Our biggest trade/draft period EVER.

[Shaneprice97]

Actually, beams a close second

 

[CoreyBurnett1]

Oxley can hit a target! Let's put some weight on him in the offseason and he should be good!

 

[Shaneprice97]

We need a quick back flanker with great skills (maybe daisy if he stays) but a player like Andrew Walker. A midfielder who constantly gets the contested possesion and lays tackles. Small body like luke ball, or big body like Josh kennedy. A second key forward who is capable of 30+ goals (reid could get 50+ but hes just as good of a backman as a foward)

 

[ash84]

We need a quick back flanker with great skills (maybe daisy if he stays) but a player like Andrew Walker. A midfielder who constantly gets the contested possesion and lays tackles. Small body like luke ball, or big body like Josh kennedy. A second key forward who is capable of 30+ goals (reid could get 50+ but hes just as good of a backman as a foward)

Young could be that HB flanker.
Adams could be the first mid you mentioned.
Daisy could be the second.
We either need a key back to allow Reid to stay fwd, or a key fwd i agree.

 

[Visions]

I was very unimpressed with the Hawks today. They were not world beaters AT ALL. If Freo kicked for goal well, it would be Freo that won today, simple as that.

Any team can be beaten on a given day, but Hawthorn are the best team in the comp and they're still a fair way ahead of us, along with a few other teams.

It is often how well a forward makes the space for himself. I am sick of seeing forward lead straight TO the ball, taking their backman with them, and when they put their hands up, they are surprised when the spoil happens. Gunston is the guy that was taking marks in the fifty, and he was staying OUT of the drop zone of the ball, and right as the ball was just about to be at the perfect spot, he would take those three four steps into the space, and clunk it. Cloke gets to the ball too quick.

That shouldn't be a problem if he can burn his defender off which he can, but it becomes an issue when he has to wait for the ball because his team mates can't weight a pass to him and it ends up over his head.

We have midfielders that can hit targets. Pendlebury and Swan don't poll well in the Brownlow because they miss targets. Beams is a very handy kick as well. And Josh Thomas did very well this year. Also Ball is a player that can hit a leading forward target. But if Cloke wants to take the defender with him, and not think before rushing at the ball, he will get what he has been getting.

Pendles and Beams I will give you but the rest of them are average at best. There is a reason why teams don't tag Swan even though he will rack more disposals than anyone and Josh Thomas is not a great kick.
Watch our final against Port again and the second half against Brisbane at the Gabba. Prime examples of how poor we deliver to leading forwards and not just Cloke.

 

[Shaneprice97]

Yeah, josh thomas's disposal is about as good as swans

 

[Duggy31]

What do Pie fans think of Alipate Carlile? Reason I ask, is that I know he enquired about a house in Werribee South on the beach. He didn't turn up to the Auction, probably because A. It was only a second thought from another option in Williamstown or St Kilda beach anyway, and B. That day he was playing for Port against North Melbourne. But the enquiry certainly pricked my ears up thinking he might be wanting to move to Melbourne.

I also see he is a Restricted Free Agent.

Also heard the other day that Scott Selwood wants to come back to Melbourne. I am sure there is heaps of players that haven't even been mentioned yet. However, when they do, it would be mad for Pies not to be doing their Homework on each and every possibility.

If Collingwood recruit a Selwood they will be losing my membership.

 

[Big Bryza]

I was very unimpressed with the Hawks today. They were not world beaters AT ALL. If Freo kicked for goal well, it would be Freo that won today, simple as that.

It is often how well a forward makes the space for himself. I am sick of seeing forward lead straight TO the ball, taking their backman with them, and when they put their hands up, they are surprised when the spoil happens. Gunston is the guy that was taking marks in the fifty, and he was staying OUT of the drop zone of the ball, and right as the ball was just about to be at the perfect spot, he would take those three four steps into the space, and clunk it. Cloke gets to the ball too quick.

We have midfielders that can hit targets. Pendlebury and Swan don't poll well in the Brownlow because they miss targets. Beams is a very handy kick as well. And Josh Thomas did very well this year. Also Ball is a player that can hit a leading forward target. But if Cloke wants to take the defender with him, and not think before rushing at the ball, he will get what he has been getting.

