Interstate teams and the MCG

[MarkT2]

Of course it's mostly mental. The game is is still 22 v 22, the ball is the same, but home ground advantage is a thing and the records in all major sports prove it. As a Port supporter I am all too aware of Malthouse being able to get a far less talented side up, home ground advantage is not insurmountable or unbeatable, no body is arguing that. But it does exist, almost all will acknowledge that...... just for some reason not by many Victorians in relation to a solitary game..... that's different, cause you know, it's tradition, it's Mabo, it's the vibe.

I haven't heard many people claim it to not exist. What most have said in that regard is that it isn't great for the GF for all the reasons around the metal aspect in the main. The results bear this out. There is actually far less Victorian bias in denials than there is non Victorian bias in the reverse claims and that is very evident in your post.

Whatever the pros and cons or of either arguments the results are an unbiased barometer.

 

[benneth]

With West Coast, Sydney and Adelaide all likely to be premiership contenders in September, it is important that they know how to win on the MCG, as it is for any team wanting to win a flag. However, looking at the recent records of the interstate teams at the MCG is grim reading overall.

Adelaide - 6 losses in a row
Brisbane - 2 wins in the last 10 games
Fremantle - 1 win in the last 12 games
Port Adelaide - 4 losses in a row
Sydney - 1 win in the last 15 games
West Coast - 1 win in the last 10 games

What are people's thoughts on this?

Never thought about it...

 

[greatwhiteshark]

Never thought about it...

Clearly shows there is no advantage lol
Just as there is no advantage when those sides play at home!!!

 

[benneth]

Clearly shows there is no advantage lol
Just as there is no advantage when those sides play at home!!!

Exactly. My man!

 

[Adelaide Hawk]

With West Coast, Sydney and Adelaide all likely to be premiership contenders in September, it is important that they know how to win on the MCG, as it is for any team wanting to win a flag. However, looking at the recent records of the interstate teams at the MCG is grim reading overall.

Adelaide - 6 losses in a row
Brisbane - 2 wins in the last 10 games
Fremantle - 1 win in the last 12 games
Port Adelaide - 4 losses in a row
Sydney - 1 win in the last 15 games
West Coast - 1 win in the last 10 games

What are people's thoughts on this?

5 of those 6 have won premierships on the MCG. That's what I think.

 

[dave123]

Just an aside to this

I noticed west coast new stadium has MCG dimensions (field size is similar)

Smart move ....Bieber this might give travelling teams a some comfort too

Overall though ...it's grass ...goals at each end ...if your good enough your good enough .....you only have to win the grand final on one day ....Brisbane did it, swans and crows have done it Eagles have done it

We've just seen a dominance by an MCG host in Hawks and previously Geelong while not a MCG home ground play it well ......analyse any sport in the world and you'll see home ground advantage is huge

Even in motor racing where there is no umpire and they can't hear the crowd ....home town drivers perform better

 

[Papa G]

If the Grand Final was played at the SCG would it be an advantage to the Swans? If the GF was played at Subiaco would it advantage West Coast? If the GF was played at AO would it be an advantage to the Crows? Thought so.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

If the Grand Final was played at the SCG would it be an advantage to the Swans? If the GF was played at Subiaco would it advantage West Coast? If the GF was played at AO would it be an advantage to the Crows? Thought so.

Of course not, magically the ground becomes a neutral ground on GF day. Have you not been reading this thread!!

 

[Gibbke]

If the Grand Final was played at the SCG would it be an advantage to the Swans? If the GF was played at Subiaco would it advantage West Coast? If the GF was played at AO would it be an advantage to the Crows? Thought so.

1991 - Hawks would have won regardless if WC still had the the two Melbourne trips beforehand. If today's rules applied, they would have played Melbourne at Subi and then Geelong in Melbourne, and if the GF had already been pre ordained a WA event, they would have spent the weekend before slogging it out against the Cats while the Hawks took a weekend off and prepared for an event they were fronting up for the eighth time in nine years...
1996 - North most likely...better team...
2007 - Geelong would have won regardless, and it still wouldn't have been pretty...
2013 - Freo the best placed of any interstate loser to have reversed the result, but they did get beaten on the day by a superior Hawk game plan
2014 & 2015 - Hawks would have won regardless if the opposition fronted up with the same lack of zeal as they did on both days. Maybe there's something in home field advantage if it means a greater desire not to look like complete duds in your own home city...

The other eight GF's between Vic and interstaters were won by interstaters who all outplayed their opponents on the day, in many cases not even being the best performed team that season. It's entirely feasible that North and St Kilda could have travelled and won no problem v Adelaide, Hawthorn v Sydney, and Essendon v Brisbane. The West Coast would most likely have still taken out the Cats, and Brisbane would have done Collingwood, each twice...

At the end of the day, the GF isn't the same as any ordinary match. If the two best teams are in it, which is normally the case, they transcend mere mortal travel disadvantages because they've most likely done that throughout the season. If they lose, it's due to other factors primarily, and since 1994 both have walked in with identical preparation. 25 years of results and 14 relevant GF's (and when other finals are taken into acount the difference is even more glaring) show this clearly. The biggest game gets played in the best stadium, so until another state can match the G, there's no argument here...

