Last night proved that we don't need the Grand Final at the MCG anymore.

[JackOutback]

It really is. Footy has been played at Gosch’s for 160 years - it’s a pretty incredible place. Regardless of whether you’re there with 100k people or with 15k on a rainy as piss Sunday twilight staring out the walkway window at the dog walkers and train lines. Its the birthplace of modern footy. It’s a pretty magical place.

Call me a cynical old bastard, but it's an oval surrounded by concrete and seating. I've been there plenty of times, I know the history, but it's not 'magical' or 'spiritual'. With a packed house, it has great atmosphere, as does most stadiums with a packed house. And with 15k, as there was the time I saw cellar dwellers Melbourne and West Coast in 2010, it's actually a little sad.

 

[captain blood 17]

I'd be surprised if those people even had passion enough to sign up for a Bigfooty account.

I can't tell you who the pre game entertainment or halftime entertainment was for the 2018 GF. What I can tell you is i remember Dom Sheeds oh so sexy left foot banger in the last. And that's how it should be.

 

[kranky al]

Have all the people who want the GF moved been to a GF at the G? It is a great event and if you get to Melbourne on the Thursday and take in the whole build up you will really be part of a special event.
Its not because it can’t be replicated elsewhere because of course it can but the G is a special place fir all Australians and not just Victorians.
It is right now and for the foreseeable future the best place for the GF, I have no doubt in a few decades it will be played elsewhere year to year but lots will have changed by then, there won’t be 10 clubs in Victoria, the game will be non contact, there will be no salary cap, we will probably be using a round ball.
Enjoy what we have and what is left of our great game. Keep it at the G.

yes i have - haw - gee

and no i dont agree that every single grand final should be attended by an 80% victorian crowd

 

[SleepingGiant]

Enough of the 100k people crap. Its meaningless.move the GF around and share the love across the whole country, not just one pocket.

I live in Melbourne but actually agree with you. If you are good enough you will win anyway. As with our performance this year, bring it on. With this being said it isn't changing anytime soon. Statistically an interstate home team would have more of an advantage than a Vic home team. Tough one and no easy answer but I sympathise with you lot. It is easier for a WC or BL or Port to get there by winning during the H&A but it disadvantages you when you get to the GF. Interstate home finals are so hard for VIC sides to overcome yet it's hard for you guys come the GF if you play an MCG Tennant. I don't think there is as much of a competitive advantage as is put out here BUT for the good of the game and growth, the GF should be shared from time to time that is for sure.

 

[greatwhiteshark]

yes i have - haw - gee

and no i dont agree that every single grand final should be attended by an 80% victorian crowd

No matter what state it is in the crowd will be 60-80% locals. Unfortunately we joined the VFL, we were not part of establishing a new national league where all of these types of things may of been on the table.
We also have to accept that every club seems happy with it being at the G as not one CEO has ever tried to mount a case to take to head office to change it. Why has Nisbett and other CEO's never said a word about it?

 

[JackOutback]

We also have to accept that every club seems happy with it being at the G as not one CEO has ever tried to mount a case to take to head office to change it. Why has Nisbett and other CEO's never said a word about it?

I don't think 1+1=2 here.

 

[kranky al]

No matter what state it is in the crowd will be 60-80% locals. Unfortunately we joined the VFL, we were not part of establishing a new national league where all of these types of things may of been on the table.
We also have to accept that every club seems happy with it being at the G as not one CEO has ever tried to mount a case to take to head office to change it. Why has Nisbett and other CEO's never said a word about it?

actually they have.

ive listed them before unfortunately any googling now seems to bring up 2020 gf


when it was initially announced everyone was blindsided but sydney especially have been vocal about it.

 

[kranky al]

No matter what state it is in the crowd will be 60-80% locals. Unfortunately we joined the VFL, we were not part of establishing a new national league where all of these types of things may of been on the table.
We also have to accept that every club seems happy with it being at the G as not one CEO has ever tried to mount a case to take to head office to change it. Why has Nisbett and other CEO's never said a word about it?

as for it being 60-80% locals - thats great - people from every state should be able to see it not just victorian and interstaters who can afford to pay thousands

 

[Dank Academy]

Given the current contract - I'm well aware that this is all a waste of hot air, but nonetheless I think that the following would take the game to another level:

- A bidding system to 'win' the rights to host the entire package - GF/parade/Brownlow - for 2 consecutive years (can't win 2 contracts in a row)
- AFL establishes minimum-specs for hosting stadium (e.g. ~70,000 capacity)
- Host city to determine kickoff time (night/day/twilight)

Outcomes:
- Improved stadium facilities across Aus
- AFL rake it in from the state v state bidding war
- GF rotation improves the exposure of the game
- A greater number/variety of Australians would have the opportunity to attend a GF
- Each host city would give the game a unique feel
- Extra impetus for clubs to maximise success when their state is hosting
- Naturally, Vic Govt would ensure that the GF would still be played at the MCG in front of 100,000 at the same kick-off time to please the traditionalists... Imagine how the media/populace would wax lyrical about 'returning home' and all that crap.

