Roast Poor conversion

[Viper2Jester]

Our poor conversion around goal is extremely frustrating too often.

12/13 doesn't look so bad, but when consider outs on the full and missing sitters in front it simply isn't good enough.

It hurt us in the Prelim last year, lost us the game against the Hawks, and too often we keep sides in the game which has hurt our %.

I think we need to improve significantly in this area as it deflates the team, and will cost us in harder games coming up.

 

[The Butcher]

In other news.. water is wet.

 

[kangaspurs]

Our poor conversion around goal is extremely frustrating too often.

12/13 doesn't look so bad, but when consider outs on the full and missing sitters in front it simply isn't good enough.

It hurt us in the Prelim last year, lost us the game against the Hawks, and too often we keep sides in the game which has hurt our %.

I think we need to improve significantly in this area as it deflates the team, and will cost us in harder games coming up.

With absolutely no stats to back this up whatsoever, I would suggest that inaccurate kicking for goal has been a problem this competition-wide. Perhaps it's the increase in fatigue levels due to the interchange cap, but I'm not sure we're alone with the poor kicking for goal recently. In fact, I seem to remember earlier in the season we were actually quite good in this area.

 

[Devil Fish]

The lack of goal-kicking practice at training across the whole competition is the major reason IMO.
The first team that says "stuff this. Let's spend several hours each week solely on goal-kicking", will reap some major rewards.

Generating shots for goal is so difficult, and then to see player after player fail to convert, must just be so demoralising and yes, it costs teams win after win after win.

 

[shinboner magic]

It's just not the bad conversion that pisses me off - it's the chances we blow going inside 50 with missed passes.

We need to be more cleaner.

 

[Elite Master]

The lack of goal-kicking practice at training across the whole competition is the major reason IMO.
The first team that says "stuff this. Let's spend several hours each week solely on goal-kicking", will reap some major rewards.

I've heard this a lot over the years that goal kicking practice isn't done enough in training, but I reckon that's bullshit. I bet there is a lot of shots on goal during training sessions by a lot of sides, it's just that for whatever reason (nerves, fatigue etc) players struggle to kick straight.

 

[Viper2Jester]

It's just not the bad conversion that pisses me off - it's the chances we blow going inside 50 with missed passes.

We need to be more cleaner.

Yep, no doubt we can improve in this area.

Watching guys miss simple passes to open teammates in range, and continually missing shots from straight in front will burn us later in the year as it has in the past.

We're a good team, but not good enough to allow quality opposition to be let off so easily.

 

[roos_fanatic08]

How many easy goals has boomer, petrie, brown, waite and thomas missed this year? If you are 35m-40m out on a slight angle as an AFL footballer you shouldn't be missing those shots. We miss way too many of them and allow teams to gain momentum because of it.

The hawks game is a perfect example,the sydney game, the third quarter against port and even against the pies we missed a shitload of easy shots.

Its unacceptable, and to be a better club its one thing we need to iron out.

We really miss Higgins clutch goals, all last year you could rely on him to kick a settler.

 

[King Corey]

Bang on V2P. Agree with the exact examples you mention. It's not a one off we shank far too many 'gettable' shots that have cost us either games and/or percentage.

The team is good enough to generate opportunities most weeks but repeatedly puts itself in danger by not taking a high enough proportion of them. Again cases in point 2015 prelim final or 2016 hawks H&A where we were in control of the games to no effect while the opposition stayed in the hunt by taking their chances.

 

[scooby1279]

and the fact we don't bury sides.... 6 goals up with 5 minutes to go in the game and we win by 23 points.

 

[Skiparoo]

How many easy goals has boomer, petrie, brown, waite and thomas missed this year? If you are 35m-40m out on a slight angle as an AFL footballer you shouldn't be missing those shots. We miss way too many of them and allow teams to gain momentum because of it.

