Coach Justin Longmuir

[im_a_lazy_sod]

We've beaten 4th, 5th and 8th but lost to 6th and 7th (twice). Also lost to 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th as well as 17th. Half of the losses to 9-17 should not have happened.

Such a depressing gulf between our best and worst and the gulf seeems to be increasing week on week, as opposed to it being narrowed. That is 100% down to how the players are being coached and how they are instructed to play when things go awry etc. That is a collective blame towards the coaching team as a whole.

A different head coach may have improved our fortunes for those mid-low tier games, just as a different set of assistants may have improved our fortunes. I'd rather reassess the whole coaching team at season's end rather than a knee-jerk sacking or restrucure now

 

[Freomaniac]

You can lose but you have to at least be competitive, yesterday was a disgrace against ordinary opposition.

True. I felt sorry who actually paid a ticket to watch that game too. Deserves way better than that

 

[Outshined]

Torn with JL because sport has plenty of recent examples of clubs sticking with an under-pressure incumbent coach and seeing positive results. Richmond with Hardwick, Denver with Malone, Arsenal with Arteta etc.

Melts aside, it's still a young team (inb4 that's not an excuse blah blah) and we know he can get them playing reasonably well, just without any sort of consistency. That gap in performance probably closes a bit with maturity. The bigger issue is whether he's equipped to meet the challenges of turning a flaky side with flashes of brilliance into a great one that can win even when Plan A is taken away from them. I'm increasingly seeing him as a good development coach who was perfect for a young squad in the midst of a rebuild, but he may not have what it takes to turn them into a hard-nosed competitor.

 

[Freomaniac]

Not that it means anything but literally the only team younger and less experienced than us was Hawthorn. That's pretty close to the least experienced team this week.

It's becoming a joke constantly saying that we have a young squad.

We spent at least 6 seasons of no finals in 2016-21. 6 years of development of 18-21 year Olds means that they are 24-27 year Olds in their prime and moving Up the ladder in a finals spot.

Why are we not in a period of spending 3-6 years in a row of finals like decent teams do?

Oh that's right, we trade experienced players away cheaply for next to nothing. They then play their best footy at other clubs.

I don't give a stuff about how young our squad is.

I tolerated the toughest years of this rebuild from 2016-18.

Why are we still in a similar position ladder wise in 2017-8 when we were bottom 6?

 

[Nodgey]

I guess I shouldn't criticise without giving some suggestions, so here's the first three things I would do moving forward:

• Don't sack JL. Successful clubs don't reactively sack coaches. They stick with them and support them with great assistants, and that's what I'd do. Find one senior guy who can be there in support. Not sure who, but someone in the Chocco, Leppitsch, Buckley, Pyke mould.

• Tweak our on-field setup. We have the talent, of that I'm convinced. But, we do get monstered in the middle too often and guys such as Brayshaw, Serong etc aren't going to get a lot bigger, even when at their peak. Whether this means Young in the middle, Brodie coming back in or looking at another option in the off season, I'm not sure. But, we can't continue to be beaten in the same way, we must change things up. Getting beaten by what you know is way worse than getting beaten by what you don't. The second option indicates an appetite for risk and it's something we must embrace...this lead me to...

• The game plan must embrace more risk. More short kicks. More forward handballs. More play on. This style plays to our strengths and allows players like Freddy, Switta, Jackson, Amiss and even someone like Sturt to better use their strengths. Our continual long kicking yesterday, was counter intuitive as it played into Carlton's strengths and away from ours. Unfortunately our list profile is going to have days when they get flustered and lose composure, that happened against Carlton.

Solutions focused. Good stuff and I agree on all points.

Brodie has to come back in when fit. Plus I liked seeing Aish at centre bounces for an experienced addition there too. I'd also try maybe Wilson for Hughes to get some more dash off half back.

 

[Freomaniac]

fnerd and tonygeeks , I wanna hear your thoughts

 

[s_wd6]

It's becoming a joke constantly saying that we have a young squad.

We spent at least 6 seasons of no finals in 2016-21. 6 years of development of 18-21 year Olds means that they are 24-27 year Olds in their prime and moving Up the ladder in a finals spot.

Why are we not in a period of spending 3-6 years in a row of finals like decent teams do?

Oh that's right, we trade experienced players away cheaply for next to nothing. They then play their best footy at other clubs.

I don't give a stuff about how young our squad is.

I tolerated the toughest years of this rebuild from 2016-18.

Why are we still in a similar position ladder wise in 2017-8 when we were bottom 6?

Our list is young because of our recruiting during our 2011-2015 period. How many players do we have left from there? Alex Pearce? Ethan Hughes?
The guys from 2016 would be 24 now, and the majority of the b22 is younger than them not older. And that's because we have nothing to show for that period before hand. Lachie Neale was the biggest **** up in this clubs history.

