Analysis Is Leppa the Right Man for the Job?

[lionshine]

Go through the list and we *are* a bottom 4 side...

Effort shouldn't need to be driven by the coach every damn week. That's why money exchanges hands at the very least.

Fair enough if you don't like the gameplan, but we're talking about a large group of our list under two coaches coasting way too regularly. Those two coaches were both inspirational hard nuts as players...

I love Leppa and want him to succeed as much as anyone. Realistically, however, the chances of him surviving if we continue to get flogged week after week are so small. Whether that is fair or not is up for debate but that imo is the reality. From 9 games we have been flogged in 6. If from 18 we have been flogged in 12 and after 22 we've copped 14-15 beltings I can't see him being our coach next year

 

[Football Pope]

After the Pies game, simply having effort is a good start. Dont find anything wrong with what Leppa said. After effort comes discipline (sticking to roles and playing your part) then skills.

Basically we can't handle the pressure when applied...Basic skills like hitting a target aren't there...How many times did kicks, handballs miss the target = turn the ball over.. so we spend the day chasing shadows..

 

[3KZ is Football]

I think today they performed exactly as their status in the competition suggests.

Considering the number of high draft picks on the Melbourne list, I'm not surprised it's coming up Milhouse for them.

I was addressing the effort discussion above only. I don't think effort needs the senior coach's approval, it should be intrinsic.

You are right of course and too many of our players are coasting. Having not seen him "live" this season, I spent the best part of the game just watching Christensen and I don't think I have seen a lazier player for a very long time. He played wide of his man when we had the ball inside 50 in the hope that if Melbourne cleared under pressure and missed a target he could get a cheap touch. The problem was that when Melbourne did clear and start to rebound, his man would start moving forward and quickly get 30 and even 40 metres on him. I watched Christensen basically jogging towards the Melbourne end while the ball was delivered over his head to a loose player. He fair dinkum made zero effort to gut run back and help out in defence. This is the beauty of watching games live, rather than on TV, you get to see this sort of thing and believe me it looked very bad.

The problem is that Christensen has a coach and if that coach can't get him or half the team to raise an effort, then the coach is naturally in the gun, especially if the same lazy players are getting regular games. I actually felt sorry for Leppitsch today, because irrespective of how fair some people think it is, he appears to have lost the players if they won't make an effort.

 

[lioninthesand]

'The Coach is a representitive of the team, if the team isnt winning games after a certain period of time, the numbers just get you'

That was leigh matthews in relation to voss half way through his 4th year, who had a much better coaching record than leppa at that time.

It is true, how long do we keep persisting? I don't care if the man is Jesus Christ himself and can turn water into wine, his coaching tenure has been a disarster.

Its his third year. Third. We are going backwards with no light at the end of the tunnel, no plan.. no amswers.. no hope.

Our skills are terrible, our system is terrible, our depth is terrible, players are unhappy, players are regressing, injuries are the worst in the clubs history, we cant kick, we cant defend, we cant attack, we are staristically the worst team in the comp... its his third year, I know some of us have a soft spot for Leppa - he hoiseted a cup for us, I love him too.. but his numbers are starting to catch up - he cant motivate effort, so what do we do? Just give up and say 'we have a bad group of players' and point to the fact another leigh matthews clone cut from the same cloth in micheal voss..also couldn't inspire the team? Sooo... naturally theres no point moving on to a new phase of our journey with a new coach?

It is neeld'esk - im happy to look at commiting to this forth year (depending on results) but gee we risk really losing all hope.

We need to start excepting we have failed in our most recent coaching appointnent and start to look elsewhere, the writing was on the wall last year, but now its just hit new unbareable lows.

Im not saying sack him tomorrow, but any coversation and or the want to start thinking about a new coach is beyond justified.

This is why club heros are a bad idea.

Edit: id be happy with 7-8 wins as a big tick, given its his third year and our young list. Im not asking for miricles.

 

[theteamtobeat]

Spot on. If we're going to judge a coach week by week if he is the right man for the job then a lot of us are going to change our minds. 10 weeks in, there's only been two performances for me that were far below what we should be producing, the rest I am not surprised by. See how the next 10 weeks go.