Ben Reid does much better in this aspect, and look how many marks he got this year while playing in the forward line. I hope they play Cloke at CHF next year, it would be much better for our team balance, and Cloke is much better at those long kicks forward and can patrol the half forward line, which is what we have been missing since Anthony Rocca retired.

Hang on, hang on.. You mean Travis Cloke, the contested marking king that plays for Collingwood??

 

[Alexander323bc]

Does anyone think we are going hard at GWS for pick one? Front load everyone's contract short term and then being able to pick up some free agents next year if available?

 

[Bloben]

The fact that GWS have Patton, Cameron and potentially Buddy means that getting Boyd will create an excess of KPFs.

That opens up some opportunities for them. They may decide that they can trade pick one for some established talent or they could look to trade Patton who has had a poor run with injuries. Definitely worth a discussion as either a Patton or Boyd would be massive for us.

We could have a forward line of Cloke, White and either Patton or Boyd allowing Reid to move down back.

 

[Pie Guy]

Any team can be beaten on a given day, but Hawthorn are the best team in the comp and they're still a fair way ahead of us, along with a few other teams.

I disagree we are too far away from them. How far away from the Freo away from the best teams last year? This year they closed that gap. There is not a lot of things that have to go right to be up with them. Toovey, Thomas and less injuries to players like Beams and some others would be half way there. Then if Elliott stepped up one level, and some others that are right on the brink of being great players, then Hawks have Buddy go, and an injury riddled season, and we are there. That may seem a lot, but it is quite possible.

That shouldn't be a problem if he can burn his defender off which he can, but it becomes an issue when he has to wait for the ball because his team mates can't weight a pass to him and it ends up over his head.

It ends up over his head because he runs under it at times. When a ball is coming fifty meters in length, it is just as much the forwards ability to read the ball in flight as it is to put it in that spot. I understand if it was a 20 meter stab passed that missed a target, because it is impossible, but fifty meter kicks should be read better.

Pendles and Beams I will give you but the rest of them are average at best. There is a reason why teams don't tag Swan even though he will rack more disposals than anyone and Josh Thomas is not a great kick.
Watch our final against Port again and the second half against Brisbane at the Gabba. Prime examples of how poor we deliver to leading forwards and not just Cloke.

Swan is not an average kick, I will not give you that at all. He averages 3 clangers out of 32 disposals a match. The best in the league range between 2 and 3 disposal clangers a match. Even looking at effective disposals, he is at 63%, which is over 20 disposals effective. Pendlebury is better, at 77%, but gets only 29 disposals a match, which brings him down to 22 disposals effective a match. That is 3 difference in the end. It is not a hell of a lot. Beams gets 3.5 Clangers a match too. But his effective disposals are at a high 76%. Josh Thomas is at 69% effective disposal and 2.3 Clangers average per match. Swan is the highest achiever of the three with inside fifty's too, at 5.2 per game, Pendlebury 4.1 and Beams 4.4, Thomas at 3.5.

Last year Swan was 67% effective. 69% effective the year before that.

But I can't believe someone that comes 3rd in the Brownlow would need sticking up for. If you asked any other teams supporters, I think they would have a better opinion on Swan than this. Even when you talk to Cloke, when talking of the delivery, he would be positive about it, he would say he gets good delivery from and the names that would role off his tongue would be Pendlebury, Swan and Beams. Thomas is young and raw, and will get better.

All this tells me, is that we have nothing to worry about. It is not even worth mentioning. Gary Ablett is 67% Effective. Ben Sinclair who is bagged no end for his disposal is 83.5%. Some players are forgiven for poor disposals, some aren't.

Over all, Swan was a little down this year. But not enough to suggest he is a poor disposal of the ball, and is best out of all of them when it comes to trying to hit up a leading forward. I find Cloke very confusing a lot of the time. Sometimes it isn't even his fault. How many times do I see he is being held back from sprinting forward. The umpires don't see it, and it frustrates me no end. Tarrant too used to get held in the same way. How can a midfielder read all of these problems? How about just pop it into a dangerous spot, and Cloke uses his smarts to out smart and breakaway from his defender. How many times do I see Cloke wrong footed close to goal, when a defender goes up and takes it. A lot to my recollection.

