Play Nice Random Chat Thread VII

[LuvtheKangas]

Of course there's a "deep state". Its why the US keeps functioning despite how useless the vast majority of US federal politicians are (Its not just presidential candidates.)

But its not what Trump says it is.

Its the networks of the sorts of power that aren't regulated by constitutional stuff like the seperation of powers.

This is an okay vid about it but it only focuses on the intelligence agencies associated with it.



The intelligence networks are one element of it but its also the networks that exist in other centres of non government power. Like Wall St in the US - the revolving door between US financial regulators and finanacial companies for example. Its why no one who was really responsible for the GFC was prosecuted for it.

In some ways its why presidential elections are meaningless.

Agree with that. Another aspect of the US deep state (I really don't like the term, though) is the strength of the Israel lobby in US politics. It's why they are so heavily backed by both sides. Israel has spent decades working to get to the point where they effectively dictate US Middle East policy.

 

[ferball]

Agree with that. Another aspect of the US deep state (I really don't like the term, though) is the strength of the Israel lobby in US politics. It's why they are so heavily backed by both sides. Israel has spent decades working to get to the point where they effectively dictate US Middle East policy.

100%.

You said you don't like the term. Do you reckon you'd have the same aversion to it if Trump never used it the way he did?

When he first used the term I remember thinking wtte of "Someone in the actual deep state told him to say that so no one with any self respect ever takes the idea seriously again."

 

[Disco Dew]

In some ways its why presidential elections are meaningless.

Keeps the masses distracted

 

[Val Keating]

Biden was so bad in the debate that it looks like they are thinking about pulling him.

'It's a mess': Biden turns to family on his path forward after his disastrous debate

Democratic leaders have stood by the president as he faces questions about his ability to defeat Trump in November. But privately, many are expressing concern.

www.nbcnews.com

President Joe Biden is expected to discuss the future of his re-election campaign with family at Camp David on Sunday, following a nationally televised debate Thursday that left many fellow Democrats worried about his ability to beat former President Donald Trump in November, according to five people familiar with the matter.

Biden was described by one person familiar with his mood as humiliated, devoid of confidence and painfully aware that the physical images of him at the debate — eyes staring into the distance, mouth agape — will live beyond his presidency, along with a performance that at times was meandering, incoherent and difficult to hear.

“It’s a mess,” this person said.

 

[The Warlord]

Agree with that. Another aspect of the US deep state (I really don't like the term, though) is the strength of the Israel lobby in US politics. It's why they are so heavily backed by both sides. Israel has spent decades working to get to the point where they effectively dictate US Middle East policy.

I only ever heard that term applied to Turkey before it came into vogue in the US.

It was used to describe how Turkey had deep institutions, notably the military, civil service and academia/media, that would prevent it ever going full Islamist and keep it a reliable NATO ally.

That was true for a long time, the army routinely interfered in politics to keep the Islamists out and Turkey's secular Western oriented outlook in place.

Certainly the US has imperial ambitions and also requirements that transcend Congressional terms and presidential administrations. It also has a huge and sprawling federal government to keep running.

It amounts to a deep state albeit its never openly thwarted democracy in the way the Turkish one did (despite what idiot MAGA types might claim)

Personally I don't think Trump's foreign policy is the danger if he gets back in.

The current Democratic administration is providing an unstable Ukranian regime that now rules by decree with advanced US weapons that are launched directly at Russian soil - they've taken us to the brink of WW3 with no need for The Donald.

The real risk is that the various nutcases and ideologues around Trump who realised they missed a chance last time get in and start enacting their delusional hard right program - dismantle the administrative state as per Bannon - with the assistance of the Supreme Court with stuff like the Chevron ruling.

That'll lead them into Liz Truss/Javier Milei territory and a collapse of the US economy like happened to the UK and Argentina brings the world down with it.

 

[The Warlord]

Biden was so bad in the debate that it looks like they are thinking about pulling him.

'It's a mess': Biden turns to family on his path forward after his disastrous debate

Democratic leaders have stood by the president as he faces questions about his ability to defeat Trump in November. But privately, many are expressing concern.

www.nbcnews.com

President Joe Biden is expected to discuss the future of his re-election campaign with family at Camp David on Sunday, following a nationally televised debate Thursday that left many fellow Democrats worried about his ability to beat former President Donald Trump in November, according to five people familiar with the matter.