Don't forget the ones that are 20-30 metres out directly in front, and they get shanked. It is the one area of the game that has not improved through the generations, in fact it has probably got worse.

 

[Mr Reliable]

How many easy goals has boomer, petrie, brown, waite and thomas missed this year? If you are 35m-40m out on a slight angle as an AFL footballer you shouldn't be missing those shots. We miss way too many of them and allow teams to gain momentum because of it.

The hawks game is a perfect example,the sydney game, the third quarter against port and even against the pies we missed a shitload of easy shots.

Its unacceptable, and to be a better club its one thing we need to iron out.

We really miss Higgins clutch goals, all last year you could rely on him to kick a settler.

I used to be confident when Wellsy was shooting for goal. Not any more.

He's not confident either. On Saturday he was about 50 out going down to the Coventry end and he passed it (I think to Swallow) about 40 out. Wellsy appeared to be in range (although I'm yet to see the replay). Swallow was clearly out of range. Why pass it?

In the end Spitta hit it about as well as he could and it fell just short.

Setshotitis - it's a disease. And it's got little to do with exhaustion. We were shanking them in the first 5 minutes on Saturday night.

 

[archereleven]

I used to be confident when Wellsy was shooting for goal. Not any more.

He's not confident either. On Saturday he was about 50 out going down to the Coventry end and he passed it (I think to Swallow) about 40 out. Wellsy appeared to be in range (although I'm yet to see the replay). Swallow was clearly out of range. Why pass it?

In the end Spitta hit it about as well as he could and it fell just short.

Setshotitis - it's a disease. And it's got little to do with exhaustion. We were shanking them in the first 5 minutes on Saturday night.

Wells has never been confident in front of goals imo unless he is on the run.

Agree with all though, the set shot kicking is horrible within this group.

 

[Samsquanch]

Set shot practice must be one of the most basic, most often repeated training drills. Why do players miss easy set shots? Pressure is one reason. I'm sure stress levels are high, heads are throbbing with adrenaline surges and crowd noise, weight of expectation etc. gets to them during matches.

Solve that without reducing intensity and you will make a killing as a coach.

The supreme players exude confidence which helps to manage the stress.

 

[indy nile]

and the fact we don't bury sides.... 6 goals up with 5 minutes to go in the game and we win by 23 points.

Then again, 17 up against the pies with 4 minutes left and we win by 40

 

[Twinkletoes]

Saw a good half hour of training this morning and I can confirm that goal kicking practice was high on the agenda.

 

[Mr Reliable]

Saw a good half hour of training this morning and I can confirm that goal kicking practice was high on the agenda.

Was Wellsy moving OK, TT? Any special little groups off to the side, chatting and practising their handball?

 

[Twinkletoes]

Was Wellsy moving OK, TT? Any special little groups off to the side, chatting and practising their handball?

Wells was pinging goals no probs. Looked to be moving well.

Higgo was out there handballing and joking around.

The VFL players were off to the side, making up one group, and there were two or three other groups. All were spending 20 minutes or so on one activity then rotating onto the next, with one of those activities being set shot kicking for goal over those fake men on the mark things.

Very impressed with Durdin's set shot up close. They were kicking to the pool end into a breeze and you could easily tell which players managed to kick right through the pill penetrating the goals post high. He was one of them, and probably the best at it.

 

[Viper2Jester]

Saw a good half hour of training this morning and I can confirm that goal kicking practice was high on the agenda.

Do you think that is out of the ordinary, or regular training though? Not sure which I'd prefer to be honest, as mids/fwds should practice set shots regularly regardless.

Sat night was far from a one-off in this regard, as we are great at shanking them left right and centre to give the opposition plenty of hope when its their turn to have control of the footy - should have been a high agenda item some time ago.

In any case, must turn this around against the better sides to come

 

[Mav]

Set shot practice must be one of the most basic, most often repeated training drills. Why do players miss easy set shots? Pressure is one reason. I'm sure stress levels are high, heads are throbbing with adrenaline surges and crowd noise, weight of expectation etc. gets to them during matches.

