Jack Ginnivan - Redemption arc

[HeHateMe]

Such hypocrisy from one asserting bias in others.

Sicily still mouthing off with Breust on his shoulder was far from "objectively funny".

Objectively, it was childish, and/or pathetic, and/or sad, but most of all, it was disgracefully disrespectful of Breust.

There is hypocrisy all through this issue, I understand the goldfish media have very short memories but players and clubs don't. It appears key figures have taken it personally. And Kenny gave that ammunition the same ammo he took personally because of Ginnis tweet. Which is it do you remain stoic or do you raise on emotions.

The story has spun back on its self as a contradiction.

 

[rei154]

Tough way to find out that 17 other clubs don’t get give a shit about Hokball. It’s all well and good to be Gen Z yapaholics when you’re winning, but this is a grown man’s league and it’s going to come back with interest every time.

Good way to re-write the bolded is "Old people don't know how to respond to banter online and respond in out-dated ways".
If Ken had clapped back in his presser, or in a like for like way online this wouldn't be a thing we'd talk about.

Being a grown man involves a level of maturity that seems a little lost on people who have strong opinions on this.

 

[HeHateMe]

I think the only thing that made it an issue is the Sicily reaction and potential to spark a melee. The AFL will blame Ken for that and condemn it, but up until that point it was all good theatre.

Yeah I agree, Sicily was reeling after giving everything to try and drag us over the line. Kenny needed to keep it in check and use it in the rooms with his boys. My opinion ofc.

 

[Mitchell Madness]

Good way to re-write the bolded is "Old people don't know how to respond to banter online and respond in out-dated ways".
If Ken had clapped back in his presser, or in a like for like way online this wouldn't be a thing we'd talk about.

Being a grown man involves a level of maturity that seems a little lost on people who have strong opinions on this.

There was more than just "clapping back"

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Don't fall of that high horse, twisting yourself into knots to avoid pointing the blame at anyone other than Ken.

It's a fair way to the ground.

Nothing in my post is about Ken.

I assume you're salty because you know it's true that Sicily paid massive disrespect to a bloke who deserves better than what he got from his captain.

Even Sicily himself regrets it.

I was simply pointing out that it was far from "objectively funny" and to post such was ridiculous.

 

[rei154]

Nothing in my post is about Ken.

I assume you're salty because you know it's true that Sicily paid massive disrespect to a bloke who deserves better than what he got from his captain.

Sorry I didn't respond to your last post-
I agree, Sicily should have backed off by the time he was chairing Breust off. It was super childish to continue from that point and Breust deserved better.
It feels like people are ignoring the immaturity on one side and dog-piling the other in this issue though.

Ginni regretted his post and didn't think it through.
Ken lashed out, recognised he went too far but had to act proud about it due to the media pressure he's under.
Sicily had to defend his boy, but went too far with it in terms of mouthing off while participating in a celebration of one of his clubs greatest ever players.

Plenty of regrets/things should have been done differently.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

The Ginnivan circus.

Hawks getting exactly what they paid for and will now have a massive target on them next year from opposition knowing how big the melts from the arrogant Hawks players will be if they dare churp back at them between selfies.

Maybe the Schultz trade wasn't so bad after all

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Sorry I didn't respond to your last post-
I agree, Sicily should have backed off by the time he was chairing Breust off. It was super childish to continue from that point and Breust deserved better.
It feels like people are ignoring the immaturity on one side and dog-piling the other in this issue though.

Ginni regretted his post and didn't think it through.
Ken lashed out, recognised he went too far but had to act proud about it due to the media pressure he's under.
Sicily had to defend his boy, but went too far with it in terms of mouthing off while participating in a celebration of one of his clubs greatest ever players.

Plenty of regrets/things should have been done differently.

Agree with all of that.

 

[Andrew Mc]

I reckon the media would have gunned Sic if he didn't stand up for his player there.
Ginni can take it for sure, but that doesn't mean those around him should let him

The media wouldn't have even known anything had been said except for Sicily reacting when he should have been celebrating his teammates 300th.