Biden was described by one person familiar with his mood as humiliated, devoid of confidence and painfully aware that the physical images of him at the debate — eyes staring into the distance, mouth agape — will live beyond his presidency, along with a performance that at times was meandering, incoherent and difficult to hear.

“It’s a mess,” this person said.

Sounds like he will thrown in the towel, I suspect he doesn't want to lose to Trump.

 

[Val Keating]

Sounds like he will thrown in the towel, I suspect he doesn't want to lose to Trump.

Especially since Trump just stated that he’d go after him harder in the next debate.

Who comes in, Newsom? They can’t go with Harris, she’s too unpopular.

 

[Val Keating]

Honestly can’t believe they were surprised at how bad he was, he’s been declining in front of everyone. Did it really take that debate for them to see it?

 

[ferball]

I only ever heard that term applied to Turkey before it came into vogue in the US.

It was used to describe how Turkey had deep institutions, notably the military, civil service and academia/media, that would prevent it ever going full Islamist and keep it a reliable NATO ally.

That was true for a long time, the army routinely interfered in politics to keep the Islamists out and Turkey's secular Western oriented outlook in place.

Certainly the US has imperial ambitions and also requirements that transcend Congressional terms and presidential administrations. It also has a huge and sprawling federal government to keep running.

It amounts to a deep state albeit its never openly thwarted democracy in the way the Turkish one did (despite what idiot MAGA types might claim)

Personally I don't think Trump's foreign policy is the danger if he gets back in.

The current Democratic administration is providing an unstable Ukranian regime that now rules by decree with advanced US weapons that are launched directly at Russian soil - they've taken us to the brink of WW3 with no need for The Donald.

The real risk is that the various nutcases and ideologues around Trump who realised they missed a chance last time get in and start enacting their delusional hard right program - dismantle the administrative state as per Bannon - with the assistance of the Supreme Court with stuff like the Chevron ruling.

That'll lead them into Liz Truss/Javier Milei territory and a collapse of the US economy like happened to the UK and Argentina brings the world down with it.

Yes, the Turkish example is a very good one.

In the US it doesn't need to thwart democracy cos the founding fathers were very careful to make sure democracy never got in the way of ruling the country when they set it up. Even the Bill of Rights was an afterthought demanded by the likes of Sam Adams (and many others).

 

[The Warlord]

Resounding support from the French people for Emmanuel "Time To Go And Fight In The Donbass Mes Ami" Macron ffs

 

[DesertRoo]

Especially since Trump just stated that he’d go after him harder in the next debate.

Who comes in, Newsom? They can’t go with Harris, she’s too unpopular.

They've already had the big D primaries, Biden/Harris ticket won. If they were to follow procedure, it would be Harris, if she declined, it would be next name on that ballot... there's no way that'll ever happen, so the DNC will pick and the lawyers come in for a massive payday.

what an entertaining shitshow.

 

[DesertRoo]

I only ever heard that term applied to Turkey before it came into vogue in the US.

It was used to describe how Turkey had deep institutions, notably the military, civil service and academia/media, that would prevent it ever going full Islamist and keep it a reliable NATO ally.

That was true for a long time, the army routinely interfered in politics to keep the Islamists out and Turkey's secular Western oriented outlook in place.

Certainly the US has imperial ambitions and also requirements that transcend Congressional terms and presidential administrations. It also has a huge and sprawling federal government to keep running.

It amounts to a deep state albeit its never openly thwarted democracy in the way the Turkish one did (despite what idiot MAGA types might claim)

Personally I don't think Trump's foreign policy is the danger if he gets back in.

The current Democratic administration is providing an unstable Ukranian regime that now rules by decree with advanced US weapons that are launched directly at Russian soil - they've taken us to the brink of WW3 with no need for The Donald.

The real risk is that the various nutcases and ideologues around Trump who realised they missed a chance last time get in and start enacting their delusional hard right program - dismantle the administrative state as per Bannon - with the assistance of the Supreme Court with stuff like the Chevron ruling.

That'll lead them into Liz Truss/Javier Milei territory and a collapse of the US economy like happened to the UK and Argentina brings the world down with it.

Waiting for the reputation overhaul of the grey wolves,
I mean targeting Algerians/Armenians in France was for their own benefit....
ffs

 

[Val Keating]

They've already had the big D primaries, Biden/Harris ticket won. If they were to follow procedure, it would be Harris, if she declined, it would be next name on that ballot... there's no way that'll ever happen, so the DNC will pick and the lawyers come in for a massive payday.

what an entertaining shitshow.