 

[Coolangatta]

I've said it before but **** the grand final entertainment off and give the grand final to the home state of whoever finishes first: SCG, Gabba, MCG, Adelaide Oval, or Optus. That's five weeks for people to prepare for airfare, accommodation, and other essentials. But make it an afternoon/evening game, not a night grand final.

 

[footy75]

First let's see 100k at the MCG at night with decent music, fireworks and lights and then we will talk.

Why do the AFL choose music to put people to sleep before a game of football (besides Wolfmother) I don't understand it.

 

[Senor M]

Given the current contract - I'm well aware that this is all a waste of hot air, but nonetheless I think that the following would take the game to another level:

- A bidding system to 'win' the rights to host the entire package - GF/parade/Brownlow - for 2 consecutive years (can't win 2 contracts in a row)
- AFL establishes minimum-specs for hosting stadium (e.g. ~70,000 capacity)
- Host city to determine kickoff time (night/day/twilight)

Outcomes:
- Improved stadium facilities across Aus
- AFL rake it in from the state v state bidding war
- GF rotation improves the exposure of the game
- A greater number/variety of Australians would have the opportunity to attend a GF
- Each host city would give the game a unique feel
- Extra impetus for clubs to maximise success when their state is hosting
- Naturally, Vic Govt would ensure that the GF would still be played at the MCG in front of 100,000 at the same kick-off time to please the traditionalists... Imagine how the media/populace would wax lyrical about 'returning home' and all that crap.

I understand your thought process in theory but the practicality of the third situation made it implausible IMO.

The TV rights holder are a significantly more valuable stakeholder to keep happy (approx. $500 mil a year compared to approx $20-25 mil a year for the GF contract) and I can't imagine that Channel 7 & Foxtel would be happy with the host city deciding what time of day the Grand Final occurs.

I think it's a guarantee that the 2021 Grand Final WILL be a night Grand Final (as will any other Grand Final's in the current TV rights deal), it's probably already been added in the renegotiated deal after the season hiatus. Once the current agreement is up I think the AFL will hold the Grand Final whenever it makes the most money for television, regardless of what the 'fans' of the game want.

 

[Dank Academy]

I understand your thought process in theory but the practicality of the third situation made it implausible IMO.

The TV rights holder are a significantly more valuable stakeholder to keep happy (approx. $500 mil a year compared to approx $20-25 mil a year for the GF contract) and I can't imagine that Channel 7 & Foxtel would be happy with the host city deciding what time of day the Grand Final occurs.

I think it's a guarantee that the 2021 Grand Final WILL be a night Grand Final (as will any other Grand Final's in the current TV rights deal), it's probably already been added in the renegotiated deal after the season hiatus. Once the current agreement is up I think the AFL will hold the Grand Final whenever it makes the most money for television, regardless of what the 'fans' of the game want.

Yeah I totally agree on that point - unfortunately it's just about the $$.
Edit - but wouldn't it be great?!

 

[Blues_Man]

Despite being a Queenslander, I'll admit that the Gabba is probably considered 4th tier in terms of AFL stadiums, yet it was able to host a Grand Final that drew huge ratings and the game's quality wasn't effected at all. There's also the narrative of what a novelty grand final will bring to the state and how it could be perceived as "New". Whether you agree with it or not, every Grand Final at the MCG feels the same. The same tune is repeated year in, year out, the same commentators, the same production, etc. Can you imagine the event of a Grand Final in Perth? Or Adelaide? Or Sydney? You would get something different each year instead of tredding the predictable nature of showing the game at the G. Now, that's not to say that the MCG should host the grand final, however, why not share the event around? I know I would rather watch a grand final in Perth than at the G after seeing that it can work.

It was pretty crappy compared to normal Grand finals ..so i think it proved the opposite

 

[Aussie in exile]

Incorrect, the very first game of footy was held in the precinct ( Yarra park ) & it has been hosting matches since the VFL’s very first year.... It is without doubt the spiritual home of AFL.

And Australian Cricket

 

[greatwhiteshark]

I understand your thought process in theory but the practicality of the third situation made it implausible IMO.

