Mega Thread Nick Daicos - Can he be the GOAT? Part 2

[Lunchtime]

Exactly, some of the time. There were also plenty of times where the ruck tap, ground ball or hard ball was won in 1v1s at stoppages and he burst directly. Really this is how all the champion inside/outside midfielders have been.

Yep the dynamic players: Ablett Jnr, Martin, Dangerfield all applied scoreboard pressure too.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Daicos 266 career coaches votes.

The maximum possible from McRae is 165. The minimum possible from the opposition coaches is 101 votes.

That is quite a large potential gulf. Up to 1 in 4(25%) of the coaches votes Daicos has received in his career have potentially been added by McRae's bias towards him. Early days yet as I have only looked at a few other players, but standard maximum possible discrepancy seems to be closer to 10% for other players.

However good Daicos actually is or will become, it is reassuring to know that the media, and his coach are going to be working flat out to make him look at least 15% better than he is.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Daicos 266 career coaches votes.

The maximum possible from McRae is 165. The minimum possible from the opposition coaches is 101 votes.

That is quite a large potential gulf. Up to 1 in 4(25%) of the coches votes Daicos has received in his career have potentially been added by McRae's bias towards him. Early days yet as I have only looked at a few other players, but standard maximum possible discrepancy seems to be closer to 10% for other players.

However good Daicos actually is or will become, it is reassuring to know that the media, and his coach are going to be working flat out to make him look at least 15% better than he is.

Umps too?

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[sr36]

For whatever reason your opinion on Ablett's role and impact at stoppages (from a first touch perspective) differs to mine and the consensus, which is fine. I have his whole career imprinted in my brain and his burst from stoppages came from every single source possible. You seem to have a blinkered view of one aspect of his play. Anyway, we're getting off track.

One last thing. What happened when Gaz got the footy around stoppage? They couldn't tackle him or get him to turn it over within the stoppage. The stoppage was cleared. Certainly not the case with Nick yet - he gets pinned with the ball quite often- the ball spills free in tackles, some rushed handballs turnover within stoppage. If Gaz got his hands on it as often as Nick did last year around stoppage - we'd have a lot higher record for most clearances in a season. That's basically my point. Not that Gaz was a receiver, that he didn't get first to the ball as often as Nick or as often as the higher clearance guys do. And it was to do with intentional positioning - it's how they thought he could be the most damaging and he certainly was damaging.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

There are only 23 current players with more career Brownlow votes than Daics

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[RUNVS]

There are only 23 current players with more career Brownlow votes than Daics

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Brownlow votes is a very poor measure of a players quality. Not only is it a midfielders award, but umpires are not great judges either. There was a game last year where it is clear the umpires mistook Josh and Nick, and gave Nick votes when he had an objectively poor game and Josh had a great game.

 

[Corn Cobbers]

Brownlow votes is a very poor measure of a players quality. Not only is it a midfielders award, but umpires are not great judges either. There was a game last year where it is clear the umpires mistook Josh and Nick, and gave Nick votes when he had an objectively poor game and Josh had a great game.

Further to that... Daics has more career Brownlow votes than any current Swans player

On SM-A225F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Brownlow votes is a very poor measure of a players quality. Not only is it a midfielders award, but umpires are not great judges either. There was a game last year where it is clear the umpires mistook Josh and Nick, and gave Nick votes when he had an objectively poor game and Josh had a great game.

There are 3 credible measures of performance imo. Coaches votes, Brownlow votes, & player ratings. Some players are favoured by one or the other of these in one way or another. Daicos is(legitimately) favoured by the Brownlow format, and imo at this stage, is favoured by his biased coach in the coaches MVP votes. The player ratings is not biased.

I don't recall exactly but maybe only 2 players have unified all 3 titles in the same season(from the last 13 seasons.

2016 Dangerfield
2017 Martin

If there was a 3rd player to do it then it was Ablett when he won his second Brownlow.

