I know plenty of people years ago who were loyal lions fans, and had family seasons tickets, reserved seats etc. we all sat together in stand on southern wing. When we started winning flags, the club in their wisdom, jacked the prices up and moved these people to inferior seats. Prices went through the roof for the same product. Reckon half left and I haven't seen them since. Dreadful bit of marketing and business acumen there.
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AFLW 2024 - Round 6 - Chat, game threads, injury lists, team lineups and more.
Lions are "the League's Strategic Disaster"
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karix
Yarrr!
I dare you to make a positive comment about the club. I don't think you even know how.
Kesterday has a point.
I didn't realise we were dead last. I guess that's why LeighMatthews has been so vocal about it.
We need a flag.
Betty Noir
Club Legend
Just out of interest, is your user name related to the president of Syria, or the manager of Man-U? One in the same really...
karix
Yarrr!
Actually Kesterday I made the comment because I read 3 different threads where all of your comments were utterly negative, this just happened to be the last of those three.
I won't hold my breath to wait for a positive or perhaps even just a neutral/balanced comment from you then eh?
- May 5, 2013
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Yeah I hear Ya would be great ,Gees even if stopped the floggings and changed from the turnover kings to a team that is consistantly like a genuine top 8 team I reckon it would be a start to get the members that just couldn't take it anymore to come back, and obviously more sponsers, corporate dollars.
Just on a comparitive note went to the Roar yesterday and they only got about 15,000 there, I wonder if their success comes from propping up from the A league or on their own back. Probably dont really care to be honest, just a thought.
Settle down Kariz old mate
Your attack on my posts seems amazingly personal. If you don't like what I post, don't reed it.
This thread is about a problem the AFL have identified at our Club. I made a small comment about one of the reasons where we went off the rails. There have been more than that one. That's the reason why Leigh Matthews and others did what they did (thankfully) to try and get our Club back to where we need to be. Our Club is in a financial abyss and we need to address how we got here before we can work out how we get out. If your bagging me for having the audacity to state the bleeding obvious then I dare say you are having a crack at the members who rallied to overthrow the old board. They clearly expressed dissatisfaction at how the club was being run. If you don't think our Club has lost its way both off the field, then I would suggest your in denial.
My other posts, which you seem to have taken offence about, relate to how I felt about our NAB Cup performance. I thought it was dreadful and I thought the level of skills shown - even though they were young players - was concerning. If you didn't, that's great, but for me it was hardly inspiring. My opinion has been confirmed and posted by numerous others, yet you seem to have launched a personal crack at me. Funny, I have never noticed you.
You also had a crack when I suggested the marketing department of the club wouldn't have been happy with the NAB Cup result suggesting a 'who cares' attitude. If you have been listening to the commentary on NAB Cup games, these esteemed commentators have regularly mentioned an early good showing at NAB Cup is good for sponsorship, membership enquiries and ticket sales. Seems commercially logical doesn't it? These blokes must have no idea as well huh?
We need both on and off field success and, given the reports about our financial position, I don't think you can flippantly suggest, who cares about the NAB Cup result from a marketing point of view. We perform off the track, attract more sponsors, sell more tickets, merchandise etc. and become more financial, then we ultimately get a bigger football budget - and that my friend is where we can get on field assistance.
karix
Yarrr!
No personal attacks. Just observations, questions and a pretty simple challenge. I suggest if you don't want people to make comments about your opinions then the internet is the wrong place to post them
But if you're going to quote me please do so accurately. I never said there was a 'who cares' attitude. In that post I asked a question and suggested people might be overestimating how popular NAB cup is in Queensland. When Mickyconlan pointed out that it isn't just about Queenslanders I conceded that he had a good point.
I can't deny most of the negatives you've bought up, they're solid points. But I struggle to believe that a well spoken (written?) big footy poster such as yourself can't find a silver lining somewhere - or even a glimmer of hope to say something good about.
If I hurt your feelings or made you feel victimised by asking if you could post a bit more positively, I apologise.
- May 5, 2013
- 2,297
- 3,041
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- Brisbane Lions
I agree that a positive show in these preseason games are better (short term)for membership drives , but lets look at it realistically, are people going to get full season membership or any membership on the win on a couple of preseason games or are they more likely to join if we have a descent start in round 1 or 2.
So Lepper fields a team to accommodate the best scoring results in the nab, we get a few more ticket sales , possible short term sponsors, but if we fail once the season starts all that positive exposure is quickly forgotten ,but if we are more successful in the season proper , that's when the inflow of members ,ticket sales,sponsors will improve.
