Player Watch Nathan Freeman

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Am not too upset with Freeman leaving as I haven't seen him play.

There will always be another player to take his place, happened before to most teams and will happen again.

Now to look to what we can get for him and move on.
 
Don't think it's Connors' business to be piping up about whether we have enough good midfield stocks or not, nor talking about if we don't need Aish or Freeman due to that. But it's a free country ... If that's his opinion fine, just don't word it as if it's the club's view.
 
It could be that Connors is just repeating what he has been told by Collingwood in regard to his dealing over Freeman i.e. we have told him we do want to retain Freeman and that we aren't chasing Aish?

We could have been bluffing (lying) or it could be true.

I'm a bit on the fence regarding Aish anyway so I'm not really fussed if we aren't into him.

The trade period doesn't even start for 3 weeks and some posters in here have their knickers in a knot.
 

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THATSGOLD said:
Our midfeild will have depth but it won't have stars like brisbanes 01 02 03 04 GFs
Voss Lappin Black Akermanis

We have one star in Pendlebury. Swan is nearly done and will be gone by the end of 2016. Treloar might make 2. That's it. It's not the midfeild some and making it out to be.

We needed guys like Freeman to become the next Dangerfeild to win flags.
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You mean the same FREEMAN you have been bagging will never make it.
Now you have crocodile tears - or are you trolling again?
 
THATSGOLD said:
Our midfeild will have depth but it won't have stars like brisbanes 01 02 03 04 GFs
Voss Lappin Black Akermanis

We have one star in Pendlebury. Swan is nearly done and will be gone by the end of 2016. Treloar might make 2. That's it. It's not the midfeild some and making it out to be.

We needed guys like Freeman to become the next Dangerfeild to win flags.
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2 things.

1) I believe you stated that Freeman would not make it and should be delisted.
2) Dangerfield himself has not won a flag.
 
1892 said:
The reason why we didn't offer him anything other than an incentive based contract would be we didn't think he was worth the risk. The reason why StKilda offered a flat 300k is because they think he is.

Under that trade we take on the risk for St Kilda. Under different circumstances where we're wanting to help the player find another club it may have merit and I can see why you want to do it, but given Freeman's walked out it's as fanciful as some of the other dream trade scenarios suggested by your fans.
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It wouldn't happen but it was the only way I could see that both sides ended up with "fairness" in the trade.

At the moment its a risk for both sides - that's why I reckon that even though Freeman has nominated St Kilda I don't count this over the line as yet.

From where I sit, St Kilda losing Pick 23 on a player whose body may/may not be up to AFL is a bigger risk for St Kilda than Collingwood downgrading a now clearly suspect Pick 10 to a Pick 23. At least you will get a second chance.

That's why I think something around late 2nd (30+) is probably closer to the mark. Only problem is - can that be achieved and would it be agreed to ?
 
Freeman going is indeed probably about a little more than just the money but, it is also definitely about the money.

Manager/Player wanted more and stated the offer was not enough, its probably not sheep stations but it would be hard to offer too much to a kid who has not been able to get on the park for two years, albeit for a few reserves games that only showed us he needed further surgery.

I think the decision also says a bit about Freeman's confidence in being able to develop himself at Collingwood, if Treloar gets to the Pies we do have a lot of midfield depth and it would be hard to see Freeman breaking through the first choice midfield anytime soon; he may feel the same way. It is probably the 'get-out-stakes' for the kid, last roll of the dice so, in that sense good luck to him.


Current Mids:

Pendles
Swan
#Treloar
Steele
Adams
Crisp
Greenwood
De Goey
Blair
Kennedy

Freeman

That is 9 or ten mids that are ahead of him right now and even if he gets fit and quickly leap frogs Blair and Kennedy, he still had a lot to do to get selected over the rest in my view. If he stays it could be year 4 in the system before he gets a senior game and his career is almost crocked.

That said, we can play hardball on this trade and try to get something decent based on him being a top ten prospect, the club is not dumb and wheeling Maxy out for a press grab effectively stating he was 'As good as Dangerfield' is a nice touch.
 
Linda_Lovelace said:
Yes, I had injections into the achilles about a decade ago. Its incredibly painful for the first couple of injections, after than the local anaesthtic starts to kicks in and its just uncomfortable. I only swore loudly when the first injection went in, she told me other patients have nearly hit her. And I had to get both feet done and it was 4 weeks for each foot. Much pain, but it worked.
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PRP is something that well may have been tried on Freeman as they would have been looking at every option. Truth is though there is little to no evidence it workswhich of course is true in a lot of things done in sports medicine. Bit of a hobby horse of mine, and I don't want to disparage what you say LL, but you would have no idea really if it worked. On an individual basis you never know because it's just a case study on one. The placebo effect for a start will immediately make you believe there has been benefit even if the treatment was useless.

