed off topic, pls move it to the draft/trade thread

As far as I know it doesn't matter if the spots are senior or rookie. Just need enough open to cover the picks.

But even if that is incorrect, it's only a bit over 90 points they are leaving on the table. Nothing to write home about.

 

[Dewnior]

I think Suns have only 6 senior list spots open. Some of the guys who left are rookie listed.

So taking only 24, 26, 27, 32, 36, 38 to draft.

I did some calculations and assuming they match 3 bids based on Cal Twomey's draft rankings, 2,9,13 they will be in deficit by around 500pts by pick 13. That would mean their F1 next yr is likely to downgraded by 4-5 picks.

Would be even worse if Will Graham gets a R1 bid, add another 700 pts deficit pushing deficit to 1200+. if their top pick is Pick 5, it will become pick 29. Luckily they have 2 F1's.

Most times clubs don't get big deficit for R1 picks and so the rules never get clarified. Last yr, Lions had a deficit of some 20pts by my calculations for their 1st pick(pick 30) this yr stayed as is.

I remember reading that deficit is calculated from same round and same pick spot. So in above scenario if their deficit is taken from picks after pick 13 in 2024, then they may get lucky..

On same note, I believe if Dear is bid on after R3, then any deficit we incur will be for F3 or later picks we hold. I can see few HFC fans assume the deficit will affect our f1 next yr which I don't think is the case. I have been looking for the news article that talked about this last year but no cookie till now.

PS : mods, if this is deemed off topic, pls move it to the draft/trade thread

It will be interesting to see what happens if 2J slips outside top 40