No one is judging Leppa week by week scenario. We are judging him from the start of 2014 until now. The team has not improved since is he started coaching. Since 2014 we are the number 1 ranked team for the total points scored against us and we finish 10 on the ladder, the year Vossy got sacked. We have gone completely backwards. Leppa was given 2 years to teach the game plan to players, recruit the types of players he wanted at the club and develop the talent that existed at the club. He has failed.

I not saying we sack him straight way, but give him the rest of the year to prove himself. In the mean time the club should be getting into the ear of Paul Roos or any high regard assistant coach in the market place and assessing who is available to coach. We need a plan C.

 

[lions2010]

No one is judging Leppa week by week scenario. We are judging him from the start of 2014 until now. The team has not improved since is he started coaching. Since 2014 we are the number 1 ranked team for the total points scored against us and we finish 10 on the ladder, the year Vossy got sacked. We have gone completely backwards. Leppa was given 2 years to teach the game plan to players, recruit the types of players he wanted at the club and develop the talent that existed at the club. He has failed.

I not saying we sack him straight way, but give him the rest of the year to prove himself. In the mean time the club should be getting into the ear of Paul Roos or any high regard assistant coach in the market place and assessing who is available to coach. We need a plan C.

I really can't process his press conference. We got beaten by 10 goals by a side way younger than us in experience and he basically says he is happy with the game. I really don't think he is setting the bar high enough if losing by 10 goals is considered ok.

 

[Dylan12]

The players are the ones that wanted to change to this fast paced run and gun game plan and they cant even put in the effort to do what they want to do.

If the players dont turn up on game day, they are the ones responsible. Yes it is the job of the coach to get them up, but they still have to actually do it. If they are happy to coast by it doesnt matter who the coach is.

So in other words, the answer is we do nothing.

We don't sack the coach because we can't change the players,yet we expect different outcomes.

I just don't see how not making a big statement sometime soon is going to propel this club because every year for countless years, this club continues to regress further and further and every year, the club and a lot of its supporters keep spinning BS that things are improving.

Where's the evidence of that?

 

[Big Lion]

Go through the list and we *are* a bottom 4 side...

Effort shouldn't need to be driven by the coach every damn week. That's why money exchanges hands at the very least.

Fair enough if you don't like the gameplan, but we're talking about a large group of our list under two coaches coasting way too regularly. Those two coaches were both inspirational hard nuts as players...

We'll have to agree to disagree on the list because it ain't bottom 4 from where I sit. 10 to 12 is where I'd say we are at, when you name Beams, Rich, Hanley, Christensen, Martin, McStay, plus a good bunch of kids we aren't duds. Leppa is having similar issues to Voss, the players aren't playing for him, the talent isn't developing like it should and the game plan is too easy to expose. At some stage the gloss of Leppa will wear off for you and you'll join us in questioning the coaching/development staff rather than putting it on the players.

 

[Gibbo_88]

No one is judging Leppa week by week scenario. We are judging him from the start of 2014 until now. The team has not improved since is he started coaching. Since 2014 we are the number 1 ranked team for the total points scored against us and we finish 10 on the ladder, the year Vossy got sacked. We have gone completely backwards. Leppa was given 2 years to teach the game plan to players, recruit the types of players he wanted at the club and develop the talent that existed at the club. He has failed.

I not saying we sack him straight way, but give him the rest of the year to prove himself. In the mean time the club should be getting into the ear of Paul Roos or any high regard assistant coach in the market place and assessing who is available to coach. We need a plan C.

...this thread getting bumped straight after big losses says to me a lot on here are judging on a weekly basis.

 

[dlanod]

We'll have to agree to disagree on the list because it ain't bottom 4 from where I sit. 10 to 12 is where I'd say we are at, when you name Beams, Rich, Hanley, Christensen, Martin, McStay, plus a good bunch of kids we aren't duds. Leppa is having similar issues to Voss, the players aren't playing for him, the talent isn't developing like it should and the game plan is too easy to expose. At some stage the gloss of Leppa will wear off for you and you'll join us in questioning the coaching/development staff rather than putting it on the players.