 

[Papa G]

1991 - Hawks would have won regardless if WC still had the the two Melbourne trips beforehand. If today's rules applied, they would have played Melbourne at Subi and then Geelong in Melbourne, and if the GF had already been pre ordained a WA event, they would have spent the weekend before slogging it out against the Cats while the Hawks took a weekend off and prepared for an event they were fronting up for the eighth time in nine years...
1996 - North most likely...better team...
2007 - Geelong would have won regardless, and it still wouldn't have been pretty...
2013 - Freo the best placed of any interstate loser to have reversed the result, but they did get beaten on the day by a superior Hawk game plan
2014 & 2015 - Hawks would have won regardless if the opposition fronted up with the same lack of zeal as they did on both days. Maybe there's something in home field advantage if it means a greater desire not to look like complete duds in your own home city...

The other eight GF's between Vic and interstaters were won by interstaters who all outplayed their opponents on the day, in many cases not even being the best performed team that season. It's entirely feasible that North and St Kilda could have travelled and won no problem v Adelaide, Hawthorn v Sydney, and Essendon v Brisbane. The West Coast would most likely have still taken out the Cats, and Brisbane would have done Collingwood, each twice...

At the end of the day, the GF isn't the same as any ordinary match. If the two best teams are in it, which is normally the case, they transcend mere mortal travel disadvantages because they've most likely done that throughout the season. If they lose, it's due to other factors primarily, and since 1994 both have walked in with identical preparation. 25 years of results and 14 relevant GF's (and when other finals are taken into acount the difference is even more glaring) show this clearly. The biggest game gets played in the best stadium, so until another state can match the G, there's no argument here...

Brilliant post. If missing the point was your aim.

 

[Gibbke]

Brilliant post. If missing the point was your aim.

The only point I've made repeatedly is that while you lot complain that an advantage is given to Vics by playing the GF at the MCG, via your own theoretical extrapolation based upon matches which aren't the GF played by teams who haven't made it, I'm giving you an exact answer to the original OP based upon actual results as achieved by the teams who played these games...

Hardly missing the point...more like slamming through the goal and hitting the head of the opposition's cheer squad square in the face...

 

[Papa G]

Just because that advantage has been over come doesn't mean the advantage doesn't exist.

 

[MarkT2]

If the Grand Final was played at the SCG would it be an advantage to the Swans? If the GF was played at Subiaco would it advantage West Coast? If the GF was played at AO would it be an advantage to the Crows? Thought so.

The best side would win.

Just because that advantage has been over come doesn't mean the advantage doesn't exist.

But it does mean it is over stated.

 

[Red Bear]

Brisbane 0-10 at the MCG since they last won there in 2014.

Gold Coast have even won at the MCG twice since 2014 and they've been crud the whole time.

All the other interstate sides have better records at the MCG than Brisbane and Gold Coast.

What is it about the MCG that makes Queensland based sides struggle to play there?

 

[Papa G]

Brisbane 0-10 at the MCG since they last won there in 2014.

Gold Coast have even won at the MCG twice since 2014 and they've been crud the whole time.

All the other interstate sides have better records at the MCG than Brisbane and Gold Coast.

What is it about the MCG that makes Queensland based sides struggle to play there?

The MCG Contract brings back memories of the Joh Bjelke-Petersen era.

 

[Ati Tude]

Brisbane 0-10 at the MCG since they last won there in 2014.

Gold Coast have even won at the MCG twice since 2014 and they've been crud the whole time.

All the other interstate sides have better records at the MCG than Brisbane and Gold Coast.

What is it about the MCG that makes Queensland based sides struggle to play there?

The weather perhaps. Yeah, must be the weather.

 

[Old Man Jenkins]

I've mentioned this in another thread, in that it goes without saying that Sydney's performance in the grand final was unlike anything we'd seen from them all year.

It's almost like having to travel interstate and sleep in hotel rooms for both the grand final parade and grand final itself prove to be significantly disruptive to the preparation schedule of a professional football side.

There's no correlation between grand finals as opposed to any other games, because all other games see interstate sides simply fly in and fly out before and after playing hence why it's less disruptive than the lead up to a grand final.

Sydney had a good record this year at the MCG and over the last decade in general with the exception of grand finals.

 

[LoungeLizard]

I've mentioned this in another thread, in that it goes without saying that Sydney's performance in the grand final was unlike anything we'd seen from them all year.

It's almost like having to travel interstate and sleep in hotel rooms for both the grand final parade and grand final itself prove to be significantly disruptive to the preparation schedule of a professional football side.

There's no correlation between grand finals as opposed to any other games, because all other games see interstate sides simply fly in and fly out before and after playing hence why it's less disruptive than the lead up to a grand final.

Sydney had a good record this year at the MCG and over the last decade in general with the exception of grand finals.

Was the GF parade in Geelong?

