Investigation into Essendon Fitness Program

[The_Wookie]

I was talking safety for humans, not athletes.

I will try to find a quote. The doctor who created AOD said it passed the safety stage of TGA on the footy show a few months ago. This was also confirmed by Doc Larkins on sport preview.

Article in the Age dated April 12 says

"I was totally floored when he first told me he was using AOD on Essendon players," Kenley says. "I wasn't sure it was the right environment. At that stage, we had no firm animal data to indicate that it could work in a human in the ways that he wanted." (This year Calzada got some clinical results showing AOD's potential to help repair cartilage in animals.)

Ref: http://www.watoday.com.au/sport/game-changer-20130412-2hr82.html#ixzz2XEKsdaC0​

 

[mxett]

Article in the Age dated April 12 says

Ref: http://www.watoday.com.au/sport/game-changer-20130412-2hr82.html#ixzz2XEKsdaC0​

Not sure what this proves.

Note 2 sources state AOD isnt a PED in that article

 

[ChopChopDigDig]

This entire thread is being propped up by three or four EFC supporters arguing the same points that have been disproved time and time again.

Every AFL supporter has some sort of bias towards their own team, but after almost 500 pages of posts, there are very few non-Essendon supporters that agree that the EFC and their players have done nothing wrong and no WADA or ASADA penalties should apply.

To those EFC supporters in this thread, it's time to give up. Your captain came out and admitted to taking a banned substance. You should now focus your efforts on copping your dues as soon as possible and start to rebuild your reputation.

 

[The_Wookie]

Not sure what this proves.

Note 2 sources state AOD isnt a PED in that article

it means the guy whos trying to market it said it wasnt proven safe in ANIMAL trials - let alone human ones - before Essendon started taking it last year, because they didnt have the clinical data on that until this year.

 

[The_Wookie]

This entire thread is being propped up by three or four EFC supporters arguing the same points that have been disproved time and time again.

Every AFL supporter has some sort of bias towards their own team, but after almost 500 pages of posts, there are very few non-Essendon supporters that agree that the EFC and their players have done nothing wrong and no WADA or ASADA penalties should apply.

To those EFC supporters in this thread, it's time to give up. Your captain came out and admitted to taking a banned substance. You should now focus your efforts on copping your dues as soon as possible and start to rebuild your reputation.

would you give up? If this was a section about North moving to the Gold Coast would you stop defending your club? I cant fault Essendon supporters for coming in here and fighting the fight they do, as long as they keep the personal crap out of it, its part of being a supporter.

 

[mxett]

Got a link for this?

Also regarding the general safety pass given by the US




ref: http://sportsbusinessinsider.com.au/features/wadas-role-as-a-corporate-citizenship-journal/

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...e-the-phase-2b-trial-of-aod9604-56000797.html

I found this.

Note safety is the first stage of TGA testing. AOD progressed through safety, showing no ill affects, but failed at the efficacy stage.

 

[Rushed_Behind]

You're missing the point. It's banned. It's effect or lack thereof is irrelevant.

About time someone pointed this out.

I'm not a smart man and sometimes I get down on myself for it, so just to make myself feel better I come onto this board and read essendon supporters' posts. It's like Prozac for me

 

[ChopChopDigDig]

would you give up? If this was a section about North moving to the Gold Coast would you stop defending your club? I cant fault Essendon supporters for coming in here and fighting the fight they do, as long as they keep the personal crap out of it, its part of being a supporter.

If we were on the plane, new logo and theme song written I'd be renewing my membership and supporting my club.

This issue is as much as done as Fitzroy are no longer an AFL club. It's no longer helpful to drag this out any more than it already has.

 

[The_Wookie]

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...e-the-phase-2b-trial-of-aod9604-56000797.html

I found this.

Note safety is the first stage of TGA testing. AOD progressed through safety, showing no ill affects, but failed at the efficacy stage.

cheers

 

[mxett]

it means the guy whos trying to market it said it wasnt proven safe in ANIMAL trials - let alone human ones - before Essendon started taking it last year, because they didnt have the clinical data on that until this year.

No it doesn't, not even close. He says "we had no firm animal data to indicate that it could work in a human in the ways that he wanted"

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/sport/game-changer-20130412-2hr82.html#ixzz2XEP3p0Bz

In other words, it my be harmless but its probably a waste of time because it hasn't proven effective

 

[bacon buster]

You believe whatever you want, it doesn't bother me on iota. But I'm not trolling, I'm stating fact. I don't deny that Jobe Watson is a very good footballer, and has been for many years. But last year was his best year by far.




I agree it wasn't a 'quantum' leap as you say, but it was undoubtedly his best year in football. Coincidence? Time will tell.

so you were wrong then, that's fine too.

 

[mxett]

And now we know of at least one essendon player who has admitted to taking these 'yeps''

And you still think nothing will happen to your club or its players?

Interesting

The club believe they have evidence. Lets wait and see what it is

 

[LanceRomance]

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...e-the-phase-2b-trial-of-aod9604-56000797.html

I found this.

