Training Pre-season updates 2025.

[sr36]

Yep, our midfield just wasn't deep enough with all the injuries

Did well to cover for a while, with Crisp, Nick and Pendles stepping up big time, but when Pendles did his arm it was a bridge too far.

 

[manicpie]

Did well to cover for a while, with Crisp, Nick and Pendles stepping up big time, but when Pendles did his arm it was a bridge too far.

hopefully we have a good year injury wise this year because at full strength, we are a very powerful side

 

[sr36]

hopefully we have a good year injury wise this year because at full strength, we are a very powerful side

Yep. Strengths all over the place and not many weaknesses.

If we keep fit, it'll take a bloody good team to stop us.

 

[DopeMaster]

Nothing travels faster than the ball itself, meaning the best attribute to have as a rebounding defender is elite ball use. Noble was not a particularly good ball user, predominantly because of poor decision making, which meant as fast as he could run, the ball would go back the other way much faster when he turned it over. vs arguably the best back half ball user in the league in Houston.

Also Noble was a complete liability in 1v1 defensive duels. Wasn't an effort issue, but he was just so incredibly physically weak over a contested ball.

Disagree. You need both elite kicks and runners out of defense. Having both Daics and Noble running out of the backline is a big part of what made our transition game so lethal in 2022.

Agree with Nobles limitations as a player as you’ve outlined, but quick runners out of the backline make you unpredictable in transition. Elite kicks are awesome too. You want em both IMO.

 

[sr36]

McInness isn't going to be a replacement candidate for Noble - that is not what the club would be thinking at all. The club are using him as a KPD / third tall defender, so there wouldn't be an expectation that he provides Noble's excellent dash and run. Houston is the better player to look at to replace Noble's contributions, and/or J Daicos.

It's hard to work out based on training reports. There's been a lot of talk of Reef being used as a running outlet. It sounds like a Maynard style role to me rather than Murphy, who kept his defensive shape to a far greater degree, which you can't really do to the same degree when looking to run and receive.

 

[Jelly Bean]

It's hard to work out based on training reports. There's been a lot of talk of Reef being used as a running outlet. It sounds like a Maynard style role to me rather than Murphy, who kept his defensive shape to a far greater degree, which you can't really do to the same degree when looking to run and receive.

If it is training report suggestions you are using to guess that Reef is being used in a structurally strategic way as a 'running outlet', I think you are overrating the training reporters ability to determine the strategy. I think a better guide is who he is lining up against during match sim. He is playing on our key talls as a key back. Sure, he may be looking to run off his man when halves the contest, etc, but that is a long way away from being a Noble-type 'running outlet', of which he was excellent at.

 

[sr36]

If it is training report suggestions you are using to guess that Reef is being used in a structurally strategic way as a 'running outlet', I think you are overrating the training reporters ability to determine the strategy. I think a better guide is who he is lining up against during match sim. He is playing on our key talls as a key back. Sure, he may be looking to run off his man when halves the contest, etc, but that is a long way away from being a Noble-type 'running outlet', of which he was excellent at.

I wasn't saying Noble style - I was suggesting it reads more like Maynard style.

At this stage it's a guess for me as to the style of defender he'll be. Training reports is all I have to go on and it's reading more like Maynard than Murphy to me. In terms of match ups, Jen has written about him playing on a range of different player types - as most defenders do. A "2nd tall" might find themselves on Harry McKay, Ollie Henry or Jamie Elliott, depending on the opposition forward line and rotations, as will players who get called 3rd talls or general defenders like Howe and Maynard,

 

[jimmy35]

How’s Reef looking in his backline role? Hopefully for him and us he can star back there.

 

[Pistol Night]

How’s Reef looking in his backline role? Hopefully for him and us he can star back there.

If he can at least provide some of the things Murph used to do apart from headbutting packs at full pace we might be onto a winner

 

[Copeland]

We also missed Pendlebury for a large period with that bicep injury.
We didn't have Perryman. We didn't try Allan in the midfield soon enough because we were testing Long and Sullivan. And finally we didn't put an extremely effective Sidebottom in the midfield until late in the year. We just had a few to many injuries and also made a few missplays that cost us a finals birth.

Eh, thats sanfl. Clearly wasn't delivered the ball very well, and doesn't help when he had to ruck

Yep SANFL, they’d be mainly men.

 

[Jelly Bean]

I wasn't saying Noble style - I was suggesting it reads more like Maynard style.

At this stage it's a guess for me as to the style of defender he'll be. Training reports is all I have to go on and it's reading more like Maynard than Murphy to me. In terms of match ups, Jen has written about him playing on a range of different player types - as most defenders do. A "2nd tall" might find themselves on Harry McKay, Ollie Henry or Jamie Elliott, depending on the opposition forward line and rotations, as will players who get called 3rd talls or general defenders like Howe and Maynard,

Yeah, I agree with those classifications. And to continue with that, I think most of what I've heard and seen, he is being used mostly as a '2nd tall' in your definition, rather than a '3rd tall / general defender' in your definition. The type of player he plays on is one who is generally a key target for our forward entries, whereas Noble and frankly Maynard rarely play on players who are key arial targets. Even Howe and Maynard are very different in this regard - Howe often plays on forwardline targets and/or expects to impact the contest of forwardline targets. Maynard rarely does. Maynard's key role is usually when the ball is not in a marking situation and he needs to shut down a ground player and/or kick the ball out of the backline. Reef is seemingly being trained more as a defender/interceptor of the arial contest rather than rebounder.

