Current Major incident at Bondi Junction

[BFew]

It was mentioned by police in one of their conferences - specifically psychedelics and methamphetamine - and is in one of the articles a few pages back. I heard it in the conference and it was definitely in one of the articles I posted.

ETA: Here's a couple I found, although it was a different article I linked to previously.

You posted this one yesterday lunchtime.

Which without more information I would treat as speculation reported to come from unnamed Police (rightly or wrongly) prior to toxicology results and first hand evidence of any illicit drug use from credible sources that witnessed it, or heard him self-confess to it (having used illicit drugs).

‘Truly horrific’: Family laments troubled son who became Bondi mass murderer

Joel Cauchi’s family also offered their support for the NSW Police officer who shot dead their son after he took the lives of six innocent people on Saturday afternoon.

amp.smh.com.au

'But police believe Cauchi used drugs including methamphetamine and psychedelics.'

 

[ms finch]

You posted this one yesterday lunchtime.

Which without more information I would treat as speculation reported to come from unnamed Police (rightly or wrongly) prior to toxicology results and first hand evidence of any illicit drug use from credible sources that witnessed it, or heard him self-confess to it (having used illicit drugs).

‘Truly horrific’: Family laments troubled son who became Bondi mass murderer

Joel Cauchi’s family also offered their support for the NSW Police officer who shot dead their son after he took the lives of six innocent people on Saturday afternoon.

amp.smh.com.au

'But police believe Cauchi used drugs including methamphetamine and psychedelics.'

I saw the police state it in the press conference before I posted the article. The mention of psychedelics seems pretty specific to me. Ice is something people might assume or take an educated guess at based on other information, but mentioning psychedelics leads me to believe that they had particular information.

My suspicion is that they got it from his Queensland health medical records, which would have been available fairly quickly, unlike private records.

I didn't take it to mean that he was on ice or psychedelics at the time, if that's how this has been interpreted, but rather that he had a history of the use of these drugs, which can still have an impact on someone's psyche, especially when interacting with a pre-existing mental illness.

 

[rdhopkins2]

Apparently he’d been doing some male escort work. Or perhaps he wasn’t a very successful one if he he has taken out his anger so terribly on innocent women.

 

[BFew]

My suspicion is that they got it from his Queensland health medical records

Or from his GP or Private Psychiatrist (possible via QLD Health).

 

[barreness]

The dude was clearly nuts but I don't think he had a hatred of Women as such, I'd say he was just a weak piece of s**t who wanted to cause maximum carnage and chose what he perceived as soft targets for that reason.

He killed a Man, but didnt want a bar of the big guy, I bet if he had a gun rather than a knife he'd have been less discretionary.

Yep, the obvious response is to look to something to blame so the gender wars come out, we saw the early religious/racial claims that a whole bunch of people were looking to jump on. It looks like a psychotic break and he was looking to do damage, he could do more damage against smaller people. Maybe he thought they were all demons idk, we'll see what the toxicology says later

If it comes out he was copiously reading incel and MRA forums, watching snuff, and hated his mother then yeh we can say it was a misogyny terror attack. From police reports you'd say it comes down to lack of mental health support if we want to blame something atm.

Men do commit basically all violent(and sexual) assaults, but saying "well men need to look at themselves" is such a individual response to a systemic issue. This is what you get with neoliberalism, individuals are blamed for the system and systems are blamed on the individual, nuffin really changes

 

[Toump Ass]

This is just looking for an excuse that makes it not gendered violence

Yeah I don’t think you really understand schizophrenia.

I think we've got plenty of well documented reasons why men attack women that have literally nothing to do with schizophrenia and we should start there

Like what? What “documented reasons” are there for violence against women- be specific.

I mean I’m all for dismantling the patriarchy, eliminating the gender pay gap, encouraging women to study maths, genderneutral bathrooms etc. but that’s just not going to stop someone who is out of their mind killing people. I’m sorry, but it won’t.

