Most overrated player in the AFL currently?

[craffles]

Overrated for me is typically a lot of the younger guys who get frothed over for potential but haven't done it for a sustained period of time.

For us it's guys like Nik Cox and Harrison Jones at the moment. Could become stars but get spoken about as if they are key pillars of the club and every good performance when in reality it's blokes taking the next step like Parish, Laverde, Langford and guys like Stringer, Merrett, Tippa, Heppell, Ridley etc playing to their abilities.

Could be guns. Look very promising. But not the key cogs of the improvement we have shown.

 

[PhatBoy]

OK wise guy. Best KPF.

Well I’m just pointing out that overrated or not he probably WOULDNT be Melbourne’s best forward if he was there right at this moment

 

[PhatBoy]

Definitely going worse than Rohan. Didn't pick him because nobody has rated him for a long time and he is never really 'pumped up' by the media. I too am unsure why he keeps getting picked, particularly when you have younger players performing better and being dropped. The only thing I can think of is he plays a role that those promising younger players can't fill.

I posted about this on the cats board before and after Thursday night.

he obviously has a designated job that the match committee have been satisfied with in terms of fulfilling it but how long can that role be so minimal before you start to question whether someone else could play it maybe not as well as him, but the other assets they bring that he doesn’t have make up the shortfall?

he hardly had a mark on him at full time the other night after wearing long sleeves in a wet weather game. That spoke volumes to me

 

[wcegls]

Nic Nat. Easily.

Lol

 

[Schnitzengruben]

Nic Nat. Easily.

He's pretty good for the 30 mins he spends on ground per week.

 

[Danger Zone]

Amazing that this thread started with Tex, given the late revival of career and sitting well in the race for the Coleman. If the OP could just start naming some more Crows players, that would be great for our chances next year, thank you.

 

[Noidnadroj]

Burgoyne. An excellent player, who's stood up numerous times when it's mattered, but his list of accolades shows his standing in the game, a Robert Horry career. 400 games, four premierships, a single All Australian so long ago that Joel Bowden was named centre half back and I doubt anyone cared. Now that he's hit the 400 milestone you can see it happening, the pundits falling over themselves with the hyperbole... I saw someone say this week that he was as important as any Hawthorn player to its success in 2013-15, which of course is utter nonsense.

You just know he's going straight in to the HOF as early as he can and I'm sorry, but I just don't think he's at that level. 400 games and four flags is nothing to sneeze at, sure, but there's plenty of time for him to be inducted for what he was: a classy player, with a sense of the occasion who won a swag of premierships and played a stack of games. Wayne Johnston had to wait nearly 25 years.

Definitely a player whose individual reputation has benefited immeasurably by the 4 x flags…. Which to a large extent it should. He played in 6 x Grand Finals and received 1 x Norm Smith Medal vote…. in 2015.

He made the AA team once in 2006, and the 40-man squad 2 other times.

He has 2 x top-3 B&F finishes - 2nd in 2006 at Port and 3rd in 2016 at the Hawks. Surprising for someone who plays almost all games every season.

So no doubt his reputation is built largely around memorable moments and being a Mr FixIt that could plug holes as required due to his flexibility… and this does not lend itself to awards or high possession games week in and week out.

So an excellent player who was a key member in 4 x flags. But I think for a range of reasons his playing reputation and the media fawning is a little over the top, where every single thing he ever did on-field for the last 6-7 years of his career was ‘sublime’ or ‘classy’ or ‘brilliant’. If often was… but his list of achievements suggests they were also a lot more rare than our memories have us believe. Which is probably the case for most enduring stars of our game.

So a terrific player? Yes. Overrated? Yes.





Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[Roosurgence]

Burgoyne. An excellent player, who's stood up numerous times when it's mattered, but his list of accolades shows his standing in the game, a Robert Horry career. 400 games, four premierships, a single All Australian so long ago that Joel Bowden was named centre half back and I doubt anyone cared. Now that he's hit the 400 milestone you can see it happening, the pundits falling over themselves with the hyperbole... I saw someone say this week that he was as important as any Hawthorn player to its success in 2013-15, which of course is utter nonsense.

You just know he's going straight in to the HOF as early as he can and I'm sorry, but I just don't think he's at that level. 400 games and four flags is nothing to sneeze at, sure, but there's plenty of time for him to be inducted for what he was: a classy player, with a sense of the occasion who won a swag of premierships and played a stack of games. Wayne Johnston had to wait nearly 25 years.

Wow!

Guy has played 400 games and true his best is behind him, but he would be one of the last players I would call overrated.

At his best this guy was as good as most going around.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

2013 PF still hurts huh?
24 & 3 to win the game. Silk is all class. Wonderful clearance player who dominated whenever he went into the middle.

Had to reinvent himself into a defender due to his knee. Which limited his midfield time. The amount of games he has won us is crazy. 2012 and 2013 PF’s especially

Play the ball, not the man.

