Analysis Is Leppa the Right Man for the Job?

2 Years in, Is Leppa the Right Man for the Job?

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jason pm said:
i don't think i have read on our board anyone calling for leppa to be sacked immediately and i am waning in my support but why not give him till the end of the season or close to it and make the call then you never know it may turn around.
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I agree with your general points but my recollection and a cursory search...

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...s-vs-collingwood.1132581/page-9#post-44488995
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-vs-collingwood.1132581/page-10#post-44489119
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-brisbane-lions.1132011/page-26#post-44383517
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-brisbane-lions.1128712/page-11#post-43822268
 
dlanod said:
I agree with your general points but my recollection and a cursory search...

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...s-vs-collingwood.1132581/page-9#post-44488995
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-vs-collingwood.1132581/page-10#post-44489119
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-brisbane-lions.1132011/page-26#post-44383517
https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/thre...-brisbane-lions.1128712/page-11#post-43822268
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interesting reading. early onset alzheimers. i didn't see the collingwood couple as they were during the game, was at the gabba and never read right over the game day thread when i get home. probably saw the geelong/port ones.

but yer when we are actually dishing up a rubbish effort in real time on BF that is when the vents will be pretty cutting.
 
dlanod said:
Obviously excluding those drafted under his watch:

Rockliff, 2014.
Hanley, 2014.
Zorko, 2014-2016.
Martin, 2015.
Bewick, 2016.
Lester, 2016.
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To this point, sustained improvement?. Its a bit of a stretch to say 'improved in a year (3 years ago)... but regressed there after' that doesent count - imo. Rocky and Hanley have gone backwards overall, pretty dramtically.. zorko ill give but not an A grader and is incredibly unpolished, martin has regressed again and bewick and lester would struggle to get a game in most teams though they have improved, they were at a pretty low base. would you like me to list those who have regressed or havent come on? Id be just about the entire list bar a couple.
 

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jason pm said:
didn't do any research into their records leading up to these articles just had a memory of them being under pretty intense pressure to hold their jobs so did a quick search on the google machine and those two popped up.

i don't think i have read on our board anyone calling for leppa to be sacked immediately and i am waning in my support but why not give him till the end of the season or close to it and make the call then you never know it may turn around.

if he was sacked now who would do the job? murray davis?
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I am happy for him to coach out the year, with 7 wins from here and general week on week improvement being a bare indicator and even then i'd want a review. The 4th year of his contract should be theoretically 'torn up' at this stage. I don't need the call to be made now, but everything is on the table from this point onward after saturday night imo
 
Winning becomes a mentality and to extent as does losing. The players have signed their inflated contract extensions, the season is already effectively over as once again finals are out of the question, so now it appears that it's a matter of going through the motions and waiting for the off season. Disgraceful that it's come to that this early in the season, but it appears the players are already of the opinion of 'what's the point', and their effort reflects that.

Some supporters need to stop kidding themselves and making the same excuses. Nearly everyone single of us had high hopes going into this season (like many before), and once again we are a laughing stock. That is unacceptable and the buck stops with the coach. As some have stated, we have not improved what so ever. Granted our list isn't full of A-graders but at the same time its not garbage either. Certainly enough talent to be competitive and causing some upsets along the way. Enough is enough.

No matter what the sport, once the coach loses the players there is no turning back. It's clear for all to see our current playing group has no interest in implementing whatever game plan it is we are trying to play. Yes, some of that falls back on them, but 3 years is more than enough time to have us executing a game plan, let alone showing the basic skills required at AFL level. Not good enough.
 
lioninthesand said:
To this point, sustained improvement?. Its a bit of a stretch to say 'improved in a year (3 years ago)... but regressed there after' that doesent count - imo. Rocky and Hanley have gone backwards overall, pretty dramtically.. zorko ill give but not an A grader and is incredibly unpolished, martin has regressed again and bewick and lester would struggle to get a game in most teams though they have improved, they were at a pretty low base. would you like me to list those who have regressed or havent come on? Id be just about the entire list bar a couple.
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Rocky, Hanley and Martin have all suffered injuries (ribs and back, hips, concussion) that have limited their ability last and/or this year. That's the problem with demanding results in what is effectively two years - if someone peaked in the first of the two you can throw it away as "not sustained" if they get injured the following year.

I don't really care if you list those who regressed, though I suspect it's actually not that many given how few of our list now predate Leppa. You just asked for those that "genuinely improved". I've given a sample. If you didn't actually want someone to show your claim as merely hyperbole, it probably wasn't worth making it.
 
dlanod said:
Rocky, Hanley and Martin have all suffered injuries (ribs and back, hips, concussion) that have limited their ability last and/or this year. That's the problem with demanding results in what is effectively two years - if someone peaked in the first of the two you can throw it away as "not sustained" if they get injured the following year.