 

[Rodney Dangerfield]

A Current Affair Season 2024 Monday 15 April, Watch TV Online

Crime Editor Simon Bouda reveals exclusive new information on the Bondi Junction killer - including what police found on the mass murder's phone.

www.9now.com.au

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/crime/joel-cauchi-worrying-posts-of-sydney-mass-murderer/news-story/80be4a0f71bfcc218830af1e393c520e

'Joel Cauchi: Killer’s chilling Google search before attack​

New evidence has emerged that suggests the Bondi killer’s horrific actions could have been carefully planned.
April 15, 2024 - 9:07PM

Mass murderer Joel Cauchi Googled knives and “how to kill” before he stabbed six people to death at Bondi Westfield on Saturday.
Cauchi, a paranoid schizophrenic, had a “fixation with killing” and a “fixation with knives” police reportedly told A Current Affair crime editor Simon Bouda.

“Initially, everyone thought this was a man suffering from schizophrenia whose mind has snapped, words in his head,” Bouda explained on Monday night’s ACA.

“I have learned today that the investigators have been able to download data from his phone, which has indicated that he had a fixation with killings.

“He also had a fixation with knives. That tells us it wasn’t a spur of the moment attack. Beforehand, he was thinking about killing, and that is terribly frightening.”

When asked if Cauchi was “searching about killing” on his phone, Bouda replied “yes, that is what I understand.”

It was also claimed that Cauchi was seen at two other Westfield shopping centres around Sydney — Penrith and Parramatta — leading investigators to question if he may have also been scoping these out for a possible attack.

“I was told he was spotted at Westfield in Penrith and Parramatta, just in recent weeks,” Bouda continued.

“What was going through his mind? Was he checking out other locations that he may have decided appropriate for what he wanted to do? Was he just visiting?

“Who knows. But it was happening in very quick succession.”

Bouda also said that Cauchi walked up behind two of his victims in the back, not speaking to them or looking at them before delivering the fatal blows.

“The first woman was lining up in a queue to buy a coffee, he has come up behind her and stabbed her in the back,” crime editor Simon Bouda said.

“He stabbed another woman in the back, he is not even looking at them.

There is nothing scarier than an unmedicated paranoid schizophrenic.
And exactly as stated here they don’t necessarily just do spur of the moment things, they obsess about things which seems to have happened here, they are totally and utterly living in their very own world which describes his calm nature on the day.
I have experienced a couple and often wondered how the hell society deals with people like that apart from institutionalising them like we once did.
The scary part is they are out there and if not medicated properly which they often aren’t due to feeling better medicated and then taking themselves off, each time declining further they are literally capable of anything and impossible to reason with.
When my cousin was lecturing us over a myriad of bizarre things, getting angrier and angrier we all feared “what happens if he does these things? How do we stop him?” Every time he went through that cycle I used to fear an event like this, until he instead took his own life to teach somebody a lesson for something that never happened.
Sadly we all know of people that we refer to as “whack jobs” and it’s often due to this hideous condition.
It’s always bugged me that there’s literally nothing we can actually do about it except try our hardest to help them which doesn’t always work but can push them further if it’s done in the wrong way and not by people with psychological qualifications.
Understandably the natural reaction of most who aren’t aware of their condition is to just to tell them they are “****ed in the head” which just pushes them in deeper.

 

[faible]

Maybe stop using their arguments then

Carn Gralin. You do this all the time.

Oh a <insert group you don't like> used this argument (among a myriad of things they say), so therefore it's invalid. I'm sure I could find statements from some of the worst people on the planet that even you would agree with.

It's a pretty big logical fallacy. MRAs core beliefs are pretty damn different to what Toump Ass was saying. And most of these movements use legitimate arguments to cover for the more egregious things they want to promote.

If you want to have a reasonable discussion on a topic, maybe don't do this same thing you do repeatedly in order to try to shame people to stop talking just because it's an uncomfortable point.

Toump Ass' point insofar as I could tell was that when we discuss infants (e.g. newborns) being killed we don't label it a women's issue, demanding women fix it, despite women being the majority of perpetrators. We actually attempt to look at the myriad of factors involved, which includes mental health - particularly post-natal depression. Yet we keep repeating this line 'men need to fix this' as though somehow all these men are out there beating their wives and daughters and just hearing the line will make them, not.

Saying 'murderers need to fix this' and 'teach murderers not to murder' which would be an equally unhelpful approach. It's a highly complex area with a number of different factors that all contribute to each individual incident, being male is undoubtedly a part of it, but given the number of males who aren't violent murderers of women, it's hardly the only factor to talk about.