Now that is not to say Cloke is not a gun of a player. I just believe he is played in the incorrect spot. Put him at CHF and you will see a huge difference. As someone else said, he is an awesome contested mark. This is when he runs up high on the fifty. It doesn't happen as much from 0-30. When it does, he misses his shot. So why not have him patrolling THE most important spot on the ground? From 40-80 meters from goal. That long raking left foot off his will have the ball transition in deep to White if we get him, Paine if he comes on, Elliott who is our best reader of a long ball, and Reid, who is a joy to watch mark those fast balls. At the moment, we have no weapon at CHF, yet we have the best one in the side, playing the wrong spot.

Swan, Pendlebury, Beams, Ball and both Thomas's effectiveness will be hitting Cloke at CHF, rather than FF. And I predict it will rise over all.

 

[Giant Sphinx]

The fact that GWS have Patton, Cameron and potentially Buddy means that getting Boyd will create an excess of KPFs.

That opens up some opportunities for them. They may decide that they can trade pick one for some established talent or they could look to trade Patton who has had a poor run with injuries. Definitely worth a discussion as either a Patton or Boyd would be massive for us.

We could have a forward line of Cloke, White and either Patton or Boyd allowing Reid to move down back.

Agree. If GWS get Buddy we should be throwing everything we can at them to get that first pick. Like I said in another post is Daisy goes and we get pick 11 and Shaw wants to go to GWS then we give them Shaw and picks 10 11 and get back pick 1 and maybe a player. Boyd will not only help Cloke now but we must think beyond Cloke as well.

 

[Pie Guy]

I am in agreeance, lets get this bloke.

 

[kevind]

Depends where the club sees itself. Are we a genuine premiership threat next year, or rebuilding?

If rebuilding, get as many good young players in the draft as possible\, even if it means trading players like Shaw, Reid etc.

If we are to have a crack at the flag, then we need players who can have immeadiate impact.

Looking at the team with the X's being players we need to make us competetive with the likes of Hawthorn, and given that Heath Shaw will definitely be traded

B Toovey Brown Goldsack
HB x1 Keefe X2
C Seedsman Pendlebury Young????????
Hf Elliot Reid Fasolo
F X3 Cloke X4

R Grundy/Witts Beams Swan

Inter Blair, J thomas, Kennedy, Williams

X1- needs to have pace and elite kicking skills -- Dal Santo--free agency
X2- needs pace and elite kicking skills----- Atley from North Melbourne would be ideal, if Hawks can plunder and burn North, why can't we??? Perhaps a swap for Sidebottom? Hence Sidebottom not named in this team
X3- Tall forward- seems like Jesse White for a second round pick may happen. White is a serviceable player. Looked finished after Adelaide knocked him back due to concerns with his knee , but this year was good. May be that Cam Mooney equivalent for us.
X4- If Heater goes , I would like to see him go to Geelong for Motlop. Motlop can be an elite small forward and we desperately need a crumber. He also has speed and is an accurate kick for goal

With the above scenario, that would give us 6 forwards who are capable of 30 plus goals for the year, and a back half with line breaking speed and enough elite kicking skills to make our forward entries count.

The question marks would be the very inexpierienced ruck division, Young on a wing who seems to be permanently injured and possibly our depth.

PS. No Dale Thomas as I have been told his ankle is stuffed.

 

[kevind]

what about Kris pendlebury? seen on his instagram that his been doing some early pre-season at westpac, i do think we should pick him up, regardless he walked out on the vfl squad or not, he could be something

Absolutely. He has an amazing footballing surname.

Just think, when he is on Buddy and the ball is coming down to them, he can turn to Buddy and say, "Mate, I've got an incredible footballing surname, so this is mine". And Buddy will, realizing he has been trumped, stand aside and let Kris get the easy possession

Which we will be nice.

 

[kevind]

I agree with Knightmare. There is just so many doom and gloom supporters that choose to think negatively. We are a very good side.

Absolutely.