But how many more guys from those years are still playing? Crozier isn't getting games for dogs,

2012 - Taberner is perpetually injured. No one else is stilll playing.
2013 - Pearce. No one else is still playing.
2014 - Hughes is the only one left and he was rookie draft. Weller, Langdon both getting regular games. Weller gave us Brayshaw so you take that. Langdon another huge **** up.
2015 - Tucker, Collins. Tucker is a fringe b22 at North. Would be fringe here. Collins had to be delisted to get his shit together.

That period of time is why we are still so young/inexperienced so far into a rebuild. We're still paying for shit house recruiting during that period of time. The entire time we recruited Neale, Weller, Langdon, Collins who are solid AFL players in 2023. That's four players, in a 5 year period of time. I can guarantee you that every other top 8 team has at least a dozen b22 players from that time period playing for them.

That being said, our list is only part of the issue. These same players can play good footy, just about every b22 player has played games where they've been hugely influential in the win. But there is something seriously wrong with the a) the coaching at the club that doesn't seem to maximise/utilise player strengths, and b) the mindset of the players and coaching staff. The amount of times JL has spoken about the mindset of players when we lose games is embarrassing. They're a mentally weak team and seem to have done nothing to resolve that. Whoever the club psych is is really not doing a good job if players are going into their shells and feeling sorry for themseleves every single time something goes wrong.

Schultz, 30 goals last year, 5th in the b&f.
Brayshaw, ALFPA MVP last year, b&f, AA.
Ryan, AA and b&f only a couple years ago.
Brodie was so influential last year nothing this year.
Pearce, =3rd b&f, one of the best lock down defenders.
Young, AA form back half of last season.
Freddy, 30 goals last year.
Cox, AA squad, 2nd in b&f.
Switta, was 2nd in our b&f until his injury last year.

All those guys can be very good players, and have been very good players within the last year or two. We definitely have a good enough list based on talent and list profile. But for whatever reason we are getting very little out of them now.

 

[wakojako]

Our list is young because of our recruiting during our 2011-2015 period. How many players do we have left from there? Alex Pearce? Ethan Hughes?
The guys from 2016 would be 24 now, and the majority of the b22 is younger than them not older. And that's because we have nothing to show for that period before hand. Lachie Neale was the biggest * up in this clubs history.

But how many more guys from those years are still playing? Crozier isn't getting games for dogs,

2012 - Taberner is perpetually injured. No one else is stilll playing.
2013 - Pearce. No one else is still playing.
2014 - Hughes is the only one left and he was rookie draft. Weller, Langdon both getting regular games. Weller gave us Brayshaw so you take that. Langdon another huge * up.
2015 - Tucker, Collins. Tucker is a fringe b22 at North. Would be fringe here. Collins had to be delisted to get his s**t together.

That period of time is why we are still so young/inexperienced so far into a rebuild. We're still paying for s**t house recruiting during that period of time. The entire time we recruited Neale, Weller, Langdon, Collins who are solid AFL players in 2023. That's four players, in a 5 year period of time. I can guarantee you that every other top 8 team has at least a dozen b22 players from that time period playing for them.

That being said, our list is only part of the issue. These same players can play good footy, just about every b22 player has played games where they've been hugely influential in the win. But there is something seriously wrong with the a) the coaching at the club that doesn't seem to maximise/utilise player strengths, and b) the mindset of the players and coaching staff. The amount of times JL has spoken about the mindset of players when we lose games is embarrassing. They're a mentally weak team and seem to have done nothing to resolve that. Whoever the club psych is is really not doing a good job if players are going into their shells and feeling sorry for themseleves every single time something goes wrong.

Schultz, 30 goals last year, 5th in the b&f.
Brayshaw, ALFPA MVP last year, b&f, AA.
Ryan, AA and b&f only a couple years ago.
Brodie was so influential last year nothing this year.
Pearce, =3rd b&f, one of the best lock down defenders.
Young, AA form back half of last season.
Freddy, 30 goals last year.
Cox, AA squad, 2nd in b&f.
Switta, was 2nd in our b&f until his injury last year.

All those guys can be very good players, and have been very good players within the last year or two. We definitely have a good enough list based on talent and list profile. But for whatever reason we are getting very little out of them now.

It is 100% gameplan and ball movement not playing to their main strengths. On a side note why the **** is Schultz running up and down the wing? Remember what Ross said to Neale when he saw him on a wing, that would be my reaction but apparently it's part of the game plan.

 

[Snuffaluphagus]

I guess I shouldn't criticise without giving some suggestions, so here's the first three things I would do moving forward:

• Don't sack JL. Successful clubs don't reactively sack coaches. They stick with them and support them with great assistants, and that's what I'd do. Find one senior guy who can be there in support. Not sure who, but someone in the Chocco, Leppitsch, Buckley, Pyke mould.