 

[faible]

Yep, the obvious response is to look to something to blame so the gender wars come out, we saw the early religious/racial claims that a whole bunch of people were looking to jump on. It looks like a psychotic break and he was looking to do damage, he could do more damage against smaller people. Maybe he thought they were all demons idk, we'll see what the toxicology says later

If it comes out he was copiously reading incel and MRA forums, watching snuff, and hated his mother then yeh we can say it was a misogyny terror attack. From police reports you'd say it comes down to lack of mental health support if we want to blame something atm.

Men do commit basically all violent(and sexual) assaults, but saying "well men need to look at themselves" is such a individual response to a systemic issue. This is what you get with neoliberalism, individuals are blamed for the system and systems are blamed on the individual, nuffin really changes

I'm pretty comfortable that he deliberately targeted women. 6 deaths of which 5 were women and 1 was a male who tried to intervene, I believe the majority of the injured are also women, and there's footage of him calmly walking around men.

Why he targeted women is something we'll hopefully find some answers to in his online history.

 

[Satan]

I'm pretty comfortable that he deliberately targeted women. 6 deaths of which 5 were women and 1 was a male who tried to intervene, I believe the majority of the injured are also women, and there's footage of him calmly walking around men.

Why he targeted women is something we'll hopefully find some answers to in his online history.

less likely to have ability to resist ie the mum with baby

 

[Gralin]

Carn Gralin. You do this all the time.

Oh a <insert group you don't like> used this argument (among a myriad of things they say), so therefore it's invalid. I'm sure I could find statements from some of the worst people on the planet that even you would agree with.

It's a pretty big logical fallacy. MRAs core beliefs are pretty damn different to what Toump Ass was saying. And most of these movements use legitimate arguments to cover for the more egregious things they want to promote.

If you want to have a reasonable discussion on a topic, maybe don't do this same thing you do repeatedly in order to try to shame people to stop talking just because it's an uncomfortable point.

Toump Ass' point insofar as I could tell was that when we discuss infants (e.g. newborns) being killed we don't label it a women's issue, demanding women fix it, despite women being the majority of perpetrators. We actually attempt to look at the myriad of factors involved, which includes mental health - particularly post-natal depression. Yet we keep repeating this line 'men need to fix this' as though somehow all these men are out there beating their wives and daughters and just hearing the line will make them, not.

Saying 'murderers need to fix this' and 'teach murderers not to murder' which would be an equally unhelpful approach. It's a highly complex area with a number of different factors that all contribute to each individual incident, being male is undoubtedly a part of it, but given the number of males who aren't violent murderers of women, it's hardly the only factor to talk about.

Again the stats don't say that women are the majority of perpetrators
The stats do say that men in pretty much all scenarios are the majority of perpetrators

The good bloke defence, fell on hard times is pretty much universally used to explain the actions

But it ignores why those actions so frequently target women

Yes he had mental health issues, yes they possibly contributed to his actions, but he clearly targeted women

There's an entire movement dedicated to blaming women for mens lack of success they promote violence they promote dominance

We all know this, most of us would know at least one person that has or has previously been red pilled

Even people that haven't can share a lot of those views because they're rooted in patriarchal ideals

People saying why does this have to be a gendered issue are saying they don't want to have to deal with all that

 

[ms finch]

A new and quite comprehensive article on Joel Cauchi's history:

Five weeks ago, Joel Cauchi sent his parents a message from a beach. The next time they saw him was on the news

A month ago, Joel Cauchi's parents were relieved to see a text message showing him enjoying life at the beach. Next time they saw him it was on national television as he attacked people in a Sydney shopping centre.

www.abc.net.au

Of particular interest to me is the reporting that he was taken off his medication by his treating psychiatrist. It's possible that this was just the story he was telling people, but his parents seem pretty adamant that it was under medical supervision. If true, that's going to require some substantial investigation.

The article covers a lot about his descent from being a seemingly well functioning person and has information from people who connected with him at various points.

 

[jason_recliner]

Again the stats don't say that women are the majority of perpetrators
The stats do say that men in pretty much all scenarios are the majority of perpetrators

The good bloke defence, fell on hard times is pretty much universally used to explain the actions

But it ignores why those actions so frequently target women

Yes he had mental health issues, yes they possibly contributed to his actions, but he clearly targeted women

There's an entire movement dedicated to blaming women for mens lack of success they promote violence they promote dominance

We all know this, most of us would know at least one person that has or has previously been red pilled

Even people that haven't can share a lot of those views because they're rooted in patriarchal ideals

People saying why does this have to be a gendered issue are saying they don't want to have to deal with all that

Part of the problem with saying "it's a men's issue / problem' is it can sound like "men need to deal with / manage / fix this", not "most violence is perpetrated by men". Nobody is denying that most violence is perpetrated by men.

