USA Kamala Harris the 47th President of the United States - Hopefully.

[troybe]

I genuinely haven't heard an actual plan on how that will be achieved?

It’s a concept of a plan it’s all hyper bowl

 

[OneGreatClub]

I genuinely haven't heard an actual plan on how that will be achieved?

I think it may have something to do with Sharks Whales and Windmills?

 

[Satan]

I genuinely haven't heard an actual plan on how that will be achieved?

Concept in 2 weeks

 

[OneGreatClub]

Sure looks that way.

 

[EagleShore]

You're displaying a breathtaking amount of ignorance while complaining about people not acting in good faith.

Being pro Israel (in the context of its government, or its military actions, or its survival as a nation state) does not necessarily equate to being pro Jewish.

Just before moaning about rabid attack dogs and good faith, in a response to a post that was nothing of the sort, you left the door open for supporters of the Palestinian people to be pro Hamas.

It's not that people won't engage in meaningful conversation, you might just be out of your depth.

Not at all. I am actually laughing at all you people who insist on sticking ideologically with the Democratic party that has become the party doing the bidding of the corrupt establishment - and you have all failed to notice!

The attack on anyone who is not diverse in the way they like; the censorship of legal speech that they don't like; the open border during the bulk of Biden's Presidency, which disproportionately disadvantages low income US citizens insofar as it places an increased burden on social security, downward pressure on wages, and inflationary pressure on housing.

I am not engaging in a debate on who I back in this election because the whole US system is corrupt to the hilt, and I therefore have no dog in this clown show of a political debate. Trump is a Narcissistic businessman, but Kamala is pretending to be something that she is not...competent and genuine. She admitted that she cannot think of anything from Biden's Presidency that she would change.

Just think about this - YOU are vehemently supporting the party that has become the representation of the war mongering establishment that backs the military industrial complex, Wall St, and the revolving door between the FDA and large pharmaceutical companies for example.

Did you ever wonder why Dick Cheney backs your side? DICK CHENEY, FFS?

ALL of you would have been dead against this guy 20 years ago, and if you think he has changed his mindset on perpetual wars to fund his buddies at Halliburton et al., I have a bridge to sell you.


RFK Jr described this change quite well during his speech - again, this does not mean that I agree with every single thing he has ever uttered about vaccines or all other issues...just that he explains my point rather well (see how I have to make such caveats? This is because a significant proportion of you use ad hominem attacks in the process of delivering your arguments):






Tulsi would make a good President, better at least than Kamala and Trump, and she would probably actually beat Trump in any such primary or other election battle. She, like so many US citizens, including Kamala, is a Christian and talks about her God, and yes (cue the caveat), this differs from my perspective (though I am not without my own spirituality - I just call it consciousness rather than God per se). But I put this here to at least explain to you what has happened without you really being aware...that the bent of the political sides have at least partially, but significantly, switched over the past few years:


I draw your attention to 0:42 (for those who wish not to view the whole video)





And please, (cue another caveat), do not let this be misconstrued as an endorsement of The Young Turks (TYT) channel, but Chris from Modern Wisdom, with whom I have found myself agreeing over the past year or so on many issues, discusses some of the aspects of Democrat v Republican politics with Ana from TYT in relation to the changes of identity and character of people who seem to identify with one party or the other:

 

[EagleShore]

The only stupid logic here is held by you.
Being pro Palestine is not being pro hamas.
I believe in a two state solution.
I condemn the actions of Hamas.
I condemn the slaughter of Palestinian people.


Open a history book and find out about Fascism and the Nazi Party.
Understand that the Nazi party started a very similar way of using discontent and the 'enemy' as a means of getting into power. Remembering that they did so without ever having the majority.

I actually agree with the bolded.

I have been here purely to point out the flawed logic leading people to suggest, or otherwise echo, the sentiment that Trump rallies are akin to Nazi rallies from the 1930's.

Many people who would consider themselves as "anti-Nazi" have attended rallies or otherwise supported Trump, as evidenced by the presence of Israeli flags at such events.

People on the left, or those otherwise supporting the Democrats, who espouse the notion that Trump, or pro-Republican individuals, are Nazis, are rendering the debate toxic and this is counterproductive in the quest to contribute to or create constructive discourse.