Without commenting on Leppa, I think you're massively overrating a bunch of guys that either aren't on the park most of the last two years (Beams, Rocky), look to be hampered in some way at the moment (Hanley, Martin), or have large, noted and persistent flaws in their game (Rich, McStay, Chistensen, Robbo, Bell, Bastinac). I'm throwing a few more names in there for completeness obviously.

 

[James North]

We'll have to agree to disagree on the list because it ain't bottom 4 from where I sit. 10 to 12 is where I'd say we are at, when you name Beams, Rich, Hanley, Christensen, Martin, McStay, plus a good bunch of kids we aren't duds. Leppa is having similar issues to Voss, the players aren't playing for him, the talent isn't developing like it should and the game plan is too easy to expose. At some stage the gloss of Leppa will wear off for you and you'll join us in questioning the coaching/development staff rather than putting it on the players.

I think only D Beams is the only genuine one, by some margin.

dlanod has summed up how I see things above - too inconsistent for too long, a lot of those guys.

 

[theteamtobeat]

So in other words, the answer is we do nothing.

We don't sack the coach because we can't change the players,yet we expect different outcomes.

I just don't see how not making a big statement sometime soon is going to propel this club because every year for countless years, this club continues to regress further and further and every year, the club and a lot of its supporters keep spinning BS that things are improving.

Where's the evidence of that?

Totally agree. Clubs like Melbourne and Western Bulldogs have similar list age profile to us. The only difference is Pauls Roo's and Luke Beveridge are far superior coaches to Leppa. Both those coaches have a superior game plan and defensive structures in place then what we have at our club. This run and gun game plan isn't working for us.

 

[Football Pope]

Totally agree. Clubs like Melbourne and Western Bulldogs have similar list age profile to us. The only difference is Pauls Roo's and Luke Beveridge are far superior coaches to Leppa. Both those coaches have a superior game plan and defensive structures in place then what we have at our club.

Dunno about that , not sure about our culture we never really cleaned it up after Voss ..Same old same old..Players not playing for the coach..

 

[James North]

So in other words, the answer is we do nothing.

We don't sack the coach because we can't change the players,yet we expect different outcomes.

I just don't see how not making a big statement sometime soon is going to propel this club because every year for countless years, this club continues to regress further and further and every year, the club and a lot of its supporters keep spinning BS that things are improving.

Where's the evidence of that?

I think everyone is on the same page that something needs to be done - nobody likes year after year of losing and losing badly.

The gamble is whether it's the coach (we've done that before) or the players (I think we've probably gone down this path a little bit in recent years) or some other systemic problem (facilities/development/general attitude up here?).

I'm genuinely not sure, because I'm not convinced that the core footballers on our list are capable of a hell of a lot more than what the two coaches they've already played under have achieved from them. Into the bargain, the best player we've managed to bring into the club in the last 10 years (no prizes guessing who that is) hasn't been on the park a whole lot.

The other reason I'm not sure is because there has only ever been one game that our best midfield was involved in. If that was 22 with our best mids this year, I think next year might have been very different.

Totally agree. Clubs like Melbourne and Western Bulldogs have have similar list and age profile to us. The only difference is Pauls Roo's and Luke Beveridge are far superior coaches to Leppa. Both those coaches have a superior game plan and defensive structures in place then what we have at our club.

I think the biggest difference is that both clubs have better lists than ours. Melbourne have been given concessions in addition to having year after year of high draft picks who don't go home.

Despite a decade of being quite poor, we have 3 players on our list that were top-10 picks. Mayes (not really performing), Rich (over his career has not performed at that level) and Schache (very young).

It's complex.

Don't for a moment think that anyone is happy with how things are. I'll never stop supporting because that's my choice and for me it's an escape that is the polar opposite of the work I do.

What I do have faith in at the moment is that Swann, Lethal and Lambert have been involved in successful systems. Now, that faith may change ... but that's what I'm behind at this point.

 

[Ceebee]

I think everyone is on the same page that something needs to be done - nobody likes year after year of losing and losing badly.

The gamble is whether it's the coach (we've done that before) or the players (I think we've probably gone down this path a little bit in recent years) or some other systemic problem (facilities/development/general attitude up here?).

