Pick Swap Completed

[Elite Crow]

Yes, but last years draft was elite. This years is middling and next years is poor with a multitude of F/S and NGA selections.

Pick 10-12 next year might net you a player the equivalent of a 20 from this year and a 29 from last year quality wise.

Pick numbers don't mean shit without the context of the relevant draft strength.

I actually don’t mind what you did, I reckon it’s a pretty good move. I’m just pointing out we didn’t sit on our hands completely and did some good stuff with live trading.

 

[Power freak 2008]

This pick gives a us a bit of flexibility. I think getting Dylan Stephens is a possibility. I am also considering that Gould is a player that we would regret not taking if we let him go. Would Stephens, Gould, Picket and Mead be a bad draft haul. Both Gould and Stephens seem to have elite kicking abilities. Pickett seems to have an X-factor.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Well let's look at fairly..

We haven't had any opportunities to draft Lynch Kennedy etc most of them were top draft picks ...

We had sarge who's body broke down and then we scrambled and pickedRyder who we turned AA and Charlie who has had injuries and playing in a disfunctional forward line.

We turned Dougal from pick 56 into 18 and we are now ready to unleash Ladhams Hayes and Marshall....

Lynch was pick 11 in 2010. We had pick 16 in 2010. If we were cutting edge we would have traded up from 16.

BUT BUT BUT I was talking about the last 5 years . Then why mention guys drafted in 2010 and 2005 respectively?

 

[Lockhart Road]

To suggest the club don't care is silly. They would have run through numerous scenarios and determined that this would have been an acceptable trade to make, not to mention they probably would have had to have gotten board approval to do this trade.

Er ... what?

 

[NEGAN]

Lynch was pick 11 in 2010. We had pick 16 in 2010. If we were cutting edge we would have traded up from 16.

BUT BUT BUT I was talking about the last 5 years . Then why mention guys drafted in 2010 and 2005 respectively?

Only because I was talking about the premier kpfs right now and where they come from. The only one is BB who I can think of we missed.

You want a developed kpf from the last 5 years only strengthens what I said previously.

 

[TeeKray]

If we on-trade this pick so we get say pick 7, will that make the trade more worthwhile?

Depends what else we give up in the process I guess. But yes, I imagine the trade would look more worthwhile in that instance.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Only because I was talking about the premier kpfs right now and where they come from. The only one is BB who I can think of we missed.

You want a developed kpf from the last 5 years only strengthens what I said previously.

You put the 5 year restriction on the cutting edge recruiting time frame, not me.

Edit my bad, you said - No one in the past 6 years doubted our lists capabilities.

Post the 2014 PF we have concentrated on filling holes with free agent players and trades and mature rookie picks rather than trying to develop KPPs.

Ryder, Dixon, Tompaus, Eddy, Lienert, Watts, Motlop, Rockliff, Thomas, Burton, Mayes, Lycett, Sutcliffe.

None of these guys have had 2 outstanding years in their tenure at Port, yet we traded out picks for half of them. Hopefully Lycett and Burton will as well as Dixon after coming back from his broken leg/ankle issues.

Lets look at our first 3 round picks since 2014. This is where you earn your keep as a recruiter, rather than getting a hail mary rookie pick turns into a star like Houston.

2014 1st and 2nd traded out for Ryder, 3rd Howard
2015 1st traded out for Dixon, 2nd Bonner, 3rd Johnson
2016 1st Marshall and SPP, 2nd Atley and Drew
2017 1st traded out for 2016 picks, 2nd traded out for Watts, 3rd Hayes and Farrell
2018 1st Rozee, Butters and Duursma

So outside the 2018 guys, a very good deep draft, there is nothing in that list that says our guys have been cutting edge recruiting. Hayes fell into our lap because Richmond spooked everyone into thinking you dont need ruckmen and Hayes slide about 30 spots.

SPP has been the only player that has had 2 solid years in a row in that list.

 

[tribey]

Chasing #7/#8/#9

Hehe.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

Adelaide swapping pick 4 for pick 6 with GWS. Almost certainly gives a GWS a free hit at a top end talent, then pick up Green for leftovers.

 

[NEGAN]

You put the 5 year restriction on the cutting edge recruiting time frame, not me.

Edit my bad, you said - No one in the past 6 years doubted our lists capabilities.

Post the 2014 PF we have concentrated on filling holes with free agent players and trades and mature rookie picks rather than trying to develop KPPs.