 

[Gralin]

Part of the problem with saying "it's a men's issue / problem' is it can sound like "men need to deal with / manage / fix this", not "most violence is perpetrated by men". Nobody is denying that most violence is perpetrated by men.

Men do need to deal with this though

 

[Pamcake1]

Watching the picnic of denialists herein.
Specious arguments about what the ideological motive is, blaming madness and exactly who's problem it should be.
Bottom lines: that it's not their problem, there is no problem, then I can't do anything about said problem you do it.

Around we go.

To summerise here;

The mental health defense:
If you’re going to keep claiming that “mental illness” causes men to go on killing sprees, you are going to need to explain why millions of people also diagnosed with the exact same “mental illnesses” never hurt a fly – and why there is not a single “mental illness” in the DSM/ICD disease and illness classifications listed as increasing the risk of committing mass murder."

The denial of Misogeny as an element;
Continually fail to acknowledge misogyny as an ideology.
MRA, Incels and other misogynist groups exist in various configurations and intentions.
Attack anyone who is perceived as a threat to shoring up beliefs held and do so by exploiting the personal, political, offensive humour, dissembling or any means possible.

Its not me It's you.
See above.
Personal affrontage is amongst one of the game plans in plausable deniability of ownership.

It's all too hard /I don't have an answer/ What's your answer then.
There is no definitive answer.
No one is expected to have a definitive answer.
Playing games by challenging any ventured answering.
Indications of ideological answers supplied by suspected ideological stakeholders.
Denial of, wilful ignorrence of or dismissal of facts and statistical data that doesn't prove ideological argument.

If all else fails repeat ad nauseum till boredom or hopelessness ensures, try the shout down technique, go for sneak personal attacks, isolate and pick one small detail to argue about and all the while derail any plausable or productive conversation about the problem.

Around we go.

 

[faible]

Again the stats don't say that women are the majority of perpetrators
The stats do say that men in pretty much all scenarios are the majority of perpetrators

The good bloke defence, fell on hard times is pretty much universally used to explain the actions

But it ignores why those actions so frequently target women

Yes he had mental health issues, yes they possibly contributed to his actions, but he clearly targeted women

There's an entire movement dedicated to blaming women for mens lack of success they promote violence they promote dominance

We all know this, most of us would know at least one person that has or has previously been red pilled

Even people that haven't can share a lot of those views because they're rooted in patriarchal ideals

People saying why does this have to be a gendered issue are saying they don't want to have to deal with all that

Did you read the ABC article?

In cases where children are killed intentionally, women are more likely to kill babies and newborns

Which is exactly what Toump Ass was talking about.

Telling him 'oh that's an MRA talking point' is just a way to shut down discussion.

Being a mother is a pretty major risk factor in killing a newborn for example. We don't react by calling it a mothers problem, telling mothers not to murder newborns and demand mothers fix it, we react by trying to work out what the hell is going on. What contributes to it. We can identify that being a mother is one factor associated with it but given the huge numbers of mothers who don't kill their newborns, it's clearly not the only one.

So back to what I said before (I'll bold one part for emphasis before you pretend I'm ignoring it);

the generalisation of 'this is a men's problem' does a disservice to actually trying to identify and fix (as best we can) the issues that lead to people ending up in a place where these things happen.

It's a highly complex area with a number of different factors that all contribute to each individual incident, being male is undoubtedly a part of it, but given the number of males who aren't violent murderers of women, it's hardly the only factor to talk about.

 

[PenfoldsFan]

I'm pretty comfortable that he deliberately targeted women. 6 deaths of which 5 were women and 1 was a male who tried to intervene, I believe the majority of the injured are also women, and there's footage of him calmly walking around men.

Why he targeted women is something we'll hopefully find some answers to in his online history.

Theres no doubt he targetted Women, however, didnt he also target a 9m baby prior to attacking the Mother?
Unless he looked at the babies gender first it wasnt a priority, he just chose the softer target first in that instance and followed up with the Mother.

