Hird to have his say

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I think one of Hird's biggest issues was coming into that position with nil coaching experience at AFL level. Or any senior level. I guess that's why protocols have been put in place for this now. Bomber was hired to assist him however he was annoyed at the program and maybe Hird didn't take his advice fully. Given Bomber got Robinson to EFC and in turn he got Dank perhaps Hird just accepted all was good. When things got out of hand it didn't look like Bomber was happy and maybe Hird and co needed to listen to him.
 
mxett said:
Hird was arguing he wanted Robinson fired. There is no indication he was in charge of Robinson. Hird did not write the protocol, it was something agree to by all stakeholders
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The protocols show conclusively that Hird was involved in the drug operations at Essendon. The protocols were sent to Hird, Reid, Dank. Hird was the boss.

Hird.
 

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pazza said:
Everyone needs to read the articles with an open mind and put themselves in Hird's shoes here. Not defending him, but, his points make a lot of sense.
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You ARE defending him. And his comments only make sense if taken in isolation. Unfortunately for Hird, we know many other details that make what he is saying absolute bullshit. The texts between Hird and dank, the meeting with dank and Robinson at Hirds house are completely at odds with the tripe he has written.
 
jenny61_99 said:
You ARE defending him. And his comments only make sense if taken in isolation. Unfortunately for Hird, we know many other details that make what he is saying absolute bullshit. The texts between Hird and dank, the meeting with dank and Robinson at Hirds house are completely at odds with the tripe he has written.
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Any conclusive evidence of such texts? Just one beyond reasonable doubt (because it wouldn't be past journalists or others to make shit up)
 
RegHickeyStand said:
Nope. Not what I have read. Mark Robinson reported at the end of 2012 that Dean Robinson was taken off from under Hird to be put under Bomber Thompson.
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And where do you think Slobbo has been getting all his information???

Slobbo has been led up the garden path on this from day 1.

Anything you have read from Slobbo is what Hird wants you to read.
 
pazza said:
The thing is this article today is only part 1.

There's at least a 2nd part of the article. To quote from the article itseelf, 2013 ownards is the last line.

There are some interesting points.

The management structure once and for all proves the lie about the "texts". It does surely show that if it was to work correctly Hird and the coaching staff were at arms length from Robinson and Dank, under Hamilton.

The continual insistence that everything was to be legal and complaint.

The fact that 12 other clubs had similar programs in place.
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That's been done to death, mate. It doesn't mean 12 clubs had a programme anything like Essendon's.

11 clubs had ONE similarity - they didn't have a single point of responsibility for supplements. NOT 11 clubs were injecting their players to the eyeballs with substances that 4 years on the players still "don't know" what they were.

SOME clubs reported medium to high supplement use. Perhaps their Musashi bill was $500 a week, when the doctor thought it should be more like $300. NOT that 11 other clubs spent over $120,000 on injected substances without even seeing a legitimate invoice.

SOME clubs had inadequate record keeping. Maybe they didn't feel the need to write down every time a player took a Berocca at home. NOT THAT 11 OTHER CLUBS WERE INJECTING THEIR PLAYERS TO THE EYEBALLS WITH SUBSTANCES THAT 4 YEARS ON THE PLAYERS STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WERE!
 
pazza said:
Any conclusive evidence of such texts? Just one beyond reasonable doubt (because it wouldn't be past journalists or others to make shit up)
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Are you serious? o_O

Has Hird ever once said those texts are fabricated? His propensity to sue, and his failure to do so in this case, would tell you the truth.
 
Sir Hugh Percy said:
That's been done to death, mate. It doesn't mean 12 clubs had a programme anything like Essendon's.

11 clubs had ONE similarity - they didn't have a single point of responsibility for supplements. NOT 11 clubs were injecting their players to the eyeballs with substances that 4 years on the players still "don't know" what they were.

SOME clubs reported medium to high supplement use. Perhaps their Musashi bill was $500 a week, when the doctor thought it should be more like $300. NOT that 11 other clubs spent over $120,000 on injected substances without even seeing a legitimate invoice.

SOME clubs had inadequate record keeping. Maybe they didn't feel the need to write down every time a player took a Berocca at home. NOT THAT 11 OTHER CLUBS WERE INJECTING THEIR PLAYERS TO THE EYEBALLS WITH SUBSTANCES THAT 4 YEARS ON THE PLAYERS STILL DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY WERE!
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But it requires a fair and full investigation.

Wouldn't you want to know what was actually happening at Melbourne?
 
t_ontour said:
Ummmmm because Hird and the club respected the process... get Dank, Robinson and Charters were not restricted by the club or AFL. Robinson also spoke out for cash. He has also received a massive payout from the AFL and ESS. So here is a bloke who is happy to make $$$ off the back of loss by all other parties in the sad affair. Quality individual we have there.... then again probably what you would expect from a bloke who was happy to inject players, support staff and his own family with suppliments! Oh and then of course lets not forget selling CJC to AFL footballers and instructing them on how to administer.
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He was dismissed and had his reputation trashed for doing what he was asked to do.

Why not take the $?