Ryder, Dixon, Tompaus, Eddy, Lienert, Watts, Motlop, Rockliff, Thomas, Burton, Mayes, Lycett, Sutcliffe.

None of these guys have had 2 outstanding years in their tenure at Port, yet we traded out picks for half of them. Hopefully Lycett and Burton will as well as Dixon after coming back from his broken leg/ankle issues.

Lets look at our first 3 round picks since 2014. This is where you earn your keep as a recruiter, rather than getting a hail mary rookie pick turns into a star like Houston.

2014 1st and 2nd traded out for Ryder, 3rd Howard
2015 1st traded out for Dixon, 2nd Bonner, 3rd Johnson
2016 1st Marshall and SPP, 2nd Atley and Drew
2017 1st traded out for 2016 picks, 2nd traded out for Watts, 3rd Hayes and Farrell
2018 1st Rozee, Butters and Duursma

So outside the 2018 guys, a very good deep draft, there is nothing in that list that says our guys have been cutting edge recruiting. Hayes fell into our lap because Richmond spooked everyone into thinking you dont need ruckmen and Hayes slide about 30 spots.

SPP has been the only player that has had 2 solid years in a row in that list.

But your whole outlook hinges on us developing a kpp ...point is in the 5 years we were chasing a flag...

We developed Sarge to some extent. He broke down and we brought in Ryder and Charlie given our midtable finishes this is nothing to scoff at....Lycett is with us now and now we are ready to unleash Marshall Ladhams and Hayes.....this is where you can start judging their development of kpps not when we were chasing a flag.

 

[Janus]

So GWS gives up:

Pick 18 (that they got for finishing runner up)
Pick 12 (which they got as half of the Shiel trade with Essendon)
2020 future first

GWS receives:

Pick 4

They have Picks 40, 59 and 60 with which to match a bid for Green. 733 points.

If Green is bid on at 5, that gives them a deficit of 769.4 points on their second round draft pick next year...which basically wipes out their second round pick.

That's how much GWS rate next year's draft - they are willing to trade out of the first and wipe themselves out of the second round for it.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

But your whole outlook hinges on us developing a kpp ...point is in the 5 years we were chasing a flag...

We developed Sarge to some extent. He broke down and we brought in Ryder and Charlie given our midtable finishes this is nothing to scoff at....Lycett is with us now and now we are ready to unleash Marshall Ladhams and Hayes.....this is where you can start judging their development of kpps not when we were chasing a flag.

No it doesn't.

I reckon your comment our recruiters are on the cutting edge is crap. Getting KPP's would probably prove your assertion. Apart from SPP and last years 1st rounders crop they have recruited average players in the first 3 round picks.

We have traded in some good players but some disappointing flops and underperforming players.

None of that is cutting edge IMO. Solid as a combined strategy, but not cutting edge.

 

[Duckimus Prime]

Adelaide swapping pick 4 for pick 6 with GWS. Almost certainly gives a GWS a free hit at a top end talent, then pick up Green for leftovers.

I don't get why the Crows would want to do this. They basically hand GWS a second top 5 player this year, in exchange for getting a likely late first round pick next year.

GWS has already improved their starting 22 with Jacobs over Mumford, and now they're gaining 2 top 5 players. You wouldn't think they're likely to head down the ladder as a result of this season.

 

[GoTheMightyCrows]

I don't get why the Crows would want to do this. They basically hand GWS a second top 5 player this year, in exchange for getting a likely late first round pick next year.

GWS has already improved their starting 22 with Jacobs over Mumford, and now they're gaining 2 top 5 players. You wouldn't think they're likely to head down the ladder as a result of this season.

Why would the cows look at it from the gws angle, the cows just traded down from pick 4 to 6 where they'll most likely still get the same player that they were after anyway plus get the gws 2020 pick, no brainer really.

 

[WAG]

I don't get why the Crows would want to do this. They basically hand GWS a second top 5 player this year, in exchange for getting a likely late first round pick next year.

GWS has already improved their starting 22 with Jacobs over Mumford, and now they're gaining 2 top 5 players. You wouldn't think they're likely to head down the ladder as a result of this season.

My thinking is that the Crows likely think the guy they're after will still be there at #6, so trading down for a future 1st rounder is pretty good value. Not sure they're worrying too much about strengthening GWS.



EDIT: What he said!

 

[Janus]

I don't get why the Crows would want to do this. They basically hand GWS a second top 5 player this year, in exchange for getting a likely late first round pick next year.

GWS has already improved their starting 22 with Jacobs over Mumford, and now they're gaining 2 top 5 players. You wouldn't think they're likely to head down the ladder as a result of this season.

