List Mgmt. Morning, Joe! (was The Daniher (Probably Mega-)thread)

[jjami15]

Next minute, Brisbane trade both their 1st round picks, plus Witherden for Daniher, then everyone on the board will be like, yeah nah great trade.

Yeah nah, I don’t think so!!!

 

[lioninthesand]

I'm not underestimating that possibility. I don't think there is any chance he stays at Essendon next year. Matching won't keep him. But it might force a trade with Brisbane, or with Sydney, or with someone else. Or Joe will go for free to somebody in the PSD.
I just don't think Dodoro is any chance to go weak at the knees at the thought of losing him to the PSD if all he would be losing is a pick in the early 20s.
(And I don't think Joe would be too happy at the idea of opening himself up to the possibility of going to Adelaide or North, not that he will have much opportunity to change the course of events.)

Yeah the cultural ramifications of 'forcing players to stay' and 'playing hardball' and 'sending them to the draft' are huge. I had the same gripe when we did it during player exodus. Players are usually pretty close and don't like seeing their mates tormented. I would say it's a huge reason for the unrest. It says to them, 'you are just a number'. Geelong, Hawks and to a lesser extent, us.. have shown how you get stuff done at trade time. Dodoro is a relic in the AFL landscape, the tough guy routine is dated and you'd be best to **** him off. That's not to say you don't hold firm at the trade table, but putting a player who is a RFA through the ringer 2 years in a row, or at all, is just a bad cultural move.

 

[lioninthesand]

Luey, Josh Green, Cutler.. maybe we do owe them a first rounder - we have been discarding our average players there for years, poor bastards. Like buying a shiney bike on Gumtree - only to get it home and find out the gears don't work and it's stuck in first gear.

 

[BuntonRules]

Luey, Josh Green, Cutler.. maybe we do owe them a first rounder - we have been discarding our average players there for years, poor bastards. Like buying a shiney bike on Gumtree - only to get it home and find out the gears don't work and it's stuck in first gear.

Too true, apart from the fact we owe them nothing. Mal Michael still sticks in the craw.

 

[60sbomber]

You came here to try to convince us, not vice versa. What did you expect?

Actually I came on your board to ask a question - why wouldn't you take Joe for free, when all it costs you is about $100k of additional "risk" (convert incentive $ to base salary) - nothing in total salary cap, nothing in trade.

 

[Nuggo]

It was answered - perhaps we don't think he is worth paying overs for from a cash perspective which we may rate higher in the long term than a draft pick.

 

[Dalions]

Actually I came on your board to ask a question - why wouldn't you take Joe for free, when all it costs you is about $100k of additional "risk" (convert incentive $ to base salary) - nothing in total salary cap, nothing in trade.

I think it’s actually called smart Administration and List Management

 

[Dalions]

Actually I came on your board to ask a question - why wouldn't you take Joe for free, when all it costs you is about $100k of additional "risk" (convert incentive $ to base salary) - nothing in total salary cap, nothing in trade.

And secondly, I am pretty sure the AFL will find a way to hand over Band 1 Compo because, well..................
A strong Essendon is good for the VFL!

 

[Milux]

Next minute, Brisbane trade both their 1st round picks, plus Witherden for Daniher, then everyone on the board will be like, yeah nah great trade.

Id vomit.

 

[Happy_Neale]

Actually I came on your board to ask a question - why wouldn't you take Joe for free, when all it costs you is about $100k of additional "risk" (convert incentive $ to base salary) - nothing in total salary cap, nothing in trade.

Think about the point you are making here, you are suggesting we overpay for a high risk/potential high reward forward so Essendon can be satisfied - the clubs goals for Daniher has nothing to do with Essendon. The clubs would both have salary cap/TPP plans going forward so just paying him extra as a means to satisfy the bombers doesn't really work.

 

[Dalions]

Think about the point you are making here, you are suggesting we overpay for a high risk/potential high reward forward so Essendon can be satisfied - the clubs goals for Daniher has nothing to do with Essendon. The clubs would both have salary cap/TPP plans going forward so just paying him extra as a means to satisfy the bombers doesn't really work.