The TV rights holder are a significantly more valuable stakeholder to keep happy (approx. $500 mil a year compared to approx $20-25 mil a year for the GF contract) and I can't imagine that Channel 7 & Foxtel would be happy with the host city deciding what time of day the Grand Final occurs.

I think it's a guarantee that the 2021 Grand Final WILL be a night Grand Final (as will any other Grand Final's in the current TV rights deal), it's probably already been added in the renegotiated deal after the season hiatus. Once the current agreement is up I think the AFL will hold the Grand Final whenever it makes the most money for television, regardless of what the 'fans' of the game want.

It's to late now as they have already sold their soul but I am a believer that the AFL Should set everything, the fixture, times, when and how and say to the TV rights what will you pay us to broadcast our product. That is the true worth of the game then with integrity of the comp the dominant force.
By allowing TV stations to have a say in your product the sport and the league becomes a bit of a joke, integrity of the comp is removed.
But like I said they have already sold their soul for the cash and what we have left is a hybrid version of Aussie Rules totally run by a TV station.

 

[juss]

Despite being a Queenslander, I'll admit that the Gabba is probably considered 4th tier in terms of AFL stadiums, yet it was able to host a Grand Final that drew huge ratings and the game's quality wasn't effected at all. There's also the narrative of what a novelty grand final will bring to the state and how it could be perceived as "New". Whether you agree with it or not, every Grand Final at the MCG feels the same. The same tune is repeated year in, year out, the same commentators, the same production, etc. Can you imagine the event of a Grand Final in Perth? Or Adelaide? Or Sydney? You would get something different each year instead of tredding the predictable nature of showing the game at the G. Now, that's not to say that the MCG should host the grand final, however, why not share the event around? I know I would rather watch a grand final in Perth than at the G after seeing that it can work.

There's a lot of huff and puff here but I don't think you've really explained how it would be better. This reads as a rotate the GF thread because you want it to.

yet it was able to host a Grand Final that drew huge ratings and the game's quality wasn't effected at all.

Of course it was able to host it. Any sporting ground in Australia that houses AFL matches could theoritcally host a Grand Final, but it doesn't mean it necessarily should. COVID aside, there'd have been atleast 60k less fans than their would have been for a Rich/Geel game last night if those teams made a GF at the MCG. There was never a question of a ground being "able" to host it.

There's also the narrative of what a novelty grand final will bring to the state and how it could be perceived as "New".

You get this novelty once. And there's not much "new", there is one storyline, Brisbane/Perth/Adelaide/Sydney's first Grand Final, that's it, and then the novelty is gone.

Whether you agree with it or not, every Grand Final at the MCG feels the same. The same tune is repeated year in, year out, the same commentators, the same production, etc.

Sorry but what does this mean? The same commentators would still call the game, the event would still follow the same structure. The match itself is just the match, it changes year on year.

Can you imagine the event of a Grand Final in Perth? Or Adelaide? Or Sydney? You would get something different each year instead of tredding the predictable nature of showing the game at the G.

What exactly would you get different? Apart from a smaller crowd? What do you expect would change? What is the predictable nature of the game at the MCG? How does this differ to other stadiums, are you going to play it on a square ground?

why not share the event around?

Well you absolutely could, but you haven't provided any real reasons as to why you should

I know I would rather watch a grand final in Perth than at the G after seeing that it can work.

Okay, but why? How is your experience if watching from home Rich v Geel better if that game is in Perth vs it being at the MCG? What changes for you? Why are people more likely to watch that match up there than at the MCG?

 

[Hap Hapablap]

was a horrible spectacle but external circumstances caused it.

 

[telsor]

Absolutely moronic to sign up the MCG as the GF venue to when many of us will be dead.

If they hadn’t, there would be bidding wars between states to get a GF (fixtured a few years in advance).

I’d love to see it move around.

Thing is, there was a bid for the current GF contract, and it was so good for the AFL that they didn't even bother soliciting other bids. It also needed to be long term because it involved large scale construction/refurbishment which benefitted the AFL.


Even if they did hold an auction every year, it would require a stupid bid from elsewhere to beat what the Vic/MCG could offer because a 100K ground will simply generate more revenue than anywhere else could, and thus be able to bid more. This would be even more pronounced so when you remember that one of the requirements of bidding would be that the AFL gets 30-40K seats 'free' in order to seat all the corporates, players, life members, and some AFL members, etc.