Adelaide doesn't care about GWS. They care about themselves. They know they aren't challenging next year, so they are trying to supercharge a rebuild in what has to be the two worst drafts in history.

They were always into Stephens with their first round pick. Basically, they are regaining the pick they lost by trading out 19 in 2018 with this trade.

 

[NEGAN]

No it doesn't.

I reckon your comment our recruiters are on the cutting edge is crap. Getting KPP's would probably prove your assertion. Apart from SPP and last years 1st rounders crop they have recruited average players in the first 3 round picks.

We have traded in some good players but some disappointing flops and underperforming players.

None of that is cutting edge IMO. Solid as a combined strategy, but not cutting edge.

Of course last year's 1st rounders are good because we put the skids on chasing a flag.....

of course our recruitment was good prior to that because we were chasing a flag.....

We were aiming to achieve different things last year in comparison to the years prior.


Ryder Dixon Lycett seems pretty decent to me given our midtable finishes.

Eddie Dingle said it best...paraphrasing here ...."they get shit done"

 

[Schulzenfest]

Melbourne gave up their 2020 first rounder + pick 26 + pick 50 for pick 8 only. Port gave up their 2020 first rounder and pick 29 for pick 16, 52 and 55. The two 70s picks swapped, meh.

We gave up our 2020 first rounder for another 2019 first rounder. The 'chaff late picks' we received back basically balance out pick 29 because Mead.

The two pick swaps aren't comparable. If we gave up three rounds of picks for pick 8 only, your head would explode.

50's picks are chaff. I'd swap 16 + 50 + 52 + 55 for 8 in a microsecond. So would anyone.

 

[Launchpad McQuack]

Adelaide do two pick downgrade and also get a future late first.

We did a two pick downgrade for ???

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

My thinking is that the Crows likely think the guy they're after will still be there at #6, so trading down for a future 1st rounder is pretty good value. Not sure they're worrying too much about strengthening GWS.



EDIT: What he said!

6 = Stephens

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

So GWS gives up:

Pick 18 (that they got for finishing runner up)
Pick 12 (which they got as half of the Shiel trade with Essendon)
2020 future first

GWS receives:

Pick 4

They have Picks 40, 59 and 60 with which to match a bid for Green. 733 points.

If Green is bid on at 5, that gives them a deficit of 769.4 points on their second round draft pick next year...which basically wipes out their second round pick.

That's how much GWS rate next year's draft - they are willing to trade out of the first and wipe themselves out of the second round for it.

So GWS don't have a top 10 pick developing away in their academy? That's a rarity.

GWS' 1st Round Picks
2011 1,2,3,4,5,7,9,10,11,13,14
2012 1,2,3,12,14
2013 1,2,14
2014 4,6,7,
2015 7*,13*,16* * = academy pick
======
2016 2,5*,14*,20*
2017 11,
2018 11,14
2019 4 + *Green a top 10 pick

GWS probably have 10 more years of top 10 picks, despite likely to finish top 4 or top 6 most years.

 

[Ford Fairlane]

50's picks are chaff. I'd swap 16 + 50 + 52 + 55 for 8 in a microsecond. So would anyone.

That's irrelevant, nobody is talking about an imaginary draft swap. You understated the price Melbourne paid #8 draft pick swap and tried to compare it to what Port did where the 50s picks served a purpose.

 

[Chrizzt]

50's picks are chaff. I'd swap 16 + 50 + 52 + 55 for 8 in a microsecond. So would anyone.

m8 we drafted Robby Grey at 55 we can do it again why dont use support the club!
#YesWeKen

 

[WAG]

6 = Stephens

I hope so. Although there's some smoke around reaching for McAsey at 6 which feels too early.

 

[Andre]

50's picks are chaff. I'd swap 16 + 50 + 52 + 55 for 8 in a microsecond. So would anyone.

With the AFL attaching point values to picks, but being the AFL only going half way and not ditching picks altogether, is clubs doing these sorts of trades that stuff up everyone else. I've put up my suggestions on how to do it several times of ditching picks for clubs getting points based on ladder finish. Then can trade points from current and next year for trades. It removes the unknown of what you'll get. If we'd traded out 1000 points to Brisbane next year for instance instead of a pick swap, it wouldn't matter if we'd finish 1st or 18th, that's the price paid. There's other advantages as well, but in the main the AFL needs to bite the bullet and ditch picks for points full stop. Stuff it if it's harder to explain in 20 seconds to punters.