Especially taking into account the secret herbs and spices of Free Agency Compo.

 

[weevil]

Actually I came on your board to ask a question - why wouldn't you take Joe for free, when all it costs you is about $100k of additional "risk" (convert incentive $ to base salary) - nothing in total salary cap, nothing in trade.

I think Brisbane have calculated that his money may well be enough to trigger band one. From what I can see Essendon have little choice but to accept it.

 

[youneverknow22]

I would rather we don't get him him, to be honest.

We're already a top 4 side, and we have a list of players who will be asking for a pay rise in their contracts. How can we possibly keep all of our stars if we end up signing an injury prone forward who may or may not work for us? Even if he does work for us, we still might not be able to keep them all. The fact of the matter is that we don't even need daniher and if he doesn't end up at this club, resulting in us not trading anything for him, I would actually be quite happy.

If I had a choice of keeping witherden, rayner, mcluggage, starcevich, mcstay, etc, over getting daniher I know which one I would take. Yes, there is a chance we could keep them all if we do sign him, but I would argue those chances are lower. It isn't worth it, IMO.

 

[Johnny Bananas]

If I had a choice of keeping witherden, rayner, mcluggage, starcevich, mcstay, etc, over getting daniher I know which one I would take. Yes, there is a chance we could keep them all if we do sign him, but I would argue those chances are lower. It isn't worth it, IMO.

Do you really think the club haven't thought of this and budgeted for it?

 

[youneverknow22]

Do you really think the club haven't thought of this and budgeted for it?

Of course they have, but they don't know the cap space or list sizes for next year. No one knows for that matter. There is a chance that covid19 could continue into the next year, which could potentially lead to a further reduction of playing lists and base salary. In times like this, it's a huge risk to bring in an injury prone player on a high salary. Even Sydney were smart enough to drop out of the race, and I can only hope our club considers this as well because there is a chance this could backfire on us. 4 years ago, I wouldn't have cared, but we're a top 4 side and we need to ask ourselves if we even need to take this risk?

 

[Johnny Bananas]

Of course they have, but they don't know the cap space or list sizes for next year. No one knows for that matter. There is a chance that covid19 could continue into the next year, which could potentially lead to a further reduction of playing lists and base salary. In times like this, it's a huge risk to bring in an injury prone player on a high salary. Even Sydney were smart enough to drop out of the race, and I can only hope our club considers this as well because there is a chance this could backfire on us. 4 years ago, I wouldn't have cared, but we're a top 4 side and we need to ask ourselves if we even need to take this risk?

They may not know the exact figure, but they surely have been given a ballpark estimate. Otherwise why would Carlton have handed Zac Williams such a huge contract if an absolutely savage salary cap cut was coming? I trust our management to know what they're doing.

 

[youneverknow22]

They may not know the exact figure, but they surely have been given a ballpark estimate. Otherwise why would Carlton have handed Zac Williams such a huge contract if an absolutely savage salary cap cut was coming? I trust our management to know what they're doing.

Carlton are going after players who don't have injury issues. We aren't, and the risk for us is far greater. Carlton also needs to be daring if they want to rise up the ladder, while we don't. We're already a top 4 side. Even writing this, i'm convinced that we don't need daniher and I actually would be disappointed if we end up with him.

 

[chopperduck]

Any player on mega dollars has the same risk. They miss a season or 2 and it hurts. We have a great medical department, who are familiar with Joe from working with him before. Everything is a risk, but we have clearly done our homework on it. If 650k a year is true, to me, that is way unders for a player of his ability and potential. 26 year old signing a 5 year deal... this is typically the big massive pay day deal for players and he is in his prime.

 

[beardancer]

I just don't think we need Daniher. IMHO we should be looking for a key central defender to release Harris Andrews to play Full Forward. Andrews is the best mark in the team, great long kick, great decision maker and leader. His talents are wasted punching the ball into the stands. The sooner we get young Payne up to speed, the better. I'm not a subscriber to the "Andrews is a great Center half back" and that's all he is......remember back in the early 2000s when we had the 4 best full forwards in the league playing in one team. Lynch, Brown, Bradshaw and Leppitch..........anyway I'm banging on.6

 

[Dalions]

I would rather we don't get him him, to be honest.