I am reminded of this production by comedic personality Jonathan Pie (I believe the actor was stating opinions that he truly believed in this bit) immediately after the 2016 election:

 

[Blue1980]

Not at all. I am actually laughing at all you people who insist on sticking ideologically with the Democratic party that has become the party doing the bidding of the corrupt establishment - and you have all failed to notice!

The attack on anyone who is not diverse in the way they like; the censorship of legal speech that they don't like; the open border during the bulk of Biden's Presidency, which disproportionately disadvantages low income US citizens insofar as it places an increased burden on social security, downward pressure on wages, and inflationary pressure on housing.

I am not engaging in a debate on who I back in this election because the whole US system is corrupt to the hilt, and I therefore have no dog in this clown show of a political debate. Trump is a Narcissistic businessman, but Kamala is pretending to be something that she is not...competent and genuine. She admitted that she cannot think of anything from Biden's Presidency that she would change.

Just think about this - YOU are vehemently supporting the party that has become the representation of the war mongering establishment that backs the military industrial complex, Wall St, and the revolving door between the FDA and large pharmaceutical companies for example.

Did you ever wonder why Dick Cheney backs your side? DICK CHENEY, FFS?

ALL of you would have been dead against this guy 20 years ago, and if you think he has changed his mindset on perpetual wars to fund his buddies at Halliburton et al., I have a bridge to sell you.


RFK Jr described this change quite well during his speech - again, this does not mean that I agree with every single thing he has ever uttered about vaccines or all other issues...just that he explains my point rather well (see how I have to make such caveats? This is because a significant proportion of you use ad hominem attacks in the process of delivering your arguments):






Tulsi would make a good President, better at least than Kamala and Trump, and she would probably actually beat Trump in any such primary or other election battle. She, like so many US citizens, including Kamala, is a Christian and talks about her God, and yes (cue the caveat), this differs from my perspective (though I am not without my own spirituality - I just call it consciousness rather than God per se). But I put this here to at least explain to you what has happened without you really being aware...that the bent of the political sides have at least partially, but significantly, switched over the past few years:


I draw your attention to 0:42 (for those who wish not to view the whole video)





And please, (cue another caveat), do not let this be misconstrued as an endorsement of The Young Turks (TYT) channel, but Chris from Modern Wisdom, with whom I have found myself agreeing over the past year or so on many issues, discusses some of the aspects of Democrat v Republican politics with Ana from TYT in relation to the changes of identity and character of people who seem to identify with one party or the other:

FFS you are giving a whos who of "why I left the left" grifters. Why do they do this? There is money to be made grifting and simping for the right, as they are doing the bidding of the super wealthy.

There isn't the same money in the left wing sphere as they are campaigning for those same people to be regulated/taxed more/less influence etc.

Surprised you haven't referenced Dave Rubin and Jimmy Dore to back up your "leaving the left" argument, or Tim Pool. These people believe in nothing and stand for nothing. If you don't realise that, you probably think Russell Brand's transformation is genuine.

Read my other post where I criticise the dems with Cheney, I hate that shit.

For all the flaws with the dems, the GOP are psychotic fascists.

The idea is to get corrpution out of politics and get the dems further left, not go "**** it lets give up on the dems and go fascist with Trump and MAGA".

 

[Bloods86]

Not at all. I am actually laughing at all you people who insist on sticking ideologically with the Democratic party that has become the party doing the bidding of the corrupt establishment - and you have all failed to notice!

The attack on anyone who is not diverse in the way they like; the censorship of legal speech that they don't like; the open border during the bulk of Biden's Presidency, which disproportionately disadvantages low income US citizens insofar as it places an increased burden on social security, downward pressure on wages, and inflationary pressure on housing.

I am not engaging in a debate on who I back in this election because the whole US system is corrupt to the hilt, and I therefore have no dog in this clown show of a political debate. Trump is a Narcissistic businessman, but Kamala is pretending to be something that she is not...competent and genuine. She admitted that she cannot think of anything from Biden's Presidency that she would change.

Just think about this - YOU are vehemently supporting the party that has become the representation of the war mongering establishment that backs the military industrial complex, Wall St, and the revolving door between the FDA and large pharmaceutical companies for example.

Did you ever wonder why Dick Cheney backs your side? DICK CHENEY, FFS?