I just heard on the news that they’re sticking with Biden.

 

[DesertRoo]

I just heard on the news that they’re sticking with Biden.

yeah they gaslit everyone for four years that's he's a-ok, whats another couple of months?

 

[Val Keating]

Resounding support from the French people for Emmanuel "Time To Go And Fight In The Donbass Mes Ami" Macron ffs

Shops are being boarded up in Paris in preparation for rioting.

 

[koshari]

Shops are being boarded up in Paris in preparation for rioting.

They do tend to swing between far left and far right more than other nations. Who ever said politics is won in the middle wasnt french.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

I just heard on the news that they’re sticking with Biden.

They will lose by less by sticking with Biden imo. If they replace him now there is a real risk that RFK Jr steals a lot of democrat votes. Newsom and Harris are too unpopular. If Newsom wants to run he is better off waiting until after this election.

 

[Val Keating]

They will lose by less by sticking with Biden imo. If they replace him now there is a real risk that RFK Jr steals a lot of democrat votes. Newsom and Harris are too unpopular. If Newsom wants to run he is better off waiting until after this election.

Just can’t see how he can cope with another 4 years.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

Just can’t see how he can cope with another 4 years.

He can't cope now let alone with another 4 years. But he won't get win anyway so the democrats are discussing damage limitation at this point.

 

[Dan]

 

[RightWingRoo]

Highly likely at his current rate of decline, Biden will lose the ability to walk, talk and feed himself. Within the next couple of years.
If they win, Harris will be president by the end of 2026. Given the polls generally have her as less popular than Joe, the prospect of that will be a net negative to their campaign.
They need to kick him off, but it might be too late.

Trump had a couple of one liners he couldn't resist, but was pretty restrained generally. Just let Biden sink himself

 

[The Warlord]

US supreme court rules Trump has ‘absolute immunity’ for official acts

Court rules former presidents entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution

www.theguardian.com

What a tinpot broken country where a President gets to appoint the judges that then let him off despite launching an insurrection after he loses the election.

And these imperial fools stomp around the world lecturing OTHERS on democracy and accountability.

Maybe they should spend less time fomenting coups d'état, murdering other countries' national heroes and engaging in proxy wars, and more looking in their own backyard

 

[DesertRoo]

US supreme court rules Trump has ‘absolute immunity’ for official acts

Court rules former presidents entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution

www.theguardian.com

What a tinpot broken country where a President gets to appoint the judges that then let him off despite launching an insurrection after he loses the election.

And these imperial fools stomp around the world lecturing OTHERS on democracy and accountability.

Maybe they should spend less time fomenting coups d'état, murdering other countries' national heroes and engaging in proxy wars, and more looking in their own backyard

The real kicker to the judgement is they basically said the Jack Smith appointment is unconstitutional, Garland should’ve gone through congress to appoint a special counsel.

 

[Grogg]

Of course there's a "deep state". Its why the US keeps functioning despite how useless the vast majority of US federal politicians are (Its not just presidential candidates.)

But its not what Trump says it is.

Its the networks of the sorts of power that aren't regulated by constitutional stuff like the seperation of powers.

This is an okay vid about it but it only focuses on the intelligence agencies associated with it.



The intelligence networks are one element of it but its also the networks that exist in other centres of non government power. Like Wall St in the US - the revolving door between US financial regulators and finanacial companies for example. Its why no one who was really responsible for the GFC was prosecuted for it.

In some ways its why presidential elections are meaningless.

Johnny Harris, excellent channel that.

It's a shame that commercial tv is in such a sad state that it's only on Youtube that you get quality research explained in a condensible form that is primarily free from bias.

 

[Bojan KantKick]

US supreme court rules Trump has ‘absolute immunity’ for official acts

Court rules former presidents entitled to some degree of immunity from criminal prosecution

www.theguardian.com

What a tinpot broken country where a President gets to appoint the judges that then let him off despite launching an insurrection after he loses the election.

And these imperial fools stomp around the world lecturing OTHERS on democracy and accountability.

Maybe they should spend less time fomenting coups d'état, murdering other countries' national heroes and engaging in proxy wars, and more looking in their own backyard

This was true all along. The way the democrats tried to get around it was disgraceful.