Ken Farmer: Greatest Full-Forward of All-time

[scottwade]

1. Ebert was the leading possession getter in the League in his one and only season. quite an achievement from the reserves.

2. the comments refer to a corresponding timeframe. Not sure either Cornes or Ebert played with Ken Farmer. what do you think?

Can you quote a reference for Ebert's stats?
According to the VFL handbook Ian Dunstan had most kicks for 1979, Garry Wilson most handballs.
The reserves reference was to Cornes.

The comments in relation to the SANFL, from most Vics, relate to the period until Blight came over. Until then none of the leading SANFL players were game enough to play in what was undoubtedly the No1 comp in the land.

Ebert & Cornes came in on his coat tails and lasted 1 year.

EDIT; Thats why Farmer is more highly regarded than Robran for example. Because he was willing to play in the VFL.
Similarly Blight, Platten, Kernahan etc are generally more highly thought of (at least outside SA) than Cornes & Ebert.

 

[Jex]

HE NEVER HAD A GAME WHERE HE DIDNT KICK A GOAL, NOT ONCE

He must have lacked versatility

 

[Smokin_Joe]

He didnt kick 100 goals in his first season or 12 goals in his first match

 

[Partridge]

not sure why people bother posting stats from the SANFL and WAFL

its fairly obvious that Victoria is the USA of the AFL world

completely ignorant to anything that doesn't involve them.

No we're not, but any athlete has to ultimately prove themselves at the highest level - which was always the VFL. As great as Farmer undoubtedly was, it's very difficult to get a true assessment, when he wasn't playing in the toughest competition against the very best players. Same with George Doig from WA.

 

[pjcrows]

Victorian's are too ignorant to even slightly appreciate anything related to football that didn't happen in their state pre-1990.

 

[scooter600x]

Victorian's are too ignorant to even slightly appreciate anything related to football that didn't happen in their state pre-1990.

That's not true at all.

I appreciate everything that happened in the SANFL, WAFL and VFA equally.

 

[pjcrows]

That's not true at all.

I appreciate everything that happened in the SANFL, WAFL and VFA equally.

I should change it to most Victorian's.

I think it's a silly argument, really. How do we know who is the "greatest"? There have been so many champion full forwards, all deserving of being named "greatest".

Victorian's will say that SANFL for far less superior to the VFL in terms of quality, and that you can't compare SANFL players to VFL players because they never played in the VFL.

But how will we ever know whether some of the VFL stars would have made it in the SANFL? SANFL from the 1930's to the 1960's was very, very good.

 

[floppinab]

Many come from those leagues back then to the VFL and failed badly as they couldn't cope with the pace of the game and went home or ended up in the Reserves. Many average VFL footballers went to the SANFL and the WAFL after their careers were finished and dominated unmercifully. We all know that. Not hard when the competitions reduced.

Suggest some of these interstaters get the chip of their shoulders.

If it helps any now we believe the current VFL and SANFL & WANFL are equivalent competitions!!!!!

And just as many went to Vic. and did pretty well and just as many come across to Adel. & Perth and struggled. Gary Hardeman was a reasonably player for the Demons but struggled when he came over and played for Sturt. Syd Jackson was a dud with Glenelg, ditto Max Kruse. Where are your names???

Ebert didn't even live in Melb. and rarely trained with the Roos but was brilliant for them that year. Sure there were others that didn't make it but plenty did.

Suggest some of these Victorians get their heads out of t...........

One other thing to consider is that the style of games in the states was a bit different as well. SA players were generally better ball skilled than their Vic. counterparts and played a game more based around that. Vics. were tougher and harder, won more hard ball and played a game more based around that.

FWIW I reckon it's very hard to split Hudson and Farmer, I reckon Coventry, Doig and Lockett sit a level (a very short distance from the other two but nonetheless a level) down from them.

 

[Papa G]

It's pointless to argue with 20 year old Victorians who have only seen the competition dominated by sides from interstate who like to fall back on the glory years of the VFL to denigrate anyone who didn't actually play the game in Victoria.

Even in the glory years of the VFL in the 70's, 80's and early 90's these premiership teams such as North Melbourne, Hawthorn, Carlton etc owed a great deal of their success and indeed players who are champions of their clubs to guys from WA, SA, Tasmania NSW and even QLD & NT. Ofcourse these players, if they had stayed in their own states could not be great footballers. Basically it has nothing to do with talent, you simply had to have a guernsey with the VFL insignia on it - that's what allows you to be a great footballer.

 

[Cyclops]

Farmer's numbers are impressive. So are Doig's. I would love to have seen them in our league. I have a feeling they'd be in the top class, but its just a feeling.

I believe the VFL was superior to the SANFL and WAFL through their entire history (aklthough at times they came moderately cliose, like the VFA did). Some players don't make the leap (eg Robran) but most do, from Polly Farmer to Nathan Buckley.

The SOO were a drunken excursion for the Vics: this is accepted fact. The WA and especially the SA sides took them deadly serious and sometimes pulled off huge upsets, but even given the self imposed handicap the Vics usually ploughed them upmand laughed as they did it.

I do take Farmer's record on Regan seriously, Regan is the Prince of Fullbacks and universally regarded as the best Full back of his era.