I don't really care if you list those who regressed, though I suspect it's actually not that many given how few of our list now predate Leppa. You just asked for those that "genuinely improved". I've given a sample. If you didn't actually want someone to show your claim as merely hyperbole, it probably wasn't worth making it.
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Sorry mate but you didn't preface your response with 'improved excluding injury'. Rocky and Hanley are shadows of their former selves, the reason is injury (more so rocky - hanley has regressed) but for one reason or another they havent improved, it was just odd you threw them up. Same with martin, he has regressed this year. You claim my post is a hyperbole, I feel yours was just inncorrect. Agree to disagree though - imo, its fair to say the lack of improvement in our list has beem alarming.
 
lioninthesand said:
Sorry mate but you didn't preface your response with 'improved excluding injury'. Rocky and Hanley are shadows of their former selves, the reason is injury (more so rocky - hanley has regressed) but for one reason or another they havent improved, it was just odd you threw them up. Same with martin, he has regressed this year. You claim my post is a hyperbole, I feel yours was just inncorrect. Agree to disagree though - imo, its fair to say the lack of improvement in our list has beem alarming.
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Martin 'regressed' in your eyes only because he'd reached such lofty heights under Leppa...
 
James North said:
Interesting line to me from that article is:
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he's had 3 years to improve these and has even brought in players he thought would improve these stats... we are still bottom 4. I think the coach has a big part to play in this and while I'm not blaming him solely as I think the players need a hard long look at themselves. I wouldn't be against a cleanout at the end of the season no matter who they are. But that is for another thread.
 

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James North said:
Martin 'regressed' in your eyes only because he'd reached such lofty heights under Leppa...
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My two who have genuinely improved, with no caveats or excuses attatched - were Martin and Robinson. Sadly this year even Martin has started to go backwards so I argued he had regressed - but his blossoming happened under leppa. Beyond that whether its injury, homesickness, being played out of position, being unhappy, gastro, rocky's captain style (all areas and obstacles which a coach must navigate) no one else in my opinion can be said to have 'improved' or 'come to life' under leppa - bewick and lester are currently 'holding their spot' but I wouldn't say their development deserves a tick. And god help us if 'stock standard' injury woes that every club face means that players lose their ability upon return for the years following and thats just life - I can exclude rocky as his injuries have been restricting, though his path and devalopment as a captain hasnt exactly been paved in gold under the current coach, which is the area we need him to devalop most - injured or not.
 
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SizeMatters said:
he's had 3 years to improve these and has even brought in players he thought would improve these stats... we are still bottom 4. I think the coach has a big part to play in this and while I'm not blaming him solely as I think the players need a hard long look at themselves. I wouldn't be against a cleanout at the end of the season no matter who they are. But that is for another thread.
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They were bad before and they're still bad.

So either, the coach hasn't improved them and he's also no good, or the players are being overrated by everyone and were never that good to start with.

Either way, we're here again.
 
crispy creme said:
And just to throw fuel on the fire, he won the job over Adam Simpson.
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Simpson is a tactically good coach. Just look what he managed to do last season with 2 of his best key defenders out for the whole season. Weagles web was a huge success... can't think of anything Leppa has implemented into our team that makes us competitive TBH. There just doesn't seem like any sort of game plan at all... looks totally random whenever we play. Maybe that's got to do with the players not sticking to structures, or maybe the game plan doesn't hold up when opposition play for it. Either way Leppa better change something soon or he may be gone by the end of the season if we keep on losing like we have been the past 2 weeks.
 
James North said:
They were bad before and they're still bad.

So either, the coach hasn't improved them and he's also no good, or the players are being overrated by everyone and were never that good to start with.

Either way, we're here again.
Click to expand...
personally I think it's a bit of both. Leppa isn't the only coach we have and even with Black, Daly and co. and also bringing in contested ball winning players we still struggle. I wouldn't be at all surprised to see Bastinacs, Bundy, Bell or Robbos contested possessions counts drop since arriving at the Lions.
 
James North said:
They were bad before and they're still bad.

So either, the coach hasn't improved them and he's also no good, or the players are being overrated by everyone and were never that good to start with.

Either way, we're here again.
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Yep its a question we may never know the answer to, but i'd rather not risk losing like this for 2017 as well and to continue to let us bleed out like this (which we will IMO) and instead be proactive in making a change of coach, should this misery continue - the cost of 'hoping' he can turn it around is far to great, and the reason for keeping him being 'I doubt anyone on gods green grass can change anything anyway' is an outlook I can't stand posessing. I Have no doubt a young, endearing coach from a good system can inspire and lead these boys back to the top. Its his third year, he has till the end of the season but from here the improvement would want to be prettt stark to warrent carrying out this forth year.
 
Also to consider is that there is still a bit of friction between Leppa and the playing group. Leppa acknowledge it last season and vowed to work on it but to still hear whispers coming out from the den of player/coach relationships not up to scratch is a it concerning. Rocky is a loose cannon as well and having those two in positions of power must be tough for anyone but especially the young players IMO.
 
I just wish the guy showed a bit more passion in the coach's box during games. Every single ****ing time the cameras are on him he's either sitting there with a dumbfounded look on his face or looks resigned and just can't ****ing wait for the game to be over. Doesn't look like he cares one way or the other when we lose.
 
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