Solve that without reducing intensity and you will make a killing as a coach.

The supreme players exude confidence which helps to manage the stress.

I've got a theory on this!

If you look at goal kicking in Soccer, League, Union, and NFL the player always comes in from the side with a slow, steady motion. In NFL the punter also comes off only a couple of steps. The process is exactly the same every time, and complete concentration is on the ball and the goals.

Now obviously there are some differences between the sports, especially as all these except the NFL punter are kicking a stationary ball but there are a couple of things I take out of other sports.

1) You don't need a lot of forward momentum to get distance.
2) A lot of guys don't concentrate fully on the goal kicking. Their eyes are scanning any possible leads as they start their run up, they spin the ball in their hands, or they're just taking it a little lackadaisical. The concentration of a rugby player is so much greater than an Aussie rules player. A rugby player visualizes their run up, visualizes the foot striking the ball and visualizes the flight of the ball going through the goals, much like a golfer does, before they even start their run up. Their entire focus is on the ball and the path it will take to go through the goals.
3) The ball drop is the most important thing. Rugby players are very accurate as they kick a stationary ball that has been placed in the perfect position. So its obvious the drop of the ball is the most important thing for AFL goal kicking. I don't believe enough attention is given to this skill at training. The concept of walking straight at goals is a technique to help with the ball drop but I'm not sure this is the best technique. If your natural tendency is to ark, ala Buddy then you should do this but alter your ball drop to compensate. Make sure the ball drop technique is the same every single time to ensure your foot strike is at its most effective point of contact.'It may not be dropping the ball over the foot, but further out to the right so your kicking action is more like a rugby player. There is nothing wrong with this and if you kick it straight then thats fine!
4) Keep it the same EVERY single time. Same stance (including how you hold the ball) before you move forward. Same number of steps before the ball drop, same ball drop every time.

Learning AFL you either kick on the run or you kick from a stationary position, (1 on 1 kick to kick). Kicking with a slow, steady run up is not often done, hence why so much practice needs to be done for goal kicking. It's not something that comes naturally to most because as a kid growing up you don't do a lot of it. I think AFL players need to learn a more defined routine, and practice perfecting it so it is exactly same every single time.

 

[Twinkletoes]

Do you think that is out of the ordinary, or regular training though? Not sure which I'd prefer to be honest, as mids/fwds should practice set shots regularly regardless.

Regular I'd say and I can tell you that all players kicked very well in a tricky breeze. Other activities out there were far more physically taxing so as to add a slight fatigue factor prior to goal kicking I presume.

Whatever doubts there may have been about the effort we're putting into rectifying our goal kicking woes, today's viewing dispelled them for me at least.

It's between the ears and definitely fixable in that case I reckon.

 

[Mr Reliable]

I've got a theory on this!

If you look at goal kicking in Soccer, League, Union, and NFL the player always comes in from the side with a slow, steady motion. In NFL the punter also comes off only a couple of steps. The process is exactly the same every time, and complete concentration is on the ball and the goals.

Now obviously there are some differences between the sports, especially as all these except the NFL punter are kicking a stationary ball but there are a couple of things I take out of other sports.