• Tweak our on-field setup. We have the talent, of that I'm convinced. But, we do get monstered in the middle too often and guys such as Brayshaw, Serong etc aren't going to get a lot bigger, even when at their peak. Whether this means Young in the middle, Brodie coming back in or looking at another option in the off season, I'm not sure. But, we can't continue to be beaten in the same way, we must change things up. Getting beaten by what you know is way worse than getting beaten by what you don't. The second option indicates an appetite for risk and it's something we must embrace...this lead me to...

• The game plan must embrace more risk. More short kicks. More forward handballs. More play on. This style plays to our strengths and allows players like Freddy, Switta, Jackson, Amiss and even someone like Sturt to better use their strengths. Our continual long kicking yesterday, was counter intuitive as it played into Carlton's strengths and away from ours. Unfortunately our list profile is going to have days when they get flustered and lose composure, that happened against Carlton.

Only thing I'll say on that first point. We can not get that assistant. It just wont happen here. We are very limited in this area and it hamstrings us. Graham was actually a huge get for this club as it's almost impossible for us to get the highly credentialled assistants from other clubs, the only one we could pinch from was in our state.

It's why I'm ok with Hardwick, we need as good a Senior coach as we can get because we'll never get a highly credited assistant like some of the names mentioned

 

[FDH16]

I'll say it.

I don't think our list is anywhere near it.

Too thin in the middle, no elite talent in front of the ball bar Amiss, Walters is a capable finisher, but doesn't really defend.

Defence is ok, Pearce is one dimensional, and in that one dimension, seems to get beaten more often than not.

We need another raft of 2-3 A graders, I feel we have 3 at a stretch - Serong, Darcy & Jackson.

Brayshaw is B+ but he is too lateral and doesn't hurt the opposition as an inside mid.

 

[Retzlaff]

Only thing I'll say on that first point. We can not get that assistant. It just wont happen here. We are very limited in this area and it hamstrings us. Graham was actually a huge get for this club as it's almost impossible for us to get the highly credentialled assistants from other clubs, the only one we could pinch from was in our state.

It's why I'm ok with Hardwick, we need as good a Senior coach as we can get because we'll never get a highly credited assistant like some of the names mentioned

Worsfold as assistant? What's he doing these days?

 

[GingerDocker]

Only thing I'll say on that first point. We can not get that assistant. It just wont happen here. We are very limited in this area and it hamstrings us. Graham was actually a huge get for this club as it's almost impossible for us to get the highly credentialled assistants from other clubs, the only one we could pinch from was in our state.

It's why I'm ok with Hardwick, we need as good a Senior coach as we can get because we'll never get a highly credited assistant like some of the names mentioned

It's a fair point and it's almost guaranteed that the names on those lists would be long shots.

But, this is where our CEO and Board earn their keep. We would have said the same thing about getting Lyon back in the day.

If we perennially think like a small club, we'll always be a small club.

 

[estibador]

It's certainly another point to make, we got absolutely destroyed by the umpires today. There was a clear 50 to Johnson not paid, they get a goal. The nearly goal for Shultz, they don't even pause, our players lose concentration for half a second and Carlton go end to end and score. A couple of 12 point plays that affected our morale.

There were a couple more shocking decisions, but these two had the greatest impact.

And Treacy's mark that they called OOB.

His feet were a metre inside the line, I find it very hard to believe that ball was out before he marked it.

 

[Tbonefreo]

True. I felt sorry who actually paid a ticket to watch that game too. Deserves way better than that

My boys first ever game. The carlscum fans didn't help. Blasted one of them, shouldn't have to do that shit

 

[purplearmy]

If they don’t sack the Deer in the headlights at the end of this season it’s just going to the the same old stuff for 2024.

 

[Alfonz]

Only thing I'll say on that first point. We can not get that assistant. It just wont happen here. We are very limited in this area and it hamstrings us. Graham was actually a huge get for this club as it's almost impossible for us to get the highly credentialled assistants from other clubs, the only one we could pinch from was in our state.

It's why I'm ok with Hardwick, we need as good a Senior coach as we can get because we'll never get a highly credited assistant like some of the names mentioned

I said much the same thing on the assistants in an earlier post. The double up could happen as well with Hardwick, as he would be able to attract high pedigree assistants who would sit underneath him that would never lower themselves (in their mind) to work under a minnow coach.

Don't see many clubs looking for a new coach. It's probably only Carlton, GC, Freo that could go early with their coaches contracted until 2024, and I see Carlton leaning to Voss if they keep winning. Not sure on North and Clarkson.

If Hardwick feels ready to coach again next season and it is basically GC versus Freo, then we have to be ruthless and make our best pitch. Compared with Hardwick, I don't see the upside to keeping Longmuir considering he would almost certainly not be better than Hardwick, even in a best case scenario. The main risk would be whether Hardwick truly has the passion again. I think that would be a lesser risk than the potential downside for Longmuir staying and not improving, and then leaving us to appoint another inexperienced coach and hope for the best.

