Analysis Is Leppa the Right Man for the Job?

[POBT]

'It defies logic' lol, apart from Melbourne and to a Lesser extent Port which is exactly the time at which the decided to step is with large scale assistance, on the back of 2 terribly failed coaches.

You've misunderstood his argument.

 

[lioninthesand]

You've misunderstood his argument.

So I did, left one word out whilst reading it - apology's notliondown

 

[lioninthesand]

I would love to see them step in and make 'real' changes to help Leppa out next year and beyond but I can't see it.

If a new coach comes in this season or the next, I feel almost assured it would happen in some shape or form.

As I said though, just an opinion not claiming to have intimate knowledge to this effect, nor do I think it really strengthens the case against sacking Leppa.

 

[POBT]

The comparison with Melbourne is interesting. The change process at that club involved a few key decisions, some of which were driven by the AFL:

- get an experienced CEO in
- board restructure and renewal
- a commitment to better governance
- changes to key staff

We've done all that since the Johnson/Holmes era.

What's interesting is that it took Jackson 2 years to right the ship financially and in a governance sense at Melbourne. He then launched a new strategy totally designed to improve football performance. In other words, he couldn't do anything until he'd stopped the bleeding.

Swann is coming up to 2 years in the job. If, as he said today, we will make budget, then he has potentially stopped the bleeding. If he can then get funding for a new base, then he will have done a very good job in a short period of time. Those two achievements will set the foundations for the future.

I guess my point is that the widespread, club-wide changes at clubs like Melbourne or Port may not be entirely appropriate at our club. We might have already gone through that stage and this is about the next steps rather than completely rebuilding a club.

 

[notliondown]

So I did, left one word out whilst reading it - apology's notliondown

It's all good, no need to apologise at all. We may disagree on the issue but I appreciate your passion and desire to see the club become better very much. Sh*t happens you know

 

[dlanod]

I guess my point is that the widespread, club-wide changes at clubs like Melbourne or Port may not be entirely appropriate at our club. We might have already gone through that stage and this is about the next steps rather than completely rebuilding a club.

So an argument could be made that we now just need the on-field assistance Melbourne received in the form of priority picks?

 

[notliondown]

The comparison with Melbourne is interesting. The change process at that club involved a few key decisions, some of which were driven by the AFL:

- get an experienced CEO in
- board restructure and renewal
- a commitment to better governance
- changes to key staff

We've done all that since the Johnson/Holmes era.

What's interesting is that it took Jackson 2 years to right the ship financially and in a governance sense at Melbourne. He then launched a new strategy totally designed to improve football performance. In other words, he couldn't do anything until he'd stopped the bleeding.

Swann is coming up to 2 years in the job. If, as he said today, we will make budget, then he has potentially stopped the bleeding. If he can then get funding for a new base, then he will have done a very good job in a short period of time. Those two achievements will set the foundations for the future.

I guess my point is that the widespread, club-wide changes at clubs like Melbourne or Port may not be entirely appropriate at our club. We might have already gone through that stage and this is about the next steps rather than completely rebuilding a club.

Which I think is probably the basis for most of the "support" around Leppa right now - his appointment too came at a time of major change and upheaval. The comparisons between him and Swann are very similar in the sense of cleaning up previous messes and needing a longer term view to achieve it. Right now the CEO looks like he'll see results before his coach.

If Swann does achieve budget and stem the losses, it's hard to fathom how anyone at AFL level could be critical of his appointment. Especially given its taken him this amount of time to "get his head around Qld" as such.

The difference is we tend to look at the on field performances far more critically because that's where the passion lies and most, ironically, are prepared to give a longer period of grace to fix financial issues, when both are long term issues resulting from poor management, with few quick fixes.

 

[Slax]

It depends from which perspective you look at it. Carlton's long term outlook is worse than Briabanes but they do have better senior players. They've also made an effort to be as competitive as possible this season in order to change the culture.

In Brisbane's case I think they're senior players are a fair bit worse but the long term outlook is substantially better because (a) you have a lot more good young players on your list and (b) you are getting senior games into most of them straight away and that's the best form of development imo. Further, by giving so many untested players games you are finding out who has a future earlier and can adjust the list accordingly

With the bolded I think its a case that the defence is rendered ineffective by the fact that the forwards and midfielders don't put any pressure on the ball carrier.

Ok now I have heard everything. Carlton have financial security, a top coach, have cleared the boardroom of deadwood, have excellent facilities too and most of all a positive culture. Carlton also have their next captain clearly identified in Weitering.

We have none of these things. Who is our next captain? There is no-one really looking like captain material.

We need to clear the decks and start fresh which means clearing out the coaches & boardroom. We have no leadership coming from the administration at all, Mathews is a disgrace, he's caused nothing but trouble over the last few years and reminds me a lot of what Garry Lyon did at Melbourne when there were going nowhere. Getting games into players sounds good, but it is an excuse by an incompetent coach to hide his failings.

Never has a coach which such a poor first three years ever achieved anything in the AFL and that won't change with Leppitsch. A top coach can achieve things with a side inside three years to show they are going forward we haven't shit anything. Hopefully when we lose to Essendon it finally sinks in that he is useless and gets sacked.

 

[LeighMatthews]

Supporters are never as balanced, or as unbalanced as they seem.

 

[Skoob]

Supporters are never as balanced, or as unbalanced as they seem.

Some are.

 

[PertRoosOsborne]

Supporters are never as balanced, or as unbalanced as they seem.

Did you sleep with Brownless' ex wife?