To really know if things like this work you have to have to have evidence from controlled blinded trials. The Cochrane database,which is the gold standard body for assessing whether there is clinical evidence for treatments, in 2014 found very weak evidence for PRP having some benefits in helping with pain in musculoskeletal injuries but no evidence of benefit in function short, medium or long term. Doesn't mean there is no benefit just that so far no one has shown there is so it should remain in the realms of an experimental, unproven therapy. The good side is ther is no evidence of adverseeffects from the treatment so it appears safe. Just be wary of believing it's benefits.

Essendon should have had a similar wariness.
 
Do people seriously think Freeman is going to be a Dangerfield???

Is that just from that tweet that Paige put up when he was drafted?

He has never in any shape or form looked or played like Dangerfield to my eyes.

The only similarity they have is pace.
 
pebblesofsand said:
It wouldn't happen but it was the only way I could see that both sides ended up with "fairness" in the trade.

At the moment its a risk for both sides - that's why I reckon that even though Freeman has nominated St Kilda I don't count this over the line as yet.

From where I sit, St Kilda losing Pick 23 on a player whose body may/may not be up to AFL is a bigger risk for St Kilda than Collingwood downgrading a now clearly suspect Pick 10 to a Pick 23. At least you will get a second chance.

That's why I think something around late 2nd (30+) is probably closer to the mark. Only problem is - can that be achieved and would it be agreed to ?
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St.Kilda's 2nd is currently 24. Brisbane will get compo pick for Leuey when he leaves as well as all the academy kids that will push most 1st and early 2nd round picks back. I expect that pick 24 to be around 27/28, when the pick is to used on draft day.

On Freeman, Piebeast spoke to him and Freeman thought his chances were limited, in part due to Treloar and Aish coming to us. Connors said we aren't chasing Aish. That flies in the face of Freemans assumptions.

It's as much about money as it is about opportunities or medical treatment. Not dirty on the kid for chasing more money and security, just stating what appears conflicting views.
 
Kirby said:
Do people seriously think Freeman is going to be a Dangerfield???

Is that just from that tweet that Paige put up when he was drafted?

He has never in any shape or form looked or played like Dangerfield to my eyes.

The only similarity they have is pace.
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Watch his TAC Cup highlights and youll see how he like danger. Has more outside game than inside, which is why he isnt exactly like danger, but his ability to win contested ball, cleareances and his massive frame for a mid is why he is SIMILAR to danger
 
pebblesofsand said:
It wouldn't happen but it was the only way I could see that both sides ended up with "fairness" in the trade.

At the moment its a risk for both sides - that's why I reckon that even though Freeman has nominated St Kilda I don't count this over the line as yet.

From where I sit, St Kilda losing Pick 23 on a player whose body may/may not be up to AFL is a bigger risk for St Kilda than Collingwood downgrading a now clearly suspect Pick 10 to a Pick 23. At least you will get a second chance.

That's why I think something around late 2nd (30+) is probably closer to the mark. Only problem is - can that be achieved and would it be agreed to ?
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As swap of pick 5 for 7 will go a long way in making that pick 23 more palatable.
 

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Bay Pie said:
St.Kilda's 2nd is currently 24. Brisbane will get compo pick for Leuey when he leaves as well as all the academy kids that will push most 1st and early 2nd round picks back. I expect that pick 24 to be around 27/28, when the pick is to used on draft day.

On Freeman, Piebeast spoke to him and Freeman thought his chances were limited, in part due to Treloar and Aish coming to us. Connors said we aren't chasing Aish. That flies in the face of Freemans assumptions.

It's as much about money as it is about opportunities or medical treatment. Not dirty on the kid for chasing more money and security, just stating what appears conflicting views.
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Yeah Leuey compo is a chance and will change the picks but I don't count academy kids as they are not really part of the draft.

By saying it becomes 27/28 doesn't change the fact that Collingwood would still select the 23/24 best player available in the draft which is valued at 100+ points (or pick 60+) than pick Pick 27/28.

So then maybe Saints would argue Freeman and your 4th rounder (62/63) for our second rounder (Pick 23/24). That way we can upgrade Sinclair and retain our first and third rounder.
 
pebblesofsand said:
It wouldn't happen but it was the only way I could see that both sides ended up with "fairness" in the trade.

At the moment its a risk for both sides - that's why I reckon that even though Freeman has nominated St Kilda I don't count this over the line as yet.

