List Management - Trading and Delistings

[yebiga]

Seeing we are drifting into player list appraisals:

simply cannot see the value of SKINNER or REDPATH

Really Concerned that PEARCE offers little but clogging the list
Like everyone else says, unless VEZ can get his tank up to marathon level before Christmas, I would not waste any more time.

Concerned at the lack of progress by GRANT and CORDY - really getting sick of it

Someone earlier was questioning TUTT. In 2011 he showed he could win contested ball and use his pace with decent decisions and delivery. 2012 was a disaster, perhaps due to injury but he would not want another like it.

As for the Draft, both Whitfield and O'Rourke are way over rated - not sure what people are thinking.

On the other hand - Hoskin-Elliot looks awesome. If we have any chance of getting him for 2014, we should move heaven and earth.

Josh Simpson will have twice the AFL career of O'Rourke - too many here are besotted by possessions kids have playing against other kids.

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

Johannisen:

My favourite tennis player, Jo-Wilfried Tsonga:

Definitely a sign.

 

[doggies ftw]

Really hope it's true about WHE and we manage to score him cheaply, also I doubt the uncertainty of going into the draft again would really worry Patton too much (if he did want to leave that is) there is no chance he would not get picked up, and hardly any chance he wouldn't go in the top 3 (especially of the PSD) so he would know what he's getting himself into.

We just have so many quality options this draft I think we need to go with best available and we can try to fix our holes a bit later on.

In order of preference I hope or draft goes ...

2 of Toumpas/O'Rourke/Menzel/Macrae/Mayes/Stringer/Grundy at 5 and 6.

But 22 is the interesting one because there are so many different scenarios.

Best case scenario is one of Garlett/Garner/Kennedy or even Menzel/Stringer slip and we grab a bargain or if we want to go KPP after picking up 2 mids we could grab one of Shaw/Jaksch/O'Brien/Clurey. If no one highly rated slips and we want to grab another small we can still get a Simpson/Colquhoun/Wright/Hrovat and still pick up a very good player.

 

[immortalmike]

Seeing we are drifting into player list appraisals:

simply cannot see the value of SKINNER or REDPATH
Agree.

Really Concerned that PEARCE offers little but clogging the list
He just had his debut season and played a handful of games where he got plenty of the ball and didn't look uncomfortable at the level what the hell else do you want from him.
Like everyone else says, unless VEZ can get his tank up to marathon level before Christmas, I would not waste any more time.
Agree
Concerned at the lack of progress by GRANT and CORDY - really getting sick of it
Grant fair enough, but this was Cordy's first full year uninjured when were you expecting to see the progress. Surely not in the London game...

Someone earlier was questioning TUTT. In 2011 he showed he could win contested ball and use his pace with decent decisions and delivery. 2012 was a disaster, perhaps due to injury but he would not want another like it.
Fair enough.
As for the Draft, both Whitfield and O'Rourke are way over rated - not sure what people are thinking.

On the other hand - Hoskin-Elliot looks awesome. If we have any chance of getting him for 2014, we should move heaven and earth.

Josh Simpson will have twice the AFL career of O'Rourke - too many here are besotted by possessions kids have playing against other kids.

Some comments in bold. Just a question how much have you actually seen of O'Rourke, Whitfield, Simpson and Hoskin-Elliott? Because you'd want to have seen more than just the vids posted on this forum to be ever taken seriously again...



Overall, I think weighing up what I've read here and some other places as well as just based on each player's stated strengths and weaknesses in my very humble and relatively uneducated opinion I'd be very happy if we drafted, O'Rourke at 5, Stringer at 6, and O'Brien/Simpson at 22. Just think it gives us a little bit of everything as well as three really talented kids that'll fill some holes in our list. With O'Rourke we have what has described as close to a sure thing, Stringer is a beast that can play anywhere and I'm not even moderately worried about the leg (name one teenager who has broken a leg and not come back fine), and with O'Brien you have an athletically gifted highly valued KPP or Simpson a flashy quick outside player.

So it has taken over a month for me to come to the same conclusion I had already made with the added inclusion of O'Brien...I'm not sure that's progress but it's something...

 

[Super Hans]

Seeing we are drifting into player list appraisals:


As for the Draft, both Whitfield and O'Rourke are way over rated - not sure what people are thinking.

On the other hand - Hoskin-Elliot looks awesome. If we have any chance of getting him for 2014, we should move heaven and earth.

Josh Simpson will have twice the AFL career of O'Rourke - too many here are besotted by possessions kids have playing against other kids.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but this statement is just wrong. Please back it up with some kind of statistic?? I am glad your not heading our recruiting.

