If Carlton begin to dominate the comp, will anybody but Blues fans respect them ?

[The Snake]

Carlton - dominate??? They only thing they've dominated of late is wooden spoons. Recruiting a grossly over-rated midfielder isn't going to change a lot.

You still living in Hodge >>> Judd fantasy land?

 

[True Bluebagger]

Threads like these are a good example of how sooky-la-la modern football fans have become.

There is only one thing that people respect: success.

It doesn't matter how it is attained.

Carlton, Collingwood and Richmond used to buy their way to premierships, pinching good young footballers from rival clubs.
In the 1970's, North milked the short-lived "10 year rule" to buy their first two flags, while Hawthorn cleaned up with their country recruitment zones.

Later on these five clubs (plus Essendon) were the leading Victorian clubs at plundering the talent from WA and SA.

Geelong always had the natural advantage of their semi-rural environment in attracting country boys who found the pace of Melbourne too difficult. They also had a goldmine of talent to draw upon from the Western Districts.

The "socialism" of the AFL/VFL (draft and salary cap) undermined these advantages to the top clubs and helped poor clubs like Melbourne, Footscray and St Kilda to compete with the big boys. They have received numerous top 5 draft picks and priority picks.

St Kilda's under Malcolm Blight and Tim Watson were massive under-achievers from 2000-2002. They should've been in the hunt for a top 8 finish in those years. Instead, they finished 16th, 15th and 15th and received great assistance at the draft table, plus they were able to use Butters' cash and their position in the Pre-Season draft to leverage themselves advantageous trades (Hamill, Gehrig, Lawrence, Powell, Gram, etc)

West Coast were gift-wrapped their flags in 1992 and 1994 when the VFL admin handed them the WA state team.
Both Adelaide and Port Adelaide hid a number of players away from their rivals when they first entered the competition - their flags of 1997, 1998 and 2004 were full of players from their initial lists from their inaugural season.

Brisbane received their pick of Fitzroy's list in 1997, plus they given extra salary cap space.
Sydney was also given extra salary cap space - the spuriously named "cost of living" allowance - which they used to recruit a number of good recruits as well as hold onto their stars.

People have said that Geelong have proved you don't need top draft picks to succeed, but this gives a false picture. As many people have said, Geelong have hit paydirt with the father son rule. Imagine their list without Gary Ablett, Nathan Ablett, Matthew Scarlett, Tom Hawkins and Mark Blake. Then throw in all of their top 8 picks: Jim Bartel, Joel Selwood, Andrew Mackie, Joel Corey and Steven King from the Supplementary Draft of 1994. Geelong have profited from the rules and bottom 8 finishes more than most people think.

Good luck to them and every other premiership side. I don't bring this up because I'm jealous or because I'm trying to detract from their successes.

To achieve the ultimate success, clubs have to build their list in whatever way they can.

Whether they have the "respect" of a handful of peanuts or sooks on Big Footy is irrelevant.

A very good summary of the last 40 years of VFL/AFL football and it is good to see that at least someone here on BigFooty has a concept of history that predates more than 3-4years, unlike most of these dim witted, knowall 15-16 year old knob jockeys that haunt some of these threads.

I beg to differ on one point though. While it is true that some of Carlton later premierships had a strong cheque book influence, I think you will find that the Blues' flag successes of the late 60's and early 70's were similar to the Hawks in that they were based on their recruits from the strong Bendigo FL/ central Victorian zone, which churned out a number of ready made stars.

 

[Thrawn]

And why should you care?

Yes, that was the question.

Why should I care that a dozen people from an internet message board don't respect my club? I believe Chewy, TheBrownDog and ODNs summed it up nicely.

To say you don't is just a throw away line, a snub if you like but I think it would be abnormal not to care

The only thing I'm throwing away here is my care factor.

 

[who_let_the_dogs_out]

doesnt really matter. you could hand carlton the top picks from the last 10 seasons and they'd still find a way go down the shitter.

losing culture

 

[spoljar]

Perhaps Carlton need to string a few wins together first before we worry about them dominating the competition.

 

[Bluebear]

Perhaps Carlton need to string a few wins together first before we worry about them dominating the competition.