Then EFC paid him $1M anyway - smart guy!!
 
pazza said:
No what it means is that the AFL now has no other option left open to it but to find out the extent of every supplements program in 2012/13 and if there are anomalies, they need to be investigated. That's a fair and reasonable course of action to take..surely?
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They did, and nothing has happened because they found nothing. The ACC didn't go to any other AFL club either.

The 'everyone else was doing it' defense doesn't wash. I would agree things on a smaller scale has probably happened elsewhere, but no way was a poorly administered club run doping program run apart from Essendon.

Should clubs that have received salary cap punishments ask every club is re-re investigated just because they got done?
 

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Hird's comments and the fact that he is making them now are nothing short of pathetic. He doesn't know anything today that he didn't already know the day before the verdict.

'I did nothing wrong.'

'I did nothing wrong.'

'I did nothing wrong.'

'I did nothing wrong.'

....verdict is out and noone in Australia with a right mind is going to believe he did nothing wrong.

'I was duped'.

He just needs to stop talking but he is too arrogant to do that. All he is doing now is embarrassing himself.
 
pazza said:
Any conclusive evidence of such texts? Just one beyond reasonable doubt (because it wouldn't be past journalists or others to make shit up)
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Talking about making shit up, the sun herald pretending it was Hamilton and not Hird who was in charge of the drug program. Where is the conclusive evidence for that?
 
Blue1980 said:
They did, and nothing has happened because they found nothing. The ACC didn't go to any other AFL club either.

The 'everyone else was doing it' defense doesn't wash. I would agree things on a smaller scale has probably happened elsewhere, but no way was a poorly administered club run doping program run apart from Essendon.

Should clubs that have received salary cap punishments ask every club is re-re investigated just because they got done?
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I do.
 
pazza said:
No what it means is that the AFL now has no other option left open to it but to find out the extent of every supplements program in 2012/13 and if there are anomalies, they need to be investigated. That's a fair and reasonable course of action to take..surely?
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Hang on, you said it was a fact that 12 other clubs had similar programs to Essendon, but now you are saying the AFL needs to investigate these other clubs' programs to see if there are any anomalies? So is it a fact 12 other clubs were doping or not? Why are you saying 'if there are anomalies' when you already know it is fact?

You're all over the shop mate, stop making stuff up.
 
RegHickeyStand said:
Talking about making shit up, the sun herald pretending it was Hamilton and not Hird who was in charge of the drug program. Where is the conclusive evidence for that?
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The club management structure at the time, as highlighted by Bruce Francis' many posts (how he got access to it I'll never know) and the club's own internal reviews.
 
pazza said:
Any conclusive evidence of such texts? Just one beyond reasonable doubt (because it wouldn't be past journalists or others to make shit up)
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The texts are from a federal police investigation and form part of another federal agencies investigation and reports.

And Mr I'm going to the Federal Court for the players has not sued yet.

But yeah, they are fabricated - FFS :rolleyes:
 
RegHickeyStand said:
Robinson?

Oh yes. Here is a brief history of it. Definitely Robinson and Dank were directly under Hird. Hamilton's name is nowhere to be seen:

https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0ahUKEwjwkdvA26rKAhWoe6YKHZJsD10QFggvMAM&url=http://www.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL%20Tenant/AFL/Files/EssendonFC-notice-of-charges.pdf&usg=AFQjCNHVr4Sxtk3_OnH-R2syCKHrLmGI0w&sig2=KlhqEToI72OQpJw4ikTfSA
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Nope, Hird was probably involved to ensure Reid was included. Why the hell would a head coach run a sports science department?
 
blue harvest said:
Hang on, you said it was a fact that 12 other clubs had similar programs to Essendon, but now you are saying the AFL needs to investigate these other clubs' programs to see if there are any anomalies? So is it a fact 12 other clubs were doping or not? Why are you saying 'if there are anomalies' when you already know it is fact?

You're all over the shop mate, stop making stuff up.
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The survey said that 12 clubs DID have situations with supplements programs. The aFL chose not to investigate each club and each program. Let's be all open, honest and accountable here. Would you want your club to be fully investigated (not just by a survey) just to be assured everything was above board?
 
mxett said:
my understanding is the protocol was discussed in a meeting but then documented by Robinson
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You know all this doesn't really matter because the players have 2 years and no one who was anywhere near the club in an official role should still be there. That includes Hird. He will never repair his reputation - bombers fans need to accept that. At some point your club needs to move forward, and protecting Hird is doing the opposite.
 
pazza said:
But it requires a fair and full investigation.

Wouldn't you want to know what was actually happening at Melbourne?
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Who pays for this investigation, the AFL? Do you have any idea of the cost of auditing every club in the league for that time period and the amount of people required to do so in a timely manner?

Only Essendon supporters would take the default position that it must have been going on at all the other clubs (it's clearly implied). If there are allegations about another club or clubs let them be brought to light and then investigated but not by the AFL, who have been shown to be incompetent at best and corrupt at worst, ASADA can conduct the entire investigation under the strict guidance of WADA.

In the meantime lets be happy that justice has been done and we'll most likely never see such a flagrant disregard for peoples safety or reputation ever happen again. James Hird should not be let within a country mile of anything do with with football nor should he slime his way back into the media and try to profit from it, let fans try to remember the player he was and not the narcissistic ego maniac who's only goal is to absolve himself of all blame even if he contrdicts himself constantly.
 
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