 

[Distinctive_]

Of course O'rourke and Whitfield are good. Why would one go at pick 5 and the other at pick 1?

 

[Tommycash]

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but this statement is just wrong. Please back it up with some kind of statistic?? I am glad your not heading our recruiting.

Statistics aren't the be all and end all. I think he's referring to the fact some players accumulate tonnes of disposals but do nothing with them, whereas he's of the belief that Simpson can do more with the few touches he gets. Think Lewis Jetta, doesn't get as many as some, but has a fair greater impact then most.

 

[TBOW]

Hate to put a dampener on the WHE to Dogs next year talk; but is he really a dogs supporter?
I was trying to work this out a while back and came across this photo of him in the age.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/quiet-achiever-lets-actions-do-the-talking-20111121-1nqzf.html

Those look an awful lot like Collingwood stickers on his wardrobe

Let's face it, as much as we passionate supporters would like it to count for something, past allegiances mean very little in the grand scheme of player movement anyway.

I would still love to get him to the kennel.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Love the amateur psychology being down with regards to O'Rourke (i.e the eyes telling the story).

Just go with him Dogs. Too much thinking and over-analysing happening on this board for mine. Sometimes the best solution is the most obvious one.

 

[100action]

Hate to put a dampener on the WHE to Dogs next year talk; but is he really a dogs supporter?
I was trying to work this out a while back and came across this photo of him in the age.

http://www.theage.com.au/afl/afl-news/quiet-achiever-lets-actions-do-the-talking-20111121-1nqzf.html

Those look an awful lot like Collingwood stickers on his wardrobe

Let's face it, as much as we passionate supporters would like it to count for something, past allegiances mean very little in the grand scheme of player movement anyway.

I would still love to get him to the kennel.

ah he is look at the thing that says DAL! inbetween the cabinet and the closet, black and white stripes.

 

[Super Hans]

Statistics aren't the be all and end all. I think he's referring to the fact some players accumulate tonnes of disposals but do nothing with them, whereas he's of the belief that Simpson can do more with the few touches he gets. Think Lewis Jetta, doesn't get as many as some, but has a fair greater impact then most.

No I mean as in draft camp testing, beep test etc. O'Rourke is widely regarded as a top 5 pick Simpson a top 20. I don't even think Simpson is the best player we can get at 22.

 

[scholar]

Tbow is right on the money with WHE, i did some checking with his friends - he does support Collingwood but his mother is crazy Magpies, his dad supports the Hawks , WHE has a real soft spot for the Dogs and would love to play for them. Loves the Western Suburbs and would love to be with his mates out here and playing for the Dogs. Hated Sydney from day one and not keen on some of the coaching staff. There are other players not happy in Sydney and i will try and find out who they are. Spoke with one of our coaches this morning and he was very forthright - need big tall forwards none in the draft, likes Springer, didn't like Sherman at all - badly behaved, lazy, couldn't be told. didn't care about anyone but himself and not a bloke you would want to know. Also found out that Moonie and Scarlett will be working at the club. So far so good with Cooney's knee. There is one tall forward but he said he is very soft! He might mean Shaw from WA ???

 

[Dogs Rule]

Tbow is right on the money with WHE, i did some checking with his friends - he does support Collingwood but his mother is crazy Magpies, his dad supports the Hawks , WHE has a real soft spot for the Dogs and would love to play for them. Loves the Western Suburbs and would love to be with his mates out here and playing for the Dogs. Hated Sydney from day one and not keen on some of the coaching staff. There are other players not happy in Sydney and i will try and find out who they are. Spoke with one of our coaches this morning and he was very forthright - need big tall forwards none in the draft, likes Springer, didn't like Sherman at all - badly behaved, lazy, couldn't be told. didn't care about anyone but himself and not a bloke you would want to know. Also found out that Moonie and Scarlett will be working at the club. So far so good with Cooney's knee. There is one tall forward but he said he is very soft! He might mean Shaw from WA ???

No surprise there. Glad Sherman and Lake are gone to be honest. Anyone else with that selfish attitude should follow them out the door.

I'm really going to enjoy the next few years with GWS and GC, the pull from home for these Victorian kids will be strong.

Will Mooney and Scarlett be helping in an official or unofficial capacity? Can only be a good thing.

I can't see us going past Stringer, I really can't.