ALL of you would have been dead against this guy 20 years ago, and if you think he has changed his mindset on perpetual wars to fund his buddies at Halliburton et al., I have a bridge to sell you.


RFK Jr described this change quite well during his speech - again, this does not mean that I agree with every single thing he has ever uttered about vaccines or all other issues...just that he explains my point rather well (see how I have to make such caveats? This is because a significant proportion of you use ad hominem attacks in the process of delivering your arguments):






Tulsi would make a good President, better at least than Kamala and Trump, and she would probably actually beat Trump in any such primary or other election battle. She, like so many US citizens, including Kamala, is a Christian and talks about her God, and yes (cue the caveat), this differs from my perspective (though I am not without my own spirituality - I just call it consciousness rather than God per se). But I put this here to at least explain to you what has happened without you really being aware...that the bent of the political sides have at least partially, but significantly, switched over the past few years:


I draw your attention to 0:42 (for those who wish not to view the whole video)





And please, (cue another caveat), do not let this be misconstrued as an endorsement of The Young Turks (TYT) channel, but Chris from Modern Wisdom, with whom I have found myself agreeing over the past year or so on many issues, discusses some of the aspects of Democrat v Republican politics with Ana from TYT in relation to the changes of identity and character of people who seem to identify with one party or the other:

That's quite the largely fact-free essay. And straying quite from the topic I was raising.

I'll just focus on a couple of points from this gish-gallop, because I'm now having to respond to similar talking points in multiple threads.

No, the things you accuse the Democrats as having become are still worse with Republicans. You only have to see Trump's extreme pro Corporate judicial and cabinet appointments, de-regulatory and anti-democratic actions in his first term to know he is no friend to the American people. He is a greater servant of the corporate elite and powerful interest groups, and himself, than Biden or Harris could hope to be, and they do a pretty good job of serving them.

And I'm aware of the unprincipled regression of Gabbard and Kasparian. I once thought of Tulsi as a potential hope of the Democratic party, but she has been a big disappointment in her trend towards supporting authoritarianism and her disingenuous rhetoric about freedom of speech and the media.

Similarly to Ana K, she appears to have been hurt by some on the left (although in Tulsi's case it was corporate Dems aligning against Bernie), and this has broken them to some degree. Those that change their principles, triggered by meanness of others, deserve little respect. Of course, they may also just be following the more lucrative paths of Dave Rubin, Tim Pool etc.

 

[Blue1980]

That's quite the largely fact-free essay. And straying quite from the topic I was raising.

I'll just focus on a couple of points from this gish-gallop, because I'm now having to respond to similar talking points in multiple threads.

No, the things you accuse the Democrats as having become are still worse with Republicans. You only have to see Trump's extreme pro Corporate judicial and cabinet appointments, de-regulatory and anti-democratic actions in his first term to know he is no friend to the American people. He is a greater servant of the corporate elite and powerful interest groups than Biden or Harris could hope to be, and they do a pretty good job of serving them.

And I'm aware of the unprincipled regression of Gabbard and Kasparian. I once thought of Tulsi as a potential hope of the Democratic party, but she has been a big disappointment in her trend towards supporting authoritarianism and her disingenuous rhetoric about freedom of speech and the media.

Similarly to Ana K, she appears to have been hurt by some on the left (although in Tulsi's case it was corporate Dems), and this has broken them to some degree. Those that change their principles, triggered by meanness of others, deserve little respect. Of course, they may also just be following the more lucrative paths of Dave Rubin, Tim Pool etc.

Ana is just entitled and thinks her shit doesn't stink, and deserves fame and fortune. Pretty telling how shes been salty about Hasan making a lot more money than her.

Basically she sucks, and new fans she has on the right who think she has genuine positions is being duped. Anyone who changes their whole belief system because a few people were mean to her on twitter means she didn't have much of an ideology in the first place.

Tulsi like RFK - only path to relevance was to do the pivot. These people are soulless cynical ghouls. At least Stephen Miller has convictions in his awful beliefs.

 

[EagleShore]

FFS you are giving a whos who of "why I left the left" grifters. Why do they do this? There is money to be made grifting and simping for the right, as they are doing the bidding of the super wealthy.

There isn't the same money in the left wing sphere as they are campaigning for those same people to be regulated/taxed more/less influence etc.