From where I sit, St Kilda losing Pick 23 on a player whose body may/may not be up to AFL is a bigger risk for St Kilda than Collingwood downgrading a now clearly suspect Pick 10 to a Pick 23. At least you will get a second chance.

That's why I think something around late 2nd (30+) is probably closer to the mark. Only problem is - can that be achieved and would it be agreed to ?
Click to expand...
No doubt there's a risk to St Kilda, but I think it's a little of club and supporters not being on the same page. A 3 year 300k contract would suggest St Kilda has weighed up talent vs injury risks and are content where things sit. Plus if you're bringing a player in you don't want to muck them around, so often clubs settle for giving up a little bit more.

It's injury not form that has stopped Freeman to date, so the talent that Hine seen to take him at 10 while unproven is still there. We wouldn't have offered a contract and wanted to keep him otherwise. For mine a late 1st round is about the mark, but reckon the 'pies would settle for an early 2nd to get some value back.

To put it into perspective it's apparently us who are looking to move Seedsman on, but we're still wanting a pick below 30 in return. If it comes off pick 23 will be a steal and I think it will be hard to find better talents at that pick in this draft.
 
1892 said:
No doubt there's a risk to St Kilda, but I think it's a little of club and supporters not being on the same page. A 3 year 300k contract would suggest St Kilda has weighed up talent vs injury risks and are content where things sit. Plus if you're bringing a player in you don't want to muck them around, so often clubs settle for giving up a little bit more.

It's injury not form that has stopped Freeman to date, so the talent that Hine seen to take him at 10 while unproven is still there. We wouldn't have offered a contract and wanted to keep him otherwise. For mine a late 1st round is about the mark, but reckon the 'pies would settle for an early 2nd to get some value back.

To put it into perspective it's apparently us who are looking to move Seedsman on, but we're still wanting a pick below 30 in return. If it comes off pick 23 will be a steal and I think it will be hard to find better talents at that pick in this draft.
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Don't get seduced by the money being offered -its the same as for Carlisle - its all about getting over the first hurdle of getting an uncontracted player to nominate you as their preferred club. Once that's done you can then negotiate with the club about trade value - the two are not directly related.

On the offer to Freeman - my understanding is that is 2 + 1 with a heavily front loaded first year as we have salary cap issues next year (ie getting to 95%). Total won't be anywhere near the million.
 
No SPIN said:
You mean the same FREEMAN you have been bagging will never make it.
Now you have crocodile tears - or are you trolling again?
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always trolling. he gets his laughs by saying the opposite and sits back and waits for the re-action
 
pebblesofsand said:
Don't get seduced by the money being offered -its the same as for Carlisle - its all about getting over the first hurdle of getting an uncontracted player to nominate you as their preferred club. Once that's done you can then negotiate with the club about trade value - the two are not directly related.

On the offer to Freeman - my understanding is that is 2 + 1 with a heavily front loaded first year as we have salary cap issues next year (ie getting to 95%). Total won't be anywhere near the million.
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Actually yeah, they are directly related. Clubs don't go offering a salary over the odds to lure players away from their current clubs unless they rate them highly. It's a dead giveaway that the Saints have big wraps on him if they're willing to offer the kind of coin they have with no performance conditions. If they're willing to take that kind of risk to lure him to their club, then the risk of a second round pick in a shallow draft shouldn't be an issue. You don't offer mediocre players big money just to make up cap space, you offer good players big money to improve the list. It's a pretty simple concept that most St Kilda fans seem to conveniently overlook.
 
Rohan25 said:
Jon Ralph "stinging" Freeman on SEN for citing opportunity as his reason for leaving.

Says he needs to provide the real reason or open himself up to extreme criticism.
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Reckon someone may have got on the phone & called Ralphy up & said listen mate, this Freeman thing, nod wink & I'll give you scoop down the track.
 
could be another tom boyd flop pressure could get to him with that new deal
has a lot of pressure and expectation now for a nobody
 
I have noticed were more then happy to entertain the stkilda fans on this forum, yet the Collingwood fans that have been on the Stkilda board there replies have been erased.

Many Stkilda fans not all are calling for payback , and a vandeta style killing for payback for Luke Ball.
Also wanting to get payback from Essendon in regards to Carlisle,becouse of the way they got screwed in the Lovett deal.
Eventhough when pointed out to them by me, that Collingwood didnt screw Stkilda. Stkilda screwed Stkilda in regards to Luke Ball with the way they treated him. They erased my message.
Obviously the truth hurts!
Just remember Saints fans dont go poak a bear, we all know what happens!
We will always be the AFL cash cow! Main event! Show stopper!
You will always be our little sister! We will protect you like we do to all small Victorian clubs.
 
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