So the point is, if we are looking to replace Noble as a running rebounder / running outlet, it is never going to be Reef - it will probably be Houston or J Daicos.

 

[Jen2310]

Love your work Jen.

Just curious on Ed Allans standing. He seemed timid against Freo, but when given genuine mid time against Melbourne he really showed his wares.
I worry Perrymans arrival might stump his opportunities.

Yeah they are now playing in the same position. Ed now playiing more on the inside, same as Perryman. I think they're trying to add a forward role into his role as well so that he has another position to get him into the rotation. Its clear he is more of a mid not a winger. He is someone that needs to be around the ball.

 

[sr36]

Yeah, I agree with those classifications. And to continue with that, I think most of what I've heard and seen, he is being used mostly as a '2nd tall' in your definition, rather than a '3rd tall / general defender' in your definition. The type of player he plays on is one who is generally a key target for our forward entries, whereas Noble and frankly Maynard rarely play on players who are key arial targets. Even Howe and Maynard are very different in this regard - Howe often plays on forwardline targets and/or expects to impact the contest of forwardline targets. Maynard rarely does. Maynard's key role is usually when the ball is not in a marking situation and he needs to shut down a ground player and/or kick the ball out of the backline. Reef is seemingly being trained more as a defender/interceptor of the arial contest rather than rebounder.

So the point is, if we are looking to replace Noble as a running rebounder / running outlet, it is never going to be Reef - it will probably be Houston or J Daicos.

Where we disagree is in terms of match ups - I think that's secondary to positioning in our system, which is why our match ups change so much within a game, as other teams will try to mess with our positioning and create mismatches. Two deep talls on the last line who are really aggressive in terms of coming off their man to try to disrupt kicks into forward 50. And Maynard and one other on the first line of defence. It was Moore and Howe deepest in 2022 and then Murphy was a revelation when Howe broke his arm in 2023. In terms of match ups, we'll still probably struggle against a team like Carlton whose second best tall forward is a physical beast too big for the likes of Howe or Reef in a one out contest - or Murphy for that matter. But personally, I think we get done at ground level more often than in an aerial contest, or through the kickers not being under pressure and being good enough to exploit our positioning and hitting up blokes uncontested - so I'm not too worried about the match ups and being monstered by brutes that concerns others, particularly as we help out so well that we avoid too many one on ones - I think we've got a group to cover most forward lines really well. Hopefully Reef gets it done as he has the attributes to be a fantastic asset back there. However, when it comes to his role, hearing a lot of talk about the players looking for him as an outlet just sounds like the first line of defence - a Maynard style role more than someone who holds his shape as an aerial protector on the last line of defence.

It's a wait and see, particularly as we might change our defensive system anyway.

 

[sr36]

Yeah they are now playing in the same position. Ed now playiing more on the inside, same as Perryman. I think they're trying to add a forward role into his role as well so that he has another position to get him into the rotation. Its clear he is more of a mid not a winger. He is someone that needs to be around the ball.

He's going to need that secondary role - going to be tough to play full time mid in our group, particularly as Nick and JDG are so attacking - we need a defensive mid or two to play with them - and that doesn't seem like Allan's go yet.

 

[Fruit]

If Reef can take the big step and play the role he’s training for, we could be super dangerous out of defence.
There would be a lot of run and carry and great foot skill with J Daicos, Houston, an improved IQ and Reef.

 

[Harry O]

Staggering we haven't traded in someone to replace Murphy

The media and fan obsession with this is crazy.
If our midfield is back to full strength the defence will be more than fine (if the captain plays most games)

 

[Pistol Night]

Yep SANFL, they’d be mainly men.

Probably but playing KPF as a 17-18yo in any state league would be bloody tough. He’s still so raw. We’ve got a good starting point for the key forward we’ve wanted for a decade. They all take a few years to really look comfortable at the level and dominate. Jono Brown had 0 touches on debut. Hawkins was ordinary until the 2011 GF of course. The problem will be when he doesn’t kick a few in the VFL on debut and there are calls to delist him and he’s a bust.

 

[Harry O]

For those worried about us taking a long weekend, Dougall Howard diskicated a shoulder at saints training today.

 

[Pistol Night]

For those worried about us taking a long weekend, Dougall Howard diskicated a shoulder at saints training today.

Isn’t he a doctor anyway or am I getting something mixed up here?

 

[Harry O]

Isn’t he a doctor anyway or am I getting something mixed up here?

Showing your age Mr Howser

 

[Pistol Night]

Showing your age Mr Howser

That, ER, A Country Practice, All Saints, Dr Quinn. The glory days of medical drama.

 

[Obese Arachnid]

That, ER, A Country Practice, All Saints, Dr Quinn. The glory days of medical drama.

The Young Doctors.

 

[Pistol Night]

The Young Doctors.

The Flying Doctors. We really had a mental blank in the 80s once medical dramas went big with some fresh ideas. Until the Blue Heelers, Water Rats law and order ages.

 

[neilk]

The Young Doctors.

Doctor in the House.

 

[Pistol Night]

Doctor in the House.

There were actually more doctors who were actors than actual doctors i think at this point