Surprised you haven't referenced Dave Rubin and Jimmy Dore to back up your "leaving the left" argument, or Tim Pool. These people believe in nothing and stand for nothing. If you don't realise that, you probably think Russell Brand's transformation is genuine.

Read my other post where I criticise the dems with Cheney, I hate that shit.

For all the flaws with the dems, the GOP are psychotic fascists.

The idea is to get corrpution out of politics and get the dems further left, not go "**** it lets give up on the dems and go fascist with Trump and MAGA".

All bolded parts (except the Russell Brand part) are ad hominem attacks and thus constitute fallacious logic rendering them poor arguments. I give such flawed logic no consideration.

Russell Brand I suspect may be a grifter, though he possibly actually agrees with the stuff he says, but yeah, I agree that he sells a bunch of useless shit and I personally do not enjoy his style, albeit unique. Tim Pool - I don't watch him.

Jimmy Dore, though, has been onto this stuff before almost anyone else and has talked about how many friends he has lost on the back of his evolving views. I have watched his stuff over the past few years but his videos go on longer than necessary, and the exact same could be said of Rubin (genuine IMO but not my cup of tea).

 

[Bloods86]

Ana is just entitled and thinks her shit doesn't stink, and deserves fame and fortune. Pretty telling how shes been salty about Hasan making a lot more money than her.

Basically she sucks, and new fans she has on the right who think she has genuine positions is being duped. Anyone who changes their whole belief system because a few people were mean to her on twitter means she didn't have much of an ideology in the first place.

Tulsi like RFK - only path to relevance was to do the pivot. These people are soulless cynical ghouls. At least Stephen Miller has convictions in his awful beliefs.

It's unfortunate. TYT were my gateway into progressive/left media, not long after arriving in the political centre from conservatism. Cenk's buffoonery always bugged me, but Ana, John Iadarola and Brett Erlich were good. Assume John and Brett still are, don't watch much of them anymore.

 

[EagleShore]

Neither of you, Blue1980 and Bloods86, have addressed the specific content within the speeches/videos in my post to which you replied.

Your replies are therefore ad hominem attacks and thus constitute flawed logic, and I will refrain from replying further unless you choose to actually address the specific content within.

And when I say "specific content within", I mean that you will need to address actual things that they said, and formulate a response into a specific argument to counter those aspects.

 

[Blue1980]

All bolded parts (except the Russell Brand part) are ad hominem attacks and thus constitute fallacious logic rendering them poor arguments. I give such flawed logic no consideration.

Russell Brand I suspect may be a grifter, though he possibly actually agrees with the stuff he says, but yeah, I agree that he sells a bunch of useless shit and I personally do not enjoy his style, albeit unique. Tim Pool - I don't watch him.

Jimmy Dore, though, has been onto this stuff before almost anyone else and has talked about how many friends he has lost on the back of his evolving views. I have watched his stuff over the past few years but his videos go on longer than necessary, and the exact same could be said of Rubin (genuine IMO but not my cup of tea).

No one in their right mind could think any of those people who have "left the left" are genuine. Opportunists every single one of them. Its about as genuine as born again christians if you suddenly change your entire belief system when you are 35+. Either that or they weren't very "left" to begin with.

I mean if they line up with your views and it makes you feel you are right knock yourself out, but the idea that the MAGA right are somehow less corrupt than the dems and better for the average person are just flat out wrong. These people who have "left the left" know this but see the $$$ of the grift.

 

[Spearman]

They are interesting stats and people closer to the action can comment but I wonder what % of Republicans are wedded to the Tuesday voting cycle v people choosing to vote early?

Spearman whats the shift in attitude over early v day voting?

Eff if I know. I haven't lived there in 3+ decades.
I vote through the US rep office here, so I guess I'm a mail in now. Being a west coaster, the question was usually decided by the time I got to the polls. Never had to stand in any real line either.
I think my old state of WA has all mail in. I would guess since covid many people might have gotten a taste of the convenience and opt for it.
TBH American voters are a mystery to me since Gore-Bush.

 

[Blue1980]

It's unfortunate. TYT were my gateway into progressive/left media, not long after arriving in the political centre from conservatism. Cenk's buffoonery always bugged me, but Ana, John Iadarola and Brett Erlich were good. Assume John and Brett still are, don't watch much of them anymore.