 

[snooplions]

Supporters are never as balanced, or as unbalanced as they seem.

Gettin' real sick of your sh*t, Leigh.

 

[Skoob]

It is an opinion of mine, based off a few factors, defs not something I have hard evidence of. It was rumored last year on various media sources that Swan had to tell the AFL to 'butt out' as it was rumored the AFL wern't happy with the contract extension (it was discussed on here at length).

My theory around why they might not is not due to personal knowledge, just more basic business sense and based of what they do in the past - I believe they will undertake a big overhaul with a fresh face in charge, can't see them being all that interested in rearranging the deck chair on the Titanic. Though I hope they do as Leppa deserves more help.

I think what you might be thinking of is the fact that the AFL weren't happy with the payout terms of his extension. They had the same concerns over Leon Cameron's contract. The AFL don't want to see anymore financial hardship and if we sack the coach, can't afford to be paying him out for too long.
I don't recall any talk of the AFL being against a contract extension.

 

[Big Sauce 21]

What does Leppa have to do to get his contract renewed at the end of next year. We will probably go win less for the remainder of the year but what is par for us next year?

 

[Bucking Beads]

What does Leppa have to do to get his contract renewed at the end of next year. We will probably go win less for the remainder of the year but what is par for us next year?

Can't really answer that until I see what happens with players we lose and bring in TBH. That said 6+ wins at bare minimum. It really depends on how fair dinkum we are about the rebuild and what kind of footy we are playing.

 

[notliondown]

Some are.

 

[POBT]

Which I think is probably the basis for most of the "support" around Leppa right now - his appointment too came at a time of major change and upheaval. The comparisons between him and Swann are very similar in the sense of cleaning up previous messes and needing a longer term view to achieve it. Right now the CEO looks like he'll see results before his coach.

For me, it supports the argument that we may have pulled the wrong rein in appointing him. The benefit of a Roos at Melbourne is that not only can he absorb a lot more pressure than a rookie coach but he gives everyone confidence that he knows where he needs to get a list to and what he needs to do to achieve that.

Now, we didn't have the option of a premiership coach so our choice wasn't as clear cut as Melbourne's. And I don't think it necessarily follows that, because an inexperienced coach was the wrong choice 3 years ago, that he is still the wrong man for the club.

Having said that, I don't support Leppa staying on as coach if we continue to struggle. Fair or not, he's too associated with 2 years of abject performance and, at some point, I think we need to accept that a change is required for us to start afresh. That's not discounting the hardship he's faced or suggesting that the bloke can't coach - but reality has to hit at some point and a 1-21 or 2-20 season is simply beyond what can be accepted.

 

[LeighMatthews]

Gettin' real sick of your sh*t, Leigh.

Yeah - did you read what I said in my last post?

 

[LeighMatthews]

Did you sleep with Brownless' ex wife?

No - did you?

 

[Fitzroy bears]

I still can't figure out why there are suggestions that the AFL would replace a coach on condition of financial or draft concessions to a club especially ours, given the unique circumstances that we face. I don't believe the AFL would be foolish enough to remove an existing coach and replace him with a person who they could not guarantee would make significant impact straight away and since Paul Roos has said "we are not an option", the only available coaches are untried and Mick Malthouse(we know how that turned out for Carlton). Second point would be: if the AFL were to make moves such as this, what was the point of installing Greg Swan if they didn't back his judgement.

 

[Ironmonger]

Supporters are never as balanced, or as unbalanced as they seem.

This joke has run its course.

 

[Gadzorks]

Ok now I have heard everything. Carlton have financial security, a top coach, have cleared the boardroom of deadwood, have excellent facilities too and most of all a positive culture. Carlton also have their next captain clearly identified in Weitering.

We have none of these things. Who is our next captain? There is no-one really looking like captain material.

We need to clear the decks and start fresh which means clearing out the coaches & boardroom. We have no leadership coming from the administration at all, Mathews is a disgrace, he's caused nothing but trouble over the last few years and reminds me a lot of what Garry Lyon did at Melbourne when there were going nowhere. Getting games into players sounds good, but it is an excuse by an incompetent coach to hide his failings.

Never has a coach which such a poor first three years ever achieved anything in the AFL and that won't change with Leppitsch. A top coach can achieve things with a side inside three years to show they are going forward we haven't shit anything. Hopefully when we lose to Essendon it finally sinks in that he is useless and gets sacked.

Weitering as captain? 18 year old 2015 draftee?
I'd never put money on a 18 yo person in a industry as fickle a professional sport to develop into a leader no matter what their apparent capability in their first year.

 

[Fitzroy bears]

I know this is about leppa, but just for arguments sake why is leppa under the pump when just down the road we have rocket Eade who is an experienced coach, with a list that was built from first round draft picks, which is also a few years further in their development then us and the major reason for sacking bluey was culture and lack of finals. He is 2 years in and no finals where are the jungle drums for Eade. You could make the injury argument, but you could make it for us and their depth should be miles ahead of ours. You could make the talent argument, but they had salary cap concessions, dozens of first round selections and recruited one of the all time greats of the game, that argument doesn't seem to hold up. So I say why not Eade?

 

[SizeMatters]

Eades a good coach that has high standards. He doesn't shirk from the media and certainly makes sure every single player from the top down are all on the same page. Injuries are the Suns biggest problem and they still have a young side after losing a few great youngsters the past few years. Eade has runs on the board, Leppa doesn't.

 

[LeighMatthews]

This joke has run its course.

There is no way I'm reading all of that.