I'm genuinely not sure, because I'm not convinced that the core footballers on our list are capable of a hell of a lot more than what the two coaches they've already played under have achieved from them. Into the bargain, the best player we've managed to bring into the club in the last 10 years (no prizes guessing who that is) hasn't been on the park a whole lot.

The other reason I'm not sure is because there has only ever been one game that our best midfield was involved in. If that was 22 with our best mids this year, I think next year might have been very different.



I think the biggest difference is that both clubs have better lists than ours. Melbourne have been given concessions in addition to having year after year of high draft picks who don't go home.

Despite a decade of being quite poor, we have 3 players on our list that were top-10 picks. Mayes (not really performing), Rich (over his career has not performed at that level) and Schache (very young).

It's complex.

Don't for a moment think that anyone is happy with how things are. I'll never stop supporting because that's my choice and for me it's an escape that is the polar opposite of the work I do.

What I do have faith in at the moment is that Swann, Lethal and Lambert have been involved in successful systems. Now, that faith may change ... but that's what I'm behind at this point.

Well said.

 

[Sherrinator]

Are you lot serious? I can't believe the current result of this thread. Do you really think that Leppa is to blame for the current lot? Thanks for reinforcing why I stopped posting here. The buck might stop with the coach in traditional reckoning but this is absolutely down to the players and their effort. **** you if you disagree

**** you too brah

 

[jackess]

Hasn't Leppa already turned over the list? And yet he's still not able to inspire the group he's put together.

 

[Big Lion]

Without commenting on Leppa, I think you're massively overrating a bunch of guys that either aren't on the park most of the last two years (Beams, Rocky), look to be hampered in some way at the moment (Hanley, Martin), or have large, noted and persistent flaws in their game (Rich, McStay, Chistensen, Robbo, Bell, Bastinac). I'm throwing a few more names in there for completeness obviously.

Not over rating them at all, the ones i mentioned can play. Beams hasn't been managed/medically treated right, Rockys got a dodgy hammy which they are working through, Rich doesn't have the tank to out run a tag, a good coach could implement strategies to get around that, Christensen can play, Robbo has limitations but adds grunt and effort, Mc Stay has talent, more time which fix any issues he has.

Your first few words says it all......without commenting on Leppa.

 

[Football Pope]

Hasn't Leppa already turned over the list? And yet he's still not able to inspire the group he's put together.

What..in 2 years?

 

[James North]

Hasn't Leppa already turned over the list? And yet he's still not able to inspire the group he's put together.

The ones who perform the best are often the guys who have come in from other clubs.

 

[Big Lion]

If i was in charge i'd give Leppa the rest of the year to turn things around. The draw gets easier thankfully. If the team is still in the same position Dew or Ratten for mine.

 

[theteamtobeat]

I have sympathy for Leppa that the AFL gave us this ridiculously hard draw and we had back luck with injuries. The only reason I'm leaning towards him getting sacked is because we are getting belted by teams that aren't even in the top 8 like Collingwood, Melbourne, Port, who are similar in age profile. If we get belted by clubs like Carlton, Richmond, Fremantle and St Kilda in the near future, then I want him gone by the end of the season.

 

[lionsbest]

Dunno about that , not sure about our culture we never really cleaned it up after Voss ..Same old same old..Players not playing for the coach..

Football Pope before the Melbourne game I felt you should have performed an exorcism to cast any demons out of MCG,then we might have won!!!!only our players ,no demons in sight!!!!

 

[dlanod]

Your first few words says it all......without commenting on Leppa.

Yep. I think we could fire Leppa, and in two years time we'll be exactly where we are now because of continued overrating of our list after some other coach tries and fails with them.

 

[Happy_Neale]

Without commenting on Leppa, I think you're massively overrating a bunch of guys that either aren't on the park most of the last two years (Beams, Rocky), look to be hampered in some way at the moment (Hanley, Martin), or have large, noted and persistent flaws in their game (Rich, McStay, Chistensen, Robbo, Bell, Bastinac). I'm throwing a few more names in there for completeness obviously.

Our list is not 10+ goals worse than Melbourne, Port and Collingwood. Or a bunch of the teams that thrashed us last year.