Yeah Cenk is a bit of a blowhard, but he still fights the good fight in a lot of cases, but Ana had been turning me off for a long time, I stick more to Secular Talk, Majority Report, Hasan is entertaining too, and there are others.

The Vanguard boys I like, they have been going hard on TYT and their pivot to bothsidesism and still branding themselves as "home of the progressives" You are right John and Brett are still good tho.

 

[Bloods86]

Neither of you, Blue1980 and Bloods86, have addressed the specific content within the speeches/videos in my post to which you replied.

Your replies are therefore ad hominem attacks and thus constitute flawed logic, and I will refrain from replying further unless you choose to actually address the specific content within.

I don't think you understand what "ad hominem" means.

"Flawed logic" is a bit rich coming from someone who thinks the national flag you might wave at a rally, precludes you or candidates from certain views.

 

[Stokey]

No one in their right mind could think any of those people who have "left the left" are genuine. Opportunists every single one of them. Its about as genuine as born again christians if you suddenly change your entire belief system when you are 35+. Either that or they weren't very "left" to begin with.

I mean if they line up with your views and it makes you feel you are right knock yourself out, but the idea that the MAGA right are somehow less corrupt than the dems and better for the average person are just flat out wrong. These people who have "left the left" know this but see the $$$ of the grift.

Do you think people that switch from the right to the left are opportunists?

The left hate people that leave the cult and treat them as such.

 

[Blue1980]

Neither of you, Blue1980 and Bloods86, have addressed the specific content within the speeches/videos in my post to which you replied.

Your replies are therefore ad hominem attacks and thus constitute flawed logic, and I will refrain from replying further unless you choose to actually address the specific content within.

And when I say "specific content within", I mean that you will need to address actual things that they said, and formulate a response into a specific argument to counter those aspects.

You are upset because we won't humor your fact free BS by engaging with your bad faith arguments.

You are doing the typical right wing trope, claim any batshit insane take you have is worthy of discussion so you can frame the discussion based on a completely false premise. You are either completely disingenuous and/or really gullible.

 

[Ghost Patrol]

Do you think people that switch from the right to the left are opportunists?

The left hate people that leave the cult and treat them as such.

Has FK invited you to the Mensa shed yet?

 

[Blue1980]

I don't think you understand what "ad hominem" means.

"Flawed logic" is a bit rich coming from someone who thinks the national flag you might wave at a rally, precludes you or candidates from certain views.

He just wants to get into the weeds and nuances of Tulsi, Kasparian, Dore etc's views. Its about as worthwhile as discussing the nuances of Jesse Waters and Greg Gutfeld at this point.

 

[Chief]

Well not in woman's sports.

I did actually chuckle at this one.

I mean, I didn't laugh with you, but take it as a win.

 

[Stokey]

I did actually chuckle at this one.

I mean, I didn't laugh with you, but take it as a win.

Chief replied to me!!

This is getting framed and put on the mantlepiece.

 

[Stokey]

Has FK invited you to the Mensa shed yet?

Funny how you and Chief always turn up at the same time.

 

[Bloods86]

Do you think people that switch from the right to the left are opportunists?

The left hate people that leave the cult and treat them as such.

Well it often seems to start with "Oh some people on the left were a bit mean to me or others" and they then steadily move rightward, while "championing" principles the politicians they end up supporting are worse on.

Not necessarily saying that lefties can't be mean, oh they can.

But when you use that as part of your reasoning (which Tulsi, Ana Kasparian, Dave Rubin do), then either your principles driving your positions were fairly weak or maybe there's other motives.

 

[Blue1980]

Do you think people that switch from the right to the left are opportunists?

The left hate people that leave the cult and treat them as such.

Media people - you bet are opportunists. The whole pivot from the left, to enlightened centrist to always ending on the right, to try and maximise their audience. With Ana Kasparian, I and many others picked what she was doing 2 years ago, they just do it gradually enough to try and make it plausible.

Regular people - not necessarily as it can just be evolving beliefs and no obvious benefit like it is in the online political media sphere.

What is this left cult you speak of? There is no cult of Harris (not that I consider her left), there was no cult of Biden (not left either). What on earth are you blabbering on about? Why can't you ever put a good argument together?