 

[toomanysquibs]

Nothing in my post is about Ken.

I assume you're salty because you know it's true that Sicily paid massive disrespect to a bloke who deserves better than what he got from his captain.

Even Sicily himself regrets it.

I was simply pointing out that it was far from "objectively funny" and to post such was ridiculous.

So we're worried about Bruest being offended by his captain's back and forth, and that Sicily committed the gravest of trespasses on Breust's feelings and one of the great conventions of the game?

The sentiment sounds eerily familiar to the point you're arguing against.

And it's not about being salty. We were beaten by a better team on the night, and there's not shame in that to feel salty about.

 

[rei154]

The media wouldn't have even known anything had been said except for Sicily reacting when he should have been celebrating his teammates 300th.

You're wrong on this- seven, Fox, MMM, SEN and ABC all had commentators who noted prior to Sicily's jawing off that Ken was making remarks and gestures towards the Hawks.

 

[toomanysquibs]

You're wrong on this- seven, Fox, MMM, SEN and ABC all had commentators who noted prior to Sicily's jawing off that Ken was making remarks and gestures towards the Hawks.

Simple people like that guy need the ignore button. Sadly you're not going to get through to them with basic, commonsense stuff like facts and actual proof.

I read a guy trumpeting that 'even Essendon, Carlton and Kangaroos supporters are uniting against us', and then use it as proof of them being right – rather than of them being bonded by their lack of success and melty, offended feelings about our team.

That's a sign that you're up against finding fertile minds for reason.

There are some great purveyors of non-intentional fiction here giving pin head takes. They don't want change their minds.

 

[rei154]

Simple people like that guy need the ignore button. Sadly you're not going to get through to them with basic, commonsense stuff like facts and actual proof.

I read a guy trumpeting that 'even Essendon, Carlton and Kangaroos supporters are uniting against us', and then use it as proof of them being right – rather than of them being bonded by their lack of success and melty, offended feelings about our team.

That's a sign that you're up against finding fertile minds for reason.

There are some great purveyors of non-intentional fiction here giving pin head takes. They don't want change their minds.

This is my first Sunday without having things to do- normally I would ignore this kind of chat, but right now I'm having fun with it!
Sometimes you've gotta do it just for the love of the game

 

[LuvtheKangas]

So we're worried about Bruest being offended by his captain's back and forth, and that Sicily committed the gravest of trespasses on Breust's feelings and one of the great conventions of the game?

The sentiment sounds eerily familiar to the point you're arguing against.

And it's not about being salty. We were beaten by a better team on the night, and there's not shame in that to feel salty about.

Straw man.

For the third time, my point is that Sicily's mouthing off was not "objectively funny" to the neutral observer. The disrespect to Breust is a large part of why I make the point.

 

[Maddo11]

Its not playful banter. You dont get it.

If yelling homophobic slurs at an oppo player doesn't get a suspension for a bloke with a ... colourful ... history, then Ken will be getting a merit award for his actions lol

 

[toomanysquibs]

Straw man.

For the third time, my point is that Sicily's mouthing off was not "objectively funny" to the neutral observer. The disrespect to Breust is a large part of why I make the point.

Straw Man, nope I cut through a bad component of your argument.

We need to be offended by that disrespect to Bruest from Sicily, but not the other.

That's your point. It's what makes it unfunny.

But it doesn't add up. Both broke with conventions of the game, and I'd argue the guy on the shoulders was likely a lot more offended by the other guy than he was by his captain.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Straw Man, nope I cut through a bad argument.

We need to be offended by that disrespect from Sicily, but not the other.

That's your point.

But it doesn't add up. Both broke with conventions of the game, and I'd argue the guy on the shoulders was likely a lot more offended by the other guy than he was by his captain.

Sigh. Ken's reaction was reasonable due to Ginni mouthing off during the week. I think most non-Hawthorn people were glad/amused to see the karma dished out.

Sicily's initial reaction was reasonable to defend Ginni. Not funny in any sense, but reasonable.