Daicos's record:

2022 Brownlow =27th, Coaches MVP =64th, Player Ratings approx 170th.

2023 Brownlow = 3rd, Coaches MVP =3rd, Player Ratings = 13th

2024 Brownlow = 2nd, Coaches MVP = 1st, Player Ratings = 7th


What we have seen is improvement in each award or rating each season. But the only time he came 1st was his highly contentious Coaches MVP in 2024. Daicos is well on course(or even well ahead of schedule)to be contending to be the best player in the competition. But claims that he is clearly the best player already are far fetched. The above shows that. If he follows his previous improvement curve he arrives this year. Let's see if he can unify the titles in a season before we start talking about him as a GOAT candidate. From there he needs multiple great finals series & or more than 1 unified season before he goes clearly head of other modern players.

 

[Do the Dew]

Blocking an opponent's kick would be a smother in AFL. Jesus this is three posts in a row, where you are completely off the mark.

I've already posted the 2024 spoil stats.

Cripps spoils stats for career are according to this

AFL Player Profile

AFL Player Profile

www.wheeloratings.com

0.4 not 0.5


2024 is an important year for both Cripps and Neale. Brownlow and Premiership respectively.

In 2024 Cripps (195cm) had 8 spoils for the whole season. Neale had 3 spoils, the same as Daicos. Same as Prestia and Dusty had... 2.

In his other Brownlow year, Cripps had even less spoils with 7. Does it really matter if Daicos got a couple of more spolis in a season?

Alright I'll concede that I was completely wrong on spoil vs smother, must've been the beer talking.

However I'm not wrong on the stats (I used the ones from the AFL website) where you claim Daicos has superior spoils to the others which is wrong. I'm using their entire careers vs one year.

Also not sure what Prestia and Dusty have to do with it. They played 13 games each last year. Regardless, both still average more spoils than Daicos. In fact, Daicos's spoils have decreased from his first year, meaning he's even less likely to be involved in an aerial contest.

 

[Do the Dew]

Is Steph Curry terrible because he doesnt dunk every game?

Theres a reason why he is in a handfull of players that have been huge in NBA & considered among the best. He does his craft well and plays to strengths , pretty simple concept really.

"Nicks not great at contested marking. Cripps is slow but thats just part of his game" Says every carlton supporter

*worst in the competition.

 

[Fadge]

Forgot Brownlow votes: 9 (tied first with Cripps)

Cripps doing particularly well to have 9 votes after only 2 games.

But if anyone can do it, he can...

 

[Fadge]

Brownlow votes is a very poor measure of a players quality. Not only is it a midfielders award, but umpires are not great judges either. There was a game last year where it is clear the umpires mistook Josh and Nick, and gave Nick votes when he had an objectively poor game and Josh had a great game.

Can you now reference the games when Nick didn't poll as many Brownlow votes as expected?

Because there have been a few of them too.

 

[Fadge]

Further to that... Daics has more career Brownlow votes than any current Swans player

On SM-A225F using BigFooty.com mobile app

I think RUNVS is quite envious.

 

[Fadge]

There are 3 credible measures of performance imo. Coaches votes, Brownlow votes, & player ratings. Some players are favoured by one or the other of these in one way or another. Daicos is(legitimately) favoured by the Brownlow format, and imo at this stage, is favoured by his biased coach in the coaches MVP votes. The player ratings is not biased.

I don't recall exactly but maybe only 2 players have unified all 3 titles in the same season(from the last 13 seasons.

2016 Dangerfield
2017 Martin

If there was a 3rd player to do it then it was Ablett when he won his second Brownlow.

Daicos's record:

2022 Brownlow =27th, Coaches MVP =64th, Player Ratings approx 170th.

2023 Brownlow = 3rd, Coaches MVP =3rd, Player Ratings = 13th

2024 Brownlow = 2nd, Coaches MVP = 1st, Player Ratings = 7th


What we have seen is improvement in each award or rating each season. But the only time he came 1st was his highly contentious Coaches MVP in 2024. Daicos is well on course(or even well ahead of schedule)to be contending to be the best player in the competition. But claims that he is clearly the best player already are far fetched. The above shows that. If he follows his previous improvement curve he arrives this year. Let's see if he can unify the titles in a season before we start talking about him as a GOAT candidate. From there he needs multiple great finals series & or more than 1 unified season before he goes clearly head of other modern players.

'PlaYeR RaTinGz'

 

[Fadge]

Daicos is well on course(or even well ahead of schedule)to be contending to be the best player in the competition.