Was Burgoyne as important as any Hawthorn player in 2013-2015? Should he get straight into the Hall of Fame as soon as his waiting period has cleared, essentially for playing 400 games and being a big game player, when Wayne Johnston waited nearly 25 years after the Hall of Fame was established and nearly 30 years after his career ended to be recognised?

You've just proved my point, with your predictable potshot. Yeah he had a great game in the 2013 PF. Absolutely vital in a narrow Hawks win. I never said he was a poor player; I just don't think he's had the kind of career that warrants him going into the Hall of Fame as soon as he's eligible, which of course he will. I think that 'first ballot' status should be reserved for the best of the best, for players who dominated for years, not for halves.

Like I said, a Rober Horry career. Horry was a role player for a long time in the NBA and had a knack for playing a key role in championship teams. Never an All Star and if he was in the team's best three players, they wouldn't be champions, but he came up big in crucial moments and had a few games in the Finals where he was outstanding and several where he hit key shots to help his team win.

I think it's ludicrous that now that Burgoyne's played 400 and pundits are trying to outdo each other with the hyperbolic quick takes that they're saying things like "He's been one of the league's greatest players over the past decade," or "He was as important as any Hawks player over the 2013 premiership period." More important than Mitchell, Hodge, Gunston, Lake, Gibson, Roughead, Lewis... I don't think so. I'd have him alongside the likes of Rioli, Breust, Birchall, with his longevity making him stand out above them. Those three were/are matchwinners in their day too and had their moments against Geelong and in big games in general. They were fantastic players too, but much like Burgoyne, they're the sort of players you want as your 6th-8th best: if they're placing in your B&F you've probably had an average season as a club.

Sam Mitchell had 38 disposals and 11 clearances that night and no-one even talks about it. Because that's just what Mitchell did. He was by far the best and most influential player on the ground, but we were accustomed to Mitchell having games like that. That's a first ballot Hall of famer, as far as I'm concerned.

Anyway, if everyone agrees with a 'most overrated' choice, then I guess that player really isn't overrated.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

I like your quest to summarise Burgoyne’s strengths and put them in some perspective but I think you have your final judgement wrong. These guys who can play multiple positions really well, have brilliant all round skills and can produce big performances on the biggest stages, they are extremely valuable, imo. I have missed large chunks of Burgoyne’s career, and he has gone on well past his best, but to me he is a proper footballer.

For the record some of my over-rated players, according to the only over-rating that matters, their contract and roles with their teams:

Blicavs - sort of can do a few roles just ok and if he is your worst player, no problems, if he is a two time b&f…

Admittedly though, it isn’t easy to know exactly how good players are as a casual observer.

I think it should be noted that Blicavs' B&Fs came in 2015 and 2018: the year Geelong missed the finals and the year that the Cats finished eighth and were thumped in the elimination final. We're not talking Corey Enright winning his two B&Fs in 2009 and 2011 here.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

I haven't heard much of the criticism to be honest but I think you are right in saying that his 'attributes' are the main contributor to him being rated more highly than he should be - its his 'excitement' and what he is 'capable of' rather then what he actually produces.

He is having an improved season though - ill give him that but I also believe that you couldn't have an easier time as a medium forward in the current Geelong set up. You've got 2 superstar key forwards who demand the best 3 defenders on their own. Also Hawkins is probably the best forward in the game at setting others up. You've also got a tonne of good mids and you regularly win. Its probably the perfect storm for him to finally kick more than 25 goals in a season.

Maybe it's a coincidence that Hawkins' ascendence to that status has perfectly coincided with Rohan's arrival at the club, but maybe it's not. Since he became a legitimate star following the 2011 Grand Final, Hawkins' best forward sidekick, prior to Rohan arriving, was probably Menzel. The lack of support, either tall or small, in that area that Hawkins had for 6-7 years was criminal. Menzel could take a grab, but he wasn't really built for busting packs and famously refused to chase.

Those two things, along with converting his opportunities, are Rohan's trademarks and that's all we need from our third option in the forward line. He can take a pack mark and he can pressure a defender running the ball out, hence he can play tall or small. If Rohan wasn't there I'd say Cameron's likely stint on the sidelines really hurts us, but I think we'll be able to cover it. If Dangerfield spends more time forward, that combination will be cause for concern, as Rohan and Danger field have similar styles as forwards (Danger gets it more, but Rohan's better at taking his chances). It could be the perfect forward line for Ratugolea or Jenkins to come in to. Ratugolea to find himself one-on-one regularly, or Jenkins to find space and do his usual Joe the Goose thing.

Rohan's not a star, but he's a key part of the side. In the sense of 'the big 3' stuff, yeah I can maybe see that seems a little much, but this season, right now, he's justifying it. 24 goals and sitting equal 23rd in the Coleman is meh/OK, but when you realise that means Geelong has three forwards basically in the top 25 for goals this year, you can see where the big three stuff might almost be warranted. I can't say I'm crazy about it either though.

 

[Bollox]

Natanui being accused of being overrated after yesterday ?