We're already a top 4 side, and we have a list of players who will be asking for a pay rise in their contracts. How can we possibly keep all of our stars if we end up signing an injury prone forward who may or may not work for us? Even if he does work for us, we still might not be able to keep them all. The fact of the matter is that we don't even need daniher and if he doesn't end up at this club, resulting in us not trading anything for him, I would actually be quite happy.

If I had a choice of keeping witherden, rayner, mcluggage, starcevich, mcstay, etc, over getting daniher I know which one I would take. Yes, there is a chance we could keep them all if we do sign him, but I would argue those chances are lower. It isn't worth it, IMO.

We will keep who we want to keep.
And even when you are a top 4 side and/or win a Premiership, it doesn’t mean you don’t try to make your team better.
You don’t win Premierships by standing still, you always need to look for ways to improve.

 

[youneverknow22]

We will keep who we want to keep.
And even when you are a top 4 side and/or win a Premiership, it doesn’t mean you don’t try to make your team better.

Name any big club from the past 10 years that brought in injury prone players to take them to a premiership? Hawthorn never did it, Richmond never did it, and Geelong never did it. They brought in players who they knew would step right in and play every game of the season. Frawley, Lynch, Dangerfield, etc. All of these players were not a risk like daniher is/was. We don't need him, and if we truly have the cap space to somehow cover him and our remaining players, I would rather sign a cheaper forward who would provide a role and bring in a player who you know would play 22 games next year.

 

[Dalions]

Name any big club from the past 10 years that brought in injury prone players to take them to a premiership? Hawthorn never did it, Richmond never did it, and Geelong never did it. They brought in players who they knew would step right in and play every game of the season. Frawley, Lynch, Dangerfield, etc. All of these players were not a risk like daniher is/was. We don't need him, and if we truly have the cap space to somehow cover him and our remaining players, I would rather sign a cheaper forward who would provide a role and bring in a player who you know would play 22 games next year.

Do you honestly think a fit Daniher won’t make us a better team?

 

[youneverknow22]

Do you honestly think a fit Daniher won’t make us a better team?

Slightly, but you have to weigh up if the slight advantage is even worth it when the risk of him not working out would hurt us far greater. And I don't think it is and I think we shouldn't fix what isn't broken. We have an able forward line who can kick enough goals to win a premiership, so why bring in daniher?

I know our medical department is top class, but it doesn't always work out. Adams is already considered a bust and having 2 injured players on our list on a considerable wage would only make things worse. Birchall was different because he isn't contracted for 5 years, but Daniher could backfire greatly for us.

 

[JasRulz63]

I just don't think we need Daniher. IMHO we should be looking for a key central defender to release Harris Andrews to play Full Forward. Andrews is the best mark in the team, great long kick, great decision maker and leader. His talents are wasted punching the ball into the stands. The sooner we get young Payne up to speed, the better. I'm not a subscriber to the "Andrews is a great Center half back" and that's all he is......remember back in the early 2000s when we had the 4 best full forwards in the league playing in one team. Lynch, Brown, Bradshaw and Leppitch..........anyway I'm banging on.6

I agree. I think we've been trying to chase down a key defender for a while that can take the opposition's big forward, even back to 2015 when we came close to signing Astbury. Adams was evidently brought in to play that role too. I think we'll probably see them back Payne in to take over that role, with fingers crossed that we can get Adams up and running given he's contracted for another 2 years.

 

[Dalions]

Slightly, but you have to weigh up if the slight advantage is even worth it when the risk of him not working out would hurt us far greater. And I don't think it is and I think we shouldn't fix what isn't broken. We have an able forward line who can kick enough goals to win a premiership, so why bring in daniher?

I know our medical department is top class, but it doesn't always work out. Adams is already considered a bust and having 2 injured players on our list on a considerable wage would only make things worse. Birchill was different because he isn't contracted for 5 years, but Daniher could backfire greatly for us.

In my opinion, I don’t think he will be brought in to replace anyone in the forward line.
He is more likely to be replacing Stef in the side and be rotating with Oscar as second Ruck.