 

[Bartel84]

I've mentioned this in another thread, in that it goes without saying that Sydney's performance in the grand final was unlike anything we'd seen from them all year.

It's almost like having to travel interstate and sleep in hotel rooms for both the grand final parade and grand final itself prove to be significantly disruptive to the preparation schedule of a professional football side.

There's no correlation between grand finals as opposed to any other games, because all other games see interstate sides simply fly in and fly out before and after playing hence why it's less disruptive than the lead up to a grand final.

Sydney had a good record this year at the MCG and over the last decade in general with the exception of grand finals.

Generally Sydney travel pretty well so why would a parade and fanfare make them not turn up on the day? Why is that a disadvantage?

I’m all for the GF moving around to other states but there is always going to be a team that has to travel to the stadium (if not both). No system is perfect.

 

[RogersResults]

I've mentioned this in another thread, in that it goes without saying that Sydney's performance in the grand final was unlike anything we'd seen from them all year.

It's almost like having to travel interstate and sleep in hotel rooms for both the grand final parade and grand final itself prove to be significantly disruptive to the preparation schedule of a professional football side.

There's no correlation between grand finals as opposed to any other games, because all other games see interstate sides simply fly in and fly out before and after playing hence why it's less disruptive than the lead up to a grand final.

Sydney had a good record this year at the MCG and over the last decade in general with the exception of grand finals.

Win percentages at the MCG 2013-2022.
Richmond 68.22%
Geelong 61.29%
Hawthorn 60.0%
Sydney 56.67%
W. Bulldogs 55.0%
Collingwood 53.68%
Port Adelaide 47.37%
St Kilda 45.45%
West Coast 45.45%
Fremantle 44.44%
Melbourne 43.42%
Essendon 41.91%
Nth Melbourne 41.18%
Adelaide 37.50%
Gold Coast 33.33%
Carlton 32.28%
GWS Giants 25.0%
Brisbane 12.5%

 

[blue harvest]

I've mentioned this in another thread, in that it goes without saying that Sydney's performance in the grand final was unlike anything we'd seen from them all year.

It's almost like having to travel interstate and sleep in hotel rooms for both the grand final parade and grand final itself prove to be significantly disruptive to the preparation schedule of a professional football side.

There's no correlation between grand finals as opposed to any other games, because all other games see interstate sides simply fly in and fly out before and after playing hence why it's less disruptive than the lead up to a grand final.

Sydney had a good record this year at the MCG and over the last decade in general with the exception of grand finals.

The WA teams normally fly to Melbourne 2 days before games so playing a GF isn't really any change to their schedule other than attending the parade. My understanding is that the other teams normally fly the day before a game - meaning a GF is an extra night in Melbourne for them compared with other games.

I heard an interview somewhere that said a lot of Cats players also stayed in a hotel after the parade. A lot of them live down on the coast so would have to decide whether to do the 90min drive home after the parade then back up on GF day. It would have been disruptive to their prep too.

I wonder if the Sydney teams that performed well in 05/06/12 did anything different?

 

[Bartel84]

Win percentages at the MCG 2013-2022.
Richmond 68.22%
Geelong 61.29%
Hawthorn 60.0%
Sydney 56.67%
W. Bulldogs 55.0%
Collingwood 53.68%
Port Adelaide 47.37%
St Kilda 45.45%
West Coast 45.45%
Fremantle 44.44%
Melbourne 43.42%
Essendon 41.91%
Nth Melbourne 41.18%
Adelaide 37.50%
Gold Coast 33.33%
Carlton 32.28%
GWS Giants 25.0%
Brisbane 12.5%

This is quite shocking considering loads of nuffies swore up and down Geelong can’t/couldn’t play the G.

 

[BallaratBulldog]

Win percentages at the MCG 2013-2022.
Richmond 68.22%
Geelong 61.29%
Hawthorn 60.0%
Sydney 56.67%
W. Bulldogs 55.0%
Collingwood 53.68%
Port Adelaide 47.37%
St Kilda 45.45%
West Coast 45.45%
Fremantle 44.44%
Melbourne 43.42%
Essendon 41.91%
Nth Melbourne 41.18%
Adelaide 37.50%
Gold Coast 33.33%
Carlton 32.28%
GWS Giants 25.0%
Brisbane 12.5%

Wouldn't mind seeing how many games were played over that time for each team. I reckon some Interstate play there more than the Dogs. 55% is surprising but I guess we won a few finals there.

 

[the harry]

The WA teams normally fly to Melbourne 2 days before games so playing a GF isn't really any change to their schedule other than attending the parade. My understanding is that the other teams normally fly the day before a game - meaning a GF is an extra night in Melbourne for them compared with other games.

I heard an interview somewhere that said a lot of Cats players also stayed in a hotel after the parade. A lot of them live down on the coast so would have to decide whether to do the 90min drive home after the parade then back up on GF day. It would have been disruptive to their prep too.

I wonder if the Sydney teams that performed well in 05/06/12 did anything different?

2/3 of those were against West Coast

 

[Freomaniac]

The MCG Contract brings back memories of the Joh Bjelke-Petersen era.

good point