Lets be honest here, if there was some pre-existing hatred of Women chances are there would be history of it in his past and we'd know about it from those sources by now.

 

[the_interloper]

Watching the picnic of denialists herein.
Specious arguments about what the ideological motive is, blaming madness and exactly who's problem it should be.
Bottom lines: that it's not their problem, there is no problem, then I can't do anything about said problem you do it.

Around we go.

To summerise here;

The mental health defense:
If you’re going to keep claiming that “mental illness” causes men to go on killing sprees, you are going to need to explain why millions of people also diagnosed with the exact same “mental illnesses” never hurt a fly – and why there is not a single “mental illness” in the DSM/ICD disease and illness classifications listed as increasing the risk of committing mass murder."

The denial of Misogeny as an element;
Continually fail to acknowledge misogyny as an ideology.
MRA, Incels and other misogynist groups exist in various configurations and intentions.
Attack anyone who is perceived as a threat to shoring up beliefs held and do so by exploiting the personal, political, offensive humour, dissembling or any means possible.

Its not me It's you.
See above.
Personal affrontage is amongst one of the game plans in plausable deniability of ownership.

It's all too hard /I don't have an answer/ What's your answer then.
There is no definitive answer.
No one is expected to have a definitive answer.
Playing games by challenging any ventured answering.
Indications of ideological answers supplied by suspected ideological stakeholders.
Denial of, wilful ignorrence of or dismissal of facts and statistical data that doesn't prove ideological argument.

If all else fails repeat ad nauseum till boredom or hopelessness ensures, try the shout down technique, go for sneak personal attacks, isolate and pick one small detail to argue about and all the while derail any plausable or productive conversation about the problem.

Around we go.

When people mention mental health being a factor here, it's important to make sure you're saying it's a possible explanation for the tragedy, not an excuse.

And I think misogyny gets thrown around way too liberally these days, but hard to deny he was deliberately targeting women because they were women, i'd say that fits the misogyny definition.

"It's not me it's you", no idea what your point is here.

The rest seems like a description of most threads on the SRP board!

 

[faible]

When people mention mental health being a factor here, it's important to make sure you're saying it's a possible explanation for the tragedy, not an excuse.

Pamcake also ignored this direct reply to their earlier comments on mental health;

I really do not like the way mental illness is in quotation marks like that.

Mental illness is a real thing and it is also an enormous catch all phrase for everything from depression to NPD and the various types of mental illness are as varied as physical illnesses. It would be like just referring to physical illness to encompass everything from a broken leg to heart failure.

Cauchi had schizophrenia, so any reference to mental illness has to look at this in terms of the specifics of schizophrenia. We have also been told that he used psychedelics and meth.

Recent research indicates that schizophrenics might be more dangerous than the average person, as in schizophrenia may be a more violent disorder than originally thought. We know that meth increases the likelihood of violence. Recent research indicates that the combination of schizophrenia and meth may substantially increase the risk of violence.

Also, people having psychotic episodes are not usually rational. It’s very difficult to comprehend the way people filter and process information in that situation and you can’t just apply motives the way you do for a rational person.

While generally we often look at men’s violence as mental health related rather than motivated by misogyny, regardless of merit, this particular instance is really not a great example of that. It is thoroughly disingenuous to ignore schizophrenia and meth use here.

And before anyone jumps on me, I was the first person to raise the women angle in this thread somewhere around page 4.

 

[the_interloper]

Pamcake also ignored this direct reply to their earlier comments on mental health;

I'm not surprised given that poster's comments in this thread.

I really detest when people "play the mental health" card if there isn't a genuine issue, it's nothing short of disgraceful. But clearly this bloke had some severe issues, again it's not an excuse but clearly a contributing factor. If you ignore this you will never be a chance of figuring out why this happened and more importantly trying to prevent these situations in the future.

 

[BFew]

A new and quite comprehensive article on Joel Cauchi's history:

Five weeks ago, Joel Cauchi sent his parents a message from a beach. The next time they saw him was on the news

A month ago, Joel Cauchi's parents were relieved to see a text message showing him enjoying life at the beach. Next time they saw him it was on national television as he attacked people in a Sydney shopping centre.

www.abc.net.au

Of particular interest to me is the reporting that he was taken off his medication by his treating psychiatrist. It's possible that this was just the story he was telling people, but his parents seem pretty adamant that it was under medical supervision. If true, that's going to require some substantial investigation.

