Club Focus Hawthorn 2023

[Chris25]

Data from footywire. To check the draft order see the thread here.

Footywire says: "While we make every effort to keep up to date with player contracts, it is likely that our data may at times be out of date, incomplete or inaccurate. If you find any player contracts that need updating, please let us know using our brand new contract submission form."

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

think ward will be a star and amon was a killer signing, just have question marks over drafting watson. he strikes me as a higgins clone which isn't bad at all but they are crying out for good young talls.i know none at the pick they had and they picked 3 other talls later on but would be gold if they find gold in those picks imo.

At the end of the day, when you're holding a top 5 pick I think you just take best talent, regardless of need. Watson was that.

Hawks do need more talls, but do have big hopes for Ramsden as a forward.

 

[jackenny]

find it funny what people argue over.Day very much played the deep link up man ie back half player marker so you could argue he played back and mid an you'd still be correct. the games siciley missed mid year day looked great as the back half leader.be keen to see how they use him next year.

think ward will be a star and amon was a killer signing, just have question marks over drafting watson. he strikes me as a higgins clone which isn't bad at all but they are crying out for good young talls.i know none at the pick they had and they picked 3 other talls later on but would be gold if they find gold in those picks imo.

Big knock on Watson for me is his set shots for goal. He can do amazing, mercurial things, but he isn’t a dead-eyed dick in front of goal. But he’s still a potentially elite small forward and I rate his scope a lot higher than Higgins (weird comparison, but he reminds me of a mini-munch version of Wingard - just his mercurial game-breaking stuff, deceptively strong overhead / marking game despite being a small, and aggression with ball in hand / tackling).

 

[SSSSSS]

Day played 90% of the season as a centre square mid. He would spend time in defence for a few minutes each quarter to try and blunt opposition momentum if they had a run going on.

Later on in the season he would spend longer stints down back if Sicily was getting tagged to try and ensure we had a plus 1. He would still normally start at the centre bounce though before drifting back.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

So your argument is that because premiership ruckman have generally not been great at ruckwork, Reeves being very good at ruck work counts against him?

There’s a reason he’s so heavily regarded inside the 4 walls at the club, and by the mids. It’s not because there’s question marks over his future, it’s because they see his weapon which is his ability to give first use to our mids.

Reeves being one of the best tapwork ruckmen isn't being held against him. That's his one and only strength currently, aside from being a nice set shot at goal. He just doesn't offer anything else outside of that one thing. Obviously that's the issue.

He may buck the trend and be a long-term option in a successful side, despite his obvious weaknesses (being everything outside of tap-work and set shots), because he is so effective with his tap work. But history shows that limited ruckmen are extremely rare, and the game is only getting quicker.

I want to see some discernible improvements in other areas before. Like I said I don't think he's ever going to be a possession getter, he's too slow and lumbers around. But he simply has to improve his marking (forward, bail-out kicks and sitting in the hole) and competitive efforts.

FWIW I think he can improve in this area.

If all you're going to do is base your opinions on what Mitchell, our players or the club thinks/does then there's no point in having this forum. Rightly or wrongly, I'm basing mine on what I have seen.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Reeves being one of the best tapwork ruckmen isn't being held against him. That's his one and only strength currently, aside from being a nice set shot at goal. He just doesn't offer anything else outside of that one thing. Obviously that's the issue.

He may buck the trend and be a long-term option in a successful side, despite his obvious weaknesses (being everything outside of tap-work and set shots), because he is so effective with his tap work. But history shows that limited ruckmen are extremely rare, and the game is only getting quicker.

I want to see some discernible improvements in other areas before. Like I said I don't think he's ever going to be a possession getter, he's too slow and lumbers around. But he simply has to improve his marking (forward, bail-out kicks and sitting in the hole) and competitive efforts.

FWIW I think he can improve in this area.

If all you're going to do is base your opinions on what Mitchell, our players or the club thinks/does then there's no point in having this forum. Rightly or wrongly, I'm basing mine on what I have seen.

Yeah, we should ignore what those who develop, watch and coach the players on a daily basis think about where our players will get to and what they’re good at.