 

[rooboy]

My post was truthful

Do you really think it is enough evidence to declare someone the greatest ever despite NEVER seeing them play nor the competition at the time?

So the best players are obviously from the last 30 odd years . Anyone that you have not seen cannot possibly have been any good.

 

[rooboy]

As for the argument put forward by the Vics, that no one, any good, from the SANFL came over to the VFL before the eightees, Bernie Smith went over in the late fourties, and lo and behold, won the Brownlow.

Still never let the facts get in ....................................

 

[Merv]

This old argument again. You'll never win against the Victoria-centric as it is today. You'll never convince them that the leagues were a lot closer in standard decades ago.

Doesn't matter anyway, stats don't tell the full story and it's all subjective. Who's to say he wouldn't have dominated even more in a 1930's VFL?

Mate that statement could not be any more wrong.

I have no problem acknowledging interstate teams, players etc, but unless you perform in the highest competition available it doesn't mean a lot.

So what if he kicked an average of 5 goals a game 10 seperate times on a great FB.
That doesn't make you the best FF of all time.

What does though, is year after year, performing in the highest competition in the land and kicking more goals than any one else in that competition, year after year.

 

[Wildmanwok]

So was Frosty Miller. Kicked a couple a hundred goals in a season for Garfield, or Nar Nar Goon, not sure which one, in the Mid-Gippsland League before kicking 100 for Dandenong. No damn good at Carlton though.

Would that be Ken Farmer's equivalent? If he didn't do it in the Big League we don't fully recognise as it wasn't against the best. Respect it but not recognise him as an all-time great FF.

Did he kick 50 goals in 10 matches against Jack Regan? In losing sides?

 

[Wildmanwok]

i knew a guy when i was 14 who kicked 167 goals a season, meaning he is obviously the greatest full forward of all time

SANFL was a little league compared to the vfl

Did he kick them on Jack Regan?

You missed the point.

 

[Wildmanwok]

Mate that statement could not be any more wrong.

I have no problem acknowledging interstate teams, players etc, but unless you perform in the highest competition available it doesn't mean a lot.

So what if he kicked an average of 5 goals a game 10 seperate times on a great FB.
That doesn't make you the best FF of all time.

What does though, is year after year, performing in the highest competition in the land and kicking more goals than any one else in that competition, year after year.

Find me any player who has averaged 5 goals per game in Interstate Football. Over 10 games. I think you will struggle.

Jack Regan was in the Inaugural Hall of Fame, so I think its fair to say he was a pretty decent fullback.

 

[Wildmanwok]

Mate that statement could not be any more wrong.

I have no problem acknowledging interstate teams, players etc, but unless you perform in the highest competition available it doesn't mean a lot.

The interstate competition back then was the highest level. This was an era when men were proud to represent their state and werent being paid huge dollars. Clubs rarely stopped or tried to stop their players playing at the highest level.

 

[Merv]

Find me any player who has averaged 5 goals per game in Interstate Football. Over 10 games. I think you will struggle.

Jack Regan was in the Inaugural Hall of Fame, so I think its fair to say he was a pretty decent fullback.

Firstly, it's not that important to me to spend my time looking for some one, and there probably isnt one.

Secondly i called him a GREAT FB.

Thirdly, a state game is a once a year game.

My previous statements stand, if you don't do it week after week, year after year, in the best competition, you are not the best.

 

[sherb]

Combine Peter Hudson's record in both the VFL and Tassie leagues and he's scored far more goals than Farmer - 1,721 in fact (and that doesn't include the 317 he scored in night matches, state games or intra-state games).

Players With Over 1,000 Goals

Hudson's 2000 plus goals in senior football is just amazing.

 

[7zark7]

HE NEVER HAD A GAME WHERE HE DIDNT KICK A GOAL, NOT ONCE

I think Mark 'Jacko' Jackson did that as well...in a real competition.

 

[frankc]

Players With Over 1,000 Goals

Hudson's 2000 plus goals in senior football is just amazing.

Hudson is unquestionably the greatest goal kicking purely in terms of output. No one will ever catch that record.

 

[bradrowe#32]

no offence - but your posts are pretty bloody stupid

when have you seem him play - did you even read the post ? chances are he didn;t see him play

but that doesn't stop people pushing other players stats down our throats who haven't played in 50 years

FFS Collingwood still go one about a triple premiership from the 30's

Four in a row.

 

[frankc]

I think it is fair to say the following are amongst the greatest full fowards to play the game.

G Doig, K Farmer, G Coverntry, J Coleman, P Hudson, A Lockett and J Dunstall.

If I had to pick one, as I have said Coleman is the one. 5.47 goals per game in an era when defensive play was encouraged is outstanding. i think you could kick the ball out of bounds on the full with no free kick!

Hudson for mine is second. His overall record is phenomenal.

Lockett and Dunstall compare very favourably as they performed against the best players.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

You never see a West Aussie carrying on like a Port Dork.

That's becasue you have no history specific to your club that stretches back to 1870 or so.

 

[thegossip]

i must of been dreaming in 1972 when north adelaide beat carlton to win the best team in australia. that day both jezza and barassi named robran the best footballer playing in australia, I think i will back then against your judgement any time.