1) You don't need a lot of forward momentum to get distance.
2) A lot of guys don't concentrate fully on the goal kicking. Their eyes are scanning any possible leads as they start their run up, they spin the ball in their hands, or they're just taking it a little lackadaisical. The concentration of a rugby player is so much greater than an Aussie rules player. A rugby player visualizes their run up, visualizes the foot striking the ball and visualizes the flight of the ball going through the goals, much like a golfer does, before they even start their run up. Their entire focus is on the ball and the path it will take to go through the goals.
3) The ball drop is the most important thing. Rugby players are very accurate as they kick a stationary ball that has been placed in the perfect position. So its obvious the drop of the ball is the most important thing for AFL goal kicking. I don't believe enough attention is given to this skill at training. The concept of walking straight at goals is a technique to help with the ball drop but I'm not sure this is the best technique. If your natural tendency is to ark, ala Buddy then you should do this but alter your ball drop to compensate. Make sure the ball drop technique is the same every single time to ensure your foot strike is at its most effective point of contact.'It may not be dropping the ball over the foot, but further out to the right so your kicking action is more like a rugby player. There is nothing wrong with this and if you kick it straight then thats fine!
4) Keep it the same EVERY single time. Same stance (including how you hold the ball) before you move forward. Same number of steps before the ball drop, same ball drop every time.

Learning AFL you either kick on the run or you kick from a stationary position, (1 on 1 kick to kick). Kicking with a slow, steady run up is not often done, hence why so much practice needs to be done for goal kicking. It's not something that comes naturally to most because as a kid growing up you don't do a lot of it. I think AFL players need to learn a more defined routine, and practice perfecting it so it is exactly same every single time.

All very good points, including the bolded bit. Back in the 60s, and maybe right through to the mid-80s, there were always kids at parks and ovals on weekday evenings and weekends and during school holidays, taking turns at kicking for goal from all angles/distances and kicking out from the goal square. We would practise torps from near one point post to curve the ball through and banana kicks from the other side. Ovals without fences were always popular for this as were ovals with posts that were standing straight. Things weren't always AFL standard in the parks.

By the late 80s parents had become too worried about kids playing unsupervised in parks and a lot of the schools had banned footy in favour of soccer.

In the last 10 to 20 years it appears that kids learn to play footy at Auskick and footy training.

As for your point on kicking on a curve, I saw vision on On the Couch last night of someone having a set shot from about 30 metres virtually straight in front and he turned side on to the goal took a few steps directly off the line and kicked it around the corner, right thru the centre. One day someone will try one of these kicks after the siren and the umpire will call "play on" and cancel the score. This is not like Buddy and others who veer offline while running at the goals. This is stepping directly off the line.

Some people liken kicking for goal with putting. Learn to putt and trust your stroke. Play for show and putt for dough! This is something that AFL clubs don't seem to believe in.

 

[Mav]

As for your point on kicking on a curve, I saw vision on On the Couch last night of someone having a set shot from about 30 metres virtually straight in front and he turned side on to the goal took a few steps directly off the line and kicked it around the corner, right thru the centre. One day someone will try one of these kicks after the siren and the umpire will call "play on" and cancel the score. This is not like Buddy and others who veer offline while running at the goals. This is stepping directly off the line.

If you start on a tighter angle than the mark, and then step so you are kicking over the mark then this should be fine. The powers to be seeing this as the case may not necessarily be the case however!!

 

[Mr Reliable]

If you start on a tighter angle than the mark, and then step so you are kicking over the mark then this should be fine. The powers to be seeing this as the case may not necessarily be the case however!!

It may not be a tighter angle. If you're almost straight in front there is a line from the centre of the goals. The umpire puts you directly on that line and you're supposed to stay on it.

The new approach is either you start off the line (ignoring the umpire's direction) and kick over your mark (around the corner), or you start on the umpire's line and step off it to kick around the corner.

I think a special rule will be needed one day as this practice gains popularity - or maybe we'll just bumble our way through like we usually do.

 

[Roozee]

It may not be a tighter angle. If you're almost straight in front there is a line from the centre of the goals. The umpire puts you directly on that line and you're supposed to stay on it.

The new approach is either you start off the line (ignoring the umpire's direction) and kick over your mark (around the corner), or you start on the umpire's line and step off it to kick around the corner.

I think a special rule will be needed one day as this practice gains popularity - or maybe we'll just bumble our way through like we usually do.

Another potential rule change. I can hear the salivation at AFL house right now.

And of course it will be made up as they go along.