You got a like from Bradkli though, so that’s a win.

 

[Judd2Sewell]

Yeah, we should ignore what those who develop, watch and coach the players on a daily basis think about where our players will get to and what they’re good at.

You got a like from Bradkli though, so that’s a win.

I'm not ignoring anything. I just can't pretend to agree with things I don't see for myself. I'll be happy to be proven wrong, like I was with Nash, Impey (when we traded for him), etc.

Surely you've learned after your valiant staunch defence of the Clarko top-up regime, up until it was all over, that simply adopting what the club thinks/says/does as your own opinion doesn't always work.

 

[SSSSSS]

Noodle is still a baby in terms of ruck development. Just turned 25 when most rucks peak from 27-28 onwards and <50 games.

He has some very clear strengths and some deficiencies that he has started to work on. I thought his back half of the year he was actually doing quite well around the ground.

If he can improve from 1 mark a game to 2-3 over the next couple of seasons he will be a great ruck.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I'm not ignoring anything. I just can't pretend to agree with things I don't see for myself. I'll be happy to be proven wrong, like I was with Nash, Impey (when we traded for him), etc.

Surely you've learned after your valiant staunch defence of the Clarko top-up regime, up until it was all over, that simply adopting what the club thinks/says/does as your own opinion doesn't always work.

If any coach deserved to top up it was him, and I think any honest Hawk fan should stand by that. We all know it failed, but we also know it was impacted by things he couldn’t control(Rough’s cancer, Rioli retirement, etc). Post 2018, he seemed to have lost his touch and burnt out.

You think I just blindly back the club in regardless of anything, rather than actually reading what I almost always write which is to talk to those behind the scenes, rationalize what they’ve done, understand the reasons behind it or why they’ve made the decision they have.

It’s like when you convinced yourself that Stratton shouldn’t have placed highly in the PCM, yet you had no idea of what role he was asked to play, whether he executed it, whether he helped others execute their role, whether he got across and covered another opponent when the shape of the backline changed…did he go above and beyond the coaches instructions.. instead you just decided he wasn’t ever in your best 5 so the club was wrong to give him so many votes over the year.

Fact is Reeves is a highly regarded ruck inside and outside of the club, who gives great first use of the ball to put mids. It’s undeniable. To suggest that he’s not locked into Sam’s plans as the Number 1 ruck based on everything we can see, just looks silly to me.

 

[hawkman]

It doesn't feel like we perform better in the midfield when he is there in contrast to others at ruck. I would be curious to see a breakdown of clearances with/without him as the ruck in 2023.

Taps are a meaningless stat in my opinion.

Comparing him to Lewis seems fanciful, but perhaps I am wrong and he really is the key to our midfield success in 2023. The clearance breakdown would be telling.

The 2nd St Kilda game when Reeves was missing and Meek rucked was a complete disaster. St Kilda had 5 goals from the centre bounce by 1/4 time

 

[jackenny]

Reeves is a big part of Hawks improvement in the midfield, because he’s allowing a greater amount of first-use possession. This has helped Worpel’s game the most, because it’s highlighting his strengths (clearance work and bollocking) and minimising his weaknesses being showcased (chasing ass from opposition clearances). Reeves will be a big part of Hawk midfield’s upward trajectory, although I do agree his around the ground influence can use improvement, but hey, he’s 25 and only just entering his prime ruck years. Have to remember Max Gawn

11

Max Gawn

Age

32

Ht

209cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

6.7

4star

CL

2.8

4star

HO

35.3

5star

D

18.5

4star

K

11.5

4star

HB

7.0

4star

CL

3.5

4star

HO

29.2

5star

D

8.4

3star

K

3.6

2star

HB

4.8

4star

CL

1.0

3star

HO

15.6

5star

could barely get a consistent run at Melbourne until he was 25. Then it just clicked… expect Reeves to have a breakout year next season or the one following.