We couldn't agree more.

Think you'll find WE didn't start the thread.

 

[Paddy_Mac]

They'll have a pretty good team next year

B Andrew Carrazzo - Setanta O’Hailpin - Brett Thornton
HB Andrew Walker - Jarrad Waite - Heath Scotland
C Bryce Gibbs - Nick Stevens - Ryan Jackson
HF Ryan Houlihan - Lance Whitnall - Kade Simpson
F Eddie Betts - Brendan Fevola - Brad Fisher
FOLL Cain Ackland - Chris Judd - Marc Murphy
I/C Matthew Kruezer - Adam Bentick - Cameron Cloke - Josh Kennedy

 

[Abaddon]

doesnt really matter. you could hand carlton the top picks from the last 10 seasons and they'd still find a way go down the shitter.

losing culture

you do realise Carlton have won the most premierships of any club in the history of the Australian Football League...

 

[BIGBEZ]

you do realise Carlton have won the most premierships of any club in the history of the Australian Football League...

School holidays!

 

[4#Didak#4]

Never have never will - the reason - because they are Carlton!

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

doesnt really matter. you could hand carlton the top picks from the last 10 seasons and they'd still find a way go down the shitter.

losing culture

HEHEHE!! Great post.

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

Never have never will - the reason - because they are Carlton!

The typical uneducated, unwashed, fake football supporters response.

To not respect a club that is the most successful is quite ridiculous.

I respect Collingwood because they have been able to remain successful, even when zero of their supporters actually understand the game. I hate your club and the fukwits that support it, but still have an inate respect for it... otherwise beating Collingwood wouldn't mean anything.

You can't hate anything you don't respect.

 

[BIGBEZ]

The typical uneducated, unwashed, fake football supporters response.

To not respect a club that is the most successful is quite ridiculous.

I respect Collingwood because they have been able to remain successful, even when zero of their supporters actually understand the game. I hate your club and the fukwits that support it, but still have an inate respect for it... otherwise beating Collingwood wouldn't mean anything.

You can't hate anything you don't respect.

So you hate there club? But you respect there club? But you cant hate anything you dont respect? Im confused??

 

[The Fireman]

Yes, that was the question.

Why should I care that a dozen people from an internet message board don't respect my club? I believe Chewy, TheBrownDog and ODNs summed it up nicely.



The only thing I'm throwing away here is my care factor.

You are kidding yourself if you think it's only a few on here that has lost respect for your club. If it makes you feel better not to care then good for you, your club has lost all respect.

 

[Baroclinic instability]

You are kidding yourself if you think it's only a few on here that has lost respect for your club. If it makes you feel better not to care then good for you, your club has lost all respect.

Lost all respect....for doing what Fireman? Being smart enough to use the system the AFL put in place?

I thought we lost all respect when we cheated.....this year we play under the rules and lose respect? How does that work?

I've read numerous club message boards and there are a few from each club who in this debate have said they would have done exactly what Carlton did.....that is play by the rules and use the system to your advantage.

Some can't stomach the fact that we have increased our talent stocks without breaking any rules.

 

[twoforjoy]

nah. arrogance based on:

a) having a rich benefactor tipping in $$$ because they cant sort it out for themselves any other way
b) thinking judd prefers them just because they are carlton (not just because they have the picks to satisfy his old mob)
c) bottoming out for years being the only way they can figure it out to rebuild
d) salary cap rorting

Indicates a massive and misguided sense of entitlement. NO RESPECT EVER.

 

[Thrawn]

You are kidding yourself if you think it's only a few on here that has lost respect for your club.

I didn't imply that as the only number of people though. Oh gee, a group of opposition supporters don't respect us anymore... I'm sure going to lose sleep over it, especially if we manage to come good on the field again.

If it makes you feel better not to care then good for you, your club has lost all respect.

Footy is an incredibly fickle game, so is most of the supporter base and this board. If Carlton start getting their act together, I guarantee you'll see less and less of this "no respect" thing. People will start to comment on how well the team is doing and how to match up on them, rather than focusing on such trivial opinions. That is of course, assuming we rise on-field. Then again, there will always be a select few who will try to find anything negative and sink their teeth in - I'm sure you're well aware of that.