He was up against a good mate, one who must have spent countless hours days weeks helping him to recover from long term injuries. Incredible amounts of practice one on one. You think Hickey wouldnt be eminently qualified to go up against him ?
In tapouts you wont beat NN, HO to advantage of course not...but he'd at least know what he can try/do to gain some sort of advantage. You get him around the ground and positional play which is the part of the game he beat NN at yesterday. NN was still GOOD. Not great but there was simply a better ruckman on the paddock and in a flogging its hard to look good as well. He definitely wasnt even one of their "problems" on the day.
When you are that good the boffins instantly find it easy to relegate "ok games" or "being beaten" to being crap. Other guys are allowed to be bloody good on the day.

 

[Shane Heard]

Dangerfield. Poor leadership skills. Poor disposal when it counts. Probably talks about himself in third person. Known to dabble in black magic.

He’s never had the makings of a varsity athlete either..

 

[Grand Uncle Horace]

He's pretty good for the 30 mins he spends on ground per week.

He (Nic Nat) was not even good for those 30 mins. Overweight and can't run off the square.

Flogged yesterday by Hickey and an undersized kid.

 

[The Swert]

And yet Naitanui has heaps more CP, tackles, higher hitout to advantage than those guys....they have different roles for their teams. WC rely on Naitanui bullocking because the mids are too weak, which is a coaching flaw in itself

Why can't he do that and catch the ball?

 

[The Devils Advocate]

That's easy Joe Daniher. Next.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

Hey but... Oh wait, bias no longer exists. Play on

 

[kaiserchief13]

Why can't he do that and catch the ball?

Because he can't be in 2 places at once? Sure he could drop back like Gawn and Grundy do for cheap touches but the midfield will get destroyed then

 

[Maylandsman]

Nic Nat. Easily.

Was it even a fair contest. By the proverbial country mile.

 

[Lynchy04]

Tim Kelly up there purely for the trade demand when there is no way he was even worth it. Good player but not a great player.

 

[WillHayward]

Fyfe is just utterly useless.

 

[Collins-Langford-Ayres]

DeGoey climbing the ladder... Papley gets talked about as the best small forward in the game... WTF???

 

[NicW]

Fyfe is just utterly useless.

Yeah and you know so much about football.

 

[StillAtLarge]

Fyfe is just utterly useless.

His atrocious kicking skills and a complete absence of defensive appetite certainly hinders his influence. Useless is way too harsh though

 

[H00t]

Play the ball, not the man.

Was Burgoyne as important as any Hawthorn player in 2013-2015? Should he get straight into the Hall of Fame as soon as his waiting period has cleared, essentially for playing 400 games and being a big game player, when Wayne Johnston waited nearly 25 years after the Hall of Fame was established and nearly 30 years after his career ended to be recognised?

You've just proved my point, with your predictable potshot. Yeah he had a great game in the 2013 PF. Absolutely vital in a narrow Hawks win. I never said he was a poor player; I just don't think he's had the kind of career that warrants him going into the Hall of Fame as soon as he's eligible, which of course he will. I think that 'first ballot' status should be reserved for the best of the best, for players who dominated for years, not for halves.

Like I said, a Rober Horry career. Horry was a role player for a long time in the NBA and had a knack for playing a key role in championship teams. Never an All Star and if he was in the team's best three players, they wouldn't be champions, but he came up big in crucial moments and had a few games in the Finals where he was outstanding and several where he hit key shots to help his team win.

I think it's ludicrous that now that Burgoyne's played 400 and pundits are trying to outdo each other with the hyperbolic quick takes that they're saying things like "He's been one of the league's greatest players over the past decade," or "He was as important as any Hawks player over the 2013 premiership period." More important than Mitchell, Hodge, Gunston, Lake, Gibson, Roughead, Lewis... I don't think so. I'd have him alongside the likes of Rioli, Breust, Birchall, with his longevity making him stand out above them. Those three were/are matchwinners in their day too and had their moments against Geelong and in big games in general. They were fantastic players too, but much like Burgoyne, they're the sort of players you want as your 6th-8th best: if they're placing in your B&F you've probably had an average season as a club.

Sam Mitchell had 38 disposals and 11 clearances that night and no-one even talks about it. Because that's just what Mitchell did. He was by far the best and most influential player on the ground, but we were accustomed to Mitchell having games like that. That's a first ballot Hall of famer, as far as I'm concerned.

Anyway, if everyone agrees with a 'most overrated' choice, then I guess that player really isn't overrated.

Burgers has been pretty underrated his whole career. It’s only his 400th that’s brought out the media attention like it has. Not that I pay much attention to the media.

I think most hawks have Burgers among the Mitchell’s and Hodges for us in regards to importance. Rioli could turn it on and win a match. But whenever we were down and need a lift to get a win, Clarko would put burgers in the middle and he’d get the clearance and win us the game. We’d have lost so many games without him.

The only sad thing is due to his knee he couldn’t play full time centre square so we never got to see him fully deliver on his talent. Even then he was a rarely beaten back pocket who just went about his business setting up attacks for us. The perfect team oriented player

 

[00Stinger]

Fyfe is just utterly useless.

probably the dumbest post I have seen on Bigfooty before