His continued reaction had only one impact, and Breust deserved better.

"Cut through a bad argument". LOL, get over yourself.

 

[jannissary]

i think it’s fascinating that the moment he leaves collingwood, the perspective on him shifts from being an arrogant youngster to having a gen z attitude. totally don’t know why but i think a stripe change to the right club benefited his image.

as a player he’s simply one of the most exciting young players out there. smart since his first game. i remember his 2022 anzac day performance, simply one of the best games from an under 20 y/o id seen. he’s a genuine match winner & will stay a match winner into his career.

wish we’d chased him but alas, that’s how it goes.

 

[toomanysquibs]

Sigh. Ken's reaction was reasonable due to Ginni mouthing off during the week. I think most non-Hawthorn people were glad/amused to see the karma dished out.

Reasonable for someone who knows nothing about footy, perhaps.

But Ken's reaction broke with a convention of the game, and it was spineless to boot.

Where's the bravado before the game was won?

Where was he at quarter time, half time, three quarter time?

The game is over. Winners don't need to flap their wings and gloat in a way that's embarrassing for them, and embarrassing to watch. They've already won and the footy has done the talking.

It's a fool's response.

Everyone on that field is aware of what has happened, and a fat man flapping his wings after the siren is doing nothing to drive the point home any further.

Just paints him as a clown, who at his age and position in the game, should be a little more self aware.

 

[LuvtheKangas]

Reasonable for someone who knows nothing about footy, perhaps.

But Ken's reaction broke with a convention of the game, and it was spineless to boot.

Where's the bravado before the game was won?

Where was he at quarter time, half time, three quarter time?

The game is over. Winners don't need to flap their wings and gloat in a way that's embarrassing for them, and embarrassing to watch. They've already won and the footy has done the talking.

It's a fool's response.

Everyone on that field is aware of what has happened, and a fat man flapping his wings after the siren is doing nothing to drive the point home any further.

Just paints him as a clown, who at his age and position in the game, should be a little more self aware.

LOL.

Salty.

 

[Gavin Excell]

Would Hawks have disciplined/had a word with Ginnevan last week for his post?

 

[rei154]

Would Hawks have disciplined/had a word with Ginnevan last week for his post?

I believe so.
I think Ginni approached them to say he ****ed up, and then they had some stern words about moving forward.

 

[RCAB]

Tough way to find out that 17 other clubs don’t get give a shit about Hokball. It’s all well and good to be Gen Z yapaholics when you’re winning, but this is a grown man’s league and it’s going to come back with interest every time.

It's going to come back with interest? It certainly did in the second half against Port. If you're worried about taunting, maybe Ken should've done nothing and Rozee should of wiped that smile off his face. Don't cry next year when we thump you.

 

[black is White]

Reasonable for someone who knows nothing about footy, perhaps.

But Ken's reaction broke with a convention of the game, and it was spineless to boot.

Where's the bravado before the game was won?

Where was he at quarter time, half time, three quarter time?

The game is over. Winners don't need to flap their wings and gloat in a way that's embarrassing for them, and embarrassing to watch. They've already won and the footy has done the talking.

It's a fool's response.

Everyone on that field is aware of what has happened, and a fat man flapping his wings after the siren is doing nothing to drive the point home any further.

Just paints him as a clown, who at his age and position in the game, should be a little more self aware.

Hawks are quickly becoming the most fickle biggest sooks in the game. You reap what you sow and majority of the AFL world believe this is the case here. Besides the few bleeding hearts with victim mentality. Ken didn't step over any boundaries in that very basic banter, ginivan took it better than the rest of the club did and it should have been left at that but Hawthon made it into something more than it was with their emotional reaction and total meltdown. Sam Mitchell sooking it up half sobbing and explaining the situation in his press conference like a primary school kid crying to a teacher at lunch time was one of the most funniest things I've ever seen from an AFL coach.

 

[RCAB]

Would Hawks have disciplined/had a word with Ginnevan last week for his post?

No