 

[AndyLesPaul]

NO RESPECT>
TANKING is not the way -.-

 

[Il Naso De Gastev]

So you hate there club? But you respect there club? But you cant hate anything you dont respect? Im confused??

It's really not that difficult is it??

I hate their club, but I respect their club... not any of their supporters though, I have no respect for them... they are insignificant, therefore I don't hate them. It's a pre-requisite to not be a football person to follow Collingwood.

 

[Baroclinic instability]

NO RESPECT>
TANKING is not the way -.-

I'm sure you and every opposition supporter would have loved it if we had've won an extra game

There were plenty of threads during the latter parts of the year barracking for Carlton to win. Since we didn't win the extra game you're finding another way to soften the blow

 

[The Fireman]

I didn't imply that as the only number of people though. Oh gee, a group of opposition supporters don't respect us anymore... I'm sure going to lose sleep over it, especially if we manage to come good on the field again.



Footy is an incredibly fickle game, so is most of the supporter base and this board. If Carlton start getting their act together, I guarantee you'll see less and less of this "no respect" thing. People will start to comment on how well the team is doing and how to match up on them, rather than focusing on such trivial opinions. That is of course, assuming we rise on-field. Then again, there will always be a select few who will try to find anything negative and sink their teeth in - I'm sure you're well aware of that.

People have long memories, Skunk fans still bring up the Greening incident.
I certainly won't forget Carlton fans wanting to see their side lose and I'm positive I won't be the only one.
The Cheating of course will never go away, so I suppose your only come back will always be " I don't care" but you are right, in amongst all of that there will be some footy talk, but the rest will be very hard to shake.
That's the way the cookie crumbles.

 

[Baroclinic instability]

nah. arrogance based on:

a) having a rich benefactor tipping in $$$ because they cant sort it out for themselves any other way

Any different from Ed going to the pies and then using channel 9 to promote the club?

b) thinking judd prefers them just because they are carlton (not just because they have the picks to satisfy his old mob)

Who would want to go to a club which is never quite good enough to win a flag?

At least when we're up there most of the time we're successful, unlike your club.

c) bottoming out for years being the only way they can figure it out to rebuild

Hang on.....I thought we were meant to be shit.....so suddenly we actually have a choice as to whether we want to win.

Typical bigfooty style......'carlton are a rabble' to 'carlton could have won'

Which one is it you imbeciles?

d) salary cap rorting

You're ignorant if you think we were the only club to cheat; besides, we received our penalties (which contributed to us being shit).....I'm sure your club was one in the early 90s that came forward....

Indicates a massive and misguided sense of entitlement. NO RESPECT EVER.

Maybe Collingwood weren't meant to be successful?

Just miss out on Stevens
Just miss out on Judd
Lose Swann
Almost win flags
Almost got in the GF this year (and would've won)

Never quite good enough......losing out to Carlton.........AGAIN

 

[AndyLucimitis]

People have long memories, Skunk fans still bring up the Greening incident.
I certainly won't forget Carlton fans wanting to see their side lose and I'm positive I won't be the only one.
The Cheating of course will never go away, so I suppose your only come back will always be " I don't care" but you are right, in amongst all of that there will be some footy talk, but the rest will be very hard to shake.
That's the way the cookie crumbles.

Morality lessons from a club who still owe players money from the '80s and used to flood their ground trying to win a game.

You're just boring now, Fireman.

 

[cfc4life]

lol hows our board screwed? Seems to have been a more painless changing of the guard than some <cough> clubs that have gone through with board challenges

westaway is just going to drill st kilda further into the ground

 

[westbrom]

Why would we give a stuff what opposition supporters think? It almost makes me feel ill to see the apathy towards us now, even some Collingwood and Essendon supporters over the last couple of years have shown apathy towards us.

I remember when I felt this way about Collingwood and laugh at the fact I gave an old boss a 10 goal head start in a Carlton v Collingwood game and still won my bet.

So yes it is true the other clubs may not respects, but we do not care.