 

[nurries]

I said much the same thing on the assistants in an earlier post. The double up could happen as well with Hardwick, as he would be able to attract high pedigree assistants who would sit underneath him that would never lower themselves (in their mind) to work under a minnow coach.

Don't see many clubs looking for a new coach. It's probably only Carlton, GC, Freo that could go early with their coaches contracted until 2024, and I see Carlton leaning to Voss if they keep winning. Not sure on North and Clarkson.

If Hardwick feels ready to coach again next season and it is basically GC versus Freo, then we have to be ruthless and make our best pitch. Compared with Hardwick, I don't see the upside to keeping Longmuir considering he would almost certainly not be better than Hardwick, even in a best case scenario. The main risk would be whether Hardwick truly has the passion again. I think that would be a lesser risk than the potential downside for Longmuir staying and not improving, and then leaving us to appoint another inexperienced coach and hope for the best.

Hardwick, will be endorsed by the AFL to go to GC. Also why would he come here when the place is full of media leaches baying for blood. He would get way more time at GC

 

[jinxd]

I'm no coach, but if I were JL, I'd get them doing some kind of rotating transition drill at training.
For example: Put 3 or 4 guys on the field; get them to pass from back square to goal as quickly as possible without fumbling or dropping a mark. Rotate through all the players in the team. Those that miss the goal, drop a mark, fumble or go too slowly have to do pushups or run laps etc.. Those that do well, get rewarded.

I know this is only one area of the game we need to improve (i.e. actually winning the ball in the first place), but the amount of times I've thought, "why can't we transition quickly like other teams?". It's like we've forgotten how to do this!

 

[Alfonz]

Hardwick, will be endorsed by the AFL to go to GC. Also why would he come here when the place is full of media leaches baying for blood. He would get way more time at GC

Yeah, I agree with you on GC. But we have to at least give it a go. Ross Lyon came here. These hard nosed coaches don't give two shits about the media. If there's one place less likely to win a flag than Freo, it would be GC. Every sporting club fails there. Maybe that would be the appeal for him to be an all time legend, but we won't know if we don't try. I guess unsuccesfully trying to replace the coach behind his back could come out and that might cause problems.

 

[BeinPurplenGreen]

People think we are just in the valley of despair and things will somehow improve because "we are so young and inexperienced" and "the umpires aren't fair" and "the players aren't executing, the plan is fine".

There is no further slope of enlightenment coming.

The second half of last season was peak mount stupid, the lack of basic coaching competence means we aren't getting any better...

 

[Bokan]

Sorry for the intrusion, but Michael Barlow has been doing excellent work in the vfl, think it could be worth getting him back in the fold in some sort of coaching capacity

On CPH1877 using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[BeinPurplenGreen]

Just on another note, if I read the coaches votes breakdown right, it looks like JL gave Luke Ryan 4 votes and nil votes at all to Sam Walsh

18

Sam Walsh

Age

24

Ht

184cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

25.1

5star

K

13.5

5star

HB

11.6

5star

M

5.1

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

3.4

5star

No current season stats available

D

26.2

5star

K

15.4

5star

HB

10.8

5star

M

6.0

5star

T

3.2

5star

CL

4.8

5star

, who almost all have as in the best 4 on the ground.

Hope I am wrong somehow, because if JL really thinks Luke Ryan was the second best player on the ground, and Walsh wasn't even in the top 5 players, it says everything about why his coaching approach is so deeply flawed. And would indicate a remarkable stubbornness and refusal to acknowledge performance...

 

[rgauci]

It is 100% gameplan and ball movement not playing to their main strengths. On a side note why the * is Schultz running up and down the wing? Remember what Ross said to Neale when he saw him on a wing, that would be my reaction but apparently it's part of the game plan.

He’s playing high half-forward while Walters plays deep.

 

[King Tenz]

Just on another note, if I read the coaches votes breakdown right, it looks like JL gave Luke Ryan 4 votes and nil votes at all to Sam Walsh, who almost all have as in the best 4 on the ground.

Hope I am wrong somehow, because if JL really thinks Luke Ryan was the second best player on the ground, and Walsh wasn't even in the top 5 players, it says everything about why his coaching approach is so deeply flawed. And would indicate a remarkable stubbornness and refusal to acknowledge performance...

View attachment 1734506

Hey now, it could've been Voss. He doesn't seem like smartest tool in the shed either.

 

[Purple Jesus]

Sorry for the intrusion, but Michael Barlow has been doing excellent work in the vfl, think it could be worth getting him back in the fold in some sort of coaching capacity

On CPH1877 using BigFooty.com mobile app

No more Freo people.