The article covers a lot about his descent from being a seemingly well functioning person and has information from people who connected with him at various points.

I've been waiting for an article like this to have his family elaborate on their understanding (right, wrong or incomplete) for more details of what happened with the Psychiatric management of his medication withdrawal and cessation.

It's a start for what is a very complex issue and a can of worms when it comes to Psychiatrics and Psychology/Psychologists (medications and the profession) the Mental Health System, Treatment, Tribunals and Orders, Relapse Risk Management, the wider health system, and the overlap and interactions with the Justice System and law enforcement.

Having family members willing to talk in public about it like this is I think quite rare.

And given that Cauchi is deceased, with what he did last week, the Coronial Inquiry, and that it appears that he was under "managed" Private Psychiatric care for a lengthy period, there's an opportunity for some of the worms in the can to get a bit more scrutiny than they might have otherwise.

However, there is also the risk that the event might lead to changes that don't reflect that the Bondi Junction incident was a once off, is extremely rare, and are in the opposite direction from where some of the changes to the NSW Mental Health System related issues (currently under review) were actually heading.

'A medication change
Michele and Andrew Cauchi said their son went off his mental health medication at about that time with the agreement and aid of his treating doctor.

Cauchi had been diagnosed with schizophrenia at the age of 17.

His mother said he had been under the care of doctors for 18 years.

Cauchi's family said he excelled at school and in 2012 graduated from the University of Southern Queensland with a Bachelor of Arts in international relations and culture and language.

'Mrs Cauchi said her son's doctor took him off his medication over a number of years, carefully warning him of what might happen.

"When he came off [the medication], it was like it had all lifted from him and he wanted to have a life," she said.
"After living at home until he was 35, he went to Brisbane, so he wasn't with his doctor anymore."

His father said it was a six-month trial with an option to recommence medication if needed.

"He didn't want anyone knowing he has got a mental illness," Mr Cauchi said.

"He was embarrassed when I said anything about it and he bolted off to Brisbane and he got a life."
...
"But he obviously was not in his right mind and he has been somehow triggered into a psychosis and he lost touch with reality.

"Anyone who has got a relative with mental illness will understand medication doesn't make you feel very well.

"There's a condition with a mental illness called anosognosia where the brain is damaged and it doesn't tell you you're sick. So if you don't know you're sick, why would you take medication?"

https://www.news.com.au/national/nsw-act/crime/loving-a-monster-bondi-stabber-dads-heartbreaking-admission/news-story/f3aee9d5b755ef0ea135172f0fac5879

'he was under the care of his doctors for something like 18 years, he was taking his medication well and then he asked the doctor to come down on (the dose).

“He did so over a period of years.”'

 

[jason_recliner]

Men do need to deal with this though

All non-violent people need to deal with this. What are you advocating? Women step back and hope that non-violent men can sort it out?

 

[jason_recliner]

Lets be honest here, if there was some pre-existing hatred of Women chances are there would be history of it in his past and we'd know about it from those sources by now.

Lying about his age to date an only-just-18yo is appalling, and it's the only thing we know about so far. If he didn't explicitly hate women, he certainly didn't respect them.

The fact is he could have stabbed a bunch of randoms in the mall but almost all of them were women. Not sure how to describe that other than targeting - and harming - women.

 

[faible]

Who/what are you railing against? The above is not occurring in this thread.

It's one of those replies that are clearly directed at certain posters, but where they don't want to name or quote those posters, so just throw out untargeted accusations.

Like the comment about mental health that was already replied to, but ignored.

 

[burge13]

Lying about his age to date an only-just-18yo is appalling, and it's the only thing we know about so far. If he didn't explicitly hate women, he certainly didn't respect them.

The fact is he could have stabbed a bunch of randoms in the mall but almost all of them were women. Not sure how to describe that other than targeting - and harming - women.

You have to go to quite a bit of effort to kill someone with a stab wound. Resistance will likely result in treatable wounds or cuts rather than fatal. Targeting women is likely a softer target by a weak individual than 'hating all women'

As someone said, if he was truly hateful of women he'd have left traces of it online we'd know about by now. He targeted the weaker