You would think we finished 8th after being bundled out of the finals in the first week by a team that was nearly on the bottom of the ladder last year.

 

[Quicky]

Oxley can hit a target! Let's put some weight on him in the offseason and he should be good!

Defenders need to be able to defend. Oxley needs to work on this. The kid has silk though.

 

[kevind]

I was very unimpressed with the Hawks today. They were not world beaters AT ALL. If Freo kicked for goal well, it would be Freo that won today, simple as that.

It is often how well a forward makes the space for himself. I am sick of seeing forward lead straight TO the ball, taking their backman with them, and when they put their hands up, they are surprised when the spoil happens. Gunston is the guy that was taking marks in the fifty, and he was staying OUT of the drop zone of the ball, and right as the ball was just about to be at the perfect spot, he would take those three four steps into the space, and clunk it. Cloke gets to the ball too quick.

We have midfielders that can hit targets.

Cloke gets to the ball too quick???????? Don't know whether to laugh or cry at that one. The idea is to get the ball to the forwards as quick as possible as that makes it harder to defend. If Cloke somehow manages to get to the ball too quikly, that would be a bonus.

Don't know if you saw the Pt Adelaide final, if not, do go and watch and you will see one of the worst exhibitions of kicking skills, particularly into the forward line, in finals history. Has been happening all year and reached a peak under finals pressure.

We cannot afford a backline next year with all of Toovey, Sinclair and Williams as some posters on here have indicated. It will result in a turnover rate that will reach world record proportions.

 

[Quicky]

We cannot afford a backline next year with all of Toovey, Sinclair and Williams as some posters on here have indicated. It will result in a turnover rate that will reach world record proportions.

If you replace Sinclair with an elite kick that can play small and is good at getting across to help out our other defenders you get a much different defensive balance. I would love Yeo from Brisbane in this role.

You don't see Shaw at the Pies next season?

 

[Matz]

Sinclair is ok but I think the club may use him as trade bait to sweeten a deal,i like him alot but dont rate his worth as much as Marley.

Sent from my GT-I9505 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Copeland]

Sinclair is ok but I think the club may use him as trade bait to sweeten a deal,i like him alot but dont rate his worth as much as Marley.

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Not interested in trading young guys with speed. Lost Wellingham, maybe Thomas or just his speed and Young can't stay on the park. He's just about the fastest on our list, keep him imo.

 

[Pie Guy]

Absolutely.

You would think we finished 8th after being bundled out of the finals in the first week by a team that was nearly on the bottom of the ladder last year.

And where did we finish in 2006? Then what did we do in 2007? Missed out on playing Port in the Grand Final by five points, that Geelong smashed Port by 120 points. So we were five points away from winning the 2007 Grand Final after being bundled out by Western Bulldogs in 2006.

If you didn't rate Ports season enough to not think the only indicator of their ability was to compare it to the previous year, then you don't think like I do. What about all those dud sides that got beaten by West Coast the year after they were near the bottom....oh the shame.

C'mon, we are a little better than what you give us credit for. Had we played Tigers in the first final, we would of beat them. Our ladder position doesn't really give our season justice does it?

 

[Pie Guy]

If you replace Sinclair with an elite kick that can play small and is good at getting across to help out our other defenders you get a much different defensive balance. I would love Yeo from Brisbane in this role.

You don't see Shaw at the Pies next season?

You do know that Sinclairs effective disposal percentage is 83.5% and averages 1.1 clangers per game. Only Nathan Brown 84.8% and Lachlan Keeffe 83.7% is better in our side and no one has a lower average in Clangers?

It is amazing how different perception is to reality. I think that is the word that the umpires keep putting up as excuses for poor umpiring, "perception". Sinclair was chosen to be a whipping boy, and god damn it, supporters are going to whip their boy whether stats back it up or not. Sinclair prior to his injury, went a long way to proving supporters wrong. He is following in the footsteps of former whipping boys Alan Toovey and Ben Johnson.

 

[gifted1]

losing a bit of credibility knightmare.....

obviously you havent watched jesse white this year, he actually has had a pretty good end to the year

if you think he is a downgrade on lynch you are kidding yourself

 

[gifted1]

and podsiady

FMD are you serious