 

[josh the gent]

Tbow is right on the money with WHE, i did some checking with his friends - he does support Collingwood but his mother is crazy Magpies, his dad supports the Hawks , WHE has a real soft spot for the Dogs and would love to play for them. Loves the Western Suburbs and would love to be with his mates out here and playing for the Dogs. Hated Sydney from day one and not keen on some of the coaching staff. There are other players not happy in Sydney and i will try and find out who they are. Spoke with one of our coaches this morning and he was very forthright - need big tall forwards none in the draft, likes Springer, didn't like Sherman at all - badly behaved, lazy, couldn't be told. didn't care about anyone but himself and not a bloke you would want to know. Also found out that Moonie and Scarlett will be working at the club. So far so good with Cooney's knee. There is one tall forward but he said he is very soft! He might mean Shaw from WA ???

Not sure why Mason Shaw is thought of as soft?

He had his jaw broken by Mitch Brown (on West Coast's list) in a WAFL game earlier this season.

Any KPF who is playing in the WAFL as a 17 year old must be ok at a minimum.

On his return he kicked 8 goals in the colts.

If he's available at 22, I would have no concerns if we took him...

 

[GrandBlue]

Mason Shaw seems really similar to Panos, and like Panos, I think he'll slide. Too much of a one-trick pony for me.

 

[Igloo]

Mason Shaw seems really similar to Panos, and like Panos, I think he'll slide. Too much of a one-trick pony for me.

Shaw has a lot more going for him than Panos. He's 197cm, and is a really good contested mark, as well as being good on the lead. His height alone compared to Panos puts him way above his level, imo. I'd be ecstatic to get him at 22.

 

[Mofra]

There is one tall forward but he said he is very soft! He might mean Shaw from WA ???

Did he mean a tall forward we are looking at or one already on our list?
We have spoken to Tim O'Brien (like most clubs), don't think anyone has said he's soft.

 

[Distinctive_]

Fremantle are going to take Shaw as they need KPF to replace Pavlich.
Pick 22 for me is Josh simpson.

 

[Dav1d]

Did he mean a tall forward we are looking at or one already on our list?
We have spoken to Tim O'Brien (like most clubs), don't think anyone has said he's soft.

Tim O'Brien looks pretty exciting, but am worried about how much bulk he can add to his frame that sort of bares similiarities to Jarrad Grant's;
speaking of which, I watched Grant's highlight reel from Under 18 level and his game hasn't changed all that much.

 

[Dogs Rule]

Tim O'Brien looks pretty exciting, but am worried about how much bulk he can add to his frame that sort of bares similiarities to Jarrad Grant's;
speaking of which, I watched Grant's highlight reel from Under 18 level and his game hasn't changed all that much.

No more Jarrad Grant stick figures please. Avoid.

 

[Distinctive_]

They can grow ya know?

 

[zephskinner26]

I still wouldn't be opposed to taking Plowman at 6 if we get O'Rourke at 5, with the intention of playing him as a midfielder in the future. Not saying we should necessarily do it, but if they believe he can develop into a midfielder I'd be pretty keen on getting a well built 191cm on baller with good pace and skills

 

[immortalmike]

No more Jarrad Grant stick figures please. Avoid.

Have a look at the difference between Fletcher Roberts now and when he came to the club. Jarrad Grant seems to be more of an exception rather than the rule. It's all about frame.

 

[Zgope1]

with it being apparent that Macca and Jmac are unsatisfied with our current big forward stocks i'm thinking Stringer would be great at 6 PROVIDED the intention is to give him a Jack Darling role. If we want him as a mid i'd rather go with Macrae. Just my opinion.

also i'm starting to think we should draft a really big mature age kpf with one of our later picks. Mature age anyone really but a Haretuku would be a good big body to plonk in there and give headaches one on one for our opponents.

 

[GrandBlue]

Shaw has a lot more going for him than Panos. He's 197cm, and is a really good contested mark, as well as being good on the lead. His height alone compared to Panos puts him way above his level, imo. I'd be ecstatic to get him at 22.

I don't think being a good contested mark in the WAFL means he'll be a good one in the AFL. Very hard to pick a good contested marking forward for AFL level, a lot of them tend to be hit or miss.

As a lead-up forward, I prefer O'Brien, mainly because he has all the right athletic attributes and has shown gradual improvement throughout the year, whereas Shaw's been inconsistent at times.

Also not sure height is that much of a factor. Brad Johnson was 180cm and he was one of, if not the best lead-up forward in the comp for a good while.

I still wouldn't be opposed to taking Plowman at 6 if we get O'Rourke at 5, with the intention of playing him as a midfielder in the future. Not saying we should necessarily do it, but if they believe he can develop into a midfielder I'd be pretty keen on getting a well built 191cm on baller with good pace and skills

Plowman does not have pace. In the bottom 10% for the 20 meter sprint.