This is my favourite part.

In the world according to MR, Daicos isn't even yet in contention to be the best player in the competition, despite many people referring to him as just that since halfway through his second season in the competition, when he was a runaway leader in every single major individual award available.

 

[Fadge]

Daicos 266 career coaches votes.

The maximum possible from McRae is 165. The minimum possible from the opposition coaches is 101 votes.

That is quite a large potential gulf. Up to 1 in 4(25%) of the coches votes Daicos has received in his career have potentially been added by McRae's bias towards him. Early days yet as I have only looked at a few other players, but standard maximum possible discrepancy seems to be closer to 10% for other players.

However good Daicos actually is or will become, it is reassuring to know that the media, and his coach are going to be working flat out to make him look at least 15% better than he is.

As an example of what you are suggesting, so far in 2025, Daicos has received 5 coaches votes in round 1, and 8 coaches votes in round 2.

Under your warped view, Fly 'could have' awarded Daicos 10 of those 13 votes, with the opposition coach awarding the remaining 3 votes.

Based on how Daicos performed in those games, what would you perceive to be the 'par' number of votes?

Because 5 and 8 votes in rounds 1 and 2 does seem reasonable to me.

 

[sr36]

In fact, Daicos's spoils have decreased from his first year, meaning he's even less likely to be involved in an aerial contest.

Jeez I wonder why?

 

[RCAB]

However I'm not wrong on the stats (I used the ones from the AFL website) where you claim Daicos has superior spoils to the others which is wrong.

I never claimed that.

You need go read my posts properly, rather then getting all outraged about me calling you out on your inaccuracies, which incidentally you've done again.

 

[RCAB]

This is my favourite part.

In the world according to MR, Daicos isn't even yet in contention to be the best player in the competition, despite many people referring to him as just that since halfway through his second season in the competition, when he was a runaway leader in every single major individual award available.

Maybe he's just bitter you never gave Dusty enough credit and that's on you Fadge

 

[ShereKhan]

I see Fly gave Naicos 5 x votes again. The Brownlow already has question marks, and now with Fly just giving Naicos maximum votes at every opportunity (as he did to tail out 2024 to get Naicos over the line), the coaches award will soon lose credibility as well. Libba was clearly better than Naicos, and arguably Darcy as well. And Naicos was nowhere near best against Port, but Fly gave him 5 (got zero from Port).

Just look at the vote tallies each week - the voting is getting a bit embarrassing by Fly.


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[Meteoric Rise]

As an example of what you are suggesting, so far in 2025, Daicos has received 5 coaches votes in round 1, and 8 coaches votes in round 2.

Under your warped view, Fly 'could have' awarded Daicos 10 of those 13 votes, with the opposition coach awarding the remaining 3 votes.

Based on how Daicos performed in those games, what would you perceive to be the 'par' number of votes?

Because 5 and 8 votes in rounds 1 and 2 does seem reasonable to me.

5 & 8 votes is very top end of the range for those two performances. He could have got say 0 & 6 without raising an eyebrow. And that is exactly how it appears the opposition coaches rated it.

 

[WalshistheGOAT]

I see Fly gave Naicos 5 x votes again. The Brownlow already has question marks, and now with Fly just giving Naicos maximum votes at every opportunity (as he did to tail out 2024 to get Naicos over the line), the coaches award will soon lose credibility as well. Libba was clearly better than Naicos, and arguably Darcy as well. And Naicos was nowhere near best against Port, but Fly gave him 5 (got zero from Port).

Just look at the vote tallies each week - the voting is getting a bit embarrassing by Fly.


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Making a mockery of the award. Did it through last year too to get him over the line.

 

[Fadge]

Making a mockery of the award. Did it through last year too to get him over the line.

Get used to it.

Nick Daicos will make a mockery of many things football related over the next decade.

Just sit back and enjoy it.

 

[RUNVS]

Get used to it.

Nick Daicos will make a mockery of many things football related over the next decade.

Just sit back and enjoy it.

I don't think you understand what is being discussed.

 

[Fadge]

I don't think you understand what is being discussed.

Oh no. I fully understand.

Just trying to work out who is the saltiest and most jealous of Nick Daicos' greatness amongst the recent posters.

It's a tightly run race...