 

[FB19]

The 2nd St Kilda game when Reeves was missing and Meek rucked was a complete disaster. St Kilda had 5 goals from the centre bounce by 1/4 time

It’s true he got a lesson in qtr 1 but he probably won the contest for the rest of the game. I was impressed he recovered and was able to perform. Meek can’t compete with Reeves as a tap ruck so he needs to develop his around the ground and forward work to give himself a shot at being first ruck.

 

[Bradkli]

It’s true he got a lesson in qtr 1 but he probably won the contest for the rest of the game. I was impressed he recovered and was able to perform. Meek can’t compete with Reeves as a tap ruck so he needs to develop his around the ground and forward work to give himself a shot at being first ruck.

Unfortunately for Meek he will be stuck playing at box hill all of next season. He won’t play at AFL level unless Reeves gets injured. Reeves back half of last season as the sole ruck was excellent. As he improves his fitness level, he will only get better. He’s also still young in terms of a ruck.

The reeves-meek combo last season was a complete disaster and will never work.

The other issue for meek is, he can’t play as a forward as he’s far too slow and has no forward craft. For his size he is also not nearly as aggressive and hard at the contest as he should be.

He will be a quality back up for us next season which is why the club will look to give him an extension, especially with our lack of depth in the ruck position but I will be surprised if he’s not looking for a trade when he’s contract expires at the end of 2024. I can’t see him wanting to play in the VFL over the coming years.

 

[Red Bull]

How are the new guys settling in at Waverley?
Is there any news of any progress at all at Dingley?

 

[smish]

How are the new guys settling in at Waverley?
Is there any news of any progress at all at Dingley?

Yes! Here he is!

Boom!

 

[smish]

Yes! Here he is!

Boom!

He just can't get enough

 

[Red Bull]

So nothing doing at Dingley?

 

[smish]

So nothing doing at Dingley?

I'm not based in Melbourne so I'm not sure of the immediate status. I've attached a link to the thread on it so you don't have to keep asking elsewhere, feel free to pop in.

Seeing as we've won four flags at Waverley I don't think a couple more years there will hurt as as much as you're hoping it will.

News - We’re going to Dingleyland! Teams to move in mid 2025!

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Red Bull]

I'm not based in Melbourne so I'm not sure of the immediate status. I've attached a link to the thread on it so you don't have to keep asking elsewhere, feel free to pop in.

Seeing as we've won four flags at Waverley I don't think a couple more years there will hurt as as much as you're hoping it will.

News - We’re going to Dingleyland! Teams to move in mid 2025!

www.bigfooty.com

Thanks for the link.
Unfortunately nothing to report on Dingley but amused to read Kennett continuing to make an arse of himself
Hopefully the new year may bring news of progress at Dingley …

 

[smish]

Thanks for the link.
Unfortunately nothing to report on Dingley but amused to read Kennett continuing to make an arse of himself
Hopefully the new year may bring news of progress at Dingley …

Hopefully mate. These rebuilds are hard work.

 

[Red Bull]

Hopefully mate. These rebuilds are hard work.

That they are.
The “because hawthorn” crew are now witness to reality …

 

[Jeremias]

This is not the thread to troll, or to discuss the status of their Dingley base.

Take it elsewhere, thanks.

 

[Red Bull]

This is not the thread to troll, or to discuss the status of their Dingley base.

Take it elsewhere, thanks.

Hawthorn supporters by their own admission rightly believe Dingley to be a huge part of the club’s rebuild both on and off field.
Lack of progress at Dingley has a direct effect on the club’s summer program and progression into next season.
Would have thought this to be very much on topic … but anyway …

 

[BIGHAWK23]

Hawthorn supporters by their own admission rightly believe Dingley to be a huge part of the club’s rebuild both on and off field.
Lack of progress at Dingley has a direct effect on the club’s summer program and progression into next season.
Would have thought this to be very much on topic … but anyway …

If your conversation was in good faith

But its not

So its not on topic

Jog on

 

[Red Bull]

If your conversation was in good faith

But its not

So its not on topic

Jog on

You wouldn’t know, but enjoy your day anyway …

 

[BIGHAWK23]

You wouldn’t know, but enjoy your day anyway …

......