Leppa is focusing on the first round of the season , and to his credit no one is manipulating his thoughts or priorities in this cause. That is why we bought season tickets this year, he has the tiller . We should give him credit for doing HIS job and thats to get the boys ready for GAME 1 .
He is right when he says nobody will remember the first game of the nab preseason comp once round 1 starts.
I,m wrapped that he is totally focusing on round 1 and not some glorified trials match, and thats all it is and should be , trial games to get games in the legs and to see and players in positions,game plan that's it, the score is irrelevant.
We are also the only one of four frontier clubs without some form of salary cap retention assistance - it might not be relevant now that we can't afford to pay the cap but it was a major reason we got into trouble onfield...the removal of the zone concession specifically to prevent Riewoldt joining us was another
Listening to to likes of Collingwood, Carlton and Essendon was the biggest mistake the AFL made - we were terminal before the Suns came in
I hated the AFL for being so influenced by those dirty rat-****ers and I lost a lot of passion for the Melbourne-centric version of the game
I'm glad the AFL acknowledge the issues but I suspect it's more about a threat to tv ratings in the northern market and knock-on effect to next tv deal - regardless, I still think they've done too little, too late
**** you, Melbourne mafia
Listening to to likes of Collingwood, Carlton and Essendon was the biggest mistake the AFL made - we were terminal before the Suns came in
I hated the AFL for being so influenced by those dirty rat-****ers and I lost a lot of passion for the Melbourne-centric version of the game
I'm glad the AFL acknowledge the issues but I suspect it's more about a threat to tv ratings in the northern market and knock-on effect to next tv deal - regardless, I still think they've done too little, too late
**** you, Melbourne mafia
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One of the (many) reasons I support the Lions is the Melbourne centric nature of the AFL. Lots of supporters of Melbourne based clubs don't get it. Unless we have a thriving national league Australian football will be a quaint minor sport in 20 years.
- Jan 13, 2001
- 15,901
- 6,942
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- Other Teams
- Man City
When the club starts treating its members with respect then it will deserve positive comments, but the administration of the Lions over the last decade has been the worst in the league. I'm a Victorian member (God only knows why), whilst some things seem to improved this season in recent years we've been an after thought that has shown a massive level of disrespect to us. 10 years ago there were over 4,000 Victorian members, I don't know the number now but it wouldn't be half that. It's been a similar story in Brisbane from what I've been told, the club just assumed that members would renew so they didn't make sure they were satisfied with what they got, so no surprise when people dropped off.
I second the motion.
chopperduck
Brownlow Medallist
I dont think there has been any shift with members in brisbane. Our SEQ membership base is most directly influenced by ladder position.
chopperduck
Brownlow Medallist
Gee I really hope the expand and put a new team in FNQ and make eddie run it, then he might learn a thing or 2. Was a good read skoob.
The inaccuracy in the article is that at the end of 2004 we were in a very strong off field position, however through exceptionally poor management we pissed that up against the wall and then through ladder decline, external forces and some extraordinary disasters (both internal and external) we find ourselves where we are today.
chopperduck
Brownlow Medallist
I would say we were sitting pretty, but we were no powerhouse off the field. We gambled it on the stock market and lost it, when that money could have helped to fund the social club or new facilities. Instead we costed along whilst everyone else increased and we now find ourself miles behind the rest and having to go into debt just to play catch up.
I guess the other point is it tookmaking 4 GFs in a row to get us that money, and winning 3 in a row. That doesnt happen often, but we need to achieve those kinds of feats just to be on par with Vic clubs. Shows the balance isnt right.
I guess the other point is it tookmaking 4 GFs in a row to get us that money, and winning 3 in a row. That doesnt happen often, but we need to achieve those kinds of feats just to be on par with Vic clubs. Shows the balance isnt right.
To suggest we were a "powerhouse" is untrue. Perhaps for the 'here & now' (there & then?) we had some money and good membership numbers (still 10 000 behind Collingwood), but realistically, what were our prospects? Qld didn't magically become an AFL loving breeding ground for success just because we won a few flags. The same problems that The Bears faced 10 years earlier, still remained. The cycle of life means that we would inevitably drop out of 'the 8' sooner or later and memberships would dive.
Regardless of how we spent our money, without some sort of assistance it would eventually dry up. We would and will never enjoy the recruiting, marketing and media success of Essendon, Carlton, or Collingwood.
In the 10 years since, Collingwood's membership has doubled while ours continues to languish. I know, on field success for the 2 clubs are poles apart over those 10 years, but 40 000 worth?