Note safety is the first stage of TGA testing. AOD progressed through safety, showing no ill affects, but failed at the efficacy stage.

but if it hasn't finished all stages then it can't be declared "approved for human use"

 

[The_Wookie]

No it doesn't, not even close. He says "we had no firm animal data to indicate that it could work in a human in the ways that he wanted"

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/sport/game-changer-20130412-2hr82.html#ixzz2XEP3p0Bz

In other words, it my be harmless but its probably a waste of time because it hasn't proven effective

the article literally says they had no firm data. so they had no idea what it would do. they couldnt say it was safe or unsafe for delivery in that matter. In fact the article says the guy thought exactly that.

 

[mxett]

the article literally says they had no firm data. so they had no idea what it would do. they couldnt say it was safe or unsafe for delivery in that matter. In fact the article says the guy thought exactly that.

No, they have safety data, as claimed in that very article. What they don't have is data supporting essendons claim it would be beneficial to athletes

 

[mxett]

but if it hasn't finished all stages then it can't be declared "approved for human use"

Therapeutic use. Its already used on humans and on sale in Australia.

 

[The_Wookie]

Pursuant to : http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/the-safety-catch-is-off-please-read.1006594/

Since it seems people have forgotten this - let me reiterate for you. Playing the man is bannable. Report offensive posts and they will be dealt with by our moderating team. Respond to offensive posts in kind and you will also find yourself on the outer.

This warning has been posted to ALL current ASADA threads on this sub forum because apparently its necessary.

 

[mxett]

Evidence for what?

I thought your club was embroiled in a simple corporate governance issue, an internal matter whereby a severe lack of documentation and supervision were the problems.

We shifted to rogue elements

Now you claim the club has evidence

Forgive me if I am not skeptical about your EVIDENCE. Whatever it is

Really? You haven't read the papers?

Robbo claimed it in the HUN this arvo. The club have evidence they could use AOD in 2012 within the rules. This has been alluded to for months.

 

[blackshadow]

I guess that's why Dank has been rather inconspicuous.

Will be very interesting what Dank has to say once the new ASADA coercive powers are passed in Parliament this week, especially about which Thymosin was injected into Essendon players along with what Hird and other coaches were shot up with.

I doubt he can afford to hold out for too long at $5K for each day he refuses to appear before ASADA.

 

[mxett]

Another letter is it?

Robbo was it?

Did the letter say you could use Thymosin?

Not sure. The watsons both seem pretty confident on advice theyve been given lately. I don't think that'd be the case if theyd used thymosin b4

 

[AFLQLD]

If Essendon had anything to get themselves out of this mess, to mitigate a PR disaster that still hasn't bottomed out, wouldn't they make sure the world knew about it?

Plain common logic tells us that if they had a critical piece of evidence that would make all of this go away, letters, emails, whatever... It would have been out in the public realm so fast. If some proof exists that clears this disaster away, if there is anything at all that could absolve the club and players...

The most they can offer is the club saying that they are sure they are in the clear. Meanwhile the PR disaster rolls on. Either the club employed the worst public relations firm in Australia to advise on how to manage PR and are sitting on the solution to all their problems...or they are managing a disaster of epic proportions as well as they are able.

 

[LanceRomance]

Therapeutic use. Its already used on humans and on sale in Australia.

but that is a loop hole for non-wada people to follow.

WADA doesn't allow drugs that aren't approved for human use - in a clinical sense.

 

[Bazzar]

Gerard Whateley had a great analogy tonight on AFL360.

If Bradley Wiggins had just announced he had taken a banned substance last year, the year he won the Tour De France, what would be the outcome.

Was the victory tainted?
Would he be stripped of the title?
How would the public view his win?
Should/would he be allowed to participate in this years events?

An interesting way to look at Jobes situation.

 

[doppleganger]

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...e-the-phase-2b-trial-of-aod9604-56000797.html

I found this.

Note safety is the first stage of TGA testing. AOD progressed through safety, showing no ill affects, but failed at the efficacy stage.

It was an ORAL trial, it and your site lists AOD as a peptide.


-- AOD9604 is an orally active, 16-amino acid, peptide drug, based on a
fragment of human Growth Hormone (hGH).

Essendon weren't administering the drug orally, they were injecting it. Jobe's words "The experience of having that many injections was something I had not experienced in AFL football".
Many advantages to injecting than consuming orally....

It seems you are in favour of your club undertaking a 'pharmacological experiment' on its players, including your captain undertaking a regime of 'shooting up' to try and gain an advantage against the rest of the league....because you think you have a loophole.
Whatever it takes indeed.

 

[Public Enemy No1]

Gerard Whateley had a great analogy tonight on AFL360.

If Bradley Wiggins had just announced he had taken a banned substance last year, the year he won the Tour De France, what would be the outcome.

Was the victory tainted?
Would he be stripped of the title?
How would the public view his win?
Should/would he be allowed to participate in this years events?

An interesting way to look at Jobes situation.

Exactly
Staggering how quiet the AFL has been on this issue since Jobes admission and in general since the start.
Are people still confused about the AFL's 'real' agenda.

"clear Essendon at all costs regardless of the level of their cheating"