 

[Craze]

I think it showed that a rotating GF wouldn't have been the end of the world like Victorians shout every time someone suggests it. Could easily make it every other year that it rotates between Brisbane, Adelaide, Perth and Sydney. So you'd have something like:

2021 - MCG
2022 - Adelaide Oval
2023 - MCG
2024 - Optus Stadium
2025 - MCG
2026 - SCG
2027 - Gabba

And so on. That way you're still recognising and understanding the particular place that the MCG has in the AFL but also seeing that it's no longer a Victorian competition and spreading it around the country.

Of course it's a pointless discussion because the AFL somehow signed a 10,000 year contract.

Love how you worked the SCG into the mix. You cannot be serious wanting to play the grand final on a postage stamp. Jesus even I could kick a goal from the '50' metre arc.

 

[Leeda]

certainty is that vic.s .. will kick up a stink about the Grand Final...

 

[kranky al]

Thing is, there was a bid for the current GF contract, and it was so good for the AFL that they didn't even bother soliciting other bids. It also needed to be long term because it involved large scale construction/refurbishment which benefitted the AFL.


Even if they did hold an auction every year, it would require a stupid bid from elsewhere to beat what the Vic/MCG could offer because a 100K ground will simply generate more revenue than anywhere else could, and thus be able to bid more. This would be even more pronounced so when you remember that one of the requirements of bidding would be that the AFL gets 30-40K seats 'free' in order to seat all the corporates, players, life members, and some AFL members, etc.

victorian poast are victorian poast

if a ground holds 60% of the mcg put the prices up for seats to match

still cheaper than flying to melbourne with hotels etc

 

[Thrawn]

Call me a cynical old bastard, but it's an oval surrounded by concrete and seating. I've been there plenty of times, I know the history, but it's not 'magical' or 'spiritual'. With a packed house, it has great atmosphere, as does most stadiums with a packed house. And with 15k, as there was the time I saw cellar dwellers Melbourne and West Coast in 2010, it's actually a little sad.

Figures that someone with a Rian Johnson avatar wouldn't understand "soul".

 

[telsor]

victorian poast are victorian poast

if a ground holds 60% of the mcg put the prices up for seats to match

still cheaper than flying to melbourne with hotels etc

He was talking about bidding for it though.

If it only holds 60K, that'd only be ~20-30K making money Vs 60-70K at the G, so you'd need to charge over twice as much. (even more at other venues).

You're also adding expenses elsewhere given the people the AFL would need to fly in & accomodate, so you'd need to make up that with more revenue too.

 

[doppleganger]

It is a game for everyone. In your argument it should be the same 35k that are entitled to go every year. If you want to build the game you need as many different people being able to experience it, by moving around the country this allows for this change.

?
No the argument is that the MCG currently allocates about 35-40k tickets to members of competing clubs.

Most clubs have tiered membership categories where people pay a premium to get a GF ticket if their clubs make it. That is just bonus revenue for clubs.

How can they offer those memberships if it will be rotated to smaller venues?

And also when it is an 80% chance the game will involve two east coast teams, it is nonsensical to schedule a random GF in Perth as you again can’t guarantee that actual competing club members will be able to get there.

The AFL also gives every listed player a couple of tickets, all the life members etc and guess where majority of them are based...

Its easy to claim its tradition, "its the way it should be..." when you are at the good end of the stick. When you are oppressed (strong language) you obviously want to see some level of change, which is effectively what is happening now. This is something that society in general struggles to see.

Oppressed...lol

The league plays the GF at the biggest stadium possible, just like basically all Aussie rules comps in Australia.

That isn’t because of tradition

It is the financial model, and catering to the market...which is again the east coast.

The regional fans always cop the rough end of the pineapple, as the big cities always get the bigger events...no different on a national scale.

If you want to blow everything up and start again, then yeah you would go with a minor premier hosts type of deal.

At the end of the day it would be a sell out no matter where you looked for it. If packages were offered to the interstate members of whichever club at the beginning of the season (if their team was successful). You would still have loyal passionate fans, just ones that live in a different state.

Well yeah, when you can only fit 40k of course it will sell out.

So a rotating year has it at the GABBa, does that mean all 18 clubs can no longer offer GF access packages to 15k top tier members? So forgoing significant ‘revenue’.

Do you then give a QLD based Pie member access over someone who has been a social club member for the last 30 years??

The problem with rotating is that you are depriving fans of the chance to see their team witness a live GF.

And if you are going to 40k at the GABBa, then what about 35k at Geelong? Or what about 25k at Gold Coast?

Where do you draw the line and why?

If you are being ‘fair’ Geelong and Gold Coast fans deserve the exposure just as much as Perth.