So, while we may have had money in the bank and good membership numbers for the time, our prospects going forward were certainly not the same as the Melbourne based 'powerhouses'.
What I found most interesting, was the author's take on "haves & have nots".
I can understand why The Pies & Bombers get ANZAC day, but it will get a bit boring when one or the other drops in form (Last year's game was rubbish),
but these fixturing issues mean the rich just get richer.
chopperduck
Brownlow Medallist
I have no problem with the AFL using the fixture to maximise gate takings and broadcast deals by having the big games. It makes sense to do so. The problem is, that means the power clubs are getting preference, and things aren't equal. There has to be some kind of cap on how much the big clubs can make on these blockbuster games they are given, with the AFL taking the cream from the top. The clubs already benefit from having the crowds and the exposure. The AFL can use the cream to give back to the clubs who are taking a hit in the fixture so that the AFL can maximise profits on the broadcast deal.
With all the clubs getting different deals on different stadiums making different cuts from profits of different things, there needs to be some kind of equalisation at the end of the day. If the lower clubs are getting a bit extra to keep them above water, so that they don't need bail outs from the AFL, than the AFL will be better off for it. The power clubs are still making plenty of profit, and there is only so much you can spend (especially if a footy dept cap is brought in) before it simply doesn't help you on the field. Clubs should be able to bank away some profits for a rainy day, or to go towards new facilities down the road, but it's not fair when only the top group of teams can afford to do that, when given everything from the AFL in terms of crowds, fixture and exposure, whilst the rest feed off the crumbs and make do with what they are given.
With all the clubs getting different deals on different stadiums making different cuts from profits of different things, there needs to be some kind of equalisation at the end of the day. If the lower clubs are getting a bit extra to keep them above water, so that they don't need bail outs from the AFL, than the AFL will be better off for it. The power clubs are still making plenty of profit, and there is only so much you can spend (especially if a footy dept cap is brought in) before it simply doesn't help you on the field. Clubs should be able to bank away some profits for a rainy day, or to go towards new facilities down the road, but it's not fair when only the top group of teams can afford to do that, when given everything from the AFL in terms of crowds, fixture and exposure, whilst the rest feed off the crumbs and make do with what they are given.
Eddie is well known for making big statements but we were well positioned and had a strong platform to capitalise on the threepeat and basically through arrogance and mismanagement we blew it, it's not all circumstancial while we are where we are. We went from a club of choice to the last chance saloon in 10 years. That is why the AFL have sat back for so long. The biggest stumbling block to getting the assistance that we need is that we have three cups sitting in the foyer while plenty of others have 0 from the last 30+ years.
I certainly agree with the bolded, and I also suggest that is unfair.
I don't begrudge Sydney a COLA for example. The percentage may be a bit high, but in a league state they need their players to feel that they are not disadvantaged by moving there. My beef with the COLA is that we should be entitled to concessions as well. Our players don't have the same access to third party & marketing opportunities as they would in Melbourne. Like the Lions, it has been labeled as unfair that they were successful with concessions and that somehow translates to them not deserving any. The cost of living didn't suddenly become cheaper because they won a flag. Concessions shouldn't be ripped away because you were able to capitalise and compete. Reassess them and their value, sure but the pre-existing situation that warranted a concession are still there, as they are up here. I didn't see any moves or policy to handicap Geelong after their string of success, why Brisbane and Sydney.
You're right about those 3 cups, and the signing of Tippett & Franklin almost brought undone Sydney. If the Swans go anywhere near the Grand Final this year with Franklin kicking bags, the COLA will be gone (it may anyway).
I don't dispute that we lost a lot through mismanagement and poor investment, I am just not convinced we would be far better off now had we done it differently.
To market AFL in Sydney and Queensland ( and that means having competitive teams and financially sustainable clubs) we need good support. If the southern clubs think that we shouldn't exist if we can't survive on our own, then they will have to make do with a 14 club competition (how are they going in the west?) and a much reduced TV viewership & revenue. As the game shrinks so will those clubs left and before you know it, it will be a 12 club competition.
A bit melodramatic perhaps, but people like Eddie miss the point when it comes to concessions and equalisation.
That's the catch 22, isn't it? I agree, it makes sense for the fixture and programming to work that way (for now), after all, much of the benefit is for the game and the AFL as an organisation and therefore all clubs in some way. If other strategies are used for equalisation to produce a more competitive comp and stronger clubs all 'round, in the longer term a